|
Some of these posts are very old and might contain outdated information. You may wish to search for newer posts instead.
|
ComebackKid
Multispore Enthusiast



Registered: 05/27/16
Posts: 3,951
Loc: ked in the trunk of a car
|
Re: 2nd try clone -> agar -> grain -> bulk [Re: globos]
#23770858 - 10/25/16 05:56 PM (7 years, 3 months ago) |
|
|
That's a good sign I bet they'll finish within 10 days are you sticking with the choke bags or are you building a SGFC or mono in the meantime?
If you really wanna get fancy you should build both and put one tray cased and not cased in each and see how they perform lol
--------------------
Substrate surface conditions / Monotub prep and care
Look around you... Everything you see exists inside the mind. Consciousness, the awareness that is experiencing this mind, is peering in from outside the universe. Our individual experiences are all part of the universe's experience of itself
|
globos
Regular User


Registered: 04/09/10
Posts: 658
|
Re: 2nd try clone -> agar -> grain -> bulk [Re: ComebackKid]
#23790998 - 11/01/16 11:05 AM (7 years, 2 months ago) |
|
|
Quote:
ComebackKid said: are you sticking with the choke bags or are you building a SGFC or mono in the meantime?
I don't know yet. Waiting for input from knowledgeable shroomerites. The choke bags worked fairly well for me - good enough, at least. On the other hand, I already have a monotub I made for my previous grow (here's the thread and picture log), but I think the content of these 4 small boxes might be too little mycelium to reach critical mass. I suspect the monotub wouldn't be able to keep the necessary moisture and temperature. Expert advice welcome!
Quote:
If you really wanna get fancy you should build both and put one tray cased and not cased in each and see how they perform lol
That's too much experimentation for a half-assed batch such as this Besides, I just noticed I actually cased 3 boxes out of 4, not 2 as I thought. I'll just get along with this as soon as I can pull it off. My next grow will be larger, a monotub for sure. I already have the agar plates getting colonized.
DAY 8
|
globos
Regular User


Registered: 04/09/10
Posts: 658
|
Fruiting? Advice, please. [Re: globos]
#23807844 - 11/06/16 07:25 PM (7 years, 2 months ago) |
|
|
DAY 13
Group and couple shots of all 4 boxes.
 A single shot of one box, with a detail showing what might be pins - or something very close to pinning.
It seems like the boxes are about ripe for fruiting. The cased boxes show less surface activity, but I guess it is to be expected - however, the sides of the boxes show good colonization even if the top is still covered with brownish vermiculite rather than white mycelium.
Am I ready to fruit in your opinion? How do I go about that? Remove the lids, put the boxes into a suitable fruiting environment and that's all?
I still haven't made my mind about going ahead with choke bags or putting the 4 boxes into a monotub. My previously built monotub isn't large enough to accommodate all 4 boxes on the bottom, though, so I'd have to build a larger tub, which is quite inconvenient, especially since I'm not planning a grow massive enough for such a huge monotub.
Also, should I dunk after the first flush?
Any informed advice will be thankfully received.
|
ComebackKid
Multispore Enthusiast



Registered: 05/27/16
Posts: 3,951
Loc: ked in the trunk of a car
|
Re: Fruiting? Advice, please. [Re: globos]
#23807949 - 11/06/16 08:08 PM (7 years, 2 months ago) |
|
|
They seem to be fully colonized. Yes, taking off the lids would be cinsidered introducing fruiting conditions but you'll want to put them in a mono tub or sgfc to keep RH up and also provide adequate FAE.
If you don't want to make another chamber then choke bags will work too obviously... Just won't be favourable conditions for your trays because they don't provide enough FAE.
You could get creative and somehow turn your trays into mini monos. Maybe drill four 1"holes above the sub and a couple holes in the bags. Cover em with MP tape
--------------------
Substrate surface conditions / Monotub prep and care
Look around you... Everything you see exists inside the mind. Consciousness, the awareness that is experiencing this mind, is peering in from outside the universe. Our individual experiences are all part of the universe's experience of itself
Edited by ComebackKid (11/06/16 08:15 PM)
|
globos
Regular User


Registered: 04/09/10
Posts: 658
|
Re: Fruiting? Advice, please. [Re: ComebackKid]
#23810222 - 11/07/16 04:49 PM (7 years, 2 months ago) |
|
|
Thanks again, ComebackKid. I have another option: a larger container, like the smaller monotub (Ikea too, only larger), but it has no holes yet - and I can't make them easily right now. I also have a lid for it. Do you think that would be better than the choke bags if I use it keeping the lid slightly open to allow some FAE?
|
bodhisatta 
Smurf real estate agent


Registered: 04/30/13
Posts: 61,889
Loc: Milky way
|
Re: Fruiting? Advice, please. [Re: globos]
#23810238 - 11/07/16 04:59 PM (7 years, 2 months ago) |
|
|

bags are fine if you can make sure you cut them or give them room for air.
|
ComebackKid
Multispore Enthusiast



Registered: 05/27/16
Posts: 3,951
Loc: ked in the trunk of a car
|
Re: Fruiting? Advice, please. [Re: bodhisatta]
#23811173 - 11/07/16 09:46 PM (7 years, 2 months ago) |
|
|
Bod I fucking love when you just barge in on a thread with like 10 related pics of some crazy as grows you've done.
I'm suprised you didn't comment about OP's suggestion to use an unmodified tub tho
--------------------
Substrate surface conditions / Monotub prep and care
Look around you... Everything you see exists inside the mind. Consciousness, the awareness that is experiencing this mind, is peering in from outside the universe. Our individual experiences are all part of the universe's experience of itself
|
globos
Regular User


Registered: 04/09/10
Posts: 658
|
Re: Fruiting? Advice, please. [Re: ComebackKid]
#23812007 - 11/08/16 08:29 AM (7 years, 2 months ago) |
|
|
Thanks for the advice, Bodhisatta and ComebackKid!
The bags I have came with the growkits, so they're already fitted with micropore filters. I suppose FAE should be enough. The amount of condensation that built up in 5-6 hours looks about right, what do you think?
FRUITING - DAY 0
|
Mushierage
SWIM Sinker



Registered: 06/29/16
Posts: 1,094
Last seen: 7 years, 1 month
|
Re: Fruiting? Advice, please. [Re: globos]
#23812252 - 11/08/16 10:07 AM (7 years, 2 months ago) |
|
|
There is no way for anybody to be able to tell if your FAE is correct looking at pics like this. But if I had to guess, I would say no. It is not adequate.
Honestly, the best way to gauge your FAE is yourself. How quickly is the surface moisture of the tray evaporating and becoming dry? If it's not becoming dry -at all-, then your humidity is probably too consistently high, and you aren't introducing enough FAE. Giving FAE is gonna do a couple things for you, it'll give fresh air obviously, which your myc needs passively, all the time - just like any organism it needs to breath, deprive it of air and it'll suffer. It's also going to lower that humidity to a reasonable RH%. 70-80% humidity is going to be more than enough. Unless you can give your mushrooms enough FAE, humidity being 99% all the time is going to be detrimental to your grows.
Think about the design of the SGFC and Monotub. There are a thousand ways to make either design and basic concept work on just about any tub. If you understand the how and why of them, you'll be able to recreate them in many different forms. It just takes a little feeling through. It takes experience, and not the kind you get from growkits and little instruction manuals and teks on forums.
I do combinations of tubs all the time. I do SGFCs and monotubs, I do jars and big gulps (rarely), I do shoeboxes and even little cake tray covers that I make specially, like a mini-mini mono tub that can support about a lb of substrate - (Holes are pre cut and stuffed with poly, so that it can be just placed overtop of whatever I'm trying to fruit.) Humidity is generally sustaining and comes from the substrate itself.
My point is, read up a bit on the technical aspects of fruiting and fruiting chambers, and you might just learn something about it that you didn't know. Like how to build them and use them to fruit your shit.
-------------------- Don't like researching posts? Read this! . Also, if you're new and your posts contain the words: Humidifer, incubator, air-stone, or heater, then you need to read and UTFSE before asking people to review your setup. OR... You should be cultivating reptiles and fish, not mushrooms.
  
|
bodhisatta 
Smurf real estate agent


Registered: 04/30/13
Posts: 61,889
Loc: Milky way
|
Re: Fruiting? Advice, please. [Re: ComebackKid]
#23812257 - 11/08/16 10:09 AM (7 years, 2 months ago) |
|
|
Quote:
ComebackKid said:
Bod I fucking love when you just barge in on a thread with like 10 related pics of some crazy as grows you've done.
I'm suprised you didn't comment about OP's suggestion to use an unmodified tub tho
Probably would habe helped if I read the OP hah. Unmodified tubs in my signature if anyone like OP is interested
|
globos
Regular User


Registered: 04/09/10
Posts: 658
|
Re: Fruiting? Advice, please. [Re: bodhisatta]
#23812434 - 11/08/16 11:27 AM (7 years, 2 months ago) |
|
|
Hm, great advice thanks! 
Experience is what I'm trying to gather by not simply aiming at the best possible harvest, but rather experimenting. In other words, when I make a mistake, I try to see it as an opportunity for learning.
The reason why I ended up with these small trays in the first place is that I f'd up inoculation or something, so I was left with much less grain than I had planned. I was hoping to spawn and grow in a monotub, which I've tried once already, but given the small quantity of colonized grain available, I decided to make a few small boxes, figuring it could be a way to salvage the batch and to learn about growing in small containers (which can be made into special presents for special people).
I have very little experience of fruiting - little experience in general, I'd say - but I have read a lot, especially on the Shroomery forums. However, as you say, reading is no substitute for actual practice. Indeed, I'm not able to gauge if RH or FAE is in the right ballpark yet. I thought these bags looked OK because they look more or less like the growkits - which did work reasonably well for me, yielding enough good stuff to spread happiness among quite a few friends apart from me :-)
So what would be the best course of action in your opinion?
- Opening the bags daily for half an hour or so, to let air circulate.
- Keeping the bags slightly open, for example by removing one paperclip and unrolling the top of the bags slightly on the side of the removed paperclip.
- My monotub is too small to accommodate all the trays, but I could use the larger container, without any holes yet, with the lid kept ajar.
By the way, the unmodified monotubs in your sig look gorgeous. I hope someday I will be able to grow a small field as beautiful as those!
|
Mushierage
SWIM Sinker



Registered: 06/29/16
Posts: 1,094
Last seen: 7 years, 1 month
|
Re: Fruiting? Advice, please. [Re: globos]
#23812507 - 11/08/16 12:02 PM (7 years, 2 months ago) |
|
|
Opening the bags for a half hour isn't going to do anything, except release the humidity a bit and help further any evaporation you might have going on, on the surface. It isn't the same as FAE, which as you know is a constant and passive way for air to get to your mycelium.
Out of all fruiting conditions, there are two that I think top everything else when it comes to fruiting/pinning. Surface condition rules all in my opinion, the microclimate of your pinning surface. In a very close second, FAE rules, and helps support the surface condition, so they often go hand in hand. If you have an awesome knotted up surface with perfect moisture -and- you are giving plenty of FAE, then everything else should be pretty close to correct and you'll get one helluva first flush pinset.
Everything else, ambient humidity, light, etc.. all secondary. But making sure all these are correct is definitely helpful.
Don't make any changes until you are sure a change is needed. I am only guessing here, I am not there and I cannot see the conditions of your bags over time, and therefore cannot say if making the changes you're asking about. Only you can decide. I'm just telling you what your mushrooms will need, based on what they show you. Take what they show you, and adjust.
And of course, taking high definition pics of the substrate and asking on here is good way to get moving in the right direction. There are people that are experienced with fruiting right from the bag here, not me, but others.
-------------------- Don't like researching posts? Read this! . Also, if you're new and your posts contain the words: Humidifer, incubator, air-stone, or heater, then you need to read and UTFSE before asking people to review your setup. OR... You should be cultivating reptiles and fish, not mushrooms.
  
|
ComebackKid
Multispore Enthusiast



Registered: 05/27/16
Posts: 3,951
Loc: ked in the trunk of a car
|
Re: Fruiting? Advice, please. [Re: Mushierage]
#23813113 - 11/08/16 03:13 PM (7 years, 2 months ago) |
|
|
Find a way to give them constant FAE. You could open the top and monitor surface moisture once in a while. Mist when the surface starts to dry out.
Then, if you have enough time to monitor your bags, you could open them different amounts and eventually find out how big of an opening you need to only have to mist once a day.
Just a suggestion
--------------------
Substrate surface conditions / Monotub prep and care
Look around you... Everything you see exists inside the mind. Consciousness, the awareness that is experiencing this mind, is peering in from outside the universe. Our individual experiences are all part of the universe's experience of itself
|
globos
Regular User


Registered: 04/09/10
Posts: 658
|
Re: Fruiting? Advice, please. [Re: Mushierage]
#23818383 - 11/10/16 05:34 AM (7 years, 2 months ago) |
|
|
Thanks for replying. It is always appreciated!
Quote:
Mushierage said: Don't make any changes until you are sure a change is needed. I am only guessing here, I am not there and I cannot see the conditions of your bags over time, and therefore cannot say if making the changes you're asking about. Only you can decide. I'm just telling you what your mushrooms will need, based on what they show you. Take what they show you, and adjust.
Talk they do, and I try to to listen. I'm not that bad at plantese, but now I need to get better at understanding mushroomese... 
Quote:
And of course, taking high definition pics of the substrate and asking on here is good way to get moving in the right direction. There are people that are experienced with fruiting right from the bag here, not me, but others.
Sure, I do post pics fairly regularly indeed 
Quote:
ComebackKid said: Find a way to give them constant FAE. You could open the top and monitor surface moisture once in a while. Mist when the surface starts to dry out.
Then, if you have enough time to monitor your bags, you could open them different amounts and eventually find out how big of an opening you need to only have to mist once a day.
Nice one. That's what I did. I can't post pics right now, but I will as soon as some progress shows. Here's a text only update.
I left the bags slightly open, and at the top of each bag there is now a sizable slit, wide enough to see the substrate from outside. Two days have passed, and the moisture inside the bag walls has decreased a bit, but not much. I touched the substrate, and it still hasn't dried out, it's pleasantly moist. I haven't misted yet, because I think there's no need. Will update as usual.
THANKS for the valuable help and support, guys!! :-)
|
globos
Regular User


Registered: 04/09/10
Posts: 658
|
Re: Fruiting? Advice, please. [Re: globos]
#23835286 - 11/15/16 12:02 PM (7 years, 2 months ago) |
|
|
I opened the bags as suggested by Mushierage, so now they definitely breathe, although I'm not sure if it's enough, just right, or too much (lack of experience). The group pic shows a slit large enough to see through to the bottom.
Now that the bags are loosened up rather than almost sealed as before, the air inside the bags does lose a little moisture: there's less condensation showing. However, the substrate is still pleasantly moist to the touch. I spray water inside the bags about every other day, careful to avoid the substrate. Rather, I target the inside surface of the bags.
The substrate is bursting with mycelium, which grew aggressively and is now making small bumps and spires on the surface - but I still see no pins. Sorry the single box pics aren't that good - the flash burned too much and the resolution is low, but there's not much to be seen yet. Next time I'll try to make better single pics.
I have a good feeling this time. If it goes well, I'll start a larger batch from the same mother culture immediately, avoiding liquid inoculation, and putting my eager monotub to good use 
Informed opinions, suggestions, etc., are always welcome.
DAY 21 (FRUITING DAY 7)
 Group pic
 Single shots of two trays
|
ComebackKid
Multispore Enthusiast



Registered: 05/27/16
Posts: 3,951
Loc: ked in the trunk of a car
|
Re: Fruiting? Advice, please. [Re: globos]
#23835339 - 11/15/16 12:18 PM (7 years, 2 months ago) |
|
|
Mist the sub not the bag. The sub is what needs the moisture
--------------------
Substrate surface conditions / Monotub prep and care
Look around you... Everything you see exists inside the mind. Consciousness, the awareness that is experiencing this mind, is peering in from outside the universe. Our individual experiences are all part of the universe's experience of itself
|
globos
Regular User


Registered: 04/09/10
Posts: 658
|
|
Mycelian life goes on. Preparing the next batch (V3).
10 agar plates (Pastywhite style) from the same "milf" clone into 14 half-full jars (SpitballJedi style). The jars seem fuller because some of the grain stuck. Total: 4 nominal myco-quarts. If all goes well, this will end into a monotub. I'll open a new thread for V3.

|
globos
Regular User


Registered: 04/09/10
Posts: 658
|
Re: Fruiting? Advice, please. [Re: ComebackKid]
#23840022 - 11/16/16 08:46 PM (7 years, 2 months ago) |
|
|
Quote:
ComebackKid said: Mist the sub not the bag. The sub is what needs the moisture 
Oh, I see. It's easier, too...
Some growkit instructions warned the user not to mist the substrate directly. Thanks for the advice.
|
globos
Regular User


Registered: 04/09/10
Posts: 658
|
Re: Fruiting? Advice, please. [Re: globos]
#23845734 - 11/18/16 04:03 PM (7 years, 2 months ago) |
|
|
Here we are at last!
I expect they'll be ripe within two weeks. How do I go about the second flush? Should I dunk them, maybe even in ice cold water?
DAY 24 (FRUTING DAY 10)
|
ComebackKid
Multispore Enthusiast



Registered: 05/27/16
Posts: 3,951
Loc: ked in the trunk of a car
|
Re: Fruiting? Advice, please. [Re: globos]
#23845826 - 11/18/16 04:33 PM (7 years, 2 months ago) |
|
|
Congrats man! The bag seems to be working after all. That last pic is pretty sexy! Yeah just pour some water in your trays and let them soak for a bit and dump out excess water nice work!
--------------------
Substrate surface conditions / Monotub prep and care
Look around you... Everything you see exists inside the mind. Consciousness, the awareness that is experiencing this mind, is peering in from outside the universe. Our individual experiences are all part of the universe's experience of itself
|
|