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InvisibleliloldmeFacebook
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Re: My Small Scale Mushroom Farm [Re: MycoFlora]
    #23964555 - 12/29/16 02:28 AM (7 years, 1 month ago)

Wow that is awesome 9 bags per run is great! I will most definitely be buying one in the next couple days now with that info. Can't wait to get the gourmet mushrooms going!

How are you liking the brick flooring in your fruiting greenhouse, any issues?
I'm getting ready to build my greenhouse 12x24 would like to know if the 1500 bucks in concrete is worth it or not? should I just do gravel or a couple layers of plastic with proper drainage or is that asking for trouble?

I really appreciate  all the help so far, digging the thread thank you much!


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InvisibleMycoFlora
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Re: My Small Scale Mushroom Farm [Re: liloldme]
    #23965212 - 12/29/16 10:51 AM (7 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

liloldme said:
Wow that is awesome 9 bags per run is great! I will most definitely be buying one in the next couple days now with that info. Can't wait to get the gourmet mushrooms going!

How are you liking the brick flooring in your fruiting greenhouse, any issues?
I'm getting ready to build my greenhouse 12x24 would like to know if the 1500 bucks in concrete is worth it or not? should I just do gravel or a couple layers of plastic with proper drainage or is that asking for trouble?

I really appreciate  all the help so far, digging the thread thank you much!



Yea it is quite a space saver being able to fit nine, but keep in mind you will have to reinforce your rack in the bottom or it will definitely break. Also, if you look around, like on piercing supply sites for example, you can find really good deals on aa75x's. I got mine for 600 bucks brand new. So it's definitely worth it to look around.

No problems with the brick so far but I am putting a few tons of travel in soon for better drainage and humidity retention.
If I were you i would absolutely spend the money on concrete and a good drain that you can clean. I am only using brick and gravel because that's what I had available financially. You can certainly get away with using gravel and a plastic barrier underneath, but concrete with drainage is a much better option. You want something you can really clean and that won't pool water.
Gravel can never really be completely cleaned, although I do spray it down with sodium percarbonate/ bleach weekly/bi-weekly. I used weed barrier plastic and gravel at my last place with no issues, so it can be done.
You really just have to balance what is best vs what is practical vs what you can afford and somewhere in there you will find something that works for you.
Good luck with the build! Let me know if you make any progress with it!


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InvisibleMycoFlora
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Re: My Small Scale Mushroom Farm [Re: MycoFlora] * 1
    #23965248 - 12/29/16 11:05 AM (7 years, 1 month ago)

Not that it's anything revolutionary, but I thought I'd post a couple pics of how I do my bags.
40 lb pellet bag into the cement mixer with 20% bran and about 6.5 gallons of water(depends on the batch).


then to the bagging table. I made a bag stand from some scrap wood big enough for my scale to fit under. Ugly but hey it works. Scoop, weigh and fold. works way quicker than when I used to individually scoop everything for each bag. Can do about 50 bags an hour.


Here is the sterilizer I'm working on.


again, pretty ugly, but I'm still in the process of getting it set up.
1500w heating element and the tub is like 80 gallons I think, may be smaller I honestly forget.
Moving it indoors soon and installing wheels to roll it directly into the lab.
My question is this-I do not have a float valve installed..if I put enough water in to last for a 24 hour steam, do I need a float valve?
I realize a float valve is ideal and I plan on installing one in the future, but can it be done or is there too much risk of running it dry and blowing the element?

Open for critique to all.
Cheers.

-Scott


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OfflineMorePies
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Re: My Small Scale Mushroom Farm [Re: MycoFlora]
    #23965602 - 12/29/16 01:42 PM (7 years, 1 month ago)

I burned out my first element in my 55gal barrel on the first run with no float thinking it could make it. Went through the 8" of water in about 6 hours. My next run, still with no float I was adding 2-3gal every 3 hours! This was also running it off a PID which I use to not keep the element on the whole run. Once it's at temp it seems to run for 20-30 seconds/minute. I now have a float valve and pressure regulator akin to what Gr0wer uses.

What's your thought on a steam barrel and plumbing it into your stock tank  without using a float?

An alternative untested by me would be a gate valve to control water in and having an overflow so you don't flood your bags. The goal being to match the flow of water in to the evaporation out. If anyone has ever cooked on a line with a pasta machine, it can be done, but isn't an exact science. The look on a pasta cook's face when they get hit and they have boiled too low or are overflowing with cold water from the machine deciding to get away from its happy place is one of complete despair.

I have never looked into solenoids, but that could be an option as well.


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Offlinevolvovr
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Re: My Small Scale Mushroom Farm [Re: MorePies]
    #23966130 - 12/29/16 05:24 PM (7 years, 1 month ago)

Interesting I've bought myself two barrels yesterday. It was a 1hour trip so for 12$ each why not 2?! Bought myself a SS float valve too. I can't always be there checking for the level of the water. If I'm making a 24 hour run, I don't want to get up each 3-4 hours for putting water in it.

Plus the risk of fire. The element could burn the wooden false bottom or the plastic or whatever you use if it's getting dry.

Tought of one barrel with heated water pumping steam to the other one but a set-up with two barrels with one half full of water and the other with the bags, I don't have the space for it. So I'm back to the Groower design and maybe I could improve the longivity of the barrel with a heat sheild next to the element and other ideas I have.

Maybe Groower can answer my question but I don't remember why a flow control valve? Can't find the video where he explain why.

Anyway I'm not questioning the idea of purchasing a SS barrel but for me 800$ for a SS barel instead of 12$ for a plastic one... 800$/12$=67. I will need to pass over 67 plastics barrels to get into the investment of one single SS barel. But I understand the investment Groower is making just not a good idea for me!

Sometimes the simplier ideas are the better.


Edited by volvovr (12/29/16 05:29 PM)


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Offlinedrake89
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Re: My Small Scale Mushroom Farm [Re: MorePies]
    #23966173 - 12/29/16 05:47 PM (7 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

MorePies said:
I burned out my first element in my 55gal barrel on the first run with no float thinking it could make it. Went through the 8" of water in about 6 hours. My next run, still with no float I was adding 2-3gal every 3 hours! This was also running it off a PID which I use to not keep the element on the whole run. Once it's at temp it seems to run for 20-30 seconds/minute. I now have a float valve and pressure regulator akin to what Gr0wer uses.

What's your thought on a steam barrel and plumbing it into your stock tank  without using a float?

An alternative untested by me would be a gate valve to control water in and having an overflow so you don't flood your bags. The goal being to match the flow of water in to the evaporation out. If anyone has ever cooked on a line with a pasta machine, it can be done, but isn't an exact science. The look on a pasta cook's face when they get hit and they have boiled too low or are overflowing with cold water from the machine deciding to get away from its happy place is one of complete despair.

I have never looked into solenoids, but that could be an option as well.



I used a valve on a timer when I ripped the electronics out of my sauna steamers.  Now I use a float valve in my steam barrel.


--------------------
Fiery Fungi (like us on faeboo)


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Offlinekeifnnugs
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Re: My Small Scale Mushroom Farm [Re: drake89]
    #23966447 - 12/29/16 07:44 PM (7 years, 1 month ago)

I'm stealing this bagging contraption idea.. :thumbup:
Looks like it will save me a ton of time and a lot less mess


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OfflineRolledUhhp
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Re: My Small Scale Mushroom Farm [Re: keifnnugs]
    #23966469 - 12/29/16 07:50 PM (7 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

keifnnugs said:
I'm stealing this bagging contraption idea.. :thumbup:
Looks like it will save me a ton of time and a lot less mess






It's such a simple design, executes so efficiently.
This definitely got saved to my mycology folder!


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OfflineMorePies
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Re: My Small Scale Mushroom Farm [Re: volvovr]
    #23967024 - 12/29/16 11:10 PM (7 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

volvovr said:


Maybe Groower can answer my question but I don't remember why a flow control valve? Can't find the video where he explain why.


Sometimes the simplier ideas are the better.




The float valve that I have (I think Gr0wer also has the same 1) does not handle the 40-60psi that my household water pressure comes out at. It overpowers the valve causing it not to be able to close completely, thus flooding all the bags. The pressure regulator allows the pressure to be controlled so this doesn't happen.


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InvisibleliloldmeFacebook
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Re: My Small Scale Mushroom Farm [Re: keifnnugs]
    #23967268 - 12/30/16 03:33 AM (7 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

keifnnugs said:
I'm stealing this bagging contraption idea.. :thumbup:
Looks like it will save me a ton of time and a lot less mess



:whathesaid:

Hey so since you guys aren't building up pressure in your steam sterilizers and running them at atmospheric pressure I imagine you don't run the risk of imploding the barrel or container if you add cold water too quickly? I have heard of this happening with steam sterilizers that run at 2-3psi I would be very upset


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InvisibleMycoFlora
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Re: My Small Scale Mushroom Farm [Re: liloldme]
    #23967616 - 12/30/16 09:35 AM (7 years, 1 month ago)

from what I've read I believe you still want a valve on the hose feed to your float valve or a psi regulator like morepies suggested. it is also supposed to help with radical temp changes the slower it is fed, which is what causes the implosion I believe.


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InvisibleMycoFlora
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Re: My Small Scale Mushroom Farm [Re: MorePies]
    #23967632 - 12/30/16 09:41 AM (7 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

MorePies said:
I burned out my first element in my 55gal barrel on the first run with no float thinking it could make it. Went through the 8" of water in about 6 hours. My next run, still with no float I was adding 2-3gal every 3 hours! This was also running it off a PID which I use to not keep the element on the whole run. Once it's at temp it seems to run for 20-30 seconds/minute. I now have a float valve and pressure regulator akin to what Gr0wer uses.

What's your thought on a steam barrel and plumbing it into your stock tank  without using a float?

An alternative untested by me would be a gate valve to control water in and having an overflow so you don't flood your bags. The goal being to match the flow of water in to the evaporation out. If anyone has ever cooked on a line with a pasta machine, it can be done, but isn't an exact science. The look on a pasta cook's face when they get hit and they have boiled too low or are overflowing with cold water from the machine deciding to get away from its happy place is one of complete despair.

I have never looked into solenoids, but that could be an option as well.



hm thanks for the voice of unfortunate experience.
I would love to pipe steam into the tank from a steam barrel, but I've always been deterred because of my lack of engineering acumen and safety concerns.
If you aren't running it at pressure is there any danger in just piping it with, say, high temp pex, to your stock tank using weldless bulk head fittings?
Any safety concerns I'm not taking into account or is it really that simple?
I suppose a 5psi relief valve on the steam barrel would be the bare minimum for some sort of safety mechanism.


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InvisibleMycoFlora
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Registered: 10/06/14
Posts: 309
Re: My Small Scale Mushroom Farm [Re: RolledUhhp]
    #23967664 - 12/30/16 10:00 AM (7 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

RolledUhhp said:
Quote:

keifnnugs said:
I'm stealing this bagging contraption idea.. :thumbup:
Looks like it will save me a ton of time and a lot less mess






It's such a simple design, executes so efficiently.
This definitely got saved to my mycology folder!



Glad you guys found it somewhat useful!
That's why i love this place. You never know who you will help or inspire with even the most insignificant things.:rockon:


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OfflineMorePies
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Re: My Small Scale Mushroom Farm [Re: MycoFlora]
    #23968918 - 12/30/16 07:04 PM (7 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

MycoFlora said:
from what I've read I believe you still want a valve on the hose feed to your float valve or a psi regulator like morepies suggested. it is also supposed to help with radical temp changes the slower it is fed, which is what causes the implosion I believe.




Mine still didn't work right with just trying to adjust the valve, I had to get a regulator. Even then, the thing is a touchy. I have mine T'd off of the washing machine hot water line. I used to turn the hot water heater all the way up, but I found leaving it below scalding temperature works fine for hydrating wood pellets. They just fluff right up. Also, immediately burning my hands at the kitchen sink got old real fast. This winter, it sure has been nice working outside with warm substrate and it helps the bags get up to temp that much faster. The flow is slow enough that the "hot" water doesn't seem to slow my 5000 watt element down enough to matter during the run. If these systems were sealed and under pressure, a dramatic temperature change would be a danger. I just have a hole in my lid big enough to get the thermocoupler through. I clamp down the lid, put a brick over the hole, and steam puffs out the top as needed. In fact, I wish my gasket for the lid was better so less steam got out.

Quote:

MycoFlora said:
hm thanks for the voice of unfortunate experience.
I would love to pipe steam into the tank from a steam barrel, but I've always been deterred because of my lack of engineering acumen and safety concerns.
If you aren't running it at pressure is there any danger in just piping it with, say, high temp pex, to your stock tank using weldless bulk head fittings?
Any safety concerns I'm not taking into account or is it really that simple?
I suppose a 5psi relief valve on the steam barrel would be the bare minimum for some sort of safety mechanism.




To put it one way, I certainly understand all too well the idea that people learn more from their mistakes than their successes!

You know, I can't really say if that high temp pex is the way to go, or recommend to someone else to play with a potential high pressure steam situation.

If it were me, I'd grab a propane/map gas torch and just go for it with some copper fittings. With the pex, i'd look at the max temp rating and just go with what was way above 212. That steam isn't going to work really hard to force it's way out if there's a 3/4" hose that's free and clear for it to go.  Emphasis on the free and clear. Those relief valves can be found for under 10$, and a replacement presto steam gauge is 23 on ebay or amazon, I forget which. America first, then safety. Thanks for sharing your build and thought process, we are working along similar scales for some of these components and it's great to be able to see some of your solutions to the challenges of mushroom cultivation.


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InvisibleMycoFlora
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Re: My Small Scale Mushroom Farm [Re: MorePies]
    #23970677 - 12/31/16 12:46 PM (7 years, 30 days ago)






To put it one way, I certainly understand all too well the idea that people learn more from their mistakes than their successes!

You know, I can't really say if that high temp pex is the way to go, or recommend to someone else to play with a potential high pressure steam situation.

If it were me, I'd grab a propane/map gas torch and just go for it with some copper fittings. With the pex, i'd look at the max temp rating and just go with what was way above 212. That steam isn't going to work really hard to force it's way out if there's a 3/4" hose that's free and clear for it to go.  Emphasis on the free and clear. Those relief valves can be found for under 10$, and a replacement presto steam gauge is 23 on ebay or amazon, I forget which. America first, then safety. Thanks for sharing your build and thought process, we are working along similar scales for some of these components and it's great to be able to see some of your solutions to the challenges of mushroom cultivation.




Ha! I run my hot water from my washing machine line too.
I'll put some thought into the copper pipe suggestion. I think I may just end up going with the float valve though since it is cheap and effective.
What psi regulator did you put on your inlet?
I have tons of old drip irrigation regulators lying around, not sure if they could handle the temps though.

And hey I love sharing. I learn something new with every conversation  I have here. I'm just glad I have others to dump some of this stuff on instead of my wife lol lord  she hears it 24/7.

Mind posting any pics of your sterilizer?


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InvisibleMycoFlora
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Re: My Small Scale Mushroom Farm [Re: MycoFlora]
    #23970729 - 12/31/16 01:07 PM (7 years, 30 days ago)

And just a small update!

Just popped some more shiitake in the greenhouse. Slapped and cold shocked for 24 hours, flipped and lifted to pin in the bag as drake suggested.


Some kings that just got out in a few days ago and have yet to pin. they are about 4 weeks old, but I am going to give them another week before I start worrying.

I flipped my flow hoods to gain some extra vertical space so I can use my scale during inoculation to measure spawn %. I have found that 99% of the time my eyeballing is completely accurate, but I am about to be buying in spawn from Amycel so I cannot afford to waste a single grain!
I only do one bag at a time anyway and since my sealer is semi automatic I can perfectly pace inoculating, shaking and labeling. Love that damn sealer.


Now on to my issues of the week. My shiitake have been pinning fpr what feels like two weeks now. That doesn't seem normal to me. The temp is a constant 55-60 and humidity is always around 85-95%. I am thinking the culprit is the light. I don't have any! I was hoping they could function off a little less light since they still get about 8-10 hours a day of sunlight, but I am not sure. What do you guys think?






I have a few t-8s lying around but they are not water tight vapor gaurd lights. I think I might try to cover them in plastic and mount on the ceiling.

Thanks everyone for being a sounding board. Keep on shroomin' and happy New year!


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InvisibleliloldmeFacebook
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Re: My Small Scale Mushroom Farm [Re: MycoFlora]
    #23970785 - 12/31/16 01:27 PM (7 years, 30 days ago)

Awesome!! Great work so far!


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OfflineQuadman
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Re: My Small Scale Mushroom Farm [Re: liloldme]
    #23970835 - 12/31/16 01:46 PM (7 years, 30 days ago)

There is a pex rated for 230° used for solar. Regular pex is rated for 180°  it will handle more at low pressure but it shrinks the pipe.


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Offlinedrake89
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Re: My Small Scale Mushroom Farm [Re: Quadman]
    #23971147 - 12/31/16 03:26 PM (7 years, 30 days ago)

Quote:

Quadman said:
There is a pex rated for 230° used for solar. Regular pex is rated for 180°  it will handle more at low pressure but it shrinks the pipe.



I have been using some old pex scraps that's just cold water rated from my boiler to the steam shack.  I think it's fine since there's no pressure.  It will definetly not last forever tho, it's kind of brittle already.  Copper is $$$


--------------------
Fiery Fungi (like us on faeboo)


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InvisibleliloldmeFacebook
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Re: My Small Scale Mushroom Farm [Re: drake89]
    #23971190 - 12/31/16 03:45 PM (7 years, 30 days ago)

Well I did it MycoFlora, I ordered the AA75xz today can't wait :datass:


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