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OfflineFerather
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Re: Antibacterial Tea Agar [Re: Ferather]
    #24513974 - 07/28/17 12:54 PM (6 years, 6 months ago)

Certain amounts-ratios of sugar and sodium are classed as "preservative", however at lower amounts both are "essential".


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OfflineDailyShroomer
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Re: Antibacterial Tea Agar [Re: Ferather]
    #24515017 - 07/28/17 09:18 PM (6 years, 6 months ago)

Do you think the usage of "plant extract" as nutrition for fungi also provide them with humic and fulvic acid which are readily available in nature??


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OfflineDailyShroomer
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Re: Antibacterial Tea Agar [Re: DailyShroomer]
    #24515183 - 07/28/17 11:17 PM (6 years, 6 months ago)

Also what do you think about alkaline extraction of plant extracts from tea and wood instead of boiling them?? Just use your CaCO3 water without boiling.


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OfflineFerather
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Re: Antibacterial Tea Agar [Re: DailyShroomer]
    #24515850 - 07/29/17 10:23 AM (6 years, 5 months ago)

CaCO3 does pull out more extractives, but I still use boiling hot water.


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OfflineFerather
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Re: Antibacterial Tea Agar [Re: Ferather]
    #24516004 - 07/29/17 11:27 AM (6 years, 5 months ago)

Here are today's images of the peg and scraping on the T-Gel.
Need's a little more tea extract for a bit more carbon.

   


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OfflineDailyShroomer
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Re: Antibacterial Tea Agar [Re: Ferather]
    #24521621 - 07/31/17 09:39 PM (6 years, 5 months ago)

Btw can you use colonized toothpicks to inoculate grain jars?? Or are they only for transferring purposes??


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OfflineFerather
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Re: Antibacterial Tea Agar [Re: DailyShroomer]
    #24522147 - 08/01/17 07:06 AM (6 years, 5 months ago)

If they have been sterilized, and you're using correct conditions (SAB, flowhood), do whatever you want.
Bearing in mind that the peg should be fully colonized, leaving little room for bacteria growth.

You may prefer to transfer the peg to an agar medium, and use that instead.
If you have clean agar, you can transfer many pegs, replace them.

:thumbup:


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Growing mushrooms, general guide and information (Ferather's Journal), https://ibb.co/rG3rML2

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OfflineFerather
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Re: Antibacterial Tea Agar [Re: Ferather]
    #24522708 - 08/01/17 12:29 PM (6 years, 5 months ago)

I updated my T-Gel antibacterial agar post, see my signature for the two recipe's.


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Growing mushrooms, general guide and information (Ferather's Journal), https://ibb.co/rG3rML2

https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/27857366#27857366

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InvisibleLizardWizard
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Re: Antibacterial Tea Agar [Re: DailyShroomer]
    #24523306 - 08/01/17 06:10 PM (6 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

DailyShroomer said:
Btw can you use colonized toothpicks to inoculate grain jars?? Or are they only for transferring purposes??




If they are taken from wild clones, no. If taken from in vitro clones, maybe. If taken from mono or SGFC type grow, probably not. If taken to agar first to clean up, yes on all three. Grains are too prone to contamination to use colonized toothpicks unless they have been colonized in sterile conditions, so if they were colonized inside a sterile jar with a sterile inoculant with sterile technique, then yes. If it's a wood loving species, you wouldn't need to go to grains first and things would be easier.


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OfflineDailyShroomer
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Re: Antibacterial Tea Agar [Re: LizardWizard]
    #24523609 - 08/01/17 08:37 PM (6 years, 5 months ago)

Thanks. I was thinking about agar and I think it will be a neat idea to do transfers like agar 2 agar. But I take that as a yes.


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OfflineDailyShroomer
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Re: Antibacterial Tea Agar [Re: DailyShroomer]
    #24523612 - 08/01/17 08:38 PM (6 years, 5 months ago)

Ferather, if I were to use other plant extract other than tea, can you comment on the potency for germinating spores??


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InvisibleLizardWizard
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Re: Antibacterial Tea Agar [Re: DailyShroomer]
    #24523690 - 08/01/17 09:23 PM (6 years, 5 months ago)

Transfers from agar to agar using wooden sticks have been around for a while, search for stareatclouds' staresticks TEK.


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OfflineFerather
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Re: Antibacterial Tea Agar [Re: LizardWizard]
    #24524465 - 08/02/17 09:38 AM (6 years, 5 months ago)

I've seen wood extractive agar, however wood is not very macro-micro nutrient rich.
Other than tea, I have not tried much else. Malt extract composition, here.

You want near equal macro-micro nutrients, no sugar-starch.
Here is the composition of ready-to-drink tea.

----

The following replaces starch, sugar and cellulose (carbohydrates).

Calcium bicarbonate: [ Ca | C | H | O3 ] 2.
Proteins, varied: [ Cx | Hx | Ox | Nx ] x.
Polyphenols, varied: [ C6 | H5 | O ] x.

Theobromine: C7 | H8 | N4 | O2.
Theophylline: C7 | H8 | N4 | O2.
Caffeine: C8 | H10 | N4 | O2.
Theaflavin: C29 | H24 | O12.
Tannins: C76 | H52 | O46.
Catechin: C15 | H14 | O6.
Carotene: C40 | H56.


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Growing mushrooms, general guide and information (Ferather's Journal), https://ibb.co/rG3rML2

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OfflineDailyShroomer
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Re: Antibacterial Tea Agar [Re: Ferather]
    #24524677 - 08/02/17 11:23 AM (6 years, 5 months ago)

Whoa, can you explain that in a bit of a layman term, I mean there are some success with wood broth liquid culture for wood lovers like P. cyanescens and all, is that due to starch sugar content in wood? So basically you're saying it is safer to use inorganic macro micro nutrients??


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OfflineFerather
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Re: Antibacterial Tea Agar [Re: DailyShroomer]
    #24524933 - 08/02/17 01:27 PM (6 years, 5 months ago)

Starch and sugar can be utilized (digested) by almost any organism, including humans. Effectively you can germinate anything using them.
Wood loving mycelium germinate using the extractives (water solubles) in wood and other starch and sugar free plants (or nearly).

When making tea or wood extracts, you are extracting the soluble carbon that actually activates and germinates them.
However many of the common contamination you get (non-woodloving) do not utilize or activate using them.

Wood is weak in nitrogen and other macro-micro nutrients, tea leaves are rich in nutrients.
Therefore using wood extracts will give you plenty of carbon, but not much else.

It's not important if the added nutrients are organic or not.


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https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/27857366#27857366

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OfflineDailyShroomer
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Re: Antibacterial Tea Agar [Re: Ferather]
    #24525904 - 08/02/17 08:37 PM (6 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

Ferather said:
Open air safe, non sterile, settings: 100% complex carbon source + pH 7-8.
No soluble or easy carbon sources + undesired pH (no activation).

You will still get "live" mold from spawn or transfers.



Were you referring to the T-gel or C-gel??


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OfflineFerather
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Re: Antibacterial Tea Agar [Re: DailyShroomer]
    #24526948 - 08/03/17 08:34 AM (6 years, 5 months ago)

That's a quick guide for reference to how open air or non-sterile methods work.
If you wanted to make or research a substrate, that's how they work.

Essentially it should have 0 or low germination chance.


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InvisibleShroomway
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Re: Antibacterial Tea Agar [Re: Ferather] * 1
    #24552712 - 08/14/17 08:25 AM (6 years, 5 months ago)

Fantastic way to inhibit bacterial growth! I especially like the fact that tea is easy to come by and it's cheap.

Ferather could you (or someone else of course) write down the recipe in a way that even dummies (that would be me) can understand? I super like to try this with some bacterial mycelium I have :cool:. I eventually understood the recipe myself but I myself feel that many ppl. could benefit from a user friendly write-up that includes all info needed to prepare it; without the need to do additional research. I don't mean it in a bad way of course! Very good work. I appreciate all the hard work that has gone into it. It's some serious time investment you did there! Thanks a lot.

- What PH range should the TEA agar be, for most mushrooms?
- What do you mean with: "Any soluble macro-micro nutrient source" you mean malt extract or dextrose ect.?
- Is microwaving the tea agar enough? (because that is what it seems like in the recipe)
- What does the gelatin do?
- "Basic materials list, carbon based" (what do you exactly mean by this?)

The above are just some questions I love to have answered in the original recipe. For ease of use. I think it would help out a lot. You could also answer the above questions in a reply (maybe with some questions of others that might still pop up) and I will have a try rewriting your recipe. If necessary I will contribute... no problem...

thanks


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OfflineFerather
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Re: Antibacterial Tea Agar [Re: Shroomway]
    #24555077 - 08/15/17 06:44 AM (6 years, 5 months ago)

I've essentially sat here for over 3 years doing nothing but research and alternative applications, I learned much from the community.
I have ADHD, which is both a gift and a burden, I can pick out things overlooked by others, including patterns or repeats.

So I apologize if my approach of sharing is "different" and perhaps "over informed".

----

1 - What PH range should the TEA agar be, for most mushrooms?
2 - What do you mean with: "Any soluble macro-micro nutrient source" you mean malt extract or dextrose ect.?
3 - Is microwaving the tea agar enough? (because that is what it seems like in the recipe)
4 - What does the gelatin do?
5 - "Basic materials list, carbon based" (what do you exactly mean by this?)

1 - This can change with the mycelium you are growing, which is why I did not state a pH range, 7-8 for oysters.
2 - Any source that contains no usable energy (carbon), you could call this A-Z vitamins and minerals.
3 - Yes, tea is very easy to make, add hot water. The other ingredients are already clean for use.
4 - Adds animal proteins (Gelatin is 97% protein), the proteins provide both carbon and nitrogen.
5 - This is the source of carbon (replaces the need for sugar), which is used as energy-other.


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Growing mushrooms, general guide and information (Ferather's Journal), https://ibb.co/rG3rML2

https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/27857366#27857366

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InvisibleShroomway
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Re: Antibacterial Tea Agar [Re: Ferather] * 1
    #24555514 - 08/15/17 10:53 AM (6 years, 5 months ago)

Ferather, thanks for the clarifications... Btw: we all have our strengths and pitfalls :smile:

I decided to keep it simple... I am cleaning myc with an tea agar. Experimenting with malt extract agar. Only using half the malt extract and tea in stead of water:
recipe for 500 ml's:
500 ml tea extract (made from 25 grams of green tea and water)
5 grams of malt extract
9 grams of agar

Will definately report back if I succeeded to clean out a really badly bacterialy infected petri...


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