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InvisibleDoctorJ
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nailed to the cross on mushrooms+syrian rue
    #2388976 - 02/29/04 03:22 PM (13 years, 7 months ago)

Well, I was chillin at a friends house last night watching saturday nite live.  It got boring so I left and went back to my house. 

It was midnight when another friend of mine called.  He had some syrian rue but no mushrooms, and I had some mushrooms but no syrian rue.  So we decided to help eachother out. 

I'd never done syrian rue before, so i went over to his house and we made a tea and both drank our doses.  I'm not sure about the dosage of syrian rue we took, because my friend did all that, but I know we both ate about 2.5 grams of (really potent millet-grown KS)mushrooms. 

Well I have a really sensitive stomach so I spent the first 45 minutes of the trip in serious pain and eventually had to throw up, as my friend predicted. 

When i was done being sick I layed on my friends couch (by that time my friend was laying on the other couch, totally gone)

The world around me began to swirl and melt into different colors.  I lost the feeling of having a body and being surrounded by a physical universe.  I didnt lose my ego per se- there was definitely a "me".  But it seemed like the equation had been reduced to just me and another entity.  I know this sounds cliche, but it really felt like it was just me and god, like we were having a conversation. 

Well, at first it was just pure bliss- all of the daily dramas and things that I normally care about were just erased from my mind and I felt that I was nothing but a speck of dust being illuminated by the energy of the universe. 

But gradually my personality started coming back, and I began to ask the entity questions.  (maybe it was just me asking myself questions, but I usually dont come up with these kinds of answers by myself- the answers did not seem localized to my brain- it felt like they were coming from somewhere else)

Well, i've been in a pretty foul mood the last couple months, and once the initial shiock and awe of the trip began to wear off, these things started coming out. 

You see, I've been having a lot of shitty feelings lately, like people dont respect me as much as they should, because of superficial reasons that shouldnt matter (like my boyish appearance).  Last semester I dated a bunch of girls that just kind of used me for money and sex and split when I tried to get things a little more serious.  Over the last couple months I've been running into ex-girlfriends that left me because they thought they could do better- and they always seem to be doing worse.  One of them is pregnant, another is a coke addict now, some are with abusive boyfriends, or boyfriends that dont love them/can't take care of them. 

I've been feeling unloved and the victim of bad justice.  I see all these people around me that dont really deserve their material wealth and/or the love of a significant other while I make do with nothing.  I tend to think of myself as a pretty decent guy who deserves happiness and respect, but never gets any because the greedy assholes take more than their share.  And its not just me- I know a lot of truly good people who get shit on every day by assholes who cant justify their power and wealth with any kind of merit or moral decency. 

So anyway, all of these feelings were kind of floating around in my mind, and I had to ask these questions to this entity, because this was one of the few times in my life that I've spoken to God and actually felt like he answered me. 

So here is a dialogue (what I can piece together, anyway- the entity's real answers were far more eloquent and came with emotional and visual aids)

me: Why is this world so cruel to those who only seek to help it?

E: such is its nature.  Get used to it.

me:  but why do bad men get rewarded and good men get punished?

E:  good men are punished because they are close to me.  and I can take all the punishment any mortal can dish out.  As for rewarding bad men, well, the material things they recieve are ultimately not rewards.  These things only draw them further from me, and I am the source of all things. 

me: If I am closer to you, than why am I in so much pain?  Is God pain?

E:  God is not pain.  God endures pain infinitely. 

me:  why?

E: freedom.  love.

me: how is allowing fascists to run amok promoting freedom and love?

E: they are free to do what they choose, and I love them no matter what they do.  I am the source of all things. 

me: but doesnt that kind of suck for you?

E:  nothing sucks for me.  pain is but a fly in my household. 

me: so you just don't care, then?

E:  You care.  and you are a part of me.  and you are free to do what you choose.  I will love you no matter what you do. 

me: how can you love people that hurt eachother and do stupid shit?

E:  I am the source of all things.  I love them as I love myself.  Their purpose is to be. 

me: why do you allow those that would seek to end pain and suffering to be punished by those farthest from you.  Why do you 'let the demons run amok' and punish those who are close to you?

E: those who aspire to be as I am must know what it is like.  They must know how to do the right thing because it is the right thing, and for no other reason.  They must be prepared to suffer for doing the right thing.  This is how I run the universe. 

me: you said that material things arent really rewards.  what are the rewards of being close to you?

E:  you have become close to me, and though you will one day cease to exist, a part of you will live forever in my keep.

me:  so the people who are far from you get nothing.  do they just disappear when they die?

E:  No, they just go further and further into nothingness until they realize it is a dead end.  then they come back to me, as you have.

me: why the whole process? 

E:  the process is the mechanism for the creation of all that is from all that could be. 

me: ...

E:  the tao does not care if it is loved or acted against.  it just is.  it is ceaseless in its flow regardless of conditions

me:  So you're saying I should just be a tool, like those complacent Chinese with their fascist government?

E: you should be who you are.  I have given you many clues as to what that is.  your body.  the makeup of your brain.  the events you have experienced.  the situation into which you were born.  all have purpose.  time will reveal this to you. 

me: but what if 'who I am' is a person far from you?

E:  It doesnt matter what you are, it only matters what you aspire to be.  As long as you seek me out, I will make myself increasingly available to you.  But first you must become accustomed to pain.  You must be able to walk through the gates of Hell with no fear in your heart.  then you will understand totality. 

me: you sound like a masochist!

E:  ...  I am the souce of all things.  from masochism to altruism.  all have purpose in the creation of what is from what could be.  In order to endure totality, compassion must be infinite. 

me: so, whatever happens in reality doesnt matter?  If I see some guy raping a 10 year old with a broken glass botlle I'm supposed to just dig why the guy's doing it and not interfere?

E:  You should do what you would do.  Such is your purpose.  But I do not concern myself with judgement and intervention.  If people want to be close to me they can.  If they want to be far from me, they can.  But ultimately everyone must come back to the source.  Otherwise they will perish.  You must do what you think is right.  That is your purpose.  I am not in your position, though if I were I would protect life whenever possible, even at the expense of my own.

me: how can you love people that hurt both you and themselves?

E:  they do not hurt me, for I take little heed of pain.  I do not like to see them hurt themselves, but I accept it as an inevitability stemming from what they are.  Not only do I love what they could be, I love what they are.  I provide for them though they take me for granted.  such is MY purpose.

me: I understand the need for both sides of the spectrum, but why does the dark side have to be so predominant?  Why do the good people seem to be outnumbered and losing the fight?

E: such is but one possible position.  there are countless numbers of other positions.  In order for them to exist, your current position must also exist.  But you're "now" is not eternity.  It is but one moment in an infinite series of events that combine to make up eternity.  Time will bring both change and wisdom. 



Well, the rest of it was all kinda personal, so i wont include it.  But I found that to be a particularly interesting experience- thinking about these things and getting completely different answers than my cynical mind normally comes up with. 

Sorry its so long, I just wanted to get it down in writing before I forget all this wisdom.  Already, I can feel my personality starting to creep back in.  This dude at my work that smokes too much ice and stays out too late woke me up from a fitful sleep by calling me to ask if I could work for him today...  I was like "HELL NO, nigga!"  :lol:  shows what a godly person I am, right? 

but anyway, I'll leave you guys with this poem, by my favorite poet.  The experience I had last night caused me to remember this poem, which I have never had any personal affliction for, but now seems relevant:

God's Wheel by  Shel Silversteen

God says to me with a kind of smile,
"Hey how would you like to be God awhile
And steer the world?"
"OK", says I, "I'll give it a try."
Where do I set?
How much do I get?
What time is lunch?
When can I quit?
"Gimme back that wheel," says God.
"I don't think you're quite ready yet."



OK, so anyway, I'm gonna go try to eat some food and maybe get more sleep now.  This post might belong in Trip Reports or whatever, but I thought it was more spiritual in nature.  I mean, its not like a science report, and I didnt even go into the physical effects of the drugs and the visuals and crazy events that happened after the peak.

Plus i wanted to hear what you guys thought about it, if you're bored enough to read the whole thing :smile:

peace niggas!


--------------------
peace, pot, and microdot!


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OfflineJacquesCousteau
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Re: nailed to the cross on mushrooms+syrian rue [Re: DoctorJ]
    #2389022 - 02/29/04 03:41 PM (13 years, 7 months ago)

"I tend to think of myself as a pretty decent guy who deserves happiness and respect, but never gets any because the greedy assholes take more than their share. And its not just me- I know a lot of truly good people who get shit on every day by assholes who cant justify their power and wealth with any kind of merit or moral decency."

I can 100% relate to that. Lately I've been heavily feeling like all my friends "use" me in a way. It's like.. the best way I can explain it is, they're around when they want to be. I've also felt unrespected at my job; I help my boss out all the time, filling in when he needs someone to cover my day off (the last 3 weeks in a row I might add) and just generally doing my job well. And yet I've gotten one 25 cent raise since I started, and he's more likely to grunt than answer pretty much any question.. I need a new job..

I can't even tell if it's all in my head at this point. It's been months since I've tripped, I'm sure I'm overdue to escape the colorings of my perceptions.

Edit: I might also add, your conversation actually kind of eases my mind in a way. It's like I got the answers indirectly through you, heh. Not that either of us have any idea if you were actually talking to some greater being or not. It's just nice to know there's a chance that's the way it is, heh.

Don't mind me.  :ooo: + :spliff: = :stoned:


Edited by JacquesCousteau (02/29/04 03:46 PM)


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OfflineMushmonkey
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Re: nailed to the cross on mushrooms+syrian rue [Re: DoctorJ]
    #2389076 - 02/29/04 04:06 PM (13 years, 7 months ago)

There've been religions based on less, and worse, insights than that.. sounds like you've had a great time man. and from god or not that sounds like some pretty good advice


--------------------
i finally got around to making a sig
revel in its glory and quake in fear at its might
grar.


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OfflineSpecialEd
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Re: nailed to the cross on mushrooms+syrian rue [Re: DoctorJ]
    #2389154 - 02/29/04 07:57 PM (13 years, 7 months ago)

:thumbup:

Good read.  Were you satisfied with your dialogue?  Are there no more questions in you?  How will you feel in a few months?  These things seem to fade for me.


--------------------
"Plus one upvote +1..."
--- //
-- :meff:
  /l_l\/
--\-/----


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Anonymous

Re: nailed to the cross on mushrooms+syrian rue [Re: DoctorJ]
    #2389625 - 02/29/04 11:29 PM (13 years, 7 months ago)

Glad to hear you had such a cool experience, Doctor. Now it's time for me to play devil's advocate.  :wink:

I hear a lot of people complaining how friends "use" them. Why do people say such things? Are you not "using" your friends for companionship? Think about the friends you have. I doubt very much that you hang out with any one of them only because they had no other companions, and that they asked you to hang out with them because they were lonely. I think this is the only case where neither person is "using" the other, because the lonely person actually needs something (as opposed to wanting). We use every person we choose to be with for something. Each person wants something different from you, whether it be companionship or some trait you have or some material thing. If you don't have what someone wants, they won't choose to be around you. If you don't like being "used", stop providing whatever it is the person wants from you.


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OfflineThe_Visionaire
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Re: nailed to the cross on mushrooms+syrian rue [Re: DoctorJ]
    #2389986 - 03/01/04 02:54 AM (13 years, 7 months ago)

That was beautiful, DR.J!  :thumbup:

Hehe, it was clear from your questions that you didn`t make up the answers by yourself.

..and if I do not exactly believe it was God that you talked to, it was definitely a being of higher spiritual knowledge. Perhaps yourself in the future?

What this being, lets call him God, says, is that there is no such thing as a wrong step. Everything you do will lead to understanding and knowledge. Some ways are more painful than others, but perhaps even more enlightening in the end?

Your dialogue with God about evil reminds me of Tolkiens work "The Silmarillion". There Illuvatar (God) explains that everything Melkor (satan) will do to desecrate his work, will only make it more beautiful in the end (as Melkor himself is also a part of Illuvatar). It sounds like God accepts evil as an integral part of his creation.

But the nature of Evil is self-annihilating, and the false material god whom lower beings worship is as empty as the abyss. Would you choose to make the pain go away for a proper powerful and wealthy position in The Matrix?


--------------------
There are no differences between men and gods,
one blends softly causal into the other.
-Frank Herbert, Dune.


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OfflineDestruKtiKon
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Re: nailed to the cross on mushrooms+syrian rue [Re: DoctorJ]
    #2389990 - 03/01/04 02:56 AM (13 years, 7 months ago)

Sounds like you had a good/interesting experience. I can relate to almost all of that. "time will reveal this to you", brilliant! :smile:


--------------------
Light & Music


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Offlinepeleg
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Re: nailed to the cross on mushrooms+syrian rue [Re: DestruKtiKon]
    #2390071 - 03/01/04 03:54 AM (13 years, 7 months ago)

very good read, sooounds like you your being yourself through all of this and that is a great big plus :thumbup:


--------------------
"Well the first days are the hardest days." When life looks like easy street there is danger at your door.....


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Offlinecastaway
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Re: nailed to the cross on mushrooms+syrian rue [Re: DoctorJ]
    #2390333 - 03/01/04 08:08 AM (13 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:

DoctorJ said:

Well, the rest of it was all kinda personal, so i wont include it.




:grin: I want to hear the rest of the story!


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Invisibleraytrace
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Re: nailed to the cross on mushrooms+syrian rue [Re: DoctorJ]
    #2390519 - 03/01/04 10:26 AM (13 years, 7 months ago)

:thumbup: thanks for sharing doc


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OfflineMAIA
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Re: nailed to the cross on mushrooms+syrian rue [Re: DoctorJ]
    #2390662 - 03/01/04 11:35 AM (13 years, 7 months ago)

Nice read. You had a great insight. The funny thing is that my view about the existence of good and evil is the same as you describe when referring to your god.
Your god is very intriguing, he has short straight answers, some are absolute and prove to have some logic.
He praises free will but he's bound to some universal mechanism which makes himself and the whole universe affected by rigid rules or some cosmical order.
The confrontation between good and evil is the basis for the flux of energy in the universe, where the individual navigates in a two way corridor, getting closer and going further from god depending on the choices one makes. It's a simple explanation but it raises some more questions. This way, people with an evil nature have a great handicap getting closer to god because they have to come up first with a balance between good and evil.
Now the big question is, if everything was made having in mind the good and evil as the essence of things, isn't it more logical to find a balance between both good and evil, or is it better to forget the evil side and be just good ?
As i see it, aren't we fooling ourselves and our human existence trying to be just the good side ?
How can we become pure in goodness if we are not perfect, not all knowing and not all doing ?
Evil is the result of our actions, so good is. Electricity is the result of the positive pole but also the negative. The universe works in two way energy flux and i think we cannot exist with just one.

MAIA


--------------------
Spiritual being, living a human experience ... The Shroomery Mandala



Use, do not abuse; neither abstinence nor excess ever renders man happy.
Voltaire


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InvisibleSwami
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Re: nailed to the cross on mushrooms+syrian rue [Re: DoctorJ]
    #2390745 - 03/01/04 12:11 PM (13 years, 7 months ago)

Very deep. I will be interested in how this trip affects you months from now.


--------------------



The proof is in the pudding.


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Offlinefireworks_godS
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Re: nailed to the cross on mushrooms+syrian rue [Re: DoctorJ]
    #2390965 - 03/01/04 01:25 PM (13 years, 7 months ago)

:thumbup:

I really like what the entity had to say. I think it is possible that there was a force, and that it wasn't actually speaking to you, but acting through your mind.. I think it all came from within you. But what sparked it? hehehe. What it was proposing was totally different than what you were asking, and even though what it said was already in your mind in bits and pieces, I think it was putting it together and presenting it to you, since you aren't conscious normally of what it said... *shrugs*

Man, I wouldn't let go of those experiences. Don't just drift away from that perspective.. that is a powerful way of thinking and can really bring about a lot of positive change in yourself and others. We tend to fall back into our old ways of thinking without much change because those type of experiences are the exception...

What you need to do is fight to stay conscious of it. The only way to keep it in mind is to keep it in mind. :grin: It is work and it is going agansit the flow of your mind because it is new, but the benefits are worth it and our minds shouldn't be resistant to change anyways...

Fight for the light, my friend! :lol: *cues the cheesy Oratory music*. Haha, and I'm likely the only person that gets that too. My superiors will be pleased.... :grin:

Okay, I've lost my mind.. if you find it, please cover it in newspapers and repeatedly stomp on it! Smush it, fucker, smush it! :nut:

Hehe, sorry. I really like the messages that were presented, it really promotes self-discovery and consciously making choices.. nothing left to do but integrate, integrate, integrate! :wink:
Peace.


--------------------
:redpanda:
If I should die this very moment
I wouldn't fear
For I've never known completeness
Like being here
Wrapped in the warmth of you
Loving every breath of you

:heartpump: :bunnyhug: :yinyang:

:yinyang: :levitate: :earth: :levitate: :yinyang:


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InvisibleDoctorJ
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Re: nailed to the cross on mushrooms+syrian rue [Re: DoctorJ]
    #2391375 - 03/01/04 03:23 PM (13 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:

I hear a lot of people complaining how friends "use" them. Why do people say such things?




When I extend the utmost kindness and compassion to a fellow human being, and they do not do the same for me, I feel used.

This has nothing to do with a mutual exchange. When I give a bartender $3 for a drink, he is not using me for my money, and I am not using him for his alchohol.

Conversely, if I give a bum $5 in a sincere attempt to help him, and he goes out and spends it on crack, and then sends all of his bum friends to me for their crack money because I am a "softie", then he is using me. He is using the money I gave him to help himself for the purpose of putting himself further into the ditch- ie the exact opposite of my intentions.

Quote:

Very deep. I will be interested in how this trip affects you months from now.




I will probably forget and have to be reminded again.


--------------------
peace, pot, and microdot!


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InvisibleSwami
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Re: nailed to the cross on mushrooms+syrian rue [Re: DoctorJ]
    #2391605 - 03/01/04 04:40 PM (13 years, 7 months ago)

I will probably forget and have to be reminded again.

This is the frustration and danger of tripping. People get in touch with what may or may not be real wisdom, at the time it certainly feels like divine insight, but then slowly evaporates like a dream and we remain relatively unchanged. Then we try to recapture that feeling with higher doses, greater frequency or more powerful substances.

I like the fact that you wrote down your inspiration and "conversation with God" when you were still in a mild psychedelic state. Now you must read and meditate on your thoughts/words daily until some part of that wisdom becomes an integral part of your world view. If this is not done, tripping again will have little benefit.


--------------------



The proof is in the pudding.


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Invisiblemr crisper
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Re: nailed to the cross on mushrooms+syrian rue [Re: Swami]
    #2391689 - 03/01/04 05:03 PM (13 years, 7 months ago)

nicely said, swami.
was it watts that wrote something about, tripping is like climbing a tree in the forest of life. you can get your bearings and enjoy a broader perspective of your situation. but it doesn't pay to climb every tree you see....and be careful of climbing too high.

rue/shrooms is my favorite combo, very much an inner journey.


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InvisibleSwami
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Re: nailed to the cross on mushrooms+syrian rue [Re: mr crisper]
    #2391737 - 03/01/04 05:20 PM (13 years, 7 months ago)

Nothing tastier than a nice cup o' rue.  :tongue:


--------------------



The proof is in the pudding.


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Invisiblekaiowas
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Re: nailed to the cross on mushrooms+syrian rue [Re: DoctorJ]
    #2391993 - 03/01/04 07:10 PM (13 years, 7 months ago)

dude!!!  :shocked:

kick ass post man!!!!

"E: You should do what you would do. Such is your purpose. But I do not concern myself with judgement and intervention. If people want to be close to me they can. If they want to be far from me, they can. But ultimately everyone must come back to the source. Otherwise they will perish. You must do what you think is right. That is your purpose. I am not in your position, though if I were I would protect life whenever possible, even at the expense of my own."

this was something that intrigued me. especially that things can perish if not close enough to god.  what would be the implications of this?    :grin:


--------------------
Annnnnnd I had a light saber and my friend was there and I said "you look like an indian" and he said "you look like satan" and he found a stick and a rock and he named the rock ooga booga and he named the stick Stick and we both thought that was pretty funny. We got eaten alive by mosquitos but didn't notice til the next day. I stepped on some glass while wading in the swamp and cut my foot open, didn't bother me til the next day either....yeah it was a good time, ended the night by buying some liquor for minors and drinking nips and going to he diner and eating chicken fingers, and then I went home and went to bed.---senior doobie


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InvisibleDoctorJ
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Re: nailed to the cross on mushrooms+syrian rue [Re: Swami]
    #2392353 - 03/01/04 09:13 PM (13 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:

This is the frustration and danger of tripping. People get in touch with what may or may not be real wisdom, at the time it certainly feels like divine insight, but then slowly evaporates like a dream and we remain relatively unchanged. Then we try to recapture that feeling with higher doses, greater frequency or more powerful substances.

I like the fact that you wrote down your inspiration and "conversation with God" when you were still in a mild psychedelic state. Now you must read and meditate on your thoughts/words daily until some part of that wisdom becomes an integral part of your world view. If this is not done, tripping again will have little benefit.





actually I think that lessons like these are meant to be forgotten.

they are like dreams where you see too much and your brain keeps you from remembering for your own good.

No human can be God. Humans can only be humans. We might be able to catch a brief glimpse of what's behind the veil, but we are not meant to be in constant contact with the other side.

I am a cynical motherfucker. Those are the cards I was dealt. I have to play out the role that I was assigned. To resist it would be to deny my own essence.

Remember the same God that created Ghandi also created Hitler. And both served their purpose.

we have egos for a reason. They are a necessary evil for existence in this plane.

Now, when my ego starts getting in the way of my purpose, I will take this trip again to remind myself. But I remain convinced that some ego is necessary, and that some mistakes arent really mistakes at all.

the entity basically explained to me that I am in pain because I am far from home and am still finding my way back. But the journey is important, or it wouldnt have been embarked upon in the first place.



PS- rue tastes like shit


--------------------
peace, pot, and microdot!


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Offlinegnrm23
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Re: nailed to the cross on mushrooms+syrian rue [Re: mr crisper]
    #2394180 - 03/02/04 09:22 AM (13 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:

mr crisper said:
nicely said, swami.
was it watts that wrote something about, tripping is like climbing a tree in the forest of life. you can get your bearings and enjoy a broader perspective of your situation. but it doesn't pay to climb every tree you see....and be careful of climbing to high.



~
& of course, the supposed reason for climing the tree was to get your bearings, so that you can continue on your journey; if you spend all your time climbing trees (or, worse, climbing the same tree?), well --- you'll never get out of the forest, right?
~


--------------------
old enough to know better
not old enough to care


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