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InvisibleThe Blind Ass
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Registered: 08/16/16
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Re: Is life worth living? [Re: The Blind Ass] * 1
    #23852585 - 11/20/16 07:53 PM (7 years, 2 months ago)

In Dzogchen, the metaphor most commonly used to describe our situation is that of a mirror and its reflections. The reflections in a mirror are like the thoughts in our mind, which if we don't recognize as being an illusory, impermanent, unmediated, manifestation of our true nature, we will react to, identify with, become conditioned by, absorbed in and embody. Our true nature state, on the other hand, is likened to the mirror itself, which underlies and embraces all of the reflections, all the while remaining pure and changeless, never being tainted or stained by any of the reflections. It is important to realize that each thought in our mind is like a dream; once we become absorbed in a thought, we have literally entered a complete dream universe and have evoked and stepped into an illusory, limited and arbitrary identity which we experience as being who we truly are. In Dzogchen, if we get immersed in our dream-like thoughts and don't recognize the pure, mirror-like nature of our mind, we are literally considered to be nonlucidly dreaming.

The problem is that as long as we are identified with and absorbed in the imagination or thought of being a separate self we are going to resist part of our experience, as resistance and contraction are themselves the very expression of the separate self. Once we, as a separate self, see that we are resisting our experience, we will undoubtedly try and not resist, which is just another, more subtle form of resistance, and we will find ourselves in a self-created double bind, a prisoner of our own mind once again.

Dzogchen truly offers us the key to liberation; from the Dzogchen point of view, these contractions and resistances are themselves seen to be the unmediated expression of the enlightened mind itself. If we don't recognize this, we will react to our resistance like it is something real and separate from ourselves, seeing it as a true obstruction to our enlightenment. If our resistance is seen in this way, it will, in no time whatsoever, spontaneously shape-shift and manifest as a seemingly genuine obscuration, as it is nothing other than our own reflection, and we will once again be caught in the infinite regression known as samsara or cyclic existence.

On the other hand, if we recognize our resistance as the unmediated expression of our enlightened nature itself, which is none other than to become lucid in the dream, not only does the resistance not last very long, but it ceases to be problematic, as we are no longer resisting our resistance, and have thus snapped out of our infinite regression. The resistance then reveals itself to be the very vehicle through which we have deepened our realization, as we have embraced even the part of ourselves that is non-embracing.


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Offlinedeff
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Re: Is life worth living? [Re: Thanatos10]
    #23852587 - 11/20/16 07:54 PM (7 years, 2 months ago)

meaningless only exists in relation to meaning. if there is no meaning, there is also no meaninglessness, there just is what is. and why is that a problem exactly?

i would say if looking outwards to life is bleak or whatever, then balance that by focusing inwards. learn to love yourself, fall in love with your inner dimensions. there is much to explore, so long as your mind doesn't put the breaks on it with a "but what is the point of that" question.

just to add - i do think life has a meaningful "purpose" in a sense, and that is why we decided to experience it. but within the experience, we are left in the dark - much like plato's cave, where we stare at the light on the wall unaware that there is a source of light, a whole expansive reality, 'behind us'. :smile: if we keep looking outwards it can seem bleak. so turn around and look where the light is coming from... go exploring :smile:


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OfflinePlantManBee
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Re: Is life worth living? [Re: Thanatos10]
    #23852588 - 11/20/16 07:54 PM (7 years, 2 months ago)

I remember calling a suicide hotline many years ago. The operator was so apathetic about my plight that it angered me into wanting life. Thanks a lot A-hole. :tongue2: :wink:


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Invisiblesudly
Darwin's stagger


Registered: 01/05/15
Posts: 10,812
Re: Is life worth living? [Re: Thanatos10]
    #23852590 - 11/20/16 07:56 PM (7 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

Thanatos10 said:
Quote:

sudly said:
Then what the fuck do you want? A diamond dildo?

Jesus dude, are you not satisfied by anything?

Try to put things in perspective, we truly do live in a heaven on Earth in a hell that is the Universe.

Life can't survive outside our atmosphere.(except in spaceships and tardigrades)





We have minds developed enough to wonder why we are even alive and why we should keep going anyway. That's a curse not a gift. Earth isn't heaven either. Nature is a vicious struggle to survive.




Quote:

a heaven on Earth in a hell that is the Universe.




We also have minds developed enough to make do with what we have.


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I am whatever Darwin needs me to be.



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Offlinedeff
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Re: Is life worth living? [Re: Thanatos10]
    #23852598 - 11/20/16 08:00 PM (7 years, 2 months ago)

also thanatos, there is a book I feel might benefit you. I haven't read it, but from what I've gathered about it, I think it might be a good bridge from your current perspective to something new (and more enjoyable).

the book: https://www.amazon.com/Biocentrism-Consciousness-Understanding-Nature-Universe/dp/1935251740/ref=sr_1_1/155-2042837-7890928?ie=UTF8&qid=1479697161&sr=8-1&keywords=biocentrism

and the sequel: https://www.amazon.com/Beyond-Biocentrism-Rethinking-Consciousness-Illusion/dp/194295221X/ref=sr_1_2/155-2042837-7890928?ie=UTF8&qid=1479697161&sr=8-2&keywords=biocentrism

your life is in your hands, as always :smile: best wishes and good luck :heart:


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InvisibleDividedQuantumM
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Re: Is life worth living? [Re: Thanatos10] * 2
    #23852604 - 11/20/16 08:01 PM (7 years, 2 months ago)

Y'all can keep posting, and trying to get through his thick skin until you're blue in the face, but he won't listen to any of you.  You're wasting your time, and the attention you're giving him is detrimental to all of us.  He has his mind made up, and is not going to consider ANY other perspective.  He just wants attention.  Just stop.


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Vi Veri Universum Vivus Vici


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InvisibleThe Blind Ass
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Re: Is life worth living? [Re: DividedQuantum]
    #23852616 - 11/20/16 08:05 PM (7 years, 2 months ago)

yeah.  he's just a young boy with alot more living and learning to do.  In his own time.


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Offlinedeff
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Re: Is life worth living? [Re: DividedQuantum] * 1
    #23852619 - 11/20/16 08:07 PM (7 years, 2 months ago)

I tend to agree, but I also see engaging with him as a worthwhile exercise, it's like dialoguing with a part of myself that doesn't believe in the rest :smile: and it can be good to converse with that aspect of mind-centric doubt and nihilism, as I think that's a propensity we can all have at times.

I don't think it will change Thanatos' mind right now, but perhaps it might plant some idea-seeds that will sprout later. I don't feel that he is debating in good faith necessarily, but still... who knows. I do think it's possible to fall into his way of thinking, and if any of our responses help a bit that's good :smile:


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Invisiblesudly
Darwin's stagger


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Re: Is life worth living? [Re: Thanatos10]
    #23852626 - 11/20/16 08:10 PM (7 years, 2 months ago)



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InvisibleThe Blind Ass
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Re: Is life worth living? [Re: sudly]
    #23852631 - 11/20/16 08:12 PM (7 years, 2 months ago)

:dontdothat:


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OfflineThanatos10
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Re: Is life worth living? [Re: deff]
    #23853048 - 11/21/16 12:20 AM (7 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

deff said:
also thanatos, there is a book I feel might benefit you. I haven't read it, but from what I've gathered about it, I think it might be a good bridge from your current perspective to something new (and more enjoyable).

the book: https://www.amazon.com/Biocentrism-Consciousness-Understanding-Nature-Universe/dp/1935251740/ref=sr_1_1/155-2042837-7890928?ie=UTF8&qid=1479697161&sr=8-1&keywords=biocentrism

and the sequel: https://www.amazon.com/Beyond-Biocentrism-Rethinking-Consciousness-Illusion/dp/194295221X/ref=sr_1_2/155-2042837-7890928?ie=UTF8&qid=1479697161&sr=8-2&keywords=biocentrism

your life is in your hands, as always :smile: best wishes and good luck :heart:




That's the type of nonsense I try to stay away from. All it shows is a poor understanding of quantum physics.


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As lightless oblivion devours you, drown in the ever-blooming darkness.


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OfflineThanatos10
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Re: Is life worth living? [Re: The Blind Ass]
    #23853052 - 11/21/16 12:21 AM (7 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

The Blind Ass said:
yeah.  he's just a young boy with alot more living and learning to do.  In his own time.




I've learned that spirituality is a dead end that pretends it has answers.


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OfflineThanatos10
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Re: Is life worth living? [Re: DividedQuantum]
    #23853058 - 11/21/16 12:23 AM (7 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

DividedQuantum said:
Y'all can keep posting, and trying to get through his thick skin until you're blue in the face, but he won't listen to any of you.  You're wasting your time, and the attention you're giving him is detrimental to all of us.  He has his mind made up, and is not going to consider ANY other perspective.  He just wants attention.  Just stop.



Because so far nothing has been able to answer the question as to why one should continue to live, why continue to struggle? No one has been able to answer the question about why one should stay alive. I have asked that question all over the Internet and no one has an answer for it.


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OfflineBuster_Brown
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Re: Is life worth living? [Re: Thanatos10]
    #23853127 - 11/21/16 01:17 AM (7 years, 2 months ago)

So now the suicidal is in a position to experiment...just what is Matthew 16:25 on about anyway?


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Invisiblesudly
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Re: Is life worth living? [Re: Thanatos10]
    #23853129 - 11/21/16 01:18 AM (7 years, 2 months ago)

:encryptedpm:

Hurry up and feed nature already.


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InvisibleDisoRDeR
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Re: Is life worth living? [Re: Thanatos10] * 2
    #23853148 - 11/21/16 01:36 AM (7 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

Thanatos10 said:
Because so far nothing has been able to answer the question as to why one should continue to live, why continue to struggle? No one has been able to answer the question about why one should stay alive. I have asked that question all over the Internet and no one has an answer for it.




It's always in the last place you look.

:lamastare:


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InvisibleLunarEclipse
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Re: Is life worth living? [Re: The Blind Ass]
    #23853687 - 11/21/16 09:30 AM (7 years, 2 months ago)

Sounds super preachy.



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Anxiety is what you make it.


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Invisiblelaughingdog
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Re: Is life worth living? [Re: DisoRDeR] * 1
    #23853775 - 11/21/16 10:05 AM (7 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

DisoRDeR said:
Quote:

Thanatos10 said:
Because so far nothing has been able to answer the question as to why one should continue to live, why continue to struggle? No one has been able to answer the question about why one should stay alive. I have asked that question all over the Internet and no one has an answer for it.




Because it's a stupid question

there are some tricky words

one is "try"
you don't try to get out of a chair and stand up
you just stand up 
trying to relax, guarntees you won’t relax

another tricky word is "should"
there is no reason the snow should fall
it  just does
there is no reason for the universe to be a universe
it just is

you don't ry to live
you just wake up in the morning
until you don't

we don't wake up in the morning because we've considered it in our dreams and decided it's a good idea
we just wake up

the notion that life is a struggle
is just an idea
which builds, into opinion, belief, and emotion
some say it is a challenge, or a gift, or whatever
all just opinion

a fox caught in a trap chews it's leg off
no opinions
no trying
no shoulds
no complaining
no hoping
just pure action

Perhaps you aka Thanatos10  think the question is clever
or you enjoy stumping folks
or you want excuses to avoid certain things
who knows

but in the end it is simply misguided

as deff said
“meaningless only exists in relation to meaning. if there is no meaning, there is also no meaninglessness, there just is what is. and why is that a problem exactly?”

no meaning
no meaninglessness
no shoulds
no complaining
no opinions
no trying

all unnecessary


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InvisibleLunarEclipse
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Re: Is life worth living? [Re: laughingdog]
    #23853801 - 11/21/16 10:12 AM (7 years, 2 months ago)

really, there is still time for you to wake up.  preaching isn't going to cut it.  doing an honest evaluation of the condition of the earth might, but in this case likely not.  theres always hope, however.


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Anxiety is what you make it.


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Invisiblelaughingdog
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Re: Is life worth living? [Re: LunarEclipse]
    #23853858 - 11/21/16 10:34 AM (7 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

LunarEclipse said:
really, there is still time for you to wake up.  preaching isn't going to cut it.  doing an honest evaluation of the condition of the earth might, but in this case likely not.  theres always hope, however.




apparently you feel / assume

1)  I am not as 'awake' as you are
2) I should 'wake up'
3)  and that I am more preachy than you !!!

4) you assume I don't know earth is messed up
5) you assume if I did know this it would be the same as 'enlightenment'

6) you state you are an optimist, but about what is unspecified, although possibly it could be an attempt at indicating superiority by the use of sarcasm, but is too vague, to really make a case for anything.

Your post seems an an odd mix of partly formed ideas and assumptions that fails to find focus, other than to express feelings of distain in a supposedly disguised rational format. Last time before you got banned (for posting numerous rants) you just came right out and called me all the 'nasty' names you could think of at that moment. You are entirely welcome to do so again, for all I care.


Edited by laughingdog (11/21/16 10:47 AM)


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