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OfflinePlazmotech
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Lowering Grain pH?
    #23827471 - 11/12/16 10:09 PM (7 years, 2 months ago)

Hey. I want to lower my grain pH to around 3.5 so my Panellus Stipticus will glow brighter. I have anhydrous citric acid powder. In a separate thread, I saw that RR had recommended NOT mixing the citric acid before PC'ing (for some reason). However, citric acid only decomposes at temps of 175ºC and water should only boil at 121ºC under 15 psi.

How do I go about doing this? Do I just like… put citric acid in the water to the proper pH before letting the grain absorb it?


--------------------
When a man lies, he murders some part of the world.
These are the pale deaths which men miscall there lives.
All this I cannot bear to witness any longer.
Cannot the kingdom of salvation take me home?
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OfflineFerather
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Re: Lowering Grain pH? [Re: Plazmotech] * 1
    #23828183 - 11/13/16 07:54 AM (7 years, 2 months ago)

Three things, for the Citric acid is that 175ºC @ 15 psi, it might lower under pressure.
Also citric acid inverts sugars into a mixture of glucose and fructose.

Citric acid cross-links starch making it tougher to digest.


--------------------
                   

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https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/27857366#27857366

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OfflinePlazmotech
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Re: Lowering Grain pH? [Re: Ferather]
    #23830553 - 11/13/16 09:01 PM (7 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

Ferather said:
Three things, for the Citric acid is that 175ºC @ 15 psi, it might lower under pressure.
Also citric acid inverts sugars into a mixture of glucose and fructose.

Citric acid cross-links starch making it tougher to digest.




Shit, not a chemist so that's really good to know.

What do you suggest?


--------------------
When a man lies, he murders some part of the world.
These are the pale deaths which men miscall there lives.
All this I cannot bear to witness any longer.
Cannot the kingdom of salvation take me home?
Plazmotech's Kratom Grow


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OfflineGrundalizer
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Re: Lowering Grain pH? [Re: Plazmotech]
    #23830800 - 11/13/16 10:52 PM (7 years, 2 months ago)

I'm sure you could find literature and journal articles on citric acid decomposition, and as a chemist, I'm not sure about it off the top of my head.  For routine lab-work, we always pH our media before auto-claving.  Granted, we're using liquid based media / agar based media.  NaOH and HCl (sodium hydroxide and hydrochloric acid, 1M each) are used.  Aka, drano (NaOH) or Muriatic acid (HCl).

Both drano and muriatic acid are much more concentrated than 1M solutions, so you'd need drops to change the pH of L's of water drastically.

pH'ing a solid mass of grain like that would probably not work in the same way....you could mix in a few drops of dilution hydrochloric acid and see how it affected it.


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OfflinePlazmotech
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Re: Lowering Grain pH? [Re: Grundalizer]
    #23830853 - 11/13/16 11:14 PM (7 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

Grundalizer said:
I'm sure you could find literature and journal articles on citric acid decomposition, and as a chemist, I'm not sure about it off the top of my head.  For routine lab-work, we always pH our media before auto-claving.  Granted, we're using liquid based media / agar based media.  NaOH and HCl (sodium hydroxide and hydrochloric acid, 1M each) are used.  Aka, drano (NaOH) or Muriatic acid (HCl).

Both drano and muriatic acid are much more concentrated than 1M solutions, so you'd need drops to change the pH of L's of water drastically.

pH'ing a solid mass of grain like that would probably not work in the same way....you could mix in a few drops of dilution hydrochloric acid and see how it affected it.




Thanks. I thought lowering the pH of agar affected how it solidified? Do you think I could lower MEA or PDA to 3.5 pH without issue? I might ask my chem teacher for some HCl lol


--------------------
When a man lies, he murders some part of the world.
These are the pale deaths which men miscall there lives.
All this I cannot bear to witness any longer.
Cannot the kingdom of salvation take me home?
Plazmotech's Kratom Grow


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Offlinedrake89
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Re: Lowering Grain pH? [Re: Plazmotech]
    #23831419 - 11/14/16 07:50 AM (7 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

Plazmotech said:
Hey. I want to lower my grain pH to around 3.5 so my Panellus Stipticus will glow brighter. I have anhydrous citric acid powder. In a separate thread, I saw that RR had recommended NOT mixing the citric acid before PC'ing (for some reason). However, citric acid only decomposes at temps of 175ºC and water should only boil at 121ºC under 15 psi.

How do I go about doing this? Do I just like… put citric acid in the water to the proper pH before letting the grain absorb it?



it's obviously not good to have strong acid boiling around in your PC, it could degrade the metal over time and the fumes are not something you want to breathe.  since nothing is going to live in HCL it's safe to add after PC.  go to the store and get you some muriatic acid, in the paint section.  $8 for a gallon.


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OfflinePlazmotech
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Re: Lowering Grain pH? [Re: drake89]
    #23831558 - 11/14/16 08:57 AM (7 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

drake89 said:
Quote:

Plazmotech said:
Hey. I want to lower my grain pH to around 3.5 so my Panellus Stipticus will glow brighter. I have anhydrous citric acid powder. In a separate thread, I saw that RR had recommended NOT mixing the citric acid before PC'ing (for some reason). However, citric acid only decomposes at temps of 175ºC and water should only boil at 121ºC under 15 psi.

How do I go about doing this? Do I just like… put citric acid in the water to the proper pH before letting the grain absorb it?



it's obviously not good to have strong acid boiling around in your PC, it could degrade the metal over time and the fumes are not something you want to breathe.  since nothing is going to live in HCL it's safe to add after PC.  go to the store and get you some muriatic acid, in the paint section.  $8 for a gallon.




Didn't even think about that, I'm on the autopilot mode of "PC EVERYTHING." How would I know how much acid to reach that pH?


--------------------
When a man lies, he murders some part of the world.
These are the pale deaths which men miscall there lives.
All this I cannot bear to witness any longer.
Cannot the kingdom of salvation take me home?
Plazmotech's Kratom Grow


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Offlinedrake89
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Re: Lowering Grain pH? [Re: Plazmotech]
    #23831949 - 11/14/16 11:14 AM (7 years, 2 months ago)

Ph papers are like $5


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OfflinePlazmotech
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Re: Lowering Grain pH? [Re: drake89]
    #23831957 - 11/14/16 11:18 AM (7 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

drake89 said:
Ph papers are like $5




Yeah but that would require opening up the grain to contams after sterilizing it. And can you just put a grain on litmus paper? I thought it was limited to liquids.


--------------------
When a man lies, he murders some part of the world.
These are the pale deaths which men miscall there lives.
All this I cannot bear to witness any longer.
Cannot the kingdom of salvation take me home?
Plazmotech's Kratom Grow


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OfflineFerather
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Re: Lowering Grain pH? [Re: Plazmotech]
    #23832022 - 11/14/16 11:50 AM (7 years, 2 months ago)

Setup and small side sample you can throw away, test that.


--------------------
                   

Growing mushrooms, general guide and information (Ferather's Journal), https://ibb.co/rG3rML2

https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/27857366#27857366

DTS DCH Driver for Realtek [DTS:X] - Unlocked and reprogrammed.


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Offlinedrake89
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Re: Lowering Grain pH? [Re: Ferather]
    #23832263 - 11/14/16 01:34 PM (7 years, 2 months ago)

Make a solution pH 3 and add that to your grain.  You can try adding it in the PC but probably not if you cook inside.


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