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OfflineOregonic
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Re: POINT DEFIANCE IS A TRAP [Re: Rain_Cloud]
    #23791339 - 11/01/16 01:20 PM (7 years, 2 months ago)

I've had one other encounter on the coast in which I actually was picking, by a trooper in Astoria. This was when I was a bit younger and didn't give as many fucks, and the cop literally saw us in the psilocybe stoop, while I had a bag of azzies in my coat. He harassed us, we denied and had our story straight, played dumb. He tried to search and we told him to respectfully fuck off in less words and that was that. He did however record my license plate, so I never drove that car while hunting ever again.


Quote:

Rain_Cloud said:

You tried to warn me a couple years back, I saw it in my post history, I should have listened to you!!!!!    I'm now facing felony charges jail time...




Wow you're right. I went through your post history to see and sure enough I did warn you.

But wait - you actually did get arrested and charged with a felony? Jesus fuck man, I'm sorry.

How did this all go down? Did you refuse a search? I don't see how being bent over picking shit out of the grass is truly probable cause to search. Can they really ID azures through their fucking binoculars?

Assuming you fully denied a search until they forced a search, I would shell out the money for a good lawyer to fight the legality of said search. If you just handed them over... well... You may be shit outta luck. Thing is cops will lie to you about REALLY having probable cause in attempt to get you to give yourself up.

I have a lawyer friend, so I'm going to ask him what would be required for true, legal probable cause for a search in these situations. I'm a bit curious.

If it's a first time felony with no criminal history I doubt you'll do jail time. But if you have the money you should hire a lawyer regardless and hope to at least plea down to a misdemeanor.

And Joust - that's fucked up man. Taking pics of actives isn't illegal - all of us and the cops know that. That makes me want to go to Cape D and just take pics just to irritate those cunts.

Not that I would, I don't really want to be in their radar.


--------------------


Edited by Oregonic (11/01/16 01:38 PM)


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Invisiblemaynardjameskeenan
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Re: POINT DEFIANCE IS A TRAP [Re: Oregonic]
    #23791405 - 11/01/16 01:42 PM (7 years, 2 months ago)

Please watch these videos anyone who hasn't seem them yet, you're freedom with worth 40 minutes of video.





--------------------
May you be filled with loving kindness.
May you be well.
May you be peaceful and at ease.
May you be happy.



AMU Q&A


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OfflineOregonic
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Re: POINT DEFIANCE IS A TRAP [Re: maynardjameskeenan]
    #23791429 - 11/01/16 01:48 PM (7 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

maynardjameskeenan said:
Please watch these videos anyone who hasn't seem them yet, you're freedom with worth 40 minutes of video.








Damn fucking straight.

However people in this thread seem to think that being seen bent over looking at the grass is qualifies as probable cause and makes you lose your rights.

Seems very wrong to me.

Again, and in case people are to lazy to watch these videos - everybody needs to deny deny deny a search, literally make them force you into a search, period. They're not going to "go easy on you" if you admit it, and they could very well be lying when they say they have probably cause so you might as well cooperate. Cops are not your friends, they do not want to help you, and they can legally lie to get you to incriminate yourself. Don't tell them a god damn thing.


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InvisibleMr Piggy
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Re: POINT DEFIANCE IS A TRAP [Re: Oregonic]
    #23791988 - 11/01/16 04:33 PM (7 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

Oregonic said:


However people in this thread seem to think that being seen bent over looking at the grass is qualifies as probable cause and makes you lose your rights.

Seems very wrong to me.






You're right, I do not know if that is legally considered probable cause.  It's likely up to the judge you get stuck with.


--------------------
🅃🄴🄰🄼 🄵🄾🄸🄻


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InvisibleRiverDweller1
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Re: POINT DEFIANCE IS A TRAP [Re: Oregonic] * 2
    #23792087 - 11/01/16 05:00 PM (7 years, 2 months ago)

It is a mistake to believe the police are upholding the constitution, they don't have time and frankly it's not their job.  That's what a court or jurors and a judge is for.  It is certainly probable cause just as much as swerving in the road late at night near a bar is. 

You will need good money for a lawyer who can actually prove your rights were violated and even then, any statement you make while in the presence of police that proves to be a lie is grounds to not have your rights upheld.  I wish believing in justice wasn't so lofty.  Also, it's pretty silly to have a conversation about probably cause and your rights because you are basically giving up your freedom while knowingly breaking the law.


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OfflineRain_Cloud
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Re: POINT DEFIANCE IS A TRAP [Re: Oregonic]
    #23792174 - 11/01/16 05:27 PM (7 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

Oregonic said:
I've had one other encounter on the coast in which I actually was picking, by a trooper in Astoria. This was when I was a bit younger and didn't give as many fucks, and the cop literally saw us in the psilocybe stoop, while I had a bag of azzies in my coat. He harassed us, we denied and had our story straight, played dumb. He tried to search and we told him to respectfully fuck off in less words and that was that. He did however record my license plate, so I never drove that car while hunting ever again.


Quote:

Rain_Cloud said:

You tried to warn me a couple years back, I saw it in my post history, I should have listened to you!!!!!    I'm now facing felony charges jail time...




Wow you're right. I went through your post history to see and sure enough I did warn you.

But wait - you actually did get arrested and charged with a felony? Jesus fuck man, I'm sorry.

How did this all go down? Did you refuse a search? I don't see how being bent over picking shit out of the grass is truly probable cause to search. Can they really ID azures through their fucking binoculars?

Assuming you fully denied a search until they forced a search, I would shell out the money for a good lawyer to fight the legality of said search. If you just handed them over... well... You may be shit outta luck. Thing is cops will lie to you about REALLY having probable cause in attempt to get you to give yourself up.

I have a lawyer friend, so I'm going to ask him what would be required for true, legal probable cause for a search in these situations. I'm a bit curious.

If it's a first time felony with no criminal history I doubt you'll do jail time. But if you have the money you should hire a lawyer regardless and hope to at least plea down to a misdemeanor.

And Joust - that's fucked up man. Taking pics of actives isn't illegal - all of us and the cops know that. That makes me want to go to Cape D and just take pics just to irritate those cunts.

Not that I would, I don't really want to be in their radar.






Ya, it really does suck.  I've never even gotten a traffic ticket and now I'm afraid I will lose my apartment and career due to the charges.  I already spent a night in jail and I have to go back to serve more time.  I did not concent to the search.  For all of these reasons I felt it necessary to make this post.  Oh ya, cherry on top was getting my car impounded...

P.S.  love the avatar.  :smile:


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Invisiblemaynardjameskeenan
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Re: POINT DEFIANCE IS A TRAP [Re: Rain_Cloud]
    #23792195 - 11/01/16 05:32 PM (7 years, 2 months ago)

Can we hear your story? I'm really interested in what happened to you.


--------------------
May you be filled with loving kindness.
May you be well.
May you be peaceful and at ease.
May you be happy.



AMU Q&A


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OfflineOregonic
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Re: POINT DEFIANCE IS A TRAP [Re: RiverDweller1]
    #23792250 - 11/01/16 05:47 PM (7 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

Mr Piggy said:
Quote:

Oregonic said:


However people in this thread seem to think that being seen bent over looking at the grass is qualifies as probable cause and makes you lose your rights.

Seems very wrong to me.






You're right, I do not know if that is legally considered probable cause.  It's likely up to the judge you get stuck with.





Indeed! Hopefully it never gets to that point for any hunter. Being at the mercy of a small town judge is not a position I ever wish upon anybody.
Quote:




RiverDweller1 said:
It is a mistake to believe the police are upholding the constitution, they don't have time and frankly it's not their job.  That's what a court or jurors and a judge is for.  It is certainly probable cause just as much as swerving in the road late at night near a bar is. 

You will need good money for a lawyer who can actually prove your rights were violated and even then, any statement you make while in the presence of police that proves to be a lie is grounds to not have your rights upheld.  I wish believing in justice wasn't so lofty.  Also, it's pretty silly to have a conversation about probably cause and your rights because you are basically giving up your freedom while knowingly breaking the law.




Who ever said we were trusting the cops to uphold the Constitution? I'm not saying to sit there and go all sovereign citizen on the fucking cops, I'm talking about what happens after that fact and your fate is in the hands of your lawyer and the court. You just reiterated exactly my point.

Lawyers exist to make sure you get a fair shake with the justice system and that the cops followed the rules and never violated your rights - as long as you kept your mouth shut and consented to nothing.

Silly to talk about probable cause and your rights? Wtf? Alright, pack it up guys, let's all go turn ourselves in to the nearest courthouse for every illegal thing we've ever done in our lives; might as well! People breaking the law still have rights.

Obviously we all take a risk our freedom doing what we do, but that doesn't mean we should just roll over and take the long dick of the justice system or not protect ourselves.

And being stooped over in a field is not equal to swerving in a car when it comes to probable cause. It could be argued that being stooped over in a field picking shit out of the grass in an area known for psilocybe harvesting meets probable cause, but I guarantee it's a lot more murky than that. I'm just creating awareness that even mushroom hunters DO have rights, should exercise them, consent to nothing and admit to nothing regardless of what the cops are telling you - because they indeed don't uphold the Constitution nor want to help you.


--------------------


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OfflineRain_Cloud
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Re: POINT DEFIANCE IS A TRAP [Re: maynardjameskeenan]
    #23792259 - 11/01/16 05:48 PM (7 years, 2 months ago)

The case hasn't been ruled on yet so I can't say too much.    I will tell you that there are officers from multiple agency's both in the woods and at a vantage point looking for pickers with binoculars.  I hold no ill will against the arresting officers, they were just doing their jobs but none the less my life is falling apart at the moment.


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OfflineOregonic
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Re: POINT DEFIANCE IS A TRAP [Re: maynardjameskeenan]
    #23792282 - 11/01/16 05:54 PM (7 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

maynardjameskeenan said:
Can we hear your story? I'm really interested in what happened to you.




Second this. Give us the deets OP.

I'm really sorry to hear what you're going through. I ended up being a prisoner of the War on Drugs at one time, and it's a very stressful thing to deal with.

But trust me, find a way to get a good lawyer. Take out a loan, borrow money if you have to. Having a clean record and a career is largely going to help you and I doubt it will put your life in shambles, but you want to do everything in your power to keep a felony charge off of your record.

If you need to talk to someone that's been through it all (not mushrooms, but still), feel free to PM me. You can get through it too.


--------------------


Edited by Oregonic (11/01/16 06:00 PM)


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Invisibledoctorghosty
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Re: POINT DEFIANCE IS A TRAP [Re: Oregonic] * 1
    #23792303 - 11/01/16 06:00 PM (7 years, 2 months ago)

Set up a GoFundMe for your legal fund and post the link here and in various forums around here, I'd contribute, i'm sure others would too. Don't let these fucking swine get you down


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InvisibleAdden
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Re: POINT DEFIANCE IS A TRAP [Re: doctorghosty]
    #23792389 - 11/01/16 06:21 PM (7 years, 2 months ago)

And last year you guys rolled your eyes and laughed at me when I told you I spotted them scoping with binoculars. It would be foolish to think they don't.

I bring mine for viewing scenery and you can just watch these guys. Get a high vantage point and watch some birds for awhile every few hours and if you see something you don't like you can leave before it becomes a problem. I dunno I also like to know who has come into or left the park, too, or if my car is safe.



Edit- And yeah it's beyond foolish to pick at Cape D. Or the entirety of Pacific County for that matter. Unless you like getting arrested I guess. Every time I see someone post finds from around there I get worried, like it's just a matter of time.


Edited by Adden (11/01/16 06:30 PM)


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InvisibleRiverDweller1
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Re: POINT DEFIANCE IS A TRAP [Re: doctorghosty]
    #23792752 - 11/01/16 07:47 PM (7 years, 2 months ago)

GoFundMe doesn't allow for legal defense contributions.


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InvisibleRiverDweller1
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Re: POINT DEFIANCE IS A TRAP [Re: Oregonic] * 1
    #23792759 - 11/01/16 07:49 PM (7 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

Oregonic said:
Quote:

Mr Piggy said:
Quote:

Oregonic said:


However people in this thread seem to think that being seen bent over looking at the grass is qualifies as probable cause and makes you lose your rights.

Seems very wrong to me.






You're right, I do not know if that is legally considered probable cause.  It's likely up to the judge you get stuck with.





Indeed! Hopefully it never gets to that point for any hunter. Being at the mercy of a small town judge is not a position I ever wish upon anybody.
Quote:




RiverDweller1 said:
It is a mistake to believe the police are upholding the constitution, they don't have time and frankly it's not their job.  That's what a court or jurors and a judge is for.  It is certainly probable cause just as much as swerving in the road late at night near a bar is. 

You will need good money for a lawyer who can actually prove your rights were violated and even then, any statement you make while in the presence of police that proves to be a lie is grounds to not have your rights upheld.  I wish believing in justice wasn't so lofty.  Also, it's pretty silly to have a conversation about probably cause and your rights because you are basically giving up your freedom while knowingly breaking the law.




Who ever said we were trusting the cops to uphold the Constitution? I'm not saying to sit there and go all sovereign citizen on the fucking cops, I'm talking about what happens after that fact and your fate is in the hands of your lawyer and the court. You just reiterated exactly my point.

Lawyers exist to make sure you get a fair shake with the justice system and that the cops followed the rules and never violated your rights - as long as you kept your mouth shut and consented to nothing.

Silly to talk about probable cause and your rights? Wtf? Alright, pack it up guys, let's all go turn ourselves in to the nearest courthouse for every illegal thing we've ever done in our lives; might as well! People breaking the law still have rights.

Obviously we all take a risk our freedom doing what we do, but that doesn't mean we should just roll over and take the long dick of the justice system or not protect ourselves.

And being stooped over in a field is not equal to swerving in a car when it comes to probable cause. It could be argued that being stooped over in a field picking shit out of the grass in an area known for psilocybe harvesting meets probable cause, but I guarantee it's a lot more murky than that. I'm just creating awareness that even mushroom hunters DO have rights, should exercise them, consent to nothing and admit to nothing regardless of what the cops are telling you - because they indeed don't uphold the Constitution nor want to help you.



go easy, man.  Maybe you didn't read my other responses in this thread but I'm clearly not saying anything you just vomited up here.  Peace.


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InvisibleJoust
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Re: POINT DEFIANCE IS A TRAP [Re: maynardjameskeenan]
    #23792765 - 11/01/16 07:51 PM (7 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

maynardjameskeenan said:
Quote:

Mr Piggy said:
Quote:

Rain_Cloud said:
Quote:

Mr Piggy said:
It's a scare tactic to try and make people panic.  Keep your cool, know your rights, deny, deny, deny.  The fact he said give them up as apposed to just searching you means either he did not see you pick them or he does not have the authority to search you.  You played it well.





Apparently if they watch you picking thru binoculars it is probable cause to search...

I was not aware that they had multiple officers from multiple agency's hidding in the bushes.  :frown:





Yes, it's called the psilocybe stoop for a reason.  If they observe you picking it's probable cause.  Be sure to know what you're about and who has authority.



I would like to go out there and pick loads of Marasmius just to fuck with them.



:bow2::rotfl::lol::laugh2:


--------------------
~~~~~~***Psilocybin Mushrooms***~~~~~~
_________A Practical Guide To Psilocybin Mushrooms_________

:sporedrop:                      "Think about the species, not your scale". -NeoSporen                      :sporedrop:

"Mr. Joust, I see you don't actually partake in the psilocin, but it looks like it may partake in you!" -Gojira


       


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InvisibleJoust
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Re: POINT DEFIANCE IS A TRAP [Re: maynardjameskeenan]
    #23792771 - 11/01/16 07:52 PM (7 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

maynardjameskeenan said:
Please watch these videos anyone who hasn't seem them yet, you're freedom with worth 40 minutes of video.







Maynard saved me a lot of trouble posting these back in the day. Give it a watch if you havent. Thanks man!


--------------------
~~~~~~***Psilocybin Mushrooms***~~~~~~
_________A Practical Guide To Psilocybin Mushrooms_________

:sporedrop:                      "Think about the species, not your scale". -NeoSporen                      :sporedrop:

"Mr. Joust, I see you don't actually partake in the psilocin, but it looks like it may partake in you!" -Gojira


       


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Invisibledoctorghosty
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Re: POINT DEFIANCE IS A TRAP [Re: RiverDweller1]
    #23792775 - 11/01/16 07:53 PM (7 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

RiverDweller1 said:
GoFundMe doesn't allow for legal defense contributions.




Ah pity, that


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InvisibleNothingsChanged
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Re: POINT DEFIANCE IS A TRAP [Re: doctorghosty] * 1
    #23792833 - 11/01/16 08:10 PM (7 years, 2 months ago)

Most people don't have it in them to just not talk to the cops. Most people break weak and start runnin there neck. and  9 out of 10 times they will blame it on whom ever there with. For the most part, people have a weak constitution in my opinion.


--------------------


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OfflineOregonic
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Re: POINT DEFIANCE IS A TRAP [Re: RiverDweller1]
    #23792944 - 11/01/16 08:41 PM (7 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

RiverDweller1 said:
Quote:

Oregonic said:
Quote:

Mr Piggy said:
Quote:

Oregonic said:


However people in this thread seem to think that being seen bent over looking at the grass is qualifies as probable cause and makes you lose your rights.

Seems very wrong to me.






You're right, I do not know if that is legally considered probable cause.  It's likely up to the judge you get stuck with.





Indeed! Hopefully it never gets to that point for any hunter. Being at the mercy of a small town judge is not a position I ever wish upon anybody.
Quote:




RiverDweller1 said:
It is a mistake to believe the police are upholding the constitution, they don't have time and frankly it's not their job.  That's what a court or jurors and a judge is for.  It is certainly probable cause just as much as swerving in the road late at night near a bar is. 

You will need good money for a lawyer who can actually prove your rights were violated and even then, any statement you make while in the presence of police that proves to be a lie is grounds to not have your rights upheld.  I wish believing in justice wasn't so lofty.  Also, it's pretty silly to have a conversation about probably cause and your rights because you are basically giving up your freedom while knowingly breaking the law.




Who ever said we were trusting the cops to uphold the Constitution? I'm not saying to sit there and go all sovereign citizen on the fucking cops, I'm talking about what happens after that fact and your fate is in the hands of your lawyer and the court. You just reiterated exactly my point.

Lawyers exist to make sure you get a fair shake with the justice system and that the cops followed the rules and never violated your rights - as long as you kept your mouth shut and consented to nothing.

Silly to talk about probable cause and your rights? Wtf? Alright, pack it up guys, let's all go turn ourselves in to the nearest courthouse for every illegal thing we've ever done in our lives; might as well! People breaking the law still have rights.

Obviously we all take a risk our freedom doing what we do, but that doesn't mean we should just roll over and take the long dick of the justice system or not protect ourselves.

And being stooped over in a field is not equal to swerving in a car when it comes to probable cause. It could be argued that being stooped over in a field picking shit out of the grass in an area known for psilocybe harvesting meets probable cause, but I guarantee it's a lot more murky than that. I'm just creating awareness that even mushroom hunters DO have rights, should exercise them, consent to nothing and admit to nothing regardless of what the cops are telling you - because they indeed don't uphold the Constitution nor want to help you.



go easy, man.  Maybe you didn't read my other responses in this thread but I'm clearly not saying anything you just vomited up here.  Peace.




...I vomited? Excuse me? I read your other responses just fine; I was replying directly to your response I quoted. Mainly your mention of saying it's silly to discuss our rights and probable cause because we're already breaking the law so fuck it.

My apologies for getting slightly heated, but the above statement is dangerous, careless and reckless. You're literally saying disregard your rights and understanding of the law in a forum where people need to understand their rights and probable cause.

Peace.


--------------------


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OfflineOregonic
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Re: POINT DEFIANCE IS A TRAP [Re: Oregonic]
    #23792954 - 11/01/16 08:44 PM (7 years, 2 months ago)

Anyway, isn't there a way OP could create a PayPal account for us to anonymously donate funds for legal defense?

Pretty sure I remember folks doing that in canna forums in the past.


--------------------


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