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Raven44
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Registered: 12/07/13
Posts: 1,970
Loc: My sovereign reality bubble
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Re: Can psilocin be produced in a LC ala claviceps? [Re: krypto2000]
#23855847 - 11/21/16 10:20 PM (7 years, 2 months ago) |
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Correct me if I am wrong but wasn't APE created via uv light mutation???
I wonder if the target traits were high be and potency like the ape have?
First it seems we need to know which psilocybe is most likely to produce high levels of psilocin in liquid fermentation
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blackout


Registered: 07/16/00
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Re: Can psilocin be produced in a LC ala claviceps? [Re: krypto2000]
#23857669 - 11/22/16 03:11 PM (7 years, 2 months ago) |
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Quote:
Raven44 said: Correct me if I am wrong but wasn't APE created via uv light mutation???
No, where did you hear this, the thread should be corrected if that info is in it, or maybe you just confused it. I think I have heard it rumoured about other albinos, possibly PF albino itself, which APE was developed from, it may not be true though, as there are reasons to lie about such things.
https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/5194890
Strain Origin: Hybrid of Penis Envy and PF Albino
Quote:
Raven44 said: First it seems we need to know which psilocybe is most likely to produce high levels of psilocin in liquid fermentation
People should look at posts by Baby_Hitler -he is the most believable poster I have seen who posted about harvesting/dosing on myc, I think he recommended azures. Obviously people are already dosing on myc which has never grown shrooms, i.e. sclerotia. Some will swear on their mother's life that myc is inactive, especially if it has not fruited, maybe their mothers are already dead though! or more likely they have just never tried it.
I know RR frowned upon discussion of harvesting myc as in effect said the forum was about mushroom cultivation, not a "drug production forum", but discussion of sclerotia growing is not really frowned upon. I presume if an extremely easy way was discovered it would be more likely that spores would be made illegal though.
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krypto2000 said: If you're growing it on grain you then have the biosmass + leftover grain to extract from, you might as well just grow mushrooms then.
the idea would be more like GLC, where you add water to colonised grains, wash it off, collect the myc strain it and let the jar recover. The grain jar can recover over and over again. It is far easier to identify if it is healthy looking growth on the grains than in a LC. If you are unsure you can shake the grains up and see if it recovers, while not 100% if it does not recover you can presume something is wrong.
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krypto2000
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Re: Can psilocin be produced in a LC ala claviceps? [Re: blackout]
#23857778 - 11/22/16 03:36 PM (7 years, 2 months ago) |
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I'm not worried about contamination, if my culture on agar is clean then I know my LC is. LC is my main method of inoculation and I always have problems with them, but it's because I either get the filter wet or stick it with a dirty needle. Never had a LC grow with a contaminate in it, well no time recently anyway, it's always introduced later through using it. I won't have to even open these until it's harvest time.
Currently I'm a little set back on my tests. I made two LC lids and after PCing the aeration port no longer worked, I guess my syringe filter was not autoclavable : /.
edit: And to clarify on my LC us, I tend to make a quart or so at a time and will use it for months or even a year. They are always fine for at least a couple of months but then one day I'll see something in one of my jars or bags or on occasion if I haven't used it in awhile within the LC itself. A LC normally lasts me 3-12 months.
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Raven44
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Registered: 12/07/13
Posts: 1,970
Loc: My sovereign reality bubble
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Re: Can psilocin be produced in a LC ala claviceps? [Re: krypto2000]
#23857827 - 11/22/16 03:52 PM (7 years, 2 months ago) |
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Ty for the enlightenment blackout. Many good points and a good link.
I wish I could remember exactly where I heard that about APE sometimes my mind plays tricks...
Thank u for clarifying either way
Nexus comes to mind...
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blackout


Registered: 07/16/00
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Re: Can psilocin be produced in a LC ala claviceps? [Re: Raven44]
#23858206 - 11/22/16 06:05 PM (7 years, 2 months ago) |
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Quote:
Raven44 said: Ty for the enlightenment blackout. Many good points and a good link.
I wish I could remember exactly where I heard that about APE sometimes my mind plays tricks...
if interested
http://www.fanaticus.com/albino.htm http://www.fanaticus.com/albino2.htm
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krypto2000
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Re: Can psilocin be produced in a LC ala claviceps? [Re: blackout]
#23868497 - 11/26/16 10:28 AM (7 years, 2 months ago) |
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So I got some new filters, ptfe this time, and the tiny air stones. I pressure cooked an airstone and a filter before assembling any this time to make sure they would not melt or decompose and they did not! I'm slightly concerned the glue on the air stone might leach into the broth and cause an issue, although it seems stable. I don't even have to glue in the filters either, I drilled my holes just right so they pop in there and are very secure and form what *seems* to me to be a good seal. On to some tests now. It might be awhile before I have any updates from here.
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Raven44
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Registered: 12/07/13
Posts: 1,970
Loc: My sovereign reality bubble
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Re: Can psilocin be produced in a LC ala claviceps? [Re: krypto2000]
#23869365 - 11/26/16 03:24 PM (7 years, 2 months ago) |
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Perhaps u could disassemble the air stone strip the glue and re assemble with a certain type of glue of ur choosing
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krypto2000
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Re: Can psilocin be produced in a LC ala claviceps? [Re: Raven44]
#23869512 - 11/26/16 04:10 PM (7 years, 2 months ago) |
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Well the glue did not seem to degrade at all so I think it's okay, I was mainly throwing it out there just as a possibility. It is targeted for aquariums too so one would hope they would use a non toxic glue.
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blackout


Registered: 07/16/00
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Re: Can psilocin be produced in a LC ala claviceps? [Re: krypto2000]
#23869551 - 11/26/16 04:23 PM (7 years, 2 months ago) |
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If the glue did give way you could just silicone it in place, most think of it purely as a sealant but its decent as adhesive.
I am going to be trying LC with potato starch as a thickener. Some say starch is not advisable, it is a far cheaper thickening agent than agar.
In other threads I mentioned the use of pumps, and internal submersed elements. Most will agree water can be sterilized by simple boiling. If you really feel the need to PC your other ingredients you can do this in a concentrated form in a PC. So you could PC a thick sugar syrup and then add to a larger homebrew style fermenter full of water, and boil this up again. You can buy tubs with heating elements preinstalled and holes and ports etc. My idea was to boil it up in the large container and have a pump running, you can get homebrew pumps intended for boiling sugary liquid. By running the pump you have boiling water passing through it and so sterilizing your lines at the same time.
The pump would simply by recirculating the liquid onto itself, it would draw liquid from the bottom and pump into the top of the container into open air, this would agitate the liquid, and aerate it at the same time. I would have a regular passive filter on the lid, as I said before I do not like the idea of forcing air through filters. At the top of the container where the liquid is coming back in you could have tubing with several holes in it, and plugged at the end, this would mean the liquid is coming out in several streams and so more aerated. I would worry about it clogging though, and the action of the liquid splashing onto the liquid below is probably more than enough agitation and stirring.
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krypto2000 said: If you're growing it on grain you then have the biosmass + leftover grain to extract from, you might as well just grow mushrooms then.
A grain like popcorn is tolerant to repeated "washing and regrowth", you could colonise grain, introduce water and draw it off again which is just what GLC is, which I presume you are familiar with https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/6817701 . I do this in bulk with what I call syringe tubes, which are just silicone tubes with syringe needs on both ends. It allows you to transfer huge amounts of liquid with no need for a syringe.
I also have a jar I have yet to inoculate which is full of cut up silicone tubes, to which agar was added. This jar was heated so the agar was just liquid, and then shook about so the agar clings to the surface of all the silicone tubing inside. This is simiar to GLC but without the risk of grains, many think GLC is risky as the grains may have endospores.
Edited by blackout (11/26/16 04:39 PM)
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phenethylamin
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Re: Can psilocin be produced in a LC ala claviceps? [Re: blackout]
#23998042 - 01/10/17 12:09 PM (7 years, 20 days ago) |
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Hey there,
SWIM is quite interested in the possibility to grow Cubensis solely in LC and check for Psilocybin production. SWIM started a small experiment of different Cubensis strains in liquid culture, which have been started from spores. Cultures have been grown in standard Malt Extract Medium with the addition of Peptone and Yeast extract (see BAM for reference). In order to oxygenate the mycelium, cultures have been placed on an orbital shaker and are grown in baffled flasks. They developed quite nice, check the pictures... Is this spherical growth a common observation?
   
So has this been done (What about OP?) and have the cultures been harvested and checked for alkaloid content (Quick literature research revealed nothing)? If so, do we know culture conditions and more importantly time point of harvest?
SWIM will be very happy to hear from you advanced mycologists!
Phen.
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krypto2000
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Re: Can psilocin be produced in a LC ala claviceps? [Re: phenethylamin]
#23998069 - 01/10/17 12:17 PM (7 years, 20 days ago) |
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That growth looks pretty cool. I'm guessing that happens due to the shaking, the mycilium probably congregates in groups forming those spheres. I have only tried forced aeration and stirring though so I can't confirm. I have not had success in producing alkaloids so far and have since put the project on hold for a various reasons after the initiap failure. I plan to pick it up again but it may be awhile.
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TwitwatSpackle
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Re: Can psilocin be produced in a LC ala claviceps? [Re: krypto2000]
#24011602 - 01/15/17 09:27 AM (7 years, 15 days ago) |
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Great idea.
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blackout


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Re: Can psilocin be produced in a LC ala claviceps? [Re: phenethylamin]
#24014654 - 01/16/17 12:59 PM (7 years, 14 days ago) |
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Quote:
phenethylamin said: SWIM started a small experiment of different Cubensis strains in liquid culture, which have been started from spores. Cultures have been grown in standard Malt Extract Medium with the addition of Peptone and Yeast extract (see BAM for reference).
was this spores direct to LC, if so you would want to test them. I have not seen growth which looks like yours before. I have seen small balls/clouds of myc though, which developed with a stirred LC, you can search for a user called blue helix for pics.
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krypto2000
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Re: Can psilocin be produced in a LC ala claviceps? [Re: blackout]
#24014923 - 01/16/17 02:39 PM (7 years, 14 days ago) |
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Have you seen a LC grown on a rotary shaker before though? It makes sense why they would turn into balls, they keep turning and clumping together as they spin resulting in balls. Think of a wet ball of flour or something, as you spin it in a bowl the flour clumbs around it and forms a more or less perfect sphere (not really perfect of course, but within reason). I can't think of another example, but it's a common effect with small particles.
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catnip40
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Re: Can psilocin be produced in a LC ala claviceps? [Re: krypto2000]
#24018483 - 01/17/17 08:34 PM (7 years, 13 days ago) |
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phenethylamin
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Re: Can psilocin be produced in a LC ala claviceps? [Re: blackout]
#24018979 - 01/18/17 01:23 AM (7 years, 12 days ago) |
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Log in to view attachment
yes this was a LC started from spores, which have been harvested from previous grows. This is definitely mycelia growing if you are in doubt of that, solid media has been successfully inoculated with the shown LC. Also there is no question about sterile work... 
Different Cubensis strains have been observed and they all show this growth pattern, some tend to form smaller, others bigger spheres. Swim told me that the extraction of mycelia and liquid media is in process, so we have to wait for the analysis of that. In the meantime I did a more in depth literature research and of course Cubensis-LCs have been performed and results been published - see attached pdf/link and references mentioned there. Special interest should be payed to tryptamine supplemented cultures.
Source 1
Phen.
Edited by phenethylamin (01/18/17 01:24 AM)
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krypto2000
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Re: Can psilocin be produced in a LC ala claviceps? [Re: phenethylamin]
#24020018 - 01/18/17 01:38 PM (7 years, 12 days ago) |
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Word, thanks for that paper.
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