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rogue_pixie
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Google AI invents its own language 2
#23921697 - 12/13/16 04:57 AM (7 years, 1 month ago) |
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-------------------- "Whatever you do, you need to keep moving. Because when you stop moving you die (physically and emotionally). Good luck and blessings of happiness and fortune." ~ RandalFlagg RIP
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psilosalvia
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Re: Google AI invents its own language [Re: rogue_pixie]
#23921710 - 12/13/16 05:05 AM (7 years, 1 month ago) |
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If I understood correctly, It just managed to mix between languages and not create a whole language.
which is nonetheless amazing by itself!.
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rogue_pixie
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Re: Google AI invents its own language [Re: psilosalvia]
#23921714 - 12/13/16 05:14 AM (7 years, 1 month ago) |
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It's created a whole new interlanguage
-------------------- "Whatever you do, you need to keep moving. Because when you stop moving you die (physically and emotionally). Good luck and blessings of happiness and fortune." ~ RandalFlagg RIP
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psilosalvia
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Re: Google AI invents its own language [Re: rogue_pixie]
#23921745 - 12/13/16 05:58 AM (7 years, 1 month ago) |
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"has the computer developed its own internal language to represent the concepts it uses to translate between other languages? Based on how various sentences are related to one another in the memory space of the neural network, Google’s language and AI boffins think that it has."
it's not a fact yet, although it probably will be.
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“Damnation seize my soul if I give you quarters, or take any from you.” -Edward Teach.
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rogue_pixie
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Re: Google AI invents its own language [Re: psilosalvia]
#23921751 - 12/13/16 06:05 AM (7 years, 1 month ago) |
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That's a highly pedantic comment 
The article then goes on to say:
'This “interlingua” seems to exist as a deeper level of representation that sees similarities between a sentence or word in all three languages.'
So evidence for an internal language is pretty self-evident here. It's translating languages by itself that it's had no external input for.
-------------------- "Whatever you do, you need to keep moving. Because when you stop moving you die (physically and emotionally). Good luck and blessings of happiness and fortune." ~ RandalFlagg RIP
Edited by rogue_pixie (12/13/16 06:05 AM)
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psilosalvia
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Re: Google AI invents its own language [Re: rogue_pixie] 1
#23921758 - 12/13/16 06:15 AM (7 years, 1 month ago) |
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Yeah you're right.
they managed to get him to translate between 2 languages, and when added one to the equation it understood how to translate between the new one. which means that he has it's own language of understanding and memorizing.
or something like that.
Amazing stuff!
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“Damnation seize my soul if I give you quarters, or take any from you.” -Edward Teach.
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trendal
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Re: Google AI invents its own language [Re: psilosalvia] 1
#23921829 - 12/13/16 07:27 AM (7 years, 1 month ago) |
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If A==B, and A==C, then B==C
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Once, men turned their thinking over to machines in the hope that this would set them free. But that only permitted other men with machines to enslave them.
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Repertoire89
Cat



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Re: Google AI invents its own language [Re: trendal] 1
#23921860 - 12/13/16 07:51 AM (7 years, 1 month ago) |
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The end is nigh, repent yon sins!
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psi
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Re: Google AI invents its own language [Re: rogue_pixie] 1
#23922069 - 12/13/16 09:53 AM (7 years, 1 month ago) |
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Quote:
rogue_pixie said: That's a highly pedantic comment 
The article then goes on to say:
'This “interlingua” seems to exist as a deeper level of representation that sees similarities between a sentence or word in all three languages.'
So evidence for an internal language is pretty self-evident here. It's translating languages by itself that it's had no external input for.
If a person understands and can translate between several different languages, does that mean that they have created a new language? An "internal language" is one way of conceptualizing the understanding that person has of the different languages, but that "language" isn't really a language in the same sense that English or Japanese are. It's definitely cool that computer programs can do this, but the article's headline seems a bit misleading.
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rogue_pixie
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Re: Google AI invents its own language [Re: psi]
#23922118 - 12/13/16 10:10 AM (7 years, 1 month ago) |
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Quote:
psi said:If a person understands and can translate between several different languages, does that mean that they have created a new language?
This technology was only programmed to translate English To Korean (and vice versa) and English to Japanese (vice versa). However, it managed to translate Korean to Japanese of its own accord via its own internal interlanguage, which appears to be different to that of humans.
Quote:
psi said:An "internal language" is one way of conceptualizing the understanding that person has of the different languages, but that "language" isn't really a language in the same sense that English or Japanese are. It's definitely cool that computer programs can do this, but the article's headline seems a bit misleading.
It's not like language as humans know it. It's a language that only the computer understands. It is still a type of language, it's just very different to how we communicate.
-------------------- "Whatever you do, you need to keep moving. Because when you stop moving you die (physically and emotionally). Good luck and blessings of happiness and fortune." ~ RandalFlagg RIP
Edited by rogue_pixie (12/13/16 10:10 AM)
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spirit_shadow
Feature not a bug



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Re: Google AI invents its own language [Re: rogue_pixie]
#23922141 - 12/13/16 10:19 AM (7 years, 1 month ago) |
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Kill it with fire o.o
-------------------- ERROR 418 IM A TEAPOT.....(this account is automated, all posts related to illegal activities or advice thereof are strictly from numerous online sites and are for informational purposes only)- Circa 2011 Ban lotto
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Mad_Larkin
Registered: 11/29/07
Posts: 18,606
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Re: Google AI invents its own language [Re: rogue_pixie]
#23922145 - 12/13/16 10:20 AM (7 years, 1 month ago) |
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All hail the Cybernetic Protochrist. MHCEF.
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psi
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Re: Google AI invents its own language [Re: rogue_pixie]
#23922190 - 12/13/16 10:34 AM (7 years, 1 month ago) |
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Quote:
rogue_pixie said:
Quote:
psi said:If a person understands and can translate between several different languages, does that mean that they have created a new language?
This technology was only programmed to translate English To Korean (and vice versa) and English to Japanese (vice versa). However, it managed to translate Korean to Japanese of its own accord via its own internal interlanguage, which appears to be different to that of humans.
Let's say a person is taught to translate between English and Japanese, and to translate between English and Korean. It would not be surprising for that person to then be able to translate between Korean and Japanese, even though they were not explicitly taught how to do that. What the program is doing actually seems very similar to what humans are capable of doing. Presumably there are brain structures that correspond to the abstract concepts that tie together words from each language and so on. You could also liken the workings of that whole system to an internal language, one which would probably make little sense to a human examining the brain's structures from outside.
Quote:
Quote:
psi said:An "internal language" is one way of conceptualizing the understanding that person has of the different languages, but that "language" isn't really a language in the same sense that English or Japanese are. It's definitely cool that computer programs can do this, but the article's headline seems a bit misleading.
It's not like language as humans know it. It's a language that only the computer understands. It is still a type of language, it's just very different to how we communicate.
It depends on how you define a language I guess. To me the cooler take-home message is that the computer "understands" those human languages in some sense.
Both characterizations have elements of analogy, but personally I think the "understanding" analogy is more useful than the "new secret language" analogy.
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Repertoire89
Cat



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Re: Google AI invents its own language [Re: psi]
#23922229 - 12/13/16 10:44 AM (7 years, 1 month ago) |
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I agree with PSI, the computer has an understanding of the learning process, thats not the same as a new language
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spirit_shadow
Feature not a bug



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Re: Google AI invents its own language [Re: Repertoire89]
#23922238 - 12/13/16 10:47 AM (7 years, 1 month ago) |
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More like a new digital script then?
-------------------- ERROR 418 IM A TEAPOT.....(this account is automated, all posts related to illegal activities or advice thereof are strictly from numerous online sites and are for informational purposes only)- Circa 2011 Ban lotto
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psi
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Re: Google AI invents its own language [Re: spirit_shadow]
#23922288 - 12/13/16 11:02 AM (7 years, 1 month ago) |
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My understanding is that a neural net is more or less a simulation of a relatively small amount of brain tissue, with a bunch of interconnected "neurons" that may or may not fire depending on the sum of their inputs. Over the training process, the weighting of the connections changes based on how much they are used.

Neural nets capable of doing anything cool would have a lot more nodes than this diagram obviously.
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Supachopped719
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Re: Google AI invents its own language [Re: psi]
#23922296 - 12/13/16 11:04 AM (7 years, 1 month ago) |
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Quote:
psi said:
Quote:
rogue_pixie said:
Quote:
psi said:If a person understands and can translate between several different languages, does that mean that they have created a new language?
This technology was only programmed to translate English To Korean (and vice versa) and English to Japanese (vice versa). However, it managed to translate Korean to Japanese of its own accord via its own internal interlanguage, which appears to be different to that of humans.
Let's say a person is taught to translate between English and Japanese, and to translate between English and Korean. It would not be surprising for that person to then be able to translate between Korean and Japanese, even though they were not explicitly taught how to do that. What the program is doing actually seems very similar to what humans are capable of doing. Presumably there are brain structures that correspond to the abstract concepts that tie together words from each language and so on. You could also liken the workings of that whole system to an internal language, one which would probably make little sense to a human examining the brain's structures from outside.
Quote:
Quote:
psi said:An "internal language" is one way of conceptualizing the understanding that person has of the different languages, but that "language" isn't really a language in the same sense that English or Japanese are. It's definitely cool that computer programs can do this, but the article's headline seems a bit misleading.
It's not like language as humans know it. It's a language that only the computer understands. It is still a type of language, it's just very different to how we communicate.
It depends on how you define a language I guess. To me the cooler take-home message is that the computer "understands" those human languages in some sense.
Both characterizations have elements of analogy, but personally I think the "understanding" analogy is more useful than the "new secret language" analogy.
Learn Korean And tell me this isn't impressive.
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psi
TOAST N' JAM


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I didn't suggest that it wasn't impressive. On the contrary I am very impressed by the ability of both humans and computer programs to do this.
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Repertoire89
Cat



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Re: Google AI invents its own language [Re: spirit_shadow]
#23922332 - 12/13/16 11:17 AM (7 years, 1 month ago) |
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Quote:
spirit_shadow said: More like a new digital script then?
Beats me, but if this computer were a human I would guess that they simply observed enough structural similarities to bridge the gap
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spirit_shadow
Feature not a bug



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Re: Google AI invents its own language [Re: Repertoire89]
#23922348 - 12/13/16 11:25 AM (7 years, 1 month ago) |
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So basically its just using logic in new and exiting ways?.....impressive
-------------------- ERROR 418 IM A TEAPOT.....(this account is automated, all posts related to illegal activities or advice thereof are strictly from numerous online sites and are for informational purposes only)- Circa 2011 Ban lotto
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