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InvisibleTantrika
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Re: Civilization VI [Re: Lophosaurus]
    #23768704 - 10/25/16 12:13 AM (7 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

Lophosaurus said:
My game wouldn't load so I gave up and reinstalled the whole game. Then I found that all I had to do was turn of Windows Defender. I lost my save and now I'm playing as Germany and I've been in like a 500 year battle with Sumeria




Ouch.  Civ is a long game to lose a save for. Dx

Have found that the AI seems to be more aggressive this time around.  In my first game, Teddy Roosevelt started off declaring a friendship with me early on, then turned around about 20 turns later and tried attacking me with a horde of warriors and scouts before he had even started to tech up.
After fighting him back with Scythia's ridiculously powerful horse archer army, conquered his cities and decided to take over the rest of the continent as a preemptive means of self-defense. :lol:

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OfflineReposadoXochipilli
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Re: Civilization VI [Re: Tantrika]
    #23791835 - 11/01/16 03:59 PM (7 years, 4 months ago)

so are people happy with this now that it has been out for awhile. i watched a little streaming and it seems a little tedious?

i love 4x style stuff i just not sure the playstyle of this one is as exciting as i might be looking for.

i also have several other games to keep me occupied with currently. probably why i am being so apprehensive.


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InvisibleTantrika
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Re: Civilization VI [Re: ReposadoXochipilli]
    #23792103 - 11/01/16 05:06 PM (7 years, 4 months ago)

My Steam has 109 hours clocked from 3 complete games and a bunch of dicking around.
Have moved over to Skyrim Special Edition for a bit just to see how Bethesda did with it, then probably going back to Civ.

The learning curve going from Civ 5 to Civ 6 is a little steep, and it has taken me a few games to get into properly setting up districts, learning the new Wonders, and stuff -- there are a lot more things to consider now in terms of city placement and specialization that was kind of slow to learn but is starting to feel more natural.
Find the mid-game to be far more interesting than Civ 5, because consolidating an Empire is a more involved process than just queuing up a bunch of buildings.
The win conditions feel a bit less compelling; not sure why -- the Space Race launch animations are among my favourites, but launching the individual pieces does not feel quite as fulfilling.
Think the issue may be that late-game Science and Culture generation can get so high that the tech tree and civics tree basically get entirely cleared out really quickly -- Civ 5 had gotten the Brave New World DLC that really slowed down endgame and made it feel more like a race, Civ 6 just has me breezing through the techs and civics.
Alternatively, it may be that the Eureka and Inspiration system is too strong -- though it is kind of interesting (basically two trees of mini "quests" to buff Science and Culture), it gets really easy to sort of cheese it by half-researching a bunch of techs while working on triggering their boosts to finish them.  Not sure how the trees have been balanced to accommodate, but doing the various boosts seems to really propel me ahead of the AI (which, presumably, does not actively pursue boosts so much as casually generates a handful of them through regular play).

Turns may take a bit longer now for people who are not used to micromanaging their empire, as the availability of automation has decreased quite a bit.

It is still pretty slow-paced by design -- have not even braved a Marathon game yet.
Time still seems to disappear while playing though.

Watched a number of Let's Plays before release, but find the game far more fun to get my hands on and play.  Part of that is also my propensity to get mad with people making strategic decisions I don't agree with. :lol:

Overall pretty happy with it; feels far better than Civ 5 felt at launch, but still suffers somewhat when compared to an experience with full DLCs.

If you feel on the fence about it, will likely be updating this thread with my thoughts as DLCs release.  Waiting on picking up a Civ game is not all that bad, as they tend to improve over time.  Have been enjoying my time with it though.

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InvisibleLophosaurus
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Re: Civilization VI [Re: Tantrika]
    #23792484 - 11/01/16 06:48 PM (7 years, 4 months ago)

I love it so far. I haven't beat it yet because my 1st civilization got deleted. My current game has an unbelievable amount of barbarians attacking me the whole time so it's hard to get stuff done. I kill one and then 3 more pop up

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OfflineReposadoXochipilli
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Re: Civilization VI [Re: Lophosaurus]
    #23800351 - 11/04/16 11:07 AM (7 years, 4 months ago)

Thanks for that perspective sweetleaf.


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InvisibleTantrika
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Re: Civilization VI [Re: ReposadoXochipilli]
    #23813344 - 11/08/16 04:48 PM (7 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

Lophosaurus said:
I love it so far. I haven't beat it yet because my 1st civilization got deleted. My current game has an unbelievable amount of barbarians attacking me the whole time so it's hard to get stuff done. I kill one and then 3 more pop up




Barbs are super brutal in this one; not just to the player but also to AI Civs.  Have had barbs break apart my economy by pillaging districts, and have seen them wipe AI cities off the map.

My initial approach to defending was to guard my borders with a bunch of cavalry -- killing the Scouts basically keeps them from attacking/makes them focus on the AI civs instead.  Scouts have to see your city and make it back to their camp before barbs will attack a city at all.

Tried a game as Gilgamesh after you mentioned them the other time -- he gets a quite significant bonus from popping barb camps, so made a few small squads and just destroyed camps as quickly as possible as soon as they popped up.

Second option makes more gold, and as Gilgamesh it also means a bunch of bonus population, technology boosts, unit experience.

By the Information Era on my earlier games, barbs were messing me up with Anti-Tank Guns, so they really don't seem to let up. :lol:

Though, also consider having been attacked so aggressively in the first games as being a really nice learning opportunity -- it taught me that pillaging districts is amazingly powerful.
Civ 4, late game pillaging could cripple an enemy economy, but Civ 5 just needed workers to repair.
Civ 6, workers repair tile improvements quickly and for free, but districts have to be repaired one by one and building by building by the city center.
If a Civ is too far away to reliably try conquering cities, can totally topple an enemy empire by pillaging everything they have (which gives some nice bonuses for each pillage).

Quote:

ReposadoXochipilli said:
Thanks for that perspective sweetleaf.




You're welcome, hope it was some degree of help. :smile:

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OfflineShroomslip
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Re: Civilization VI [Re: Tantrika]
    #23861087 - 11/23/16 03:46 PM (7 years, 4 months ago)

I figured I'd just ask here instead of making a thread specifically for it, hopefully someone sees it..

Anyways how the hell do you offensively kill enemy air fighters? I can't seem to make my own fighter jets engage theirs and they are standing in the way of my bombers (which in this game is my main city killer) I've had several very long games and never ran into this problem because AI never really seems to bother with air units but they did this time and the AI is smart enough to redeploy their jets when I decide to start bombing another of their (unguarded) cities first :crankey:. I guess it's kinda cool the AI isn't totally stupid (like seriously, they had all their jets on the one city I was focusing on and the second I targeted a second city with the bombers they spread the jets out to all their cities on the front, not just relocating them to the new city I bombed lol) but it's frustrating me now.

I also can't seem to target their airfield with ground units/bombardment.

Did they just leave out any way to offensively deal with an enemies jets in this game?

I'll probably have already wiped this country from the map by the time someone has an answer but it'd be nice to know for the future. Not just for future games but I have a couple of other very large/powerful nations to target (I'm using one of those giant map mods and have no turn limit set, I'm going for a planet united under the Brazilian flag :lol:) in the future and I know they have planes as well.

P.S. Thermonuclear weapons are OP as fuck . I try not to resort to them because of the contamination and when you get to that point in the game, 20 turns is a long damn time, but just firing one into the heart of their country cripples them to the point they can't really do much to save themselves. I use them on very large nations because by the time I get to the heartland the contamination won't be an issue. 3,000 military power? Let's go ahead and knock that down to about 750 with one click:rofl:.


--------------------
With my face against the floor I can’t see who knocked me out of the way.
I don’t want to get back up but I have to so it might as well be today.
Nothing appeals to me no one feels like me, I’m too busy being calm to disappear.
I’m in no shape to be alone contrary to the shit that you might hear.


You can't wake up, this is not a dream. You're part of a machine, you are not a human being
With your face all made up, living on a screen. Low on self esteem, so you run on gasoline

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InvisibleTantrika
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Re: Civilization VI [Re: Shroomslip]
    #23863841 - 11/24/16 02:37 PM (7 years, 4 months ago)

Unfortunately, have no clue with regards to potential to attack air units; have run into the same issue as you with AI not building air units.
My next game may be different though, they apparently patched some various AI matters recently.
Quote:


    Adjusted AI victory condition focus to increase their competitiveness in Science and Tourism.
    Adjusted AI understanding of declared friendship.
    Adjusted the AI approach to beginning and ending a war based on potential gain and loss.
    Increased AI competitiveness in building a more advanced military.
    Increased AI usage of Inquisitors. Especially Phillip.
    Increased AI value of upgrading units.
    Increased AI use of Settler escorts.
    Tuned AI usage of units that cannot move and shoot, like Catapults.
    Tuned AI city and unit build planning.
    Improved the ability of city-states to maintain a strong military.




https://civilization.com/news/entries/civilization-vi-fall-2016-update-now-live

Air units may be covered under the city and unit build planning.

Poking into it on reddit the best I could find was a reference that ranged units may be able to bombard deployed air units -- poster said his planes were either attacked by a city or a field cannon.

For the airfield, is it possible to move on top of it and pillage rather than make an attack?  Think all tile improvements and districts function in that matter.

And yeah, nukes are ridiculous by the time they show up in game.  Had France declare war on me, so fired two nukes into their territory and they went into full retreat until peace could be declared. :lol:

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OfflineShroomslip
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Re: Civilization VI [Re: Tantrika]
    #23863939 - 11/24/16 03:40 PM (7 years, 4 months ago)

Well even if you lose the airfield, they can still have one fighter on a city (which, without a way to deal with them is more than enough to take down plenty of bombers). I found a round about way to deal with the issue. Link Mobile Sam with whatever melee units you use to capture the city, and just park them all around the city center. The jet will still attack your bombers so you need enough of them to do enough attack runs back to back (drawing the jet out every time) so that you can kill the jet with your sam and NOT lose your bombers in the process. I haven't lost one yet but it seems like if you do two runs without taking down the jet, your bombers will die on the second run because the jet seems to take off more than half the bombers HP. From memory it takes about 5-6 times of the jet being attacked before it's dead, so you need about 8 bombers just to be safe. Pretty stupid way of having to deal with it, honestly. The only appeal for using the bombers is their ridiculous range, instead of having to relocate (or just having a massive bombardment army at your disposal) you can just hammer away at city after city until your ground units can capture, the modern tanks have really good range so bombers+modern tanks make a really great city capture team.

I've never really used the rapid deployment thing (I honestly only really noticed it on this game) so I may just revert back to a large ground bombardment force and plan my attack runs better so that I can just transfer them from airfield to airfield.

I however won't be uniting the planet under the Brazilian flag. I've reached the point where turns were taking like 5 minutes to process and eventually I couldn't declare war without the game freezing and crashing anymore. I tried reloading a bunch of times but always the same thing. I just wanted to do it for completion's sake, I'd already taken over half the entire map and destroyed like 8 other countries. I had a giant country with nothing to spend production on but units :lol:. I was an unstoppable war machine. Even if they started trying to nuke me, they wouldn't' be able to get far enough into the heartland to wipe me out before I wiped out their armies and could rebuild. Plus I had like 20 thermo nukes at my disposal. Anyone who tried to take me on would be met with complete annihilation.

I'm playing on emperor or whatever. I wish there was a better way to make things difficult for me rather than just give the AI a handicap bonus, they should play smarter, take (or try to) key cities that would cripple me, produce units that counter what I'm using, form alliances that is more than just an "I like you" token, like force me to fight a war on two fronts. Stuff like that.

I think this one is far more addicting than 5 was. First few nights I had it, I lost track of time like I haven't done since the days of Mario Kart being new and you had sleep overs. Start playing and before you know it, sun is coming up, your hands are all cramped up and your eyes burn.


--------------------
With my face against the floor I can’t see who knocked me out of the way.
I don’t want to get back up but I have to so it might as well be today.
Nothing appeals to me no one feels like me, I’m too busy being calm to disappear.
I’m in no shape to be alone contrary to the shit that you might hear.


You can't wake up, this is not a dream. You're part of a machine, you are not a human being
With your face all made up, living on a screen. Low on self esteem, so you run on gasoline

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InvisibleTantrika
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Re: Civilization VI [Re: Shroomslip]
    #23864123 - 11/24/16 05:06 PM (7 years, 4 months ago)

The ones based in cities would certainly be more of an issue; was able to use based bombers and fighters to pretty devastating effect in 5 as well.
Since sending a bomber against the city triggers the fighter to try and intercept, is it possible that targeting the city with a fighter first would trigger them to dogfight?
Would think that fighters could be deployed to intercept in place of the Sam units, but it seems really strange that they cannot trigger combat with each other.

Rebasing units via airports has always been quite powerful, particularly if it is possible to get even just a basic outpost set up on a separate continent and then move land armies back and forth quickly.

The AI as difficulty scales certainly is still a bit disappointing; think that is part of the appeal of multiplayer games, but was never any good at them.  Take a long time to think and process things, and trying to manage anything on a clock just has my brain fizzle out.
The general AI seems to function a bit better than before though, or at least the agenda system seems to have them interact with the player and each other in a more sensible way, but it is still a big complex game and the AI still responds to really simple cues.

There is always an interesting way to work with the mechanics though, and enjoy that my games feel more varied from play to play than they did in 5. There is a lot more of a sense of playing to the map layout, and think that hooks me more than anything.
Have been quite fond of watching how the maps change over time as cities and empires swap hands, and now with the district layouts it feels like each of the AIs has a more lasting impact.

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OfflineShroomslip
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Re: Civilization VI [Re: Tantrika]
    #23865083 - 11/25/16 01:24 AM (7 years, 4 months ago)

Nope, your jet just attacks the city and the enemy jet attacks your jet.

And yeah I'm not much for multiplayer in strategy games. Especially something like Civ, it doesn't really suit my play style at all. I mostly like to build my empire up and start maxing out all my cities before I start pumping out units and going on conquest. In my experience, if you don't build a giant army right off the bat and attack them before they attack you, you've already lost.


--------------------
With my face against the floor I can’t see who knocked me out of the way.
I don’t want to get back up but I have to so it might as well be today.
Nothing appeals to me no one feels like me, I’m too busy being calm to disappear.
I’m in no shape to be alone contrary to the shit that you might hear.


You can't wake up, this is not a dream. You're part of a machine, you are not a human being
With your face all made up, living on a screen. Low on self esteem, so you run on gasoline

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InvisibleTantrika
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Re: Civilization VI [Re: Tantrika]
    #23944710 - 12/20/16 09:41 PM (7 years, 3 months ago)

Thread resurrection.

Apparently my Steam updated Civ 6 today, but I did not catch that it was the first microdlc.

As was able to be gleaned from the trailer, when the winged hussar arrived, the first update is Poland.



And since they have been given the overpowered hussars again (with the same forces-enemy-to-withdraw-after-combat bonus from Civ 5) am probably going to jump into a new game and play as them soon. :cookiemonster:

Am looking forward to having access to a culture bomb again, but will probably end up riding around with a huge cavalry army like with Scythia, just cuz winged hussars. :lol:


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InvisibleTantrika
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Re: Civilization VI [Re: Tantrika]
    #24108056 - 02/21/17 11:48 AM (7 years, 1 month ago)

New DLC Civilization announced,
It's Australia



The Outback Station caters a little too much
to some of my preferred methods of play :lol:
but they should serve well on an Islands map

People seem to be complaining that lesser-known candidates
are being chosen for DLC packs,
but it seems to make sense to me
because it facilitates dropping bigger-names
into the expansion packs, when they come

They have also (finally) announced that the formal mod system through Steam Workshop
will be offered at the same time

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InvisibleTantrika
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Re: Civilization VI [Re: Tantrika]
    #24181976 - 03/21/17 10:57 PM (7 years, 8 days ago)

Persia announced under the leadership of Cyrus



Think what interests me most about this is his bonuses to declaring surprise wars,
aside from how that potentially impacts player play styles,
it also holds implications for how they seem to want the AI to function after the DLC releases
Cyrus and Tomyris (Scythia) historically warred
and their unique/AI bonuses directly contrast each other
meaning the computer will be 'motivated' to declare wars
that specifically trigger Tomyris' AI resentment of surprise wars

Playstyle does not seem fantastic for me personally,
as most frequently make efforts war early and wipe out AI before meeting too many other civs
in order to get an early landspace advantage without incurring penalties anyway
like the unique tile improvement tho

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InvisibleTantrika
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Re: Civilization VI [Re: Tantrika]
    #24186453 - 03/23/17 03:22 PM (7 years, 6 days ago)

Alexander the Great being added in under a new civ of Macedon in the same DLC pack



And just in case he was not enough of a jerk in previous titles,
now he gets a unique bonus that makes it more easy for him to war than any other civs
:lol:

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OfflineXUL
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Re: Civilization VI [Re: Tantrika]
    #24186468 - 03/23/17 03:28 PM (7 years, 6 days ago)

They took the world congress out of VI.

That broke my heart.


--------------------
TRUMP 2020

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InvisibleTantrika
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Re: Civilization VI [Re: XUL]
    #24186547 - 03/23/17 03:51 PM (7 years, 6 days ago)

Quote:

XUL said:
They took the world congress out of VI.

That broke my heart.




Think the more likely candidate is that they have not yet added it.
World Congress was added by one of 5's major content packs, Brave New World

At launch, the Religious Victory was their substitute for the World Congress
the premise seems to have been that the goal is to keep diplomatic ties effective to spread religion,
similarly the World Congress had a significant impact in 5 by allowing declaration of a World Religion that increased the ability to win a culture victory

Apparently the season pass tied to the the Deluxe edition only carries up to this Persia/Macedon DLC
so kind of presuming they will gear up and do an actual expansion pack next, since they will likely charge for it
given that they went about adding Australia under John Curtin,
though the Aborigines have been popular among modders of past games,
kind of makes me think they plan some sort of World War expansion for the game
that hopefully adds a sort of United Nations system, and potentially improves industrial and modern era warring
though part of that is also just my speculation based on the aerial combat in the trailer
and that after teasing a Winged Hussar in the trailer, they turned around and dropped Poland

:cookiemonster:

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OfflineXUL
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Re: Civilization VI [Re: Tantrika]
    #24186595 - 03/23/17 04:06 PM (7 years, 6 days ago)

Nice.

Ya. There are some neat parts about VI.

I like how you can choose where to build wonders, libraries, and etc..

Building libraries next to the mountains for extra science is nice.

On another note, I am still trying to get used to the AI for VI. I am not sure if it's better or worse than V.

I always thought CIV should have really invested in AI. Since they use points or frequencies, one should be able to ASK them, "Why?" And then make another remark for more points in anger or friendship.

They need to get on that. More complex AI.


--------------------
TRUMP 2020

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InvisibleTantrika
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Re: Civilization VI [Re: XUL]
    #24186662 - 03/23/17 04:38 PM (7 years, 6 days ago)

Quote:

XUL said:
...
On another note, I am still trying to get used to the AI for VI. I am not sure if it's better or worse than V.

I always thought CIV should have really invested in AI. Since they use points or frequencies, one should be able to ASK them, "Why?" And then make another remark for more points in anger or friendship.

They need to get on that. More complex AI.




Personally think of the AI as both better and worse than 5,
like that they made the system transparent through diplomacy,
being able to see what motivates the AI helps to figure out why they are doing what they are doing,
or why they are hung up on hating another AI Civ

being able to ask them Why is really an immersion/interface factor that they totally should work on,
at present it is possible to (like 5) go in and see exact numerical representations
of how much each action is causing that civ to like or dislike the player,
but that's just a messy way of displaying it,
when they could use some interface tweaks to convey the same information via conversation

the part that drives me a little nuts about their new system is the random generated traits
Paranoid as a trait seems to be the most game-breaking on an AI
Had a paranoid China spawn that would do nothing but build great wall improvements on every available hex
and had a Cleopatra spawn who loved me because her default AI bonus is she tries to befriend people with large militaries
but she was paranoid, so her random trait meant she was afraid of anyone who had a large military
so she would compliment me on the size and impressiveness of my military, referring to me as worthy of her attention
then would turn around and immediately cry that my military is too large and freaks her out
come to think of it, on that playthrough she kind of reminded me of some of my exes...

Do have hopes over the long-term though, if they keep having contrasting AI bonuses like with Cyrus and Tomyris
one of the big challenges of AI is to get it to more fully interact with its own digital world
but by making AIs effectively trigger each other's traits,
it effectively forces the AIs to more fully interact with the world
it could turn out genius,
or they could be overreaching and it will collapse more than it succeeds
am enjoying experimenting with the way it 'thinks' in different scenarios either way
:cookiemonster:

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OfflineXUL
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Re: Civilization VI [Re: Tantrika]
    #24186682 - 03/23/17 04:46 PM (7 years, 6 days ago)

Quote:

the part that drives me a little nuts about their new system is the random generated traits
Paranoid as a trait seems to be the most game-breaking on an AI
Had a paranoid China spawn that would do nothing but build great wall improvements on every available hex
and had a Cleopatra spawn who loved me because her default AI bonus is she tries to befriend people with large militaries
but she was paranoid, so her random trait meant she was afraid of anyone who had a large military
so she would compliment me on the size and impressiveness of my military, referring to me as worthy of her attention
then would turn around and immediately cry that my military is too large and freaks her out
come to think of it, on that playthrough she kind of reminded me of some of my exes...




:lolsy:

Ya. That is nuts. Sounds like Kim Jung-Il or something

Indeed. I can't wait to see where civilization goes. One of the best games of all time.

:mushroom2:


--------------------
TRUMP 2020

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