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viktor
psychotechnician



Registered: 11/03/10
Posts: 4,293
Loc: New Zealand
Last seen: 1 year, 9 months
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Quote:
Jokeshopbeard said: I'll tell you straight - I've never met a man so obsessed with proof as yourself.
This is a recipe for misery. Spiritual truths are intuited, not proven. If you demand proof for them you will never get it and you will thus guarantee that you will never make peace with death and will end up old and miserable...
...wait.
-------------------- "They consider me insane but I know that I am a hero living under the eyes of the gods."
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redgreenvines
irregular verb


Registered: 04/08/04
Posts: 37,539
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Re: What will you do tomorrow? [Re: viktor]
#23820124 - 11/10/16 03:29 PM (7 years, 2 months ago) |
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old and miserable? wait a minute! Spiritual truths are not different than other truths; but guesses that are unproven is another thing entirely, and if you fill up with unproven guesses, it's going to take more horsepower to move forward, and that means much more horseshit.
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pineninja
Dream Weaver



Registered: 08/17/14
Posts: 12,468
Loc: South
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Quote:
OrgoneConclusion said: Most men lead lives of quiet desperation. ~ Thoreau
It is time for some noisy desperation. 
As my life is winding down, I feel as if I have missed something important, but that may be some sort of religious/spiritual guilt. Perhaps mere survival is the only goal and the rest is just frosting. No other animals (to our knowledge) rub their paws/flippers/fins/mandibles/tentacles together in angst about what their life purpose is.
Perhaps you're close to the blissful acceptance of your own insignificance and ultimate lack of purpose. Animals and flora don't need to understand they just are and it's beautiful.
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redgreenvines
irregular verb


Registered: 04/08/04
Posts: 37,539
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Re: What will you do tomorrow? [Re: pineninja]
#23820252 - 11/10/16 04:06 PM (7 years, 2 months ago) |
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if there is a purpose to intelligence, it is to make things better, and if you do any of that, you did good.
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zzripz
Stranger


Registered: 12/23/08
Posts: 8,292
Loc: Manchester, UK
Last seen: 4 years, 7 months
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Re: What will you do tomorrow? [Re: pineninja]
#23820265 - 11/10/16 04:14 PM (7 years, 2 months ago) |
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OK, Aunty Blavatsky tells me she has been 'in contact with the ascended masters' and they have informed her that the race she belongs to is the superior 'root race', and other 'inferior races' must be defeated and go extinct.
Should I believe her and ask for proof? OR should I trust her 'spiritual intuition?'
Of course I won't trust her. I won't trust anyone who claims to have been in touch with invisible beings and their authority I must believe
But I do trust my spiritual experience and do not need to prove it. And I do not define it as contact with ascended spirits, but with the spiritual aspect of nature, and my connection with nature
it would be like me trying to prove how I feel when I am dancing and feel part OF the dance, because I am immersed in the experience. I am experiencing it. I do not have to prove it.
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redgreenvines
irregular verb


Registered: 04/08/04
Posts: 37,539
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Re: What will you do tomorrow? [Re: zzripz]
#23820277 - 11/10/16 04:19 PM (7 years, 2 months ago) |
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authority! Yikes!
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pineninja
Dream Weaver



Registered: 08/17/14
Posts: 12,468
Loc: South
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Quote:
redgreenvines said: if there is a purpose to intelligence, it is to make things better, and if you do any of that, you did good.
Purpose is the trap and better is an illusion both to be manipulated by those who could. Sum total of it all will not be changed one way or the other. It may sound nihilistic but it's more a celebration of purposeless experience, love.
-------------------- Just a fool on the hill.
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OrgoneConclusion
Blue Fish Group



Registered: 04/01/07
Posts: 45,414
Loc: Under the C
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Re: What will you do tomorrow? [Re: viktor]
#23820360 - 11/10/16 04:57 PM (7 years, 2 months ago) |
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Quote:
viktor said:
Quote:
Jokeshopbeard said: I'll tell you straight - I've never met a man so obsessed with proof as yourself.
This is a recipe for misery. Spiritual truths are intuited, not proven. If you demand proof for them you will never get it and you will thus guarantee that you will never make peace with death and will end up old and miserable...
...wait.
Personal slam plus bald assertion plus false observation. Triple fail! 
You make a good case that personal intuition turns one into a compassionless asshole.
There are some several hundred thousand flavors and sub-flavors of religion and subsequent oppression and terror attacks because everyone intuits their own "truth" which is not a truth at all.
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Khancious
da Crow



Registered: 12/05/12
Posts: 628
Loc: Behind Everything
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Quote:
OrgoneConclusion said: everyone intuits their own "truth" which is not a truth at all. 
Is that true?
-------------------- I am that, which is.
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viktor
psychotechnician



Registered: 11/03/10
Posts: 4,293
Loc: New Zealand
Last seen: 1 year, 9 months
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I'm talking about spirituality, you start talking about religion 
Proof that you don't get it, never will get it. You haven't even started to get it. You'll die without getting it.
Sucks to be you, I guess. Perhaps if you had been born in a less materialist generation you would not have been misled as badly as you were.
Not much I can do other than to chide people of my generation into avoiding the same errors.
-------------------- "They consider me insane but I know that I am a hero living under the eyes of the gods."
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viktor
psychotechnician



Registered: 11/03/10
Posts: 4,293
Loc: New Zealand
Last seen: 1 year, 9 months
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Re: What will you do tomorrow? [Re: viktor]
#23820544 - 11/10/16 06:00 PM (7 years, 2 months ago) |
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Do you want to go out like Icelander did? Pissing and moaning and dragging everyone else down with him?
-------------------- "They consider me insane but I know that I am a hero living under the eyes of the gods."
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Jokeshopbeard
Humble Student

Registered: 11/30/11
Posts: 26,088
Loc: Deep in the system
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Re: What will you do tomorrow? [Re: viktor]
#23820562 - 11/10/16 06:09 PM (7 years, 2 months ago) |
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Quote:
viktor said: You'll die without getting it.
Not if I've got anything to do with it. Getting it was the best thing that ever happened to me, all in the last year or two.
OC and I were both dealt a very similar hand by life which I believe was a call to 'get it'. Shit, he's told me about a bunch of synchronicities in his life, but he counters them. I feel like all the ingredients for him to get it are there, he's just gotta tame that supercharged drag engine of a brain IMO - it's like his vast intelligence is blocking him from getting it. I can empathise. My IQ aint exactly low, but I'm glad it's not as high as his. I feel it's the main thing standing between him and 'it'.
As an aside, pretty harsh words there viktor. You could've been so much kinder in the way you conveyed that. Just wanted to bring it to your attention.
-------------------- Let it be seen that you are nothing. And in knowing that you are nothing... there is nothing to lose, there is nothing to gain. What can happen to you? Something can happen to the body, but it will either heal or it won't. What's the big deal? Let life knock you to bits. Let life take you apart. Let life destroy you. It will only destroy what you are not. --Jac O'keeffe
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viktor
psychotechnician



Registered: 11/03/10
Posts: 4,293
Loc: New Zealand
Last seen: 1 year, 9 months
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Vast intelligence exists for a reason.
The reason for it is to make it easier for the organism possessing it to dominate and control their environment. Like big muscles, it provides an evolutionary advantage.
Unfortunately it also does another thing. Intelligent people tend to rely on intelligence to solve all their problems ("if all you have is a hammer, everything starts to look like a nail").
Unfortunately happiness is a matter of humility, and being intelligent and being strong make you arrogant and not humble.
Thus, the 'intelligence' you're talking about is actually an impediment to getting it.
OC will never get it because he's clinging barnacle-like to the idea that he's smarter than everyone else. Thus the constant demands for logical proof. Basically the same delusion Icelander had.
I laugh because I can see the misery this creates but I also feel a kind of pity because he is old and probably will not get much further than this.
OC: man of silver. No shame in that.
-------------------- "They consider me insane but I know that I am a hero living under the eyes of the gods."
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Jokeshopbeard
Humble Student

Registered: 11/30/11
Posts: 26,088
Loc: Deep in the system
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Re: What will you do tomorrow? [Re: viktor]
#23820682 - 11/10/16 06:39 PM (7 years, 2 months ago) |
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I wish you'd stop saying he'll never get it. It makes you sound arrogant, unkind, and judgemental.
So maybe the dude is gonna have a harder battle than you or I due to his high IQ and age... But you're here spitting absolutes which he's gonna read and which may well make the process more difficult for him.
Where's your fucking compassion man? You're just being part of the problem. Not very nice.
-------------------- Let it be seen that you are nothing. And in knowing that you are nothing... there is nothing to lose, there is nothing to gain. What can happen to you? Something can happen to the body, but it will either heal or it won't. What's the big deal? Let life knock you to bits. Let life take you apart. Let life destroy you. It will only destroy what you are not. --Jac O'keeffe
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Khancious
da Crow



Registered: 12/05/12
Posts: 628
Loc: Behind Everything
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What if he's laughing at us as we scour the background of our intellect in search of ways to conceptualize the perception of his username and use of language to send messages along the wire of shroomery consciousness
-------------------- I am that, which is.
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redgreenvines
irregular verb


Registered: 04/08/04
Posts: 37,539
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we have to keep on getting it because we keep losing it
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Khancious
da Crow



Registered: 12/05/12
Posts: 628
Loc: Behind Everything
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It's so elusive yet so obtrusive once in tune with the moon and the eternalness of the tomb.
I think Mckenna said it's like "liquid gold running through ones fingers"
-------------------- I am that, which is.
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Jokeshopbeard
Humble Student

Registered: 11/30/11
Posts: 26,088
Loc: Deep in the system
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Quote:
redgreenvines said: we have to keep on getting it because we keep losing it
Well said. That's exactly what led me to start that frustrated thread the other day. I wonder if say, a Buddhist monk living in a monastery gets it most of the time, and rarely loses it, unlike I who doesn't get it most of the time, but given the right conditions (environment, mindset) can definitely get it about once a week.
-------------------- Let it be seen that you are nothing. And in knowing that you are nothing... there is nothing to lose, there is nothing to gain. What can happen to you? Something can happen to the body, but it will either heal or it won't. What's the big deal? Let life knock you to bits. Let life take you apart. Let life destroy you. It will only destroy what you are not. --Jac O'keeffe
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DividedQuantum
Outer Head


Registered: 12/06/13
Posts: 9,819
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I have to wonder if there is anything to "get." If one withdraws the question, one withdraws the need for an answer.
-------------------- Vi Veri Universum Vivus Vici
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LunarEclipse
Enlil's Official Story


Registered: 10/31/04
Posts: 21,407
Loc: Building 7
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Re: What will you do tomorrow? [Re: Khancious]
#23820900 - 11/10/16 07:38 PM (7 years, 2 months ago) |
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Quote:
Khancious said: I'll be thinking about the yesterday I thought that I was thinking of today as if I was seeing into the future tomorrow, but at least I have something to works towards in the now.

I think my computer will be going down tomorrow.
-------------------- Anxiety is what you make it.
Edited by LunarEclipse (11/10/16 07:44 PM)
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