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OfflineSkellies


Registered: 06/02/15
Posts: 822
Loc: The Dream
Last seen: 1 day, 56 minutes
How do you stop being bitter?
    #23784066 - 10/29/16 10:32 PM (7 years, 3 months ago)

I think the title says everything but here's some background.

It seems as if throughout my life so far I've been very lonely. I was made fun of/bullied throughout middle school and in high school I was just ignored. I would sit with some people at lunch but they just tolerated my presence until they kicked me out of their group. After graduation I decided to attend a large public university because it would provide more opportunities to make friends. After over two years of being here I can't say I've seriously befriended anyone. I have many people I'm friendly with but at the end of the day they will only contact me if they want something which can be quite often. If I ever ask to hang out or try and plan anything they will just ignore me or give the standard "I'm busy". I think the reason I'm not getting anywhere is because I'm quiet and a little socially awkward. It's effected my employment as well. I've been rejected from positions I'm qualified for because apparently I can't pass a job interview. If I wasn't self employed right now I would be screwed.

I've tried to change this part of myself but it's hard to practice social skills when nobody wants to talk. Around a two years ago I would get very sad and cry when I was alone but now I'm unable to cry even if I try to. Eventually the sadness and hopelessness was replaced with anger. I've been channeling it into motivation for working out and other forms of self improvement but when nothing improves in my social life I get more angry and over time the anger has turned into bitterness. I've noticed that my sense of humor has darkened. When world events such as terrorism or war happen I get excited but I notice other people reacting very differently. Taking psychedelics has only reinforced these feelings. While I do feel more connected to other people, this connection makes me feel victimized in the sense of "How could you do this to me? Why do you only value me for your personal gain? You must be a bad person."

I know that in order to change my predicament I will need to stop being bitter and start being more positive. The problem is that I don't know how to. So far my personal experiences with other people have been pretty bad so whenever I see them I involuntarily assume the worst. Has anyone here been bitter and if so how did you get out of it?

TLDR: Throughout my life people have only taken an interest in me whenever they wanted something. People who I thought were good friends showed their true colors once I inconvenienced them in the slightest. This has led to me being bitter and I need to stop. Has anyone here been bitter and if so how did you get out of it?


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InvisibleCookieCrumbsM
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Registered: 12/10/11
Posts: 14,146
Re: How do you stop being bitter? [Re: Skellies] * 2
    #23784334 - 10/30/16 02:32 AM (7 years, 2 months ago)

Alot of people suck. But not all of them. It's not all you and your head that's the problem. I had the same issue. I still do, to a degree. And it sounds fucked up but I cope with it by using people. They use me. I use them. I don't let them use me for things I really don't want to do and I usually give the a generous line I don't cross. It makes it easier not to be angry and disappointed. It makes it easier to take having a social life way less seriously.

That's not to say I don't feel bad about these things. I've been in a pretty thick depression most of the year so I pushed most of my friends away. Or I suppose I let them fade away. All relationships involve a balance of give and take. I haven't been in a state of mind to give much and all my mind wants to do is take. So I've let them go. I do feel a bit bitter and resentful that the one person I still chatted with occasionally got mad about me "not keeping up with her" and shit "because that's what friends do." ime most friends aren't worth keeping. Not that I think they should be gotten rid of but if they want to go or don't want to hold on and be there after the storms clear then they should just be let go.


Same case with making friends. They're not worth an extreme amount of effort. Loose and easy is the best way to go about it. Break the ice, start a conversation, offer to chill somewhere. If you give more than you get, say something or move on.


School makes your circumstances a bit different. You have much more opportunities to make and have friends. But so do they. And people will always choose to spend their time on the most beneficial people. Doesn't mean you have to do them favors all the time. You can just be interesting to talk to or fun to hang out with. If you aren't either of these things then it's probably time you get into a hobby. Learn an instrument, play a sport, write novels, whatever interests you. Because what interests you is apart of you and that's bound to interest someone else out there.


The friends I have that I know I'll see again are the ones that share an interest in me. Not what I can do or do for them. And I feel the same about them. If you want a social life you can have one. But you have to be able to get and to give. Don't take it so seriously, just enjoy yourself, enjoy your company. If you can't do that with some people without it feeling like a chore or they cross your own line then just don't chill with them. Or make your lines and boundaries clear. If they still can't respect that then definitely move on.


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          :dancingbear: Free time is the only time :dancingbear:                    :thatsinteresting:


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OfflineRJ Tubs 202
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Registered: 09/20/08
Posts: 6,016
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Re: How do you stop being bitter? [Re: Skellies]
    #23784365 - 10/30/16 03:10 AM (7 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

austothehun said:

I know that in order to change my predicament I will need to stop being bitter and start being more positive.




Have you considered abandoning your expectation people should behave as you want them to?

Forget trying to adopt a positive attitude. Just deal with your negativity.


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Offlinebeforethedawn
Registered: 06/19/16
Posts: 1,859
Last seen: 4 years, 5 months
Re: How do you stop being bitter? [Re: RJ Tubs 202]
    #23784481 - 10/30/16 05:56 AM (7 years, 2 months ago)

Lay your woes on the Self. :sunny:


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Hostile humankind
Can't you see you're fucking blind?


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OfflineSkellies


Registered: 06/02/15
Posts: 822
Loc: The Dream
Last seen: 1 day, 56 minutes
Re: How do you stop being bitter? [Re: RJ Tubs 202]
    #23785465 - 10/30/16 01:18 PM (7 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

CookieCrumbs said:
And it sounds fucked up but I cope with it by using people. They use me. I use them. I don't let them use me for things I really don't want to do and I usually give the a generous line I don't cross. It makes it easier not to be angry and disappointed. It makes it easier to take having a social life way less seriously.





I don't really have anything to use people for except company. The problem is that I lack social skills but I can't improve because nobody is willing to spend time with me which makes me angry because they act like my friend.

Quote:

CookieCrumbs said:
You can just be interesting to talk to or fun to hang out with. If you aren't either of these things then it's probably time you get into a hobby. Learn an instrument, play a sport, write novels, whatever interests you. Because what interests you is apart of you and that's bound to interest someone else out there.





This is probably what I'm going to continue doing. I'm just afraid of being too bitter for people once they start taking genuine interest in me.

Quote:

RJ Tubs 202 said:
Have you considered abandoning your expectation people should behave as you want them to?




I think it's generally accepted that people shouldn't manipulate each other.


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OfflineThey
Stranger


Registered: 10/23/16
Posts: 146
Last seen: 7 years, 2 months
Re: How do you stop being bitter? [Re: Skellies] * 1
    #23786006 - 10/30/16 03:54 PM (7 years, 2 months ago)

Oh this sounds like a fantastic case to take a look at, thanks for sharing :highfive:

First of, yes, I've had periods of my life where I've been bitter. No, it's not permanent or anything (unless you make it) so yes, it can be outgrown and transcended.

Quote:

I've been rejected from positions I'm qualified for because apparently I can't pass a job interview. If I wasn't self employed right now I would be screwed.



What do you do? Bears little relevance on the bitterness, but genuinely curious. What work do you do and how do you like it?

Basically what you need to understand is that "talking", verbalizing, isn't all that important, all that it's cracked up to be. There's other stuff like body language, how you breathe and carry yourself, that kinda comes before that. Whether you get the girl or the new friend during an interaction is not so much what you say, but what else you do, and how you say it. Whether you're relaxed or tense as hell. If you're tense you're spreading tension, and your lines simply don't matter, people just want you away because nobody wants more stress and tension brought upon them. Applies to job interviews as well.

Here, check this stuff out for instance. Serotonin from group integration and Oxytocin from quality skin contact, are cornerstones of feeling OK with yourself. Now the last one, even if you're socially awkward as shit, you can still show up to a massage parlor, get a massage 1-2 times a week, with or without happy ending (I don't know how that works :lol: ) and you'll get a nice Oxytocin boost. The relaxation from that will make you more mellow for the next couple of days, thus increasing your chances at having cool interactions. Less imaginative people will try to do something like this by getting cheap Dopamine spikes from smoking cigs or drinking/eating sugary crap, but these have all manner of crazy side-effects compared to Oxytocin from massage. Food for thought :smile:

What you describe here, I've definitely had, I mean I was at times (middle school, high school) a secluded video gamer, only leaving house for school work, that's it, and I was literally afraid of doing things like going to get a haircut (my dad used to cut my hair so I'd never learned how to act when going to a hair salon, or whatever it's called), or going to shop for shoes & clothes, or on bad days even walking down the street.

Later I got more into fitness and studied PUA (which I recommend, hit some YouTube, RSD Julien is one of my faves) and I started to put attention on social interactions, to bring that Prefrontal Cortex into it more, even started having some success with the girls, but STILL I'd have these massive bouts of bitterness and anger at the world from time to time. Didn't know it then but my diet at the time was shit, WAY too much Omega 6 in it, which is inflammatory, it triggers overthinking, worry, insomnia, all kinds of crazy.

In the meantime I've learned a vast array of skills and methods to make life work, and now I can do things like go in some park or city square, and do things that literally attract ALL attention on me, I am talking dozens or hundred of people, and just be chill about it. Bitterness, I may have it about some bitch girl or other (generally liars) but I think that's fairly normal, I mean I do like females in general. Whatever I'm bitter about I just express, eject, moving on. Life's too short to stay angry.

Things that helped me a ton:

- PUA - to understand how things work between humans, between males and females of any species

- Terence McKenna, Alan Watts, Ram Dass - the way these dudes talk just mellows me out, long term.

- Stand-up comedy, and comedy movies. Don't underestimate endorphins, funny shit, for breaking that spell of bitter serious tension. Even some threads and posts here on the shroomery get me going, I mean one proper fool is all you need :lol:

- Tripping. Shroom tripping specifically. Epic. Awesome.

- Psytrance festivals. Being there, seeing people that really open up, move, smile, hug, share of themselves, radiate beauty and peace. Having been to several, I am now bringing that stuff to the emotionally dead city areas where I live the rest of the year.

- Meditation. This was a HUGE one. I couldn't do it by myself, no matter how I tried, but the shrooms and Aya kept insisting that there's something to learn in that direction and so I went to a 10-day retreat. This blew the whole game wide open, as this together with the tripping opened some next level skills, observations and insights that just have to be witnessed to be believed. It's pandemonium. Read some of my other posts to see how my head works, you'll see some shit :lol:

- Learning how we use language more effectively. Trips pointed out how we can make things in our head permanent or temporary. You use in this thread several instances of negative language against yourself. Examples below:

Quote:

I think the reason I'm not getting anywhere is because I'm quiet and a little socially awkward.



You're making the negative permanent. To be of any use to you whatsoever, this phrase should read:

I think the reason I didn't get anywhere yet is because I was quiet and a little socially awkward. <- - - notice how this leaves place in the future for maybe not being so socially awkward as in the past.

Notice how you still have the same exact data, but it's clearly identified as in the past, something that you DID not something that you DO. Have seen a lot of this problematic language here on the forum, and heard it offline, and am sure was using it myself years ago before cracking this.

Quote:


I don't really have anything to use people for except company.



Sure you do. We're pack animals, like the neurons in our heads, we work better together in teams. I know you've been surviving solo, maybe for decades, I have as well, but knowing what I know now I wouldn't plan on solo existence for too long as there's simply no way to get that Serotonin and Oxytocin going proper, unless you work with others. So you don't just need "people", you need "people you feel some sense of connection with" - which is more specific. Don't try to bond and make friends with every fool and bimbo you run across. Most of my university colleagues I had nothing in common with, never kept in touch. Most people I meet today I have nothing in common with, nor do I wish to. Be selective, find the others, like Terence says, find your tribe and you will thrive :smile:

Anyway as I read between the lines, you have deeper underlying issues that are the root cause of your current issues, all people have them, it has to do with your relationship to your parents, and to which extent they were bold decisive open affectionate people. It's not just kids who get abused and knocked around that can grow up with emotional issues. Simpler things like insufficient attention (eye contact) or insufficient skin contact, hugs and the like, can have a tremendous effect on how we feel emotionally, what we perceive as baseline.

I know I've been there, my folks weren't huggers or too affectionate either, initially I thought sex solves everything, but then I found I can be bitter and angry even on the evening that I just got laid, so then that told me that nope, it's something else, having to do with the heart, affection, emotions, connection, and since the psytrance peeps were doing and sharing that, then I learned how the game of life really goes :smile:

It can be transcended dude, and do start taking some steps to do so, as the kind of mean vindictive humor you describe can get out of hand really fast if you leave it unchecked. That sense of hatred towards others, feeling let down and disconnected, that's what events like Columbine are made of. Same stuff you describe here, just a lot more of it. I've had some too, but luckily found ways to fix it before it became a real problem :smile:


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OfflineSkellies


Registered: 06/02/15
Posts: 822
Loc: The Dream
Last seen: 1 day, 56 minutes
Re: How do you stop being bitter? [Re: They]
    #23786308 - 10/30/16 05:12 PM (7 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:


What do you do? Bears little relevance on the bitterness, but genuinely curious. What work do you do and how do you like it?





I edit photos. It's cool but it can get tiring because I'm sitting in front of my computer screen for hours on end.

Thanks for the advice, especially the part about language. I never really thought about how the way I phrase things can drastically change the meaning.


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OfflineThey
Stranger


Registered: 10/23/16
Posts: 146
Last seen: 7 years, 2 months
Re: How do you stop being bitter? [Re: Skellies]
    #23786801 - 10/30/16 08:32 PM (7 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

austothehun said:
Quote:


What do you do? Bears little relevance on the bitterness, but genuinely curious. What work do you do and how do you like it?





I edit photos. It's cool but it can get tiring because I'm sitting in front of my computer screen for hours on end.



Sounds cool. I have some computer work that I do as well, so I know how it is. You may want to make sure that you get sunlight and exercise daily, maybe in the morning if you can, just to signal to your brain the proper sleep / wake cycles. We need a certain amount of lumen for that to work, light intensity, and that's generally just not available indoors.

Quote:


Thanks for the advice, especially the part about language. I never really thought about how the way I phrase things can drastically change the meaning.



It most definitely can :yesnod:

You have a few more of that:

- I lack social skills but I can't improve
- I'm just afraid of being too bitter

All these are just expressions (or I prefer to call them spells, verbal spells) about how you're stuck, blocked, and in fact what they do is the "make permanent" some blockages that would dispel simply over time, if not constantly reinforced in this way. It's an issue of attention focus and also formulation.

Basically whatever you wish to change, you're in the business of reformulating in the direction of "this WAS the case, now I am heading in THIS (other) direction". As soon as you say this IS what's going on, I AM like this, then you're withdrawing your energy, becoming passive about that topic and reinforcing fixed reality, where past=future. There's this sensation of no space to move or change, because you're unintentionally declaring that there is no place to move or change. YOU ARE like that, period.

How about saying you've been like that (even if for a long time) and then leaving the future open to whatever comes next? Maybe still the same maybe not. If you do that and also clarify the green bit of what you do want to do or see, then you're changing from red to green, from avoidance and fear, to moving towards, to actually aiming at a target. Very different neurology kicks in to get the job done.

Notice for instance that you weren't really that short on social skills ALL the time from birth to now. Go through your memory and look to various friends you were goofing off with, random spontaneous interactions, maybe you've been to some camp or other, outside of your regular social circle, or someone asked you for advice about something, and in those conditions presto, you have the gift of gab just fine :smile:

Focus on those more, see what happened, how you spoke, and basically you are looking to speak to the people you meet tomorrow, kind of how you spoke those other times when things worked right. For me for instance, it was a huge breakthrough with the girls when I decided to test what would happen if I speak to girls like they're just one of the guys. I even got into the habit of calling girls dude, just to stay fully into character. Works awesome, there's just no place to get all stiff and worried and official, if you're treating this person like your homie you've known for years (and not trying to bang right away) :lol:

What kind of photos are you editing? Looking to outsource some of that? I know my way around Photoshop and am looking for some variation in my activities.


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OfflineSkellies


Registered: 06/02/15
Posts: 822
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Last seen: 1 day, 56 minutes
Re: How do you stop being bitter? [Re: They]
    #23787008 - 10/30/16 09:38 PM (7 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

What kind of photos are you editing? Looking to outsource some of that? I know my way around Photoshop and am looking for some variation in my activities.




It's mostly marketing materials and portraits for social media. I'm going on a hike soon so I can send you some nature shots if you want.


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OfflineThey
Stranger


Registered: 10/23/16
Posts: 146
Last seen: 7 years, 2 months
Re: How do you stop being bitter? [Re: Skellies]
    #23787091 - 10/30/16 10:13 PM (7 years, 2 months ago)

Was asking if you need some extra help with the editing work, if that's something I can do as well. I know at one point I hired some peeps from the Philippines to do some of the online work I was doing, I paid them a decent % of what I was getting paid for the work, kept a nice finder's fee for myself, everybody turned a profit :tongue2:


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OfflineSkellies


Registered: 06/02/15
Posts: 822
Loc: The Dream
Last seen: 1 day, 56 minutes
Re: How do you stop being bitter? [Re: They]
    #23789479 - 10/31/16 06:27 PM (7 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

They said:
Was asking if you need some extra help with the editing work, if that's something I can do as well.




I'm not pulling enough work yet to start outsourcing. I'll definitely keep it in mind though.


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OfflineRosen_Rot
Learning
I'm a teapot


Registered: 12/06/14
Posts: 1,225
Loc: Goa
Last seen: 11 months, 22 days
Re: How do you stop being bitter? [Re: CookieCrumbs]
    #23793586 - 11/02/16 02:04 AM (7 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

CookieCrumbs said:
Alot of people suck. But not all of them. It's not all you and your head that's the problem. I had the same issue. I still do, to a degree. And it sounds fucked up but I cope with it by using people. They use me. I use them. I don't let them use me for things I really don't want to do and I usually give the a generous line I don't cross. It makes it easier not to be angry and disappointed. It makes it easier to take having a social life way less seriously.




My situation as the same as you OP, people have made me bitter by isolating me all the time. I've spent the first 15years of my life since I started primary school being bullied, outcasted, beaten up, made fun off, had my toys/things stolen and I made countless efforts to try and connect with some of them. I used to bring my hot wheels to school and they would just steal it and destroy them infront of me, boys and girls mind you. They used to bully me so much that I had to go to hospital for a hernia cause their favorite place was to kick me in the nuts. No matter how many times I tried to appeal to authority no one would listen, this explains my extreme distaste towards authority. I thought junior school and high school would be different but instead it got scarier and more physical. I used to get threatened, I had to avoid certain corridors, sometimes I wasn't even safe just sitting in the classroom during recess. They always found a way to make my life more miserable.

I had found some solice in drawing but that wasn't enough. I couldn't open up to my parents, my mother was dealing with a lot of abuse at home so she had her own problems a 10year old couldn't help with, my dad was just a spoilt shit and I never trusted him nor liked him from day one, my brother often played the father role for me but he was moving to college back then so protection was extremely limited.

Anyway that caused me to become extremely bitter, hateful, raging and a little violent and much like Cookiecrumbs I learned on my own how to manipulate people and using them towards my advantage. During my time growing up I realized I had a knack of convincing people along with my frontal assault attitude. I manipulate and use people towards my advantage but nothing ever bad that would cause them harm, just enough to get what I want and advance in my practices, knowledge, resources...etc behind the curtain sort of things that they had no idea about

I am not as bitter as I once was but still can be sometimes, especially with ex-stuff, even though they don't care about me anymore I still have moments where I just want bad things to happen to them and then later realize ''what am I thinking'' and try to reverse back the thoughts and instead try to understand the situation. I have this attitude with everything now, instead of giving people the satisfaction of my reaction, I ponder on what could have caused this individual to react this way. Sometimes it can lead to self blame and I put blame on myself where I think I was to blame but there is a fine line between admitting to your mistakes and rage hating yourself for it.

What I am saying is realize your potential and that you every right as everyone else to respect yourself, love yourself, you have every right to live in a safe environment and have every right to access resources much like everyone else :shineon:


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:sporedrop:"The internet has one rule; use or be used" - Bjeldiablo :sporedrop:
''there is no loneliness, only moments where contentment is fleeting''

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Invisiblesudly
Darwin's stagger


Registered: 01/05/15
Posts: 10,811
Re: How do you stop being bitter? [Re: Skellies] * 1
    #23793905 - 11/02/16 08:12 AM (7 years, 2 months ago)

Learn to:
- Love yourself
- Ignore irrelevant thoughts that sadden your mood
- Don't bottle up your anger, but instead practice expressing it coherently


--------------------
I am whatever Darwin needs me to be.



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