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Invisiblevatman
I'm Vatman


Registered: 04/17/14
Posts: 1,642
Getting into lc
    #23769405 - 10/25/16 09:46 AM (7 years, 3 months ago)

I know LI>LC but I want to use LC due to simplicity.


This is for gourmet but asking here due to people have more experience with liquid teks in the active side of house.

Right now I go agar»grain jar»spawn bag»spawn bag as long as things are clean.

I want to reduce grain jar growth time and maybe skip the jar all together. I'd be too worried to skip the jar right now. my spawn bags have excessive condensation right now. I need to work on improving that right now. Not sure if a longer sterilization time is needed or dryer grains.


I plan on going for a malt LC tek. what recipe would you recommend?

Should I build no tilt lids?

What gauge needles? I have 18 right now (pink)

What would you recommend for stirring once agar is added without a stir plate? (Marbles?)

If I have synthetic filter discs cut to size all ready is a whatman still preferred?


Edited by vatman (10/25/16 12:45 PM)


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Invisiblevatman
I'm Vatman


Registered: 04/17/14
Posts: 1,642
Re: Getting into lc [Re: vatman]
    #23770274 - 10/25/16 02:42 PM (7 years, 3 months ago)

Smallest tube I've found so far has been a 1/4 copper tube. spent a half hour at home depot looking


Edited by vatman (10/25/16 02:52 PM)


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Invisiblewildernessjunkie
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Re: Getting into lc [Re: vatman]
    #23770948 - 10/25/16 06:25 PM (7 years, 3 months ago)

LC is less simple than LI. If you have good clean spawn, then a couple TBS of grain spawn will make a quart of slurry. Youre gambling a bit on both accounts, but your chances are better if you can see good clean growth on the grain.

From there you can just do a "Free Pour" which is basically the same as a G2G transfer, except with liquid.


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Invisiblevatman
I'm Vatman


Registered: 04/17/14
Posts: 1,642
Re: Getting into lc [Re: wildernessjunkie]
    #23771089 - 10/25/16 07:04 PM (7 years, 3 months ago)

I always had issues with LI when ti clomes to blendering it. The LI tends to leak while being blendered no mater how much I tired and what I have built in the past has fallen apart on me while in operation etc. I had a selfmade blender lid come off while bursting it and my flow hood blew all that water all over me. Not very fun.

LC has less moving parts. Thus why I am considering it over LI.


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InvisiblePastywhyteMDiscord
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Re: Getting into lc [Re: vatman]
    #23771130 - 10/25/16 07:15 PM (7 years, 3 months ago)

LC recipe is just like agar. 2-4% nutes. I don't use the no tilt lids, I prefer plastic lids for most things.


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Invisiblevatman
I'm Vatman


Registered: 04/17/14
Posts: 1,642
Re: Getting into lc [Re: Pastywhyte]
    #23771180 - 10/25/16 07:31 PM (7 years, 3 months ago)

So what about whatman vs synthetic discs.

Yeah I would need to test the LC batch more often on agar to see if it is bad or risk putting a bunch of mold or bacteria into a tun of jars.


Edited by vatman (10/25/16 07:31 PM)


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Offlinespore-ty
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Re: Getting into lc [Re: vatman]
    #23771221 - 10/25/16 07:40 PM (7 years, 3 months ago)

Well since you mentioned LC with a magnetic stirrer, do you guys drop your magnetic stirrer bar in the LC to be sterilized or add it in with the wedge in a sab or fh ?


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InvisiblePastywhyteMDiscord
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Re: Getting into lc [Re: spore-ty]
    #23771231 - 10/25/16 07:42 PM (7 years, 3 months ago)

Whatman for LC.


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InvisibleHallucyjunkie99

Registered: 10/21/15
Posts: 132
Re: Getting into lc [Re: vatman]
    #23771242 - 10/25/16 07:45 PM (7 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

vatman said:
I always had issues with LI when ti clomes to blendering it. The LI tends to leak while being blendered no mater how much I tired and what I have built in the past has fallen apart on me while in operation etc. I had a selfmade blender lid come off while bursting it and my flow hood blew all that water all over me. Not very fun.

LC has less moving parts. Thus why I am considering it over LI.



Have you seen the blenderless LI tek


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Invisiblevatman
I'm Vatman


Registered: 04/17/14
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Re: Getting into lc [Re: Hallucyjunkie99]
    #23771256 - 10/25/16 07:51 PM (7 years, 3 months ago)

I just saw it. Looks interesting and might be something I should give a shot.

Can grain be used in the water or just agar dishes?


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OfflineSpore Ninja
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Re: Getting into lc [Re: vatman]
    #23771547 - 10/25/16 09:24 PM (7 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

vatman said:
Smallest tube I've found so far has been a 1/4 copper tube. spent a half hour at home depot looking




Hobby Lobby has tubing that should fit your needs. If you use their phone app it will give you a 40% off coupon to use at the register. They have both copper and aluminum. I picked the Al for corrosion resistance.
It was $2.69 before the coupon for a 3 piece package that had multiple sizes of tubing. Only one size was was a really tight fit though. And the pieces are approx. 14 inches long.


--------------------
I'm interested in Dr. Pollock's work and his (especially older) strains.
Anyone have pix of his Shroommobile RV??

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Edited by Spore Ninja (10/26/16 06:16 PM)


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Offlinetump
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Re: Getting into lc [Re: Spore Ninja]
    #23771584 - 10/25/16 09:44 PM (7 years, 3 months ago)

Try pasty ez lc system. Then make a few trafer jars to inject form your clean lc. Like three pints of grain water plus anything else not simple sugars lc.  Will get you through half a year in grow terms unless you need a huge amount.


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Invisiblevatman
I'm Vatman


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Re: Getting into lc [Re: tump]
    #23771952 - 10/25/16 11:56 PM (7 years, 3 months ago)

I am leaning towards LC due to the expand-ability aspect. I would be going through a lot of dishes if I was using LI. My gentics are from an aloha sample pack. I have made a lot of masters off those after they went to agar dishes.

Still no one has answered my question about the filiter disks and using a tilt or no tilt jar. I will be checking out a few hobby lobby shops this weekend.

Would synthetic filter disks cut it out would I need something like I linked in the first post?


Edited by vatman (10/25/16 11:58 PM)


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Offlinetump
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Re: Getting into lc [Re: vatman]
    #23772089 - 10/26/16 01:11 AM (7 years, 3 months ago)

Just rtv the lid for the filter disc. Go with tilt lids. And no cuts out


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Offlinetombosley8
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Re: Getting into lc [Re: tump]
    #23772146 - 10/26/16 02:02 AM (7 years, 3 months ago)

idk what that means.....

but whatmans are the best choice for filtering liquid as sfd cannot get wet.


--------------------


Edited by tombosley8 (10/26/16 02:02 AM)


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OfflineSpore Ninja
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Re: Getting into lc [Re: vatman]
    #23773016 - 10/26/16 11:26 AM (7 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

vatman said:
I am leaning towards LC due to the expand-ability aspect. I would be going through a lot of dishes if I was using LI. My gentics are from an aloha sample pack. I have made a lot of masters off those after they went to agar dishes.

Still no one has answered my question about the filiter disks and using a tilt or no tilt jar. I will be checking out a few hobby lobby shops this weekend.

Would synthetic filter disks cut it out would I need something like I linked in the first post?




I like liquid innoculant, but I hate tilting the jars, that's why I'm trying the no-tilt lids. The Pasty jars look like an upscale version of the old "hose tek" where you lifted the lid on the petri, hosed down the myc with sterile water and sucked it back up. I usually end up making way more LC than I need, so I may scale it back and give the Pasty jars a whirl.
Make one of each, and see which one you like best. :thumbup:
The metal tubing should be on the aisle with the rockets and other manly items.

BTW- for the poster that asked:the stir bar goes into the liquid BEFORE it's PC'ed.


--------------------
I'm interested in Dr. Pollock's work and his (especially older) strains.
Anyone have pix of his Shroommobile RV??

PSA: Protonmail offers free, encrypted email hosted in privacy loving Switzerland.
Red Phone / Signal offer free encrypted phone calls and texting between users.

All of these programs are available free for PC and Android or apple and are available in the respective stores or online by googling the names.
Stay safe out there!

The Electronic Freedom Foundation's review of text and messaging program's security is here>>> https://www.eff.org/node/82654


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Invisiblevatman
I'm Vatman


Registered: 04/17/14
Posts: 1,642
Re: Getting into lc [Re: tombosley8]
    #23773180 - 10/26/16 12:40 PM (7 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

tombosley8 said:
idk what that means.....

but whatmans are the best choice for filtering liquid as sfd cannot get wet.





So a what man is the best option due to the fact it won't whick the constamation in compared to a synthetic disk that Will.


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Offlinetombosley8
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Re: Getting into lc [Re: vatman]
    #23773250 - 10/26/16 01:04 PM (7 years, 3 months ago)

yes watmans are designed to filter while wet and sfd's are made to filter non liquids and will fail as soon as they get wet. Yes I would say that a wet sfd allows the contam to wick through into your media.

In pasty's new LC tek he explains how sfd's can be used for liquid.

You just can't let the liquid touch the sfd.

Best way is to use an overly sized jar with a little lc in it(quart jar with about 200-250 ml lc works good), so that when you agitate(just swirling for 10 sec 2x a day) the liquid stays near the bottom and never touches the filter.

I have been using sfd's on my lc's for quite some time and never had them get wet using this method.

Though I do plan on making some jars with whatmans and trying out pasty's tek as you should too.

Could really expand your plates greatly with very little risk of contam and very little work.

The ability to shake a lc jar to agitate (when using a watman) would help in speed and ease a ton as the mycelium could be dispersed into the media that much faster/better/easier.


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Invisiblevatman
I'm Vatman


Registered: 04/17/14
Posts: 1,642
Re: Getting into lc [Re: tombosley8]
    #23773324 - 10/26/16 01:27 PM (7 years, 3 months ago)

I'd assume any syringe filtr meeting micron requirements of .02 would work and whatman's are just a brand name.


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Offlinetombosley8
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Re: Getting into lc [Re: vatman]
    #23773365 - 10/26/16 01:41 PM (7 years, 3 months ago)

Yeah think so.... I am looking to get some syringe filters asap but I am not sure what size/brand/etc is best so if anyone has some specifics or clarification on that it would be well appreciated by me and the op.


--------------------


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Invisiblevatman
I'm Vatman


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Re: Getting into lc [Re: tombosley8]
    #23773400 - 10/26/16 01:55 PM (7 years, 3 months ago)

http://www.ebay.com/itm/201602291682?rmvSB=true

0.2um pore size

pack of 100 for 23 USD with shipping. This seller also has larger size filters but doubt they are needed.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Omicron-PTFE-Syringe-Filters-Non-Sterile-25mm-0-2um-10-pk-/262093979644?hash=item3d0604bffc:g:lfMAAOSwT5tWFqPk
10 for 12 bucks.



Edited by vatman (10/26/16 01:58 PM)


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Invisiblevatman
I'm Vatman


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Re: Getting into lc [Re: vatman]
    #23774157 - 10/26/16 05:58 PM (7 years, 3 months ago)

http://www.gelifesciences.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/catalog/en/GELifeSciences-us/products/AlternativeProductStructure_16336/28420269

as far as I can tell there is no difference between a syringe filter and a whatman. The size of the disk should just affect how much material it can filter before reaching capacity. There is a low oxygen requirement at this stage of growth.


Edited by vatman (10/26/16 06:00 PM)


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Offlinetombosley8
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Re: Getting into lc [Re: vatman]
    #23774167 - 10/26/16 06:02 PM (7 years, 3 months ago)

hey thanks a ton:super:

that 100 pack is a great deal...!


--------------------


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Invisiblevatman
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Re: Getting into lc [Re: tombosley8]
    #23774173 - 10/26/16 06:03 PM (7 years, 3 months ago)

yeah it is Polypropylene so will last in a pressure cooker at 15 PSI.


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OfflineSpore Ninja
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Re: Getting into lc [Re: vatman]
    #23774186 - 10/26/16 06:08 PM (7 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

tombosley8 said:
Yeah think so.... I am looking to get some syringe filters asap but I am not sure what size/brand/etc is best so if anyone has some specifics or clarification on that it would be well appreciated by me and the op.



I'd like to find some too. My only concern has been how fast the let air in when trying to fill a big syringe.

Does Amazon have them? They were out of the .2 micron size when I cheeked last.... but the new Amazon listings are confusing AF sometimes.
I have Amazon Prime, so I don't get reamed on the shipping from them.
Quote:

vatman said:
http://www.gelifesciences.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/catalog/en/GELifeSciences-us/products/AlternativeProductStructure_16336/28420269

as far as I can tell there is no difference between a syringe filter and a whatman. The size of the disk should just affect how much material it can filter before reaching capacity. There is a low oxygen requirement at this stage of growth.




Whatman is a high quality brand name. I don't really want cheap generic Chinese stuff for this.

I do wonder how the FAE compares to SFD... If you drilled (5) 1/4 inch holes in a lid and used a SFD, would it have 5 times the FAE of a single Whatman?
And would it matter?


--------------------
I'm interested in Dr. Pollock's work and his (especially older) strains.
Anyone have pix of his Shroommobile RV??

PSA: Protonmail offers free, encrypted email hosted in privacy loving Switzerland.
Red Phone / Signal offer free encrypted phone calls and texting between users.

All of these programs are available free for PC and Android or apple and are available in the respective stores or online by googling the names.
Stay safe out there!

The Electronic Freedom Foundation's review of text and messaging program's security is here>>> https://www.eff.org/node/82654


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Invisiblevatman
I'm Vatman


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Re: Getting into lc [Re: Spore Ninja]
    #23774239 - 10/26/16 06:29 PM (7 years, 3 months ago)

We use tyvek envelopes, easy flit and polyfill as filters.

I cut my synthetic filter disks down for single holes. I use a sharpie marker lid as my outline. My jars do fine.

https://www.shroomery.org/9407/Pleurotus-eryngii
Oxygen in a liquid culture is very low. Your shaking will add the most oxygen back to the liquid. From the sounds of it the syringe filter would be better suited for under stress.


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Invisiblevatman
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Re: Getting into lc [Re: vatman]
    #23775093 - 10/26/16 10:44 PM (7 years, 3 months ago)



Edited by vatman (10/26/16 10:46 PM)


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OfflineSpore Ninja
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Re: Getting into lc [Re: vatman]
    #23776661 - 10/27/16 12:51 PM (7 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

vatman said:
http://www.earthstongue.com/product/Widemouth-Autoclavable-Plastic-Dual-Filter-Lid-Injectorsite-Leakproof

Seems like a marketing ploy but what do you guys think

Here is them showing the filter not getting wet
http://www.earthstongue.com/product/Sterilized_liquid_Culture_Quart_Jar_Media_Injectable_Injection_Port_Leak_Proof




Edited and updated;

He doesn't seem to have a very good rep around here after viewing some threads going back to at least 2005!

And I don't know if I could bring myself to drop close to $40 on 4 lids.
( I just use RTV to make my own gaskets in the plastic lids I use. Smear Dawn detergent on the jar mouth and threads, screw on the lids with fresh RTV and let the jar mouth mold the RTV.

He says he has a degree in mycology... and his site talks about collecting trips into Mexico and Guatemala and meeting Maria Sabina...so maybe he's a good mycologist and a crappy businessman. Kind of odd though.
And he seems to be out of a lot of his products.



Edited by Spore Ninja (10/27/16 07:26 PM)


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Invisiblevatman
I'm Vatman


Registered: 04/17/14
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Re: Getting into lc [Re: Spore Ninja]
    #23777907 - 10/27/16 07:01 PM (7 years, 3 months ago)

I know rr doesn't like him. (Well on the past) so he might be on a different mushroom board.

Also just picked this up at my local brew store


Was surprised it was comparative in price to Amazon


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Offlinesinisterminister7
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Re: Getting into lc [Re: tombosley8]
    #23777942 - 10/27/16 07:14 PM (7 years, 3 months ago)

Shroomsupply carries some cheap syringe filters, I dunno if their any good though :confused:


--------------------
"Psychedelics are illegal not because a loving government is concerned that you may jump out of a third story window. Psychedelics are illegal because they dissolve opinion structures and culturally laid down models of behaviour and information processing. They open you up to the possibility that everything you know is wrong." - Terrence Mckenna


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Invisiblevatman
I'm Vatman


Registered: 04/17/14
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Re: Getting into lc [Re: sinisterminister7]
    #23777992 - 10/27/16 07:27 PM (7 years, 3 months ago)

They look like the first set off eBay. I think it boils down to size determines how fast you can use your syringe. i.e. ml a second and how much it can filter over the course of the life of the filter


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