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Offlinesdlocalkid85
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using colonized bulk substrate to colonize more tubs
    #23907547 - 12/08/16 04:10 PM (7 years, 1 month ago)

anyone try this?  I was wondering if you took a freshly colonized bulk substrate and cut it up into 4 pieces and then used those pieces to spawn to 4 more monotubs.  any thoughts or input?


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InvisibleAllDay420
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Re: using colonized bulk substrate to colonize more tubs [Re: sdlocalkid85]
    #23907555 - 12/08/16 04:12 PM (7 years, 1 month ago)

That's what grain is for...
But only one way to find out. :crazy:
I don't see why it wouldn't work but it does not seem economical and would be a waste of time when that is what grain is for.

I dunno.
:popcorn:


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OfflineHamHead
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Re: using colonized bulk substrate to colonize more tubs [Re: sdlocalkid85]
    #23907563 - 12/08/16 04:13 PM (7 years, 1 month ago)

Better to just start tubs fresh with colonized grains. You could do it, but the contamination risk probably goes up.

Wait for a more educated reply as I'm very much still novice.


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Offlinetump
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Re: using colonized bulk substrate to colonize more tubs [Re: HamHead]
    #23908987 - 12/09/16 01:03 AM (7 years, 1 month ago)

Its been done lots of time by many people. Its called super spawning. Its almost never worth it. Honestly if you want to divide your spawn into tubs instead of one. Learn straw. It can be used as a spawn ratio 1 to 10 or 1 to 20 with little problems. If you case your straw tub its amazing.


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InvisibleJosex
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Re: using colonized bulk substrate to colonize more tubs [Re: AllDay420]
    #23909041 - 12/09/16 01:55 AM (7 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

sdlocalkid85 said:
anyone try this?  I was wondering if you took a freshly colonized bulk substrate and cut it up into 4 pieces and then used those pieces to spawn to 4 more monotubs.  any thoughts or input?



Quote:

AllDay420 said:
That's what grain is for...




:whathesaid:
Grains are the bulk of nutrition in your tubs, whereas a bulk substrate is mainly used to provide the mycelium colony with enough water to help it produce good flushes, but as far as nutrition goes, a bulk sub will do little for you.

So if you divide one tub into more tubs you'd be cutting down on nutes and you'd see a decrease in performance. Also, by expanding a colonized tub into more tubs you'd be streching and weakening the mycelium colony, which will also have to recover a second time and nothing good can come out of that.

Lastly and very important, when we break up a 100% colonized grain jar to spawn it to bulk sub, every single colonized grain will serve as an inoculation point, allowing a faster colonization of the substrate (very important if you take into account that every single grow is a race against competing organisms). An already colonized tub won't break up easily into small pieces, and as said above the mycelium network will no longer be as vigorous and capable of colonizing a new bulk sub in a reasonable time.

The only reasonable way IMO to carry out your idea would be to divide your grain spawn into more tubs, so for example, instead of using 6 grain jars per tub you'd be using 2 grain jars to spawn into 3 tubs. But again, that's cutting down on nutrition so be prepared to see a drop-off in performance.


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OfflineKulkulcan
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Re: using colonized bulk substrate to colonize more tubs [Re: tump]
    #23917310 - 12/11/16 06:19 PM (7 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

tump said:
if you want to divide your spawn into tubs instead of one. Learn straw. It can be used as a spawn ratio 1 to 10 or 1 to 20 with little problems.



Where can I read how to do this?


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InvisiblebodhisattaMDiscordReddit
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Re: using colonized bulk substrate to colonize more tubs [Re: Kulkulcan]
    #23917628 - 12/11/16 07:25 PM (7 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

Kulkulcan said:
Quote:

tump said:
if you want to divide your spawn into tubs instead of one. Learn straw. It can be used as a spawn ratio 1 to 10 or 1 to 20 with little problems.



Where can I read how to do this?



shroomery.org/forums


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OfflinePussyFart
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Re: using colonized bulk substrate to colonize more tubs [Re: bodhisatta]
    #23917693 - 12/11/16 07:43 PM (7 years, 1 month ago)

:whathesaid:


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OfflineKulkulcan
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Re: using colonized bulk substrate to colonize more tubs [Re: bodhisatta]
    #23917831 - 12/11/16 08:41 PM (7 years, 1 month ago)

I searched for about 5 minutes and didn't find it, no doubt because I didn't even know enough about it to search using the right keywords, other than "straw". How much trouble is it to either give a 5 word answer, or to not take the trouble to answer at all? Sorry to bother you.


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OfflinecronicrFacebook
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Re: using colonized bulk substrate to colonize more tubs [Re: Josex]
    #23918034 - 12/11/16 09:40 PM (7 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

Josex said:
Quote:

sdlocalkid85 said:
anyone try this?  I was wondering if you took a freshly colonized bulk substrate and cut it up into 4 pieces and then used those pieces to spawn to 4 more monotubs.  any thoughts or input?



Quote:

AllDay420 said:
That's what grain is for...




:whathesaid:
Grains are the bulk of nutrition in your tubs, whereas a bulk substrate is mainly used to provide the mycelium colony with enough water to help it produce good flushes, but as far as nutrition goes, a bulk sub will do little for you.

So if you divide one tub into more tubs you'd be cutting down on nutes and you'd see a decrease in performance. Also, by expanding a colonized tub into more tubs you'd be streching and weakening the mycelium colony, which will also have to recover a second time and nothing good can come out of that.

Lastly and very important, when we break up a 100% colonized grain jar to spawn it to bulk sub, every single colonized grain will serve as an inoculation point, allowing a faster colonization of the substrate (very important if you take into account that every single grow is a race against competing organisms). An already colonized tub won't break up easily into small pieces, and as said above the mycelium network will no longer be as vigorous and capable of colonizing a new bulk sub in a reasonable time.

The only reasonable way IMO to carry out your idea would be to divide your grain spawn into more tubs, so for example, instead of using 6 grain jars per tub you'd be using 2 grain jars to spawn into 3 tubs. But again, that's cutting down on nutrition so be prepared to see a drop-off in performance.



Semi agree...but i disagree on the drop off in performance and would put my money on the three tubs putting out more then the one. This comes down to you either trying to get the most out of your tub or trying to get the most out of your spawn...bulk of anykind makes shitty spawn as the leap off sucks


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InvisiblebodhisattaMDiscordReddit
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Re: using colonized bulk substrate to colonize more tubs [Re: Kulkulcan]
    #23918061 - 12/11/16 09:52 PM (7 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

Kulkulcan said:
I searched for about 5 minutes and didn't find it, no doubt because I didn't even know enough about it to search using the right keywords, other than "straw". How much trouble is it to either give a 5 word answer, or to not take the trouble to answer at all? Sorry to bother you.



Because you didn't try hard

https://www.shroomery.org/forums/dosearch.php?where=body&tosearch=main&how=all&words=Straw&newerval=5&newertype=y&minwords=200&limit=25&forum=c1&showmain=1&image=1&sort=r&way=d


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Offlinetump
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Re: using colonized bulk substrate to colonize more tubs [Re: bodhisatta]
    #23918219 - 12/11/16 11:04 PM (7 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

RogerRabbit said:
You can use a spawn ratio of 1/20 if you're spawning to straw.  If you're spawning to manure, compost, or coir, don't go over 1:4.  A greater spawn rate is preferred, because in addition to the faster colonization, the grains are an important source of nutrients during fruiting.
RR





Straw logs, straw laundry basket tek which works but not ideal. Straw monotubs with light casing my favourite.


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OfflineKulkulcan
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Re: using colonized bulk substrate to colonize more tubs [Re: tump]
    #23919203 - 12/12/16 11:09 AM (7 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

bodhisatta said:
Because you didn't try hard

https://www.shroomery.org/forums/dosearch.php?where=body&tosearch=main&how=all&words=Straw&newerval=5&newertype=y&minwords=200&limit=25&forum=c1&showmain=1&image=1&sort=r&way=d



Thanks, I really appreciate this, I was just thinking someone might post a link to a specific tutorial, but I guess you guys get the same questions over and over again, sorry, and thanks again

Quote:

tump said:
Quote:

RogerRabbit said:
You can use a spawn ratio of 1/20 if you're spawning to straw.  If you're spawning to manure, compost, or coir, don't go over 1:4.  A greater spawn rate is preferred, because in addition to the faster colonization, the grains are an important source of nutrients during fruiting.
RR




Straw logs, straw laundry basket tek which works but not ideal. Straw monotubs with light casing my favourite.



Thanks a lot for this.

So for straw, it would be better go with a spawn ratio of 1:10 than 1:20, right?


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Offlinetump
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Re: using colonized bulk substrate to colonize more tubs [Re: Kulkulcan]
    #23919892 - 12/12/16 02:46 PM (7 years, 1 month ago)

Depends on the amount of spawn you have. With the monos i always did 1 to 10. But thats cause when doing straw its best to do a big ass batch. Its best to actually use a higher spawn ratio like 1 to 5 ratio just for speed. Slower colonised time leads to high contaminate rate. It has to be colonised in max of two weeks or will contaminate. Straw is not contaminate resistant like coir.


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OfflineKulkulcan
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Re: using colonized bulk substrate to colonize more tubs [Re: tump]
    #23920170 - 12/12/16 04:08 PM (7 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

tump said:
Quote:

RogerRabbit said:
You can use a spawn ratio of 1/20 if you're spawning to straw.  If you're spawning to manure, compost, or coir, don't go over 1:4.  A greater spawn rate is preferred, because in addition to the faster colonization, the grains are an important source of nutrients during fruiting.
RR




Straw logs, straw laundry basket tek which works but not ideal. Straw monotubs with light casing my favourite.




Quote:

tump said:
Depends on the amount of spawn you have. With the monos i always did 1 to 10. But thats cause when doing straw its best to do a big ass batch. Its best to actually use a higher spawn ratio like 1 to 5 ratio just for speed. Slower colonised time leads to high contaminate rate. It has to be colonised in max of two weeks or will contaminate. Straw is not contaminate resistant like coir.




Hmmm. 1:5 spawn/straw would yield only about 25% more colonized bulk substrate than 1:4 spawn/coir, and coir is more resistant to contams.

But for equal amounts of colonized bulk substrate, how do straw and coir compare for how much fruit they yield?

In case it affects what spawn ratio can be safely used with straw, I was kind of thinking monotub.


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Offlinetump
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Re: using colonized bulk substrate to colonize more tubs [Re: Kulkulcan]
    #23920184 - 12/12/16 04:13 PM (7 years, 1 month ago)

My one quart if spawn to ten quarts of straw mono was about 3 to 3.5 ounces dry. Straw doesnt hold water well remember to case it


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OfflineKulkulcan
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Re: using colonized bulk substrate to colonize more tubs [Re: tump]
    #23920872 - 12/12/16 08:10 PM (7 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

tump said:
My one quart if spawn to ten quarts of straw mono was about 3 to 3.5 ounces dry. Straw doesnt hold water well remember to case it



For comparison purposes, do you have any idea roughly what yield of fruit you could expect from one quart of spawn to 3 quarts of coir, also mono?


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Offlinetump
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Re: using colonized bulk substrate to colonize more tubs [Re: Kulkulcan]
    #23921107 - 12/12/16 09:37 PM (7 years, 1 month ago)

Yes i do the max i ever get for coir is 2 ounces if the spawn is perfect. If you just look at it form a Yeild concept then straw always wins. Someone useing straw logs like RR can get 4 lbs dry form a bale of straw and 9 qts of spawn. Straw is food for myc and it travels up the shaft inside the straw.


All that said see it form a normal coir monotub. 3qts of spawn and 9 qts of coir/verm will Yeild more then its one qt spawn straw counterpart. With the bonus of easy bucket tek clean up and use with contam buffer. Can do that with straw. You have to cut straw, and pasteurization it just right and compact it while colonizing


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InvisibleJosex
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Re: using colonized bulk substrate to colonize more tubs [Re: tump]
    #23921746 - 12/13/16 05:59 AM (7 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

tump said:
Yes i do the max i ever get for coir is 2 ounces if the spawn is perfect. If you just look at it form a Yeild concept then straw always wins. Someone useing straw logs like RR can get 4 lbs dry form a bale of straw and 9 qts of spawn. Straw is food for myc and it travels up the shaft inside the straw.


All that said see it form a normal coir monotub. 3qts of spawn and 9 qts of coir/verm will Yeild more then its one qt spawn straw counterpart. With the bonus of easy bucket tek clean up and use with contam buffer. Can do that with straw. You have to cut straw, and pasteurization it just right and compact it while colonizing




:takingnotes: I agree, although straw is shaft than myc will win if you coir tek some shit with bucket while useing gipsurm FTW.


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Invisibleblindingleaf
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Re: using colonized bulk substrate to colonize more tubs [Re: Josex]
    #23921770 - 12/13/16 06:24 AM (7 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

Straw doesnt holds water VERY well




FTFY :cool:


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