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OfflineMattMVS7
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Life extension on psychedelics
    #23841962 - 11/17/16 02:23 PM (7 years, 2 months ago)

Many scientists are trying so hard to find ways to extend our lives.  Perhaps for us to even live thousands of years.  But why should they bother when a psychedelic drug can do just that?  If a person takes a powerful does of a psychedelic drug and they claimed to have lived multiple lives or even millenniums in some blissful realm, then really, what is the difference between the life extended period achieved through scientific technology as opposed to the life extended period experienced in a psychedelic drug trip?

Actually, I see the life extension achieved on a psychedelic far better than any scientific technology can ever achieve.  You could be living in a life that is far more blissful and better than this unfortunate life filled with suffering and disease that science has yet to find cures for.  Not only that, if you got to live many millenniums in such a blissful realm, then that is a vast period of time that I don't think any scientific technology can possibly achieve. 

It could.  But only far far into the future.  We are nowhere near that goal.  Therefore, why don't scientists already recognize psychedelics as the solution right now to extend our lives?  All of the achievements of their life extended futuristic technology is all packed within these drugs and scientists don't even give recognition to that.  Yes, I realize that some of the effects of these drugs are unpredictable.  But as long as they are capable of allowing you to live thousands of years in a blissful realm, then I already see these drugs as being the solution to life extension.

The goal of life extension is to simply prolong our lives.  This goal can be achieved through psychedelic trips.  So it doesn't matter if this goal is achieved here in the physical world or not, my point was that it would be a solution to life extension since the goal itself of living longer can be achieved through the use of a psychedelic drug.  It might matter to some, but those who just simply wish to live longer and don't care if that takes place here in this physical reality, then a solution to life extension has already been found for these types of people.


Edited by MattMVS7 (11/17/16 07:22 PM)


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OfflineTrypto-Fan
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Re: Life extension on psychedelics [Re: MattMVS7]
    #23842006 - 11/17/16 02:35 PM (7 years, 2 months ago)

The altered states of psychedelics are unpredictable, ineffable, and intangible.

Trips are not a 'solution' to real world life extension,
You're comparing two quite unrelated things as if they were analogous..


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OfflineMattMVS7
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Re: Life extension on psychedelics [Re: Trypto-Fan]
    #23842026 - 11/17/16 02:41 PM (7 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

Trypto-Fan said:
The altered states of psychedelics are unpredictable, ineffable, and intangible.

Trips are not a 'solution' to real world life extension,
You're comparing two quite unrelated things as if they were analogous..




But don't some people who take these drugs claim that they have literally lived thousands of years in a blissful realm?  If that is the case, then why can't this be a solution to life extension?  Yes, I know that the effects of these drugs are unpredictable, but as long as they are capable of allowing someone to live thousands of years, then why can't that be a solution to life extension?


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OfflineTrypto-Fan
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Re: Life extension on psychedelics [Re: MattMVS7]
    #23842037 - 11/17/16 02:46 PM (7 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

MattMVS7 said:
Quote:

Trypto-Fan said:
The altered states of psychedelics are unpredictable, ineffable, and intangible.

Trips are not a 'solution' to real world life extension,
You're comparing two quite unrelated things as if they were analogous..




But don't some people who take these drugs claim that they have literally lived thousands of years in a blissful realm?  If that is the case, then why can't this be a solution to life extension?  Yes, I know that the effects of these drugs are unpredictable, but as long as they are capable of allowing someone to live thousands of years, then why can't that be a solution to life extension?




In a very vague way, yes..
But this is conflating the physical and the metaphysical.

I've had between 200-300 trips, and though having experienced extreme time dilation I've never experienced other tangible lifetimes.
I realise this can be the case but it's not easily replicated, and it's not a solution to physically prolonging a life in the physical realm.


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Offlinekrypto2000
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Re: Life extension on psychedelics [Re: Trypto-Fan]
    #23842164 - 11/17/16 03:17 PM (7 years, 2 months ago)

Psychedelics do dilate time, I've lived many lives, but the thing is they do not extend THIS life. For now the one we keep coming back to. Let me ask you this. You agree you can travel on psychedelics to unimaginable places and at ineffable speeds but has this made cars useless? Why not? There's your answer.


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OfflineDmt_psilocybin
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Re: Life extension on psychedelics [Re: MattMVS7]
    #23842167 - 11/17/16 03:17 PM (7 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

MattMVS7 said:
Quote:

Trypto-Fan said:
The altered states of psychedelics are unpredictable, ineffable, and intangible.

Trips are not a 'solution' to real world life extension,
You're comparing two quite unrelated things as if they were analogous..




But don't some people who take these drugs claim that they have literally lived thousands of years in a blissful realm?  If that is the case, then why can't this be a solution to life extension?  Yes, I know that the effects of these drugs are unpredictable, but as long as they are capable of allowing someone to live thousands of years, then why can't that be a solution to life extension?



These scientists your quoting are talking about physical life on earth, in real time. completely different.


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Edited by Dmt_psilocybin (11/17/16 03:18 PM)


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Invisibleruaware
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. [Re: Dmt_psilocybin]
    #23842456 - 11/17/16 04:27 PM (7 years, 2 months ago)

.


Edited by ruaware (12/06/16 03:12 AM)


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OfflineMattMVS7
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Re: Life extension on psychedelics [Re: Trypto-Fan]
    #23843123 - 11/17/16 07:13 PM (7 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

Trypto-Fan said:
Quote:

MattMVS7 said:
Quote:

Trypto-Fan said:
The altered states of psychedelics are unpredictable, ineffable, and intangible.

Trips are not a 'solution' to real world life extension,
You're comparing two quite unrelated things as if they were analogous..




But don't some people who take these drugs claim that they have literally lived thousands of years in a blissful realm?  If that is the case, then why can't this be a solution to life extension?  Yes, I know that the effects of these drugs are unpredictable, but as long as they are capable of allowing someone to live thousands of years, then why can't that be a solution to life extension?




In a very vague way, yes..
But this is conflating the physical and the metaphysical.

I've had between 200-300 trips, and though having experienced extreme time dilation I've never experienced other tangible lifetimes.
I realise this can be the case but it's not easily replicated, and it's not a solution to physically prolonging a life in the physical realm.




The goal of life extension is to simply prolong our lives.  This goal can be achieved through psychedelic trips.  So it doesn't matter if this goal is achieved here in the physical world or not, my point was that it would be a solution to life extension since the goal itself of living longer can be achieved through the use of a psychedelic drug.  It might matter to some, but those who just simply wish to live longer and don't care if that takes place here in this physical reality, then a solution to life extension has already been found for these types of people.


Edited by MattMVS7 (11/17/16 07:18 PM)


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Offlinekrypto2000
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Re: Life extension on psychedelics [Re: MattMVS7]
    #23843323 - 11/17/16 08:16 PM (7 years, 2 months ago)

Sure, but that's not the goal of life extension. Your definition of 'life extension' is a very narrow one.


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OfflineMattMVS7
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Re: Life extension on psychedelics [Re: krypto2000]
    #23843366 - 11/17/16 08:33 PM (7 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

krypto2000 said:
Sure, but that's not the goal of life extension. Your definition of 'life extension' is a very narrow one.




So you are actually saying I can live thousands or even millions of years taking a very powerful dose of a psychedelic drug?  I personally find that too good to be true.  Or would that vast amount of time be nothing more than some hallucinatory-like feature not akin to how you would experience that amount of time here in this physical world?

Basically, it would be leaving a person saying:

"Bummer.  I was really hoping I could live that long taking a psychedelic.  It was like I lived that long during the trip in a way, but was all just some weird hallucination that was not like actually living that long."


Edited by MattMVS7 (11/17/16 08:35 PM)


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Invisibleconnectedcosmos
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Re: Life extension on psychedelics [Re: krypto2000]
    #23843378 - 11/17/16 08:36 PM (7 years, 2 months ago)

Psychdelics dilate human perception of time... not your actual physical body aging... its not gonna make you live longer ... just expierence time slowing down really... the goal of life extension is to stop or slow down the actual aging process


--------------------


54. The true nature of things is to be known personally , through the eyes of clear illumination and not through a sage : what the moon exactly is , is to be known with one's own eyes ; can another make him know it?


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OfflineMattMVS7
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Re: Life extension on psychedelics [Re: connectedcosmos]
    #23843399 - 11/17/16 08:43 PM (7 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

connectedcosmos said:
Psychdelics dilate human perception of time... not your actual physical body aging... its not gonna make you live longer ... just expierence time slowing down really... the goal of life extension is to stop or slow down the actual aging process




My question in my previous post applies to the mental perception of time.  Would the perception of centuries or millenniums during a trip just be some sort of weird hallucinatory experience that is sort of like how you would experience that time here in this physical reality in a way, but not actually like how you would experience that amount of time here?  What I am trying to ask is, would you experience every day, hour, minute, and second of centuries/millenniums during a trip?


Edited by MattMVS7 (11/17/16 09:01 PM)


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InvisibleThe Blind Ass
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Re: Life extension on psychedelics [Re: MattMVS7]
    #23843697 - 11/17/16 10:30 PM (7 years, 2 months ago)

Even if you trip like your talking about, your not living past 150, and thats like the top 1% or less for humans that kind live that long.

Psychedelics do not keep the human organism alive longer per say, as anything else he puts in his body for the most part.  Humans have shown they can basically get to roughly around 150 years old MAX (currently, i say with optimism), and the amount that reach that is so small its almost unheard of.


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Re: Life extension on psychedelics [Re: The Blind Ass]
    #23843701 - 11/17/16 10:33 PM (7 years, 2 months ago)

No part of that altered state of consciousness (tripping) helps extend the life cycles of the complex symbiosis of cells.  So no, your quiet literally thinking wrong about something.  I seewhat your getting at , and buddy a few steps back you took a wrong turn in your thinking and got confused and did not notice, lol, then carried on and made this humorous proposition.

Because simply altering perception of time, does not in actuality stop the flow of the now - which is where the birth of cells, and them playing out their life cycles, and dying, all happens in cyclical, repeating, mutating, and evolving ways.


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Edited by The Blind Ass (11/17/16 10:35 PM)


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OfflineMattMVS7
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Re: Life extension on psychedelics [Re: The Blind Ass]
    #23843750 - 11/17/16 10:52 PM (7 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

The Blind Ass said:
No part of that altered state of consciousness (tripping) helps extend the life cycles of the complex symbiosis of cells.  So no, your quiet literally thinking wrong about something.  I seewhat your getting at , and buddy a few steps back you took a wrong turn in your thinking and got confused and did not notice, lol, then carried on and made this humorous proposition.

Because simply altering perception of time, does not in actuality stop the flow of the now - which is where the birth of cells, and them playing out their life cycles, and dying, all happens in cyclical, repeating, mutating, and evolving ways.




That is what you say according to the biological definition of life extension.  But I define living as being consciously aware for a certain period of time.  In other words, if you were aware for a total of 60 years of your life and then died, then you have lived for 60 years.

Since you can be aware for thousands or even millions of years during a trip, then I would see that as living for thousands or millions of years.  So, yes, I would view this as a form of life extension since you can be aware far beyond the normal duration of awareness that you would have if you just simply lived your entire life here in the physical world without ever having a trip.


Edited by MattMVS7 (11/17/16 10:54 PM)


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InvisibleThe Blind Ass
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Re: Life extension on psychedelics [Re: MattMVS7]
    #23843764 - 11/17/16 10:58 PM (7 years, 2 months ago)



Trips dont extend life its plain and simple.  Dont forget, that is what the original content of your proposition was.  If by distort your perception so that  1 hour or 1 second seems like an eternity, than Ok.  But there you fail to distinguish a mirage, from an actual thing.  A dream, from waking.
Becauses even if your aware like that your cells are not "slowing down" or "stopping"  they going at the same rate of life like always.  So eventually they run their course and break apart and are absorbed via other organisms etc.  You were talking about the body, right?


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Edited by The Blind Ass (11/17/16 10:58 PM)


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InvisibleThe Blind Ass
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Re: Life extension on psychedelics [Re: MattMVS7]
    #23843774 - 11/17/16 11:03 PM (7 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

MattMVS7 said:

The goal of life extension is to simply prolong our lives.  This goal can be achieved through psychedelic trips.  So it doesn't matter if this goal is achieved here in the physical world or not,




actually what that would mean is that it DOES Matter! that is Does matter, not the opposite.  That is were you were confused or in error.

Life processes are not prolonged by the ingestion of things like DMT, LSD-25, and Psilocybin.  As far as we know, not significantly anyways if it ever where shown.

You need the body to be aware like you are now.  After the body breaks apart and is re absorbed into other organisms sure we might have had all along some sort of mysterious primordial awareness that goes on regardless of the body.  But life extension, by definition entails making the body live longer. AKA cellular processes ongoing, and cells healthy past their so far normal life/death cycle.

I like where your going with the proposition though.  Just needs some work, and playing by the given definition we have as a species, that is generally understood by all. 


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Give me Liberty caps -or- give me Death caps


Edited by The Blind Ass (11/17/16 11:05 PM)


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OfflineMattMVS7
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Re: Life extension on psychedelics [Re: The Blind Ass]
    #23843777 - 11/17/16 11:05 PM (7 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

The Blind Ass said:


Trips dont extend life its plain and simple.  Dont forget, that is what the original content of your proposition was.  If by distort your perception so that  1 hour or 1 second seems like an eternity, than Ok.  But there you fail to distinguish a mirage, from an actual thing.  A dream, from waking.
Becauses even if your aware like that your cells are not "slowing down" or "stopping"  they going at the same rate of life like always.  So eventually they run their course and break apart and are absorbed via other organisms etc.  You were talking about the body, right?




I am not talking about life extension in terms of the biological processes that go on.  I am talking about life extension in terms of conscious awareness alone.  So by my definition, if a person was on their deathbed and he/she took a psychedelic that allowed him/her to live thousands or millions of years in some blissful realm, then that would be extending the person's life.  Not in biological terms, but just in terms that he/she is conscious for a far greater period than what his/her normal sober life would of ever allowed for.


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InvisibleThe Blind Ass
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Re: Life extension on psychedelics [Re: MattMVS7]
    #23843782 - 11/17/16 11:07 PM (7 years, 2 months ago)

Still, needs the biology to trip in the first place - aka to process the effects of the drug you ingest upon your death bed.  Or do you go with the primordial awareness belief, that upon death or before being born there was our awareness we always were all along - and so somehow the trip would affect that primordial awareness?


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InvisibleThe Blind Ass
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Re: Life extension on psychedelics [Re: MattMVS7]
    #23843787 - 11/17/16 11:08 PM (7 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

MattMVS7 said:



I am not talking about life extension in terms of the biological processes that go on.  I am talking about life extension in terms of conscious awareness alone.




so then dont call it life extension, because by definition it is not..  Call it what it is please. Maybe just edit your original post and the thread title.  Because your not talking about "life extension" , which by def.  is biological processes, your talking about Awareness. They are not the same.


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Edited by The Blind Ass (11/17/16 11:10 PM)


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OfflineMattMVS7
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Re: Life extension on psychedelics [Re: The Blind Ass]
    #23843798 - 11/17/16 11:13 PM (7 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

The Blind Ass said:
Quote:

MattMVS7 said:



I am not talking about life extension in terms of the biological processes that go on.  I am talking about life extension in terms of conscious awareness alone.




so then dont call it life extension, because by definition it is not..  Call it what it is please. Maybe just edit your original post and the thread title.  Because your not talking about "life extension" , which by def.  is biological processes, your talking about Awareness. They are not the same.




I think I would instead call it an alternative to life extension then.  So many people wish they could live for thousands or millions of years and they think that the only way that can happen is if scientific technology somehow manages to extend our lives.  But this doesn't have to be.  A person can take a psychedelic drug and live a vast amount of time during a trip.


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InvisibleThe Blind Ass
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Re: Life extension on psychedelics [Re: MattMVS7]
    #23843813 - 11/17/16 11:23 PM (7 years, 2 months ago)

Gotcha.  Yeah I agree to a degree, dreams too


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OfflineMattMVS7
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Re: Life extension on psychedelics [Re: The Blind Ass]
    #23843816 - 11/17/16 11:28 PM (7 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

The Blind Ass said:
Gotcha.  Yeah I agree to a degree, dreams too




But for a person who has had a powerful trip that they said lasted for thousands or even millions of years, then do they mean that literally?  In other words, were they actually aware for thousands or millions of years from their subjective point of view (i.e. aware of every day, hour, minute, and second that has passed for that whole entire time just like how that would happen here in this physical reality)?  Or did it really just seem like the trip lasted that vast amount of time, but was not actually that long for him/her?


Edited by MattMVS7 (11/17/16 11:29 PM)


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InvisibleThe Blind Ass
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Re: Life extension on psychedelics [Re: MattMVS7]
    #23843835 - 11/17/16 11:41 PM (7 years, 2 months ago)

You should be able to answer that question correctly by just asking yourself.

I have had a few experiences which you describe, but i wouldnt say they were 10,000 years or what not, but timeless - so they seemed a un-quantifiable amount of time, like a life time I suppose, or like a full dream, but that is just metaphor, because it was a subjective experience, aka know one else knew but me, others werent aware of what I was aware of, or rather no longer aware of - aka time, and space, as we know them normally.  But upon emerging from said trip the people in my life and the clock had just carried on and 8 hours had passed.  And my body had been carrying on while I was there.  It was the kind of trip where you drop your body and mind.


--------------------
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Edited by The Blind Ass (11/17/16 11:43 PM)


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OfflineMattMVS7
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Re: Life extension on psychedelics [Re: The Blind Ass]
    #23843872 - 11/18/16 12:05 AM (7 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

The Blind Ass said:
You should be able to answer that question correctly by just asking yourself.

I have had a few experiences which you describe, but i wouldnt say they were 10,000 years or what not, but timeless - so they seemed a un-quantifiable amount of time, like a life time I suppose, or like a full dream, but that is just metaphor, because it was a subjective experience, aka know one else knew but me, others werent aware of what I was aware of, or rather no longer aware of - aka time, and space, as we know them normally.  But upon emerging from said trip the people in my life and the clock had just carried on and 8 hours had passed.  And my body had been carrying on while I was there.  It was the kind of trip where you drop your body and mind.




My question is in regards to those whose experiences were not timeless, but seemed to drag on for thousands or millions of years.  I cannot answer this question for myself since there is no way to.  Were they aware that whole entire time (every hour, minute, and second) of all those thousands/millions of years just like how a person would be aware of every hour, minute, and second of all those thousands/millions of years here in this physical life?  Or did it just really seem like that and wasn't actually the case?  There is a big distinction here and I wish to know which is true.


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Re: Life extension on psychedelics [Re: MattMVS7]
    #23843888 - 11/18/16 12:15 AM (7 years, 2 months ago)

Its considered distorted.  So its not really living forever or a super long time.  Its a way of speaking about what the experience was like is all.  Probably an illusion.  If it was real they would have thousands of life times worth of experience and memory to share with the world.  And no one really has or can. Maybe Im wrong, show me! that would be cool if it were true.


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OfflineMattMVS7
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Re: Life extension on psychedelics [Re: The Blind Ass]
    #23843906 - 11/18/16 12:27 AM (7 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

The Blind Ass said:
Its considered distorted.  So its not really living forever or a super long time.  Its a way of speaking about what the experience was like is all.  Probably an illusion.  If it was real they would have thousands of life times worth of experience and memory to share with the world.  And no one really has or can. Maybe Im wrong, show me! that would be cool if it were true.




That would actually be the most horrible thing to me.  Let's pretend it was a horrible trip that lasted that long, then one would be driven to insanity if they had to undergo immense torment and suffering that whole entire time.  So that is why I am hoping this isn't true.  I don't plan on taking any psychedelic drug, but near death experiences can be the same as a psychedelic trip and I don't want to have some sort of horrible nde that would last that long.

If you read the accounts of others here who have taken psychedelic drugs, they do say that they have literally lived thousands or millions of years during a trip.  Now I am not sure if that is really true or if it was simply a distorted perception as you have pointed out.


Edited by MattMVS7 (11/18/16 12:28 AM)


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by Xtals
* You shouldn't do psychedelic drugs, you're the reason why they are illegal in the USA
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Fluxburn 24,804 137 10/04/09 03:48 PM
by crayoladreams

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