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Chakra Shock
Waxing Prophetic


Registered: 02/22/13
Posts: 2,514
Loc: The Enterprise
Last seen: 3 years, 8 months
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Re: You ever wonder what life would be like without drugs? [Re: Ezuma] 1
#23762556 - 10/22/16 10:27 PM (7 years, 3 months ago) |
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Well i've seen some of your drawings, and that says dedication, to me. It's cool to gravitate towards what we enjoy, but it takes knowing pain to understand pleasure.
I wish some of y'all would read my earlier post, but I'll just describe it more here:
meditation, psychedelics, taking a walk, remembering 'god', it's not really important how it happens, but when you have that 'aha' moment of perceiving something so real, so much more solid than anything we've known before, the ground is ripped out from underneath you, everything we've ever known feels fake in comparison, and life takes on the new colors of a world unseen.
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Jokeshopbeard
Humble Student

Registered: 11/30/11
Posts: 26,088
Loc: Deep in the system
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Re: You ever wonder what life would be like without drugs? [Re: ohcrapitsnico]
#23762559 - 10/22/16 10:29 PM (7 years, 3 months ago) |
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I'm sorry man, I don't mean it to come across as arrogant, but it really is a path that is so unique to every one of us - for the path ventures inside yourself, taking you away from the shared experiences of your fellow man, but somehow helping you to then understand your fellow man all the better.
Hey look, I'm just words on a screen, but I'd spill my own blood to share with my fellow man that the rewards are real, and worthy of pursuit.
-------------------- Let it be seen that you are nothing. And in knowing that you are nothing... there is nothing to lose, there is nothing to gain. What can happen to you? Something can happen to the body, but it will either heal or it won't. What's the big deal? Let life knock you to bits. Let life take you apart. Let life destroy you. It will only destroy what you are not. --Jac O'keeffe
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Ezuma
Gontish Wizard



Registered: 12/02/13
Posts: 8,423
Loc: Roke
Last seen: 10 months, 21 days
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Re: You ever wonder what life would be like without drugs? [Re: Chakra Shock]
#23762562 - 10/22/16 10:30 PM (7 years, 3 months ago) |
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Quote:
Chakra Shock said: Well i've seen some of your drawings, and that says dedication, to me. It's cool to gravitate towards what we enjoy, but it takes knowing pain to understand pleasure.
I wish some of y'all would read my earlier post, but I'll just describe it more here:
meditation, psychedelics, taking a walk, remembering 'god', it's not really important how it happens, but when you have that 'aha' moment of perceiving something so real, so much more solid than anything we've known before, the ground is ripped out from underneath you, everything we've ever known feels fake in comparison, and life takes on the new colors of a world unseen.
for sure, but I find pain all too easy to come by, I don't think most people need any more of it really
ok maybe I'm being a bit stiff on my position here, as indeed just sitting in contemplation is one of my preferred pastimes, and in fact psychedelics rarely deliver the way I always think they should (maybe 1 in every 5 times)
hmmm
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Jokeshopbeard
Humble Student

Registered: 11/30/11
Posts: 26,088
Loc: Deep in the system
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Re: You ever wonder what life would be like without drugs? [Re: Ezuma]
#23762565 - 10/22/16 10:30 PM (7 years, 3 months ago) |
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Quote:
Ezuma said: Unless of course you just mean how awakening can't be described in words, or something to that effect
See my previous post.
-------------------- Let it be seen that you are nothing. And in knowing that you are nothing... there is nothing to lose, there is nothing to gain. What can happen to you? Something can happen to the body, but it will either heal or it won't. What's the big deal? Let life knock you to bits. Let life take you apart. Let life destroy you. It will only destroy what you are not. --Jac O'keeffe
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Chakra Shock
Waxing Prophetic


Registered: 02/22/13
Posts: 2,514
Loc: The Enterprise
Last seen: 3 years, 8 months
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Re: You ever wonder what life would be like without drugs? [Re: Ezuma] 1
#23762566 - 10/22/16 10:30 PM (7 years, 3 months ago) |
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It's not about keeping information 'secret' and making sure that you 'go through the right steps', it's simply that experiences of self-realization can not be described by language because language is inherently limited to logical structures of abstract symbolism, and realization surpasses logic through an all encompassing experience of reality.
That's like asking someone to prove the theory of relativity without mathematics.
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mt cleverest
clevendafodil

Registered: 08/19/12
Posts: 2,348
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Re: You ever wonder what life would be like without drugs? [Re: WeAreMushroom]
#23762570 - 10/22/16 10:31 PM (7 years, 3 months ago) |
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Quote:
WeAreMushroom said:
Quote:
Ezuma said:
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Chakra Shock said: Ram Dass gave a buddhist monk in India some LSD and the next morning when he asked the monk how it was he said "it's good, but not as good as meditation".
I've heard that monk actually didn't take the lsd. I don't buy the meditation crowd's rhetoric, I mean sure you can do cool things with it, even go places with enough time and the right conditions, but to me the fact that solid information on this is incredibly hard to find always implies to me it's just cult rhetoric at work.
I just spent two months backpacking in New Zealand and stayed at a zen commune where a I met a man named John who was 70 and claimed to spend 10+ hours of the day in meditation. He said he had been doing this for 40+ years,
Everyone there was into meditating for very long periods of time and done vispassana meditation, where you meditate for 14 days and don't talk at all.
John was a very strange man and for someone that you would expect to be sort of a guru, he was actually sort of a crotchety old man. The amount of time he spent meditating really ate away at his ability to interact with humans effectively. He was very awkward. It made me wonder what about his meditation was so good that he wanted to do it for 10 hours a day.
Other people at this commune believed things like that if you meditate long enough you can breathe underwater or go entirely without food and just live off of sunlight.
One of the people there though looked a solid 20 years younger than his age. I was amazed when I found out how old he was. I had been treating him like a little brother and I found out he was almost as old as my dad! He said he attributed it all to meditation and being vegetarian since birth.
He was a cool cat. I gave him some acid. I'm sure it improved his meditation.
Haha that old guy is just mad cus he wasted his life, but hes not going to stop now cus then what would he have? Same with ram dass' guru. Theres no way he was going to admit lsd is better than meditation. He probably wanted to ask for more but he knew that it wouldnt be very masterly of him if he did.
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Jokeshopbeard
Humble Student

Registered: 11/30/11
Posts: 26,088
Loc: Deep in the system
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Re: You ever wonder what life would be like without drugs? [Re: Chakra Shock]
#23762573 - 10/22/16 10:32 PM (7 years, 3 months ago) |
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Quote:
Chakra Shock said: meditation, psychedelics, taking a walk, remembering 'god', it's not really important how it happens, but when you have that 'aha' moment of perceiving something so real, so much more solid than anything we've known before, the ground is ripped out from underneath you, everything we've ever known feels fake in comparison, and life takes on the new colors of a world unseen.
BOOM. That. Yes.
-------------------- Let it be seen that you are nothing. And in knowing that you are nothing... there is nothing to lose, there is nothing to gain. What can happen to you? Something can happen to the body, but it will either heal or it won't. What's the big deal? Let life knock you to bits. Let life take you apart. Let life destroy you. It will only destroy what you are not. --Jac O'keeffe
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Ezuma
Gontish Wizard



Registered: 12/02/13
Posts: 8,423
Loc: Roke
Last seen: 10 months, 21 days
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Re: You ever wonder what life would be like without drugs? [Re: Jokeshopbeard]
#23762576 - 10/22/16 10:34 PM (7 years, 3 months ago) |
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Quote:
Jokeshopbeard said: I'm sorry man, I don't mean it to come across as arrogant, but it really is a path that is so unique to every one of us - for the path ventures inside yourself, taking you away from the shared experiences of your fellow man, but somehow helping you to then understand your fellow man all the better.
Hey look, I'm just words on a screen, but I'd spill my own blood to share with my fellow man that the rewards are real, and worthy of pursuit.
ah good, nicely said
actually I really would like to get into meditation, I suppose I'm just cautious about getting my hopes up and trying to justify my lazy existence, both at once.
if this sort of meditation requires years of solitude or even months, I know it can never be obligation to earn money and all that boring shit will impede, and another cog I'll be
I have always felt though that a few months of isolation is necessary if I'm ever to really 'go in' to contemplation in a big way, or into my art, or writing. Seems unachievable now, but perhaps I'm just limiting myself
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Jokeshopbeard
Humble Student

Registered: 11/30/11
Posts: 26,088
Loc: Deep in the system
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Re: You ever wonder what life would be like without drugs? [Re: Chakra Shock]
#23762577 - 10/22/16 10:34 PM (7 years, 3 months ago) |
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Quote:
Chakra Shock said: That's like asking someone to prove the theory of relativity without mathematics.
Double Yes. There's things that happen in this life that science cannot explain.
-------------------- Let it be seen that you are nothing. And in knowing that you are nothing... there is nothing to lose, there is nothing to gain. What can happen to you? Something can happen to the body, but it will either heal or it won't. What's the big deal? Let life knock you to bits. Let life take you apart. Let life destroy you. It will only destroy what you are not. --Jac O'keeffe
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Ezuma
Gontish Wizard



Registered: 12/02/13
Posts: 8,423
Loc: Roke
Last seen: 10 months, 21 days
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Re: You ever wonder what life would be like without drugs? [Re: Jokeshopbeard] 1
#23762584 - 10/22/16 10:37 PM (7 years, 3 months ago) |
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Quote:
Jokeshopbeard said:
Quote:
Chakra Shock said: That's like asking someone to prove the theory of relativity without mathematics.
Double Yes. There's things that happen in this life that science cannot explain.
perhaps, but maybe it simply can't explain them yet. I think I am a little close minded though, I tend to think of logic as the supreme human ability, what makes us different than animals, and what actually helps us to understand the world in any useful way. I do think though that logical, analytical thinking alone is not enough for personal fulfillment, hence my drug use. but my experience is one very limited fragment of an immense whole so it's quite likely many things I consider impossible or can't conceive of are commonplace even in human experience. Tis a weird world
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Jokeshopbeard
Humble Student

Registered: 11/30/11
Posts: 26,088
Loc: Deep in the system
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Re: You ever wonder what life would be like without drugs? [Re: Ezuma] 1
#23762588 - 10/22/16 10:38 PM (7 years, 3 months ago) |
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Ezuma said: Seems unachievable now, but perhaps I'm just limiting myself
Mate, the common perception of meditation and mindfulness is as pathetic as the common perception of anything in this world: it's wrong.
Start a thread in P&MW-B sometime, I'll share everything I can. Feeling pretty sleepy right now though.
-------------------- Let it be seen that you are nothing. And in knowing that you are nothing... there is nothing to lose, there is nothing to gain. What can happen to you? Something can happen to the body, but it will either heal or it won't. What's the big deal? Let life knock you to bits. Let life take you apart. Let life destroy you. It will only destroy what you are not. --Jac O'keeffe
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Jokeshopbeard
Humble Student

Registered: 11/30/11
Posts: 26,088
Loc: Deep in the system
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Re: You ever wonder what life would be like without drugs? [Re: Ezuma]
#23762595 - 10/22/16 10:40 PM (7 years, 3 months ago) |
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Quote:
Ezuma said: I think I am a little close minded though, I tend to think of logic as the supreme human ability, what makes us different than animals, and what actually helps us to understand the world in any useful way. I do think though that logical, analytical thinking alone is not enough for personal fulfillment, hence my drug use.
LOL, I get it man. I know that place. DMT is especially good for shattering that illusion.
-------------------- Let it be seen that you are nothing. And in knowing that you are nothing... there is nothing to lose, there is nothing to gain. What can happen to you? Something can happen to the body, but it will either heal or it won't. What's the big deal? Let life knock you to bits. Let life take you apart. Let life destroy you. It will only destroy what you are not. --Jac O'keeffe
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Ezuma
Gontish Wizard



Registered: 12/02/13
Posts: 8,423
Loc: Roke
Last seen: 10 months, 21 days
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Re: You ever wonder what life would be like without drugs? [Re: Jokeshopbeard]
#23762606 - 10/22/16 10:42 PM (7 years, 3 months ago) |
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I need to get onto DMT, the other's haven't quite delivered, and the duration and nausea gets me (I have trouble with food so trips tend to make me miserable simply due to not being able to get any food down which sets off a whole chain of non-eating that's really regrettable)
the descriptions of it always sound like what I think I want, but we'll see haha
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ohcrapitsnico
The Other One


Registered: 06/06/09
Posts: 2,720
Loc: Houston
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Re: You ever wonder what life would be like without drugs? [Re: Ezuma] 1
#23762607 - 10/22/16 10:43 PM (7 years, 3 months ago) |
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Quote:
Ezuma said: I think I am a little close minded though, I tend to think of logic as the supreme human ability, what makes us different than animals, and what actually helps us to understand the world in any useful way. I do think though that logical, analytical thinking alone is not enough for personal fulfillment, hence my drug use. but my experience is one very limited fragment of an immense whole so it's quite likely many things I consider impossible or can't conceive of are commonplace even in human experience. Tis a weird world
I think i would get alont really well with you.
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Ezuma
Gontish Wizard



Registered: 12/02/13
Posts: 8,423
Loc: Roke
Last seen: 10 months, 21 days
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Re: You ever wonder what life would be like without drugs? [Re: ohcrapitsnico]
#23762611 - 10/22/16 10:44 PM (7 years, 3 months ago) |
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one can only hope, from your posts I think you're right though
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Jokeshopbeard
Humble Student

Registered: 11/30/11
Posts: 26,088
Loc: Deep in the system
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Re: You ever wonder what life would be like without drugs? [Re: Ezuma]
#23762622 - 10/22/16 10:47 PM (7 years, 3 months ago) |
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Quote:
Ezuma said: the descriptions of it always sound like what I think I want, but we'll see haha 
Yeah. I've done traditional ceremonys, and I've worked at the art of smoking it (DMT machine) solo.
When you get deep into it, and it holds you in the present moment while your mind fights to escape it.. yeah, you see alright.
-------------------- Let it be seen that you are nothing. And in knowing that you are nothing... there is nothing to lose, there is nothing to gain. What can happen to you? Something can happen to the body, but it will either heal or it won't. What's the big deal? Let life knock you to bits. Let life take you apart. Let life destroy you. It will only destroy what you are not. --Jac O'keeffe
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mt cleverest
clevendafodil

Registered: 08/19/12
Posts: 2,348
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Re: You ever wonder what life would be like without drugs? [Re: Ezuma]
#23762631 - 10/22/16 10:50 PM (7 years, 3 months ago) |
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Quote:
Ezuma said: I need to get onto DMT, the other's haven't quite delivered, and the duration and nausea gets me (I have trouble with food so trips tend to make me miserable simply due to not being able to get any food down which sets off a whole chain of non-eating that's really regrettable)
the descriptions of it always sound like what I think I want, but we'll see haha 
write up a trip report when you get around to it. I'm a bit of a paranoid tripper too and never tried smoking dmt because of it.
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Ezuma
Gontish Wizard



Registered: 12/02/13
Posts: 8,423
Loc: Roke
Last seen: 10 months, 21 days
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Re: You ever wonder what life would be like without drugs? [Re: mt cleverest]
#23762637 - 10/22/16 10:52 PM (7 years, 3 months ago) |
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I'll be sure too, if I don't go psychotic
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koods
Ribbit



Registered: 05/26/11
Posts: 106,066
Loc: Maryland/DC Burbs
Last seen: 31 minutes, 35 seconds
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Re: You ever wonder what life would be like without drugs? [Re: ohcrapitsnico]
#23762642 - 10/22/16 10:53 PM (7 years, 3 months ago) |
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Quote:
ohcrapitsnico said:
Quote:
Ezuma said: I think I am a little close minded though, I tend to think of logic as the supreme human ability, what makes us different than animals, and what actually helps us to understand the world in any useful way. I do think though that logical, analytical thinking alone is not enough for personal fulfillment, hence my drug use. but my experience is one very limited fragment of an immense whole so it's quite likely many things I consider impossible or can't conceive of are commonplace even in human experience. Tis a weird world
I think i would get alont really well with you. 
--------------------
NotSheekle said “if I believed she was 16 I would become unattracted to her”
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Ezuma
Gontish Wizard



Registered: 12/02/13
Posts: 8,423
Loc: Roke
Last seen: 10 months, 21 days
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Re: You ever wonder what life would be like without drugs? [Re: koods]
#23762647 - 10/22/16 10:56 PM (7 years, 3 months ago) |
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