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Invisibleirequirechocolate
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Registered: 10/15/16
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Lab access
    #23758760 - 10/21/16 06:17 PM (7 years, 3 months ago)

Since I joined this board about a week ago, I've only posted a few questions about my basic, first-time PF TEK setup, but it seems to be going well enough that I'm already thinking about what I might want to try in the future.
I am a geneticist/microbiologist that works in a lab and so I have access to a lot of resources most people don't. For example, I was able to use an autoclave when sterilizing my cakes and some more simple things like a clean bench w/ a flame and a sharps container for syringe disposal, etc.

My first question is, if you were in my shoes and additionally had access to an incubator (30°C, aka 86°F, unfortunately too hot for any tek I've read about), a fume hood, basic micro tools and supplies, access to lots of high grade reagent vendors, etc, what would you do to step up your cultivation game?

Also, because I have access to a lot of scientific literature, I've been perusing some old papers. Thing is, they truly are OLD. So, my second question is, as an experienced cultivator, what type of questions would you like to see geneticists answer?
(I already have a lot of work on my plate, but I am still curious what this community wonders about).

EDIT: If this is your first time looking at this thread, you may want to skip to ~the halfway mark of page 2 to avoid the arguments :wink:


Edited by irequirechocolate (10/21/16 10:54 PM)


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Invisibler.lutece
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Re: Lab access [Re: irequirechocolate]
    #23758789 - 10/21/16 06:25 PM (7 years, 3 months ago)

I want to start off by pointing out that I am NOT an experienced cultivator, but one of the first questions that comes to mind for me is: do you have access to a gas chromatograph? I feel like there are lots of fun results from experiments that would best be measured via GC.


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One goes into an experiment knowing one might fail.
But one does not undertake an experiment knowing one HAS failed.


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Invisibleirequirechocolate
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Re: Lab access [Re: r.lutece]
    #23758815 - 10/21/16 06:36 PM (7 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

r.lutece said:
I want to start off by pointing out that I am NOT an experienced cultivator, but one of the first questions that comes to mind for me is: do you have access to a gas chromatograph? I feel like there are lots of fun results from experiments that would best be measured via GC.




Those are more common in chemistry and biochemistry labs, and while I don't have direct access to one, I do have buddies that do. I also have a friend, (he works w/ proteins, I work w/ DNA), in the field who regularly does NMR, which I believe may be a step-up, but has a waitlist to use most weeks, and I don't really want to hassle him.


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Invisibler.lutece
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Re: Lab access [Re: irequirechocolate]
    #23758911 - 10/21/16 07:14 PM (7 years, 3 months ago)

Totally fair. My understanding is that the incubator would be awesome for colonizing petris (I assume that's its intended purpose?), as the mycelium on agar won't be generating much of its own heat. So, agar teks would be in your realm of possibility I imagine.


--------------------
One goes into an experiment knowing one might fail.
But one does not undertake an experiment knowing one HAS failed.


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Invisibleamidogen
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Re: Lab access [Re: r.lutece] * 1
    #23758929 - 10/21/16 07:21 PM (7 years, 3 months ago)

.


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The biggest trip of my life was realizing all of the events and actions described in posts made by this account were never real and had never actually happened, but were instead the delusional ramblings of a severely mentally ill human being. I just had to move on for my own good. I love you all.


Edited by amidogen (04/19/18 11:59 AM)


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InvisibleInocuole
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Re: Lab access [Re: irequirechocolate]
    #23758968 - 10/21/16 07:34 PM (7 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

irequirechocolate said:
simple things like a clean bench w/ a flame and a sharps container for syringe disposal, etc.




Why would you dispose of a perfectly good syringe?  It wasn't stuck in a hepatitis patient.

Quote:

amidogen said:
86 F is far above an ideal temperature. Mycelial growth increases with temperature until topping out around 80F, but those temperatures are also much more hospitable to bacteria and mold. Ideal temps for both agar work, colonizing jars, and fruiting is 65-75F. I'm actually loving the fall weather because I'm not fighting at all to keep my place in the upper 60s. You'll see much fewer instances of contams in those temperature ranges. Mycelial growth will be slower, but your fruits will tend to be thicker and meatier.





All of this.  I'm sure microbiologists have their own way of handling clean work but you might still want to just forget that and do it our way.  :shrug:

http://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/20048771#20048771
https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/22721954


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Invisibler.lutece
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Re: Lab access [Re: amidogen]
    #23758986 - 10/21/16 07:41 PM (7 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

amidogen said:
86 F is far above an ideal temperature. Mycelial growth increases with temperature until topping out around 80F, but those temperatures are also much more hospitable to bacteria and mold. Ideal temps for both agar work, colonizing jars, and fruiting is 65-75F. I'm actually loving the fall weather because I'm not fighting at all to keep my place in the upper 60s. You'll see much fewer instances of contams in those temperature ranges. Mycelial growth will be slower, but your fruits will tend to be thicker and meatier.




I just double checked the post where I was getting that from and I realized that there was more discussion about it below. It was something RR quoted Stamets as saying, but apparently Stamets was quoting someone else and further testing disproved that. Mea culpa!


--------------------
One goes into an experiment knowing one might fail.
But one does not undertake an experiment knowing one HAS failed.


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Invisibleirequirechocolate
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Re: Lab access [Re: r.lutece]
    #23759007 - 10/21/16 07:52 PM (7 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

Inocuole said:
Quote:

irequirechocolate said:
simple things like a clean bench w/ a flame and a sharps container for syringe disposal, etc.




Why would you dispose of a perfectly good syringe?  It wasn't stuck in a hepatitis patient.





A couple reasons. There is no reason to risk contamination by airborne pathogens, especially when you have an unlimited supply as is - I have fresh ones available that I use daily. Plus I don't want to keep a bunch of needles/syringes around.

Quote:

amidogen said:
86 F is far above an ideal temperature.




Yes, I realize it's too high for my purposes. I primarily use it for bacteria & yeast . Still, the lab is kept at 68-72 F so those temps are not really a concern.

I will add that for me, I would really just use the lab for setting things up, not maintaining tubs. That's for home.


Edited by irequirechocolate (10/21/16 07:58 PM)


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OfflineParafaragaramus
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Re: Lab access [Re: irequirechocolate]
    #23759083 - 10/21/16 08:21 PM (7 years, 3 months ago)

I think if you have a sort of lab setting a good place to go is agar. I think the realistic progression usually goes pf cakes, grains, then agar. Some may go straight to grains. I've always wanted to dive into agar but the place I'm staying at now isn't the best for agar work so I have been sticking to grains and it has been just fine for me for a while now.

I think the transporting of things might get a bit tiresome. In the end they will still go to grains before being spawned in a tub or some other fruiting chamber. people have done great things at home with limited equipment.
Are you planning on keeping the petris there until it's time to put them on grains?


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Invisibleirequirechocolate
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Re: Lab access [Re: Parafaragaramus]
    #23759111 - 10/21/16 08:30 PM (7 years, 3 months ago)

Keeping plates in lab at RT is no problem. They're already all over the place as is.
Admittedly I have not thoroughly read thru much of the agar threads yet. I glanced at some and saw people adding blue dye I think??? This would certainly stand out, as most plates in this lab are YEPD, a translucent yellow color, if not totally clear.

Above someone posted a link to some agar tek threads tho, so I'll check those out more seriously soon.


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OfflineParafaragaramus
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Re: Lab access [Re: irequirechocolate]
    #23759212 - 10/21/16 09:03 PM (7 years, 3 months ago)

I only have a limited knowledge of agar myself but I don't think I've read anything about a blue dye.
as far as I know they're just that translucent yellow until the mycelium colonizes it and it turn a fairly stark white unless there is some sort of contamination.


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InvisibleLeviticus969
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Re: Lab access [Re: irequirechocolate]
    #23759215 - 10/21/16 09:04 PM (7 years, 3 months ago)

Congratulations on all the access to the lab gear but really imo, it isn't really necessary. Growing shrooms is easy. Growing extremely potent magical shrooms is the hard part.

Which leads me to this...

Quote:

So, my second question is, as an experienced cultivator, what type of questions would you like to see geneticists answer?




1. If you take a spore print from a parent shroom and grow from those spores will the mushrooms be identical in potency and appearance from the parent shroom or will it give you a reset on genetics and provide different results?

This is the single most important thing I want to know as an experienced cultivator. It's not even that hard to experiment on but I don't have the time, space, and energy for it right now.

So in other words, I'm trying to find out if Michael Jackson had babies what are the odds they'll end up exactly like their father.



:mikemcdonald:


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InvisibleInocuole
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Re: Lab access [Re: Parafaragaramus]
    #23759216 - 10/21/16 09:05 PM (7 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

Archenemy_6 said:
I only have a limited knowledge of agar myself but I don't think I've read anything about a blue dye.





Well where the hell have you been?  It's food coloring btw.  And it can be any color.  It's only there to provide contrast.

Quote:

Leviticus969 said:


1. If you take a spore print from a parent shroom and grow from those spores will the mushrooms be identical in potency and appearance from the parent shroom or will it give you a reset on genetics and provide different results?

This is the single most important thing I want to know as an experienced cultivator. It's not even that hard to experiment on but I don't have the time, space, and energy for it right now.






You don't need a geneticist to tell you this.  No, spore prints have thousands of genetics in them.  Each mushroom can have multiple genetics within itself, and the spores don't just represent the mushroom you see.  They're completely randomized and result in the possibility of thousands or even millions of individual strains from a single print.  Even if a mushroom did only have one set of genetics in it (from an isolated strain), the spores would still be representative of more than just the mushroom you see.

The print could produce a good number of mushrooms that look like the parent, but it could also produce just as many mushrooms that are different.


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Edited by Inocuole (10/21/16 09:10 PM)


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OfflineParafaragaramus
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Re: Lab access [Re: Inocuole]
    #23759230 - 10/21/16 09:12 PM (7 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

Inocuole said:



Well where the hell have you been?  It's food coloring btw.  And it can be any color.  It's only there to provide contrast.




I've definitely been living under a rock for a little while now. I've just recently started to try and get back into the swing of grains.
But I can see how that can be useful.


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InvisibleLeviticus969
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Re: Lab access [Re: Inocuole]
    #23759239 - 10/21/16 09:15 PM (7 years, 3 months ago)

I don't have to be a geneticist to know this? Did I ask you? Mr Know it all? Have you studied mushrooms all your life? Who are you?

I'm not looking for the cliche status quo responses on here given by random growers that think they know everything when they just recycle outdated information on the shroomery so thanks and have a good day.


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InvisibleInocuole
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Re: Lab access [Re: Leviticus969] * 1
    #23759243 - 10/21/16 09:16 PM (7 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

Archenemy_6 said:
Quote:

Inocuole said:



Well where the hell have you been?  It's food coloring btw.  And it can be any color.  It's only there to provide contrast.




I've definitely been living under a rock for a little while now. I've just recently started to try and get back into the swing of grains.
But I can see how that can be useful.



Yeah dude I haven't seen you around in like, years.
Quote:

Leviticus969 said:
I don't have to be a geneticist to know this? Did I ask you? Mr Know it all? Have you studied mushrooms all your life? Who are you?

I'm not looking for the cliche status quo responses on here given by random growers that think they know everything when they just recycle outdated information on the shroomery so thanks and have a good day.





Alright fucknut, ask the geneticist.  Sorry I bothered correctly answering your stupid ass question.

:banyouverymuch:


--------------------
                            :rainbowdrink: Tea doesn't work?                            AMU  (Q & A)                  Grain prep for Intergalactic Space Oats :pes:     

Coir-ca-cola
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InvisibleLeviticus969
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Re: Lab access [Re: Inocuole]
    #23759252 - 10/21/16 09:20 PM (7 years, 3 months ago)

Whatever man no one needs that condescending know it all attitude around here get a life. :lol:


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Invisibleirequirechocolate
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Re: Lab access [Re: Inocuole]
    #23759256 - 10/21/16 09:21 PM (7 years, 3 months ago)

Hopefully this will satisfy both of you: asexual spores are genetically identical to the parent. But, because of epigenetics and environmental cues, you're still not going to have an identical mushroom.
EDIT: I have not reached the level of taking prints yet; I'm still waiting on my first set o'cakes. But maybe eventually I can extract DNA from a mother than daughter and sequence the two. This should not be hard to do.


Edited by irequirechocolate (10/21/16 09:22 PM)


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InvisibleInocuole
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Re: Lab access [Re: irequirechocolate]
    #23759266 - 10/21/16 09:23 PM (7 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

irequirechocolate said:
Hopefully this will satisfy both of you: asexual spores are genetically identical to the parent. But, because of epigenetics and environmental cues, you're still not going to have an identical mushroom.





The spores aren't asexual though.


--------------------
                            :rainbowdrink: Tea doesn't work?                            AMU  (Q & A)                  Grain prep for Intergalactic Space Oats :pes:     

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OfflineSloppyJoseph
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Re: Lab access [Re: Leviticus969] * 1
    #23759270 - 10/21/16 09:24 PM (7 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

Leviticus969 said:
Whatever man no one needs that condescending know it all attitude around here get a life. :lol:



No what is not needed around here are jackass's who start shit when their questions get answered. :rolleyes:


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