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Offlinetopdog82
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amphetamine is the same as meth?
    #23807331 - 11/06/16 04:47 PM (7 years, 2 months ago)

http://www.vice.com/read/a-neuroscientist-explains-how-he-found-out-meth-is-almost-identical-to-adderall?utm_source=vicefbus

So this gentleman (I am actually starting to read through his book) claims that amps and meth are identical minus the dosage range

Could this be true? I was addicted to oral/intranasal amphetamines and ritalin. I can say that both of these burn you the fuck out and are incredibly damaging. I have 0 interest in using either anymore. But if you are really careful and smart they can help you quite a bit and within a specific context. (emphasis on extra careful). but from Bitter Cactus' and a few others members' posts, I want to say that their descriptions of meth and amphetamine are completely different

But one thing to factor in; the descriptions that BC/other posters gave me where basically the dosages would have been large and the routes are usually smoked or shot

I was wondering if anyone can back up or refute the above article. I already know there are gonna be a ton of people making huge claims and not even reading the article. Thats just how these things typically work. If you are going to refute or support the user's claim, actually click on the article


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OfflineXiliad
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Re: amphetamine is the same as meth? [Re: topdog82]
    #23807416 - 11/06/16 05:12 PM (7 years, 2 months ago)

Hahaha that scientist sounds like a dumb ass,  ive never done Meth but I've done Adderall and compared to the more euphoric stimulants I've done like ethylphenidate, Adderall is way more focused.

With Adderall you get about an hour or two of nice speedy euphoria and then your left with clean focused stimulation.  I can imagine Meth as being pure euphoria that Adderall won't come close to no matter the dose.


--------------------
"I cannot begin to unravel the imagery that imposes itself during the finding of an orgasm. I jacked off eight times that night." Alexander Shulgin PIHKAL #20 2CB


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OfflineHippocampus
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Re: amphetamine is the same as meth? [Re: topdog82] * 1
    #23807423 - 11/06/16 05:14 PM (7 years, 2 months ago)

I get what the neuroscientist is saying.  I'm not sure about the pharmacokinetics and all that.  He seems to believe that his research indicates that the biochemical reactions are more similar than theory would dictate.  But his study example is dubious.  n=13 is laughable. 

But I think his main theme, that meth is the same as any other amphetamine, is mostly accurate.  I think dosage makes the slight differences more pronounced.  dosage for methamphetamine for ADHD is lower than recreational users.  iirc it's something like 5mg for ADHD.  Compared to 30mg for a common recreational dose.  A lot of people smoke meth too, which makes that 30mg hit way harder.  And some people smoke more.   

So let's compare that to coffee.  Imagine the difference between someone who drinks 1 cup of coffee to someone who drinks 6 cups of coffee.  Or injects 600mg of caffeine. 

Anyway.  I'm sure plenty of stim heads around here will say that meth and other amps are way different from each other.  But just remember that in far smaller oral doses those differences are going to be a lot less noticeable.  I don't really believe that they are exactly the same.  But I think the point about methamphetamine stigma, vs stim use in medicine/psyche is valid.  A lot of people hate meth too much.  It's useful for a couple things in medicine.  People just abuse it to the point of horror.


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Offlinetopdog82
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Re: amphetamine is the same as meth? [Re: Hippocampus]
    #23807722 - 11/06/16 06:36 PM (7 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

Hippocampus said:
I get what the neuroscientist is saying.  I'm not sure about the pharmacokinetics and all that.  He seems to believe that his research indicates that the biochemical reactions are more similar than theory would dictate.  But his study example is dubious.  n=13 is laughable. 

But I think his main theme, that meth is the same as any other amphetamine, is mostly accurate.  I think dosage makes the slight differences more pronounced.  dosage for methamphetamine for ADHD is lower than recreational users.  iirc it's something like 5mg for ADHD.  Compared to 30mg for a common recreational dose.  A lot of people smoke meth too, which makes that 30mg hit way harder.  And some people smoke more.   

So let's compare that to coffee.  Imagine the difference between someone who drinks 1 cup of coffee to someone who drinks 6 cups of coffee.  Or injects 600mg of caffeine. 

Anyway.  I'm sure plenty of stim heads around here will say that meth and other amps are way different from each other.  But just remember that in far smaller oral doses those differences are going to be a lot less noticeable.  I don't really believe that they are exactly the same.  But I think the point about methamphetamine stigma, vs stim use in medicine/psyche is valid.  A lot of people hate meth too much.  It's useful for a couple things in medicine.  People just abuse it to the point of horror.



ya this sort of summed up the article pretty well. I think we both agree on this mostly


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InvisibleSophistic Radiance
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Re: amphetamine is the same as meth? [Re: topdog82] * 1
    #23807753 - 11/06/16 06:48 PM (7 years, 2 months ago)

quick n dirty: it is but it isn't. They have the same action on the dopamine system, but meth penetrates the tissues more effectively and has a longer half life which contributes to an exponentially more intense response and reinforcement.

I don't know where this guy gets off acting like he made a profound discovery. It's like comparing moonshine to vodka or something. "Omg guys, I discovered that the chemical in vodka that gets you drunk is THE SAME AS IN MOONSHINE!!!!" Well, duh.


--------------------
Enlil said:
You really are the worst kind of person.



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Offlinesanchothestoner
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Re: amphetamine is the same as meth? [Re: Sophistic Radiance]
    #23807764 - 11/06/16 06:51 PM (7 years, 2 months ago)

it's kinda like mdma:mda to amp:meth as in they have very similar effects, but they're still different.


--------------------
I fucking hate you... God damn, I love you...
But we both know if we stick together, we'll just tear ourselves apart
You are my sunshine, my only sunshine, you make me happy, when skies are grey
You are my heroin, but there's an abscess... God damn, I miss the vein!


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Offlinegoldcaphunter
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Re: amphetamine is the same as meth? [Re: sanchothestoner]
    #23807939 - 11/06/16 08:05 PM (7 years, 2 months ago)

Amphetamine and Meth feel nothing alike. Amphetamine has a lot of speedy/discombobulated effects while meth is euphoric/speedy/discombobulated:lol:


--------------------

The picture to the far left is a reminder to our users to stay safe and healthy, that's my third open heart surgery due to over use of amps. Stay safe kiddos :wink:


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Offlinesanchothestoner
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Re: amphetamine is the same as meth? [Re: goldcaphunter]
    #23807948 - 11/06/16 08:07 PM (7 years, 2 months ago)

no way, man.  pure amphetamine is pretty damn amazing.  not adderall or any of that shit, but legit amp.  it's just not as long or euphoric as meth, imo.  meth also has a slight visual aspect, where amp doesn't.  but i haven't fucked with amp that much, but i have a lot of addies and concerta.


--------------------
I fucking hate you... God damn, I love you...
But we both know if we stick together, we'll just tear ourselves apart
You are my sunshine, my only sunshine, you make me happy, when skies are grey
You are my heroin, but there's an abscess... God damn, I miss the vein!


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OfflineEverything
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Re: amphetamine is the same as meth? [Re: sanchothestoner]
    #23807952 - 11/06/16 08:09 PM (7 years, 2 months ago)

Meth is way more compulsive. The high is different too. I thought for a while that amphetamine and methamphetamine were very similar, but that's really only true chemically. The addictions are different, the way people use them is different.

Meth destructs people much more quickly. I think the act of smoking it has a lot to do with that.

Meth binds to serotonin receptors unlike plain amphetamine.

I think there are considerable differences and that meth burns people out a lot faster. This is from my own personal experience and observation of people around me, as well as knowledge on the pharmacology of both drugs.


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Offlinekoods
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Re: amphetamine is the same as meth? [Re: goldcaphunter]
    #23807958 - 11/06/16 08:11 PM (7 years, 2 months ago)

Meth and regular amphetamine have nearly identical CNS effects, the main difference is
That amphetamine is not as potent.

The peripheral nervous system effects are more pronounced with amphetamine: it produces more of the unpleasant side effects like anxiety, high blood pressure, dry mouth etc than meth. Because of this it is harder to abuse.


--------------------
NotSheekle said
“if I believed she was 16 I would become unattracted to her”


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Offlinesanchothestoner
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Re: amphetamine is the same as meth? [Re: koods]
    #23807962 - 11/06/16 08:12 PM (7 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

koods said:
Meth and regular amphetamine have nearly identical CNS effects, the main difference is
That amphetamine is not as potent.

The peripheral nervous system effects are more pronounced with amphetamine: it produces more of the unpleasant side effects like anxiety, high blood pressure, dry mouth etc than meth. Because of this it is harder to abuse.




this is pretty much what i was tryna say, just used a comparison instead.


--------------------
I fucking hate you... God damn, I love you...
But we both know if we stick together, we'll just tear ourselves apart
You are my sunshine, my only sunshine, you make me happy, when skies are grey
You are my heroin, but there's an abscess... God damn, I miss the vein!


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InvisibleCowb0yNeal00
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Re: amphetamine is the same as meth? [Re: goldcaphunter]
    #23807981 - 11/06/16 08:22 PM (7 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

goldcaphunter said:
Amphetamine and Meth feel nothing alike. Amphetamine has a lot of speedy/discombobulated effects while meth is euphoric/speedy/discombobulated:lol:




thats not true


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Offlinegoldcaphunter
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Re: amphetamine is the same as meth? [Re: Cowb0yNeal00]
    #23808011 - 11/06/16 08:35 PM (7 years, 2 months ago)

I think we're all in agreement here. I'm glad.


--------------------

The picture to the far left is a reminder to our users to stay safe and healthy, that's my third open heart surgery due to over use of amps. Stay safe kiddos :wink:


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Offlinetopdog82
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Re: amphetamine is the same as meth? [Re: Everything]
    #23808053 - 11/06/16 08:52 PM (7 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

sanchothestoner said:
Quote:

koods said:
Meth and regular amphetamine have nearly identical CNS effects, the main difference is
That amphetamine is not as potent.

The peripheral nervous system effects are more pronounced with amphetamine: it produces more of the unpleasant side effects like anxiety, high blood pressure, dry mouth etc than meth. Because of this it is harder to abuse.




this is pretty much what i was tryna say, just used a comparison instead.



i c. Didn't know this
Quote:

Everything said:
Meth is way more compulsive. The high is different too. I thought for a while that amphetamine and methamphetamine were very similar, but that's really only true chemically. The addictions are different, the way people use them is different.

Meth destructs people much more quickly. I think the act of smoking it has a lot to do with that.

Meth binds to serotonin receptors unlike plain amphetamine.

I think there are considerable differences and that meth burns people out a lot faster. This is from my own personal experience and observation of people around me, as well as knowledge on the pharmacology of both drugs.



Well the thing is, people see the world with the view of "the drugs that are socially acceptable are okay. But the drugs that I haven't done and are not socially acceptable are messed". Most people in college who do coke think acid is some ocean of difference. Like if you do it, even a couple times, you turn into some sort of delusional idiot

He was trying to hit home the idea that the main difference between meth and amps is the illegality and stigma. I think that amps would leave people in the streets if they were smokable and more openly available


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Offlinegoldcaphunter
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Re: amphetamine is the same as meth? [Re: topdog82]
    #23808079 - 11/06/16 09:02 PM (7 years, 2 months ago)

Amps are more available than meth in my area. And the addiction potential is super personal too. I know people that HATE stims so they aren't at as much of a risk as people who like them.

Pretty much the only thing I find similar between the two is that they're both stims.


--------------------

The picture to the far left is a reminder to our users to stay safe and healthy, that's my third open heart surgery due to over use of amps. Stay safe kiddos :wink:


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Offlinetopdog82
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Re: amphetamine is the same as meth? [Re: goldcaphunter]
    #23808114 - 11/06/16 09:16 PM (7 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

goldcaphunter said:
Amps are more available than meth in my area. And the addiction potential is super personal too. I know people that HATE stims so they aren't at as much of a risk as people who like them.

Pretty much the only thing I find similar between the two is that they're both stims.



but here's the thing; you are taking amps orally correct? the only way to properly test would be to get both amphetamine and methamphetamine via powder form, and capsule them (not tablet) and have a friend or girlfriend blindly give you small, medium, and large dosages

Cause I am assuming that you took amps via adderall, and meth via meth pipe?


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Offlinegoldcaphunter
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Re: amphetamine is the same as meth? [Re: topdog82]
    #23808155 - 11/06/16 09:36 PM (7 years, 2 months ago)

I'm referring mostly to oral roa. I've taken amps via adderall, pastes and pressed pills; orally and nasally. Meth orally, snorted, smoked and shot.

I know what you're saying tho. But I'm referring to the effects in a lumped fashion. We can talk all night about the minute differences between different roa's. :smile:


--------------------

The picture to the far left is a reminder to our users to stay safe and healthy, that's my third open heart surgery due to over use of amps. Stay safe kiddos :wink:


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Offlinesanchothestoner
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Re: amphetamine is the same as meth? [Re: goldcaphunter] * 1
    #23808189 - 11/06/16 09:54 PM (7 years, 2 months ago)

ur so hardcore


--------------------
I fucking hate you... God damn, I love you...
But we both know if we stick together, we'll just tear ourselves apart
You are my sunshine, my only sunshine, you make me happy, when skies are grey
You are my heroin, but there's an abscess... God damn, I miss the vein!


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Offlineedos
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Re: amphetamine is the same as meth? [Re: topdog82]
    #23808469 - 11/07/16 01:50 AM (7 years, 2 months ago)

I've done some pretty degenerate things in the past, so I have some experience with this unfortunately. In low oral doses, adderall (amphetamine) and methamphetamine feel pretty similar. When taking higher doses or abusing it, they are very different. Meth is incredibly recreational and even kind of intoxicating feeling; it turns you into a euphoric mess. Taking high doses of amphetamine doesn't really do that...initially it makes you feel motivated/productive, but then it just starts making you feel on edge, and kind of in a shitty mood, and you would much rather it just wear off so that you can go to sleep.


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OfflineLucisM
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Re: amphetamine is the same as meth? [Re: goldcaphunter]
    #23808501 - 11/07/16 02:44 AM (7 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

goldcaphunter said:
Amphetamine and Meth feel nothing alike. Amphetamine has a lot of speedy/discombobulated effects while meth is euphoric/speedy/discombobulated:lol:





Parachuting 0.3-0.5 meth has always given me a smooth ride, with low dose (20-30mg) adderall I used to take years ago, I would feel awake, but jerky kind of, not as smooth as ice, I have heard people say the exact opposite though, so I guess it all depends on the quality of your meth, and your bodies chemistry?


--------------------
©️


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