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Bagels
Huntress



Registered: 07/11/14
Posts: 1,029
Loc: NZ
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NZ: Panaeolina foenisecii ?
#23824305 - 11/11/16 10:24 PM (7 years, 2 months ago) |
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Oops that probably should be Panaeolus foenisecii
Looking for an id please as I have not found these before.
Growing in grass next to a paddock with cattle beasts. No bruising and a brown spore print.





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Origyn
Neato


Registered: 09/18/16
Posts: 1,031
Loc: On 2 wheels somewhere
Last seen: 1 month, 27 days
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Re: NZ: Panaeolina foenisecii ? [Re: Bagels]
#23824355 - 11/11/16 10:40 PM (7 years, 2 months ago) |
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I think the last two pics have cincts mixed in, unless ALL prints were brown.
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360degreecircle
Renaissance Man

Registered: 10/05/16
Posts: 70
Loc: NE usa
Last seen: 7 years, 2 months
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Re: NZ: Panaeolina foenisecii ? [Re: Bagels]
#23824370 - 11/11/16 10:45 PM (7 years, 2 months ago) |
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Definitely Pans ...if they do in fact have brown spore prints then yes they are foenisecii (Panaeolina is the correct genus for foes btw). If they print jet black they are Panaeolus cinctulus.
Now if you're assuming brown due to the gills, you might want to go ahead and print them all. They can be tricky to id on sight and I've found foes and cincs growing next to each other.
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Bagels
Huntress



Registered: 07/11/14
Posts: 1,029
Loc: NZ
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Thanks some of the prints are darker than others from a dark chocolate brown to some you could almost say were black. I wasn't going to talk myself into saying they were black. There are more there. Very hard to separate, yes?
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Origyn
Neato


Registered: 09/18/16
Posts: 1,031
Loc: On 2 wheels somewhere
Last seen: 1 month, 27 days
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Re: NZ: Panaeolina foenisecii ? [Re: Bagels]
#23824458 - 11/11/16 11:15 PM (7 years, 2 months ago) |
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Here is what you want for cincts. Zero color except black.
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Bagels
Huntress



Registered: 07/11/14
Posts: 1,029
Loc: NZ
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Re: NZ: Panaeolina foenisecii ? [Re: Origyn]
#23824510 - 11/11/16 11:32 PM (7 years, 2 months ago) |
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Not as heavy as yours. I've used a Sharpie there. idk what do you think?
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Origyn
Neato


Registered: 09/18/16
Posts: 1,031
Loc: On 2 wheels somewhere
Last seen: 1 month, 27 days
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Re: NZ: Panaeolina foenisecii ? [Re: Bagels]
#23824564 - 11/11/16 11:53 PM (7 years, 2 months ago) |
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Pretty dang close. Maybe leave them overnight. Hope a TI chimes in. BTW, there are no poisonous panaeolus species as documented all through out this site.
Read through this too. https://www.shroomery.org/12484/Panaeolus-cinctulus
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Bagels
Huntress



Registered: 07/11/14
Posts: 1,029
Loc: NZ
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Re: NZ: Panaeolina foenisecii ? [Re: Origyn]
#23824588 - 11/12/16 12:04 AM (7 years, 2 months ago) |
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Yes, that they are Thanks! The stems appear all the same to me being reasonably sturdy, hollow and about 3mm. Do they have a distinct odour when fresh or with taste is there any difference?
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Anglerfish
hearing things



Registered: 09/08/10
Posts: 18,646
Loc: Norvegr
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Re: NZ: Panaeolina foenisecii ? [Re: Bagels]
#23824873 - 11/12/16 04:04 AM (7 years, 2 months ago) |
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Yeah, those prints are look very dark brown, not black. But as already said, leave them all printing over night.
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360degreecircle
Renaissance Man

Registered: 10/05/16
Posts: 70
Loc: NE usa
Last seen: 7 years, 2 months
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Re: NZ: Panaeolina foenisecii ? [Re: Bagels]
#23825587 - 11/12/16 11:00 AM (7 years, 2 months ago) |
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Quote:
Bagels said:There are more there.
For what it's worth, in my experience pastures (compared to lawn finds) seem to produce more cincts than foes so it couldn't hurt to go back for more.
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Edited by 360degreecircle (11/12/16 11:01 AM)
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Bagels
Huntress



Registered: 07/11/14
Posts: 1,029
Loc: NZ
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Anglerfish and 360degreecircle thank you for your replies.
In daylight most of the prints are black but what I am seeing in my photos is slightly tinted brown or purple. Why can the prints turn from a dark brown to black when you leave them overnight?
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Origyn
Neato


Registered: 09/18/16
Posts: 1,031
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Re: NZ: Panaeolina foenisecii ? [Re: Bagels]
#23826213 - 11/12/16 03:24 PM (7 years, 2 months ago) |
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They drop more spores the longer you leave them.....potentially confirming 100% black or brown etc.....
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Origyn
Neato


Registered: 09/18/16
Posts: 1,031
Loc: On 2 wheels somewhere
Last seen: 1 month, 27 days
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Re: NZ: Panaeolina foenisecii ? [Re: Origyn]
#23826220 - 11/12/16 03:28 PM (7 years, 2 months ago) |
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An oldie but goodie.
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Bagels
Huntress



Registered: 07/11/14
Posts: 1,029
Loc: NZ
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Re: NZ: Panaeolina foenisecii ? [Re: Origyn]
#23826348 - 11/12/16 04:08 PM (7 years, 2 months ago) |
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Thanks Origyn I'll pinch that I got someone else to have a look and they said black but I still can't convince myself 100%. I grab some more
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AllDay420
Ghost0420

Registered: 09/03/16
Posts: 301
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Re: NZ: Panaeolina foenisecii ? [Re: Bagels]
#23826395 - 11/12/16 04:21 PM (7 years, 2 months ago) |
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Yeah, get some more specimens and print them for at least 24, if not 48 hours so the caps are able to produce THICK spore prints.
-------------------- Approved puppet.
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AllDay420
Ghost0420

Registered: 09/03/16
Posts: 301
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Re: NZ: Panaeolina foenisecii ? [Re: AllDay420]
#23826479 - 11/12/16 04:44 PM (7 years, 2 months ago) |
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Those darker gilled specimens look like they could be, and those prints could be jet black perhaps, but they are not thick enough to tell for sure with those pictures, I think it is the lighting throwing off the true jet black color possibly.
I feel the image may be kind of throwing the actual color off, they very well could be jet black, but the photo makes it look more slightly brownish black. 
I don't know, I suppose for something like distinguishing foes and cincts I believe natural clear lighting that does not alter the true shade of color and a thick print is mandatory.
-------------------- Approved puppet.
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AllDay420
Ghost0420

Registered: 09/03/16
Posts: 301
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Re: NZ: Panaeolina foenisecii ? [Re: Origyn]
#23826513 - 11/12/16 04:53 PM (7 years, 2 months ago) |
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This..
Quote:
Bagels said:

Looks like a hybrid of this..
Quote:
Origyn said:

It's like your print color is a frickin mix of those two colors. It's like your print color is neither, it's in between brown and jet black, (DARK BROWN), what the actual.
Not sure if dark brown or jet black.
-------------------- Approved puppet.
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AllDay420
Ghost0420

Registered: 09/03/16
Posts: 301
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Re: NZ: Panaeolina foenisecii ? [Re: AllDay420]
#23826576 - 11/12/16 05:14 PM (7 years, 2 months ago) |
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Okay, I think all those prints are truly jet black now. Even those extremely light prints, got a feeling they are actually jet black. Analyzed the fuck out of them and they look jet black.
But everything taken into account to make this guess was not concrete because of the quality of your content, it's merely just a guess and we need much better quality content to be certain.
Quality of input = quality of output.. And with your input I am un-able to decipher the true output, because the output does not show/tell me enough.
To make the content more quality, do the following. - Please take pictures of whole specimens, and only one specimen per picture, not just severed pileus and light prints without an intact specimen shot.
- Then you can sever the pileus and make a print, give it 48 hours next time, but as long as we know what the specimen that produced the print looks like.
- Number each specimen and it's prints so we know what made what.
- Get NICE AND CLEAR shots that portray the true natural shade of color, those images have distorted the true natural color.
I want to see you posting images of cincts and I can not wait to see the TI's give you the thumb up on cincts once you get more and do the required tasks to make an ID request we can give a concrete verdict upon.
-------------------- Approved puppet.
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Bagels
Huntress



Registered: 07/11/14
Posts: 1,029
Loc: NZ
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Re: NZ: Panaeolina foenisecii ? [Re: AllDay420]
#23826736 - 11/12/16 06:00 PM (7 years, 2 months ago) |
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Thanks Allday420, it is very hard for me to take photos showing the correct colour. Believe me I've tried and it is very frustrating It is confusing as to whether to trust what I see or the camera. But yes point(s) taken and I'll see what I can do
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AllDay420
Ghost0420

Registered: 09/03/16
Posts: 301
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Re: NZ: Panaeolina foenisecii ? [Re: Bagels]
#23826752 - 11/12/16 06:07 PM (7 years, 2 months ago) |
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-------------------- Approved puppet.
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