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Offlinerubberlizard
Brewer and hobbymycologist
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Registered: 10/26/10
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Last seen: 2 years, 7 months
Seitan with meat? (cooking with insects)
    #23887149 - 12/02/16 10:29 AM (7 years, 1 month ago)

The main problem about bugs, seems to be them being bugs. So if you could make them look like something else i think people would eat them.

So i have been thinking about making fake chicken nuggets, cricket nuggets that would be.

Thinking about making something similar to seitan, but adding cricket flour.



With the cricket flour adding protein you could save on the gluten, or maybe do completely without it. Thinking cornstarch and eggs could do the binding of the 'chicken' part of the nugget. And then do like you would do normaly when making the crispy outside.

>

Ive tried soy based chicken substitute and it was good, but not very chicken like. Chewy and rubberlike and the only chicken taste was from the poultry stock. Any one know how seitan is compared to soy based products?

Do you think the cricket, egg corn starch mix would stick together and have enought 'bite' to feel like real meat?
Any ideas how much of each to use?

This here recipe uses 1/5 cricket flour for pasta:

http://www.gastrobug.com/recipe/super-cricket-pasta/

How about the taste, havent tasted crickets yet, but people say they do not taste like a lot. Can poultry stock cover the taste?


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Invisiblekoraks
Registered: 06/02/03
Posts: 26,672
Re: Seitan with meat? (cooking with insects) [Re: rubberlizard]
    #23895829 - 12/05/16 03:23 AM (7 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

Do you think the cricket, egg corn starch mix would stick together and have enought 'bite' to feel like real meat?



Probably not. The corn starch will make it stick together if you get the ratio right, but it will make it closer to a gelatinous mass than to something fiber-like like seitan. The egg will make it come together a bit more and perhaps add some air. A disadvantage of corn starch is that it tends to flatten flavors, so getting the flavor right will be a huge issue. It's the primary reason why I barely use any corn starch at all.

The reason why seitan 'works' is because the gluten create polymers that make the thing coherent and sort of spongy. Something similar could be done with other food polymers such as casein.

Adding a certain percentage of protein flour (of any origin) to seitan may work, but keep in mind that in making seitan, you wash out the non-polymer stuff from the matrix. Adding insect flour to regular flour and then making seitan with it will probably result in the vast majority of the protein being washed out of the seitan.

If you plan on using poultry stock to induce a chicken flavor, I don't see why you wouldn't just eat chicken. Seitan or a soy-based alternative can be flavored with non-meat based stocks, which can be quite good. I personally don't see much use in trying to recreate vegetarian meat; vegetarian alternatives to meat can be great in their own way without trying to make them look, feel and taste like meat.


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Offlinerubberlizard
Brewer and hobbymycologist
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Registered: 10/26/10
Posts: 388
Loc: Probably my brewery
Last seen: 2 years, 7 months
Re: Seitan with meat? (cooking with insects) [Re: koraks]
    #23902112 - 12/07/16 02:12 AM (7 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

koraks said:
Quote:

Do you think the cricket, egg corn starch mix would stick together and have enought 'bite' to feel like real meat?



Probably not. The corn starch will make it stick together if you get the ratio right, but it will make it closer to a gelatinous mass than to something fiber-like like seitan. The egg will make it come together a bit more and perhaps add some air. A disadvantage of corn starch is that it tends to flatten flavors, so getting the flavor right will be a huge issue. It's the primary reason why I barely use any corn starch at all.

The reason why seitan 'works' is because the gluten create polymers that make the thing coherent and sort of spongy. Something similar could be done with other food polymers such as casein.

Adding a certain percentage of protein flour (of any origin) to seitan may work, but keep in mind that in making seitan, you wash out the non-polymer stuff from the matrix. Adding insect flour to regular flour and then making seitan with it will probably result in the vast majority of the protein being washed out of the seitan.

If you plan on using poultry stock to induce a chicken flavor, I don't see why you wouldn't just eat chicken. Seitan or a soy-based alternative can be flavored with non-meat based stocks, which can be quite good. I personally don't see much use in trying to recreate vegetarian meat; vegetarian alternatives to meat can be great in their own way without trying to make them look, feel and taste like meat.




Thanks, never tried seitan before and dont know anything about how it reacts. ITs hard to find here in Denmark.

The reason for this is to make bugs less buggy, and who does not love chicken nuggets? :smile:

Think ill try making a very firm omelet with flour, eggs and cricket flour for the chicken part to see how it will works.


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Offlinerubberlizard
Brewer and hobbymycologist
Male User Gallery

Registered: 10/26/10
Posts: 388
Loc: Probably my brewery
Last seen: 2 years, 7 months
Re: Seitan with meat? (cooking with insects) [Re: rubberlizard]
    #23964707 - 12/29/16 05:56 AM (7 years, 1 month ago)

Did a nugget experiment with eggs, flour and chicken stock. MAybe it was bad chicken stock, but it had next to no taste of chicken.
It needed more flour, but the crumbling was great. The real problem was the taste, had it tasted alot like chicken it would have been good, but the way it was was just boring.
Maybe ill try to make some concnetrated stock next time i make a hole chicken, and see if it helps.


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