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InvisibleDividedQuantumM
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Americans Work 25% More Than Europeans, Study Finds * 1
    #23750443 - 10/18/16 09:49 PM (7 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:


Americans Work 25% More Than Europeans, Study Finds

Ben Steverman 22 hours ago


Americans are addicted to their jobs. U.S. workers not only put in more hours than workers do almost anywhere else. They’re also increasingly retiring later and taking fewer vacation days.

A new study tries to measure precisely how much more Americans work than Europeans do overall. The answer: The average person in Europe works 19 percent less than the average person in the U.S. That’s about 258 fewer hours per year, or about an hour less each weekday. Another way to look at it: U.S. workers put in almost 25 percent more hours than Europeans.

Hours worked vary a lot by country, according to the unpublished working paper (PDF) by economists Alexander Bick of Arizona State University, Bettina Bruggemann of McMaster University in Ontario, and Nicola Fuchs-Schundeln of Goethe University Frankfurt. Swiss work habits are most similar to Americans', while Italians are the least likely to be at work, putting in 29 percent fewer hours per year than Americans do.


The study was designed to make it easier to compare countries to each other, by capturing the overall hours per person, not just for people with jobs. That incorporates not just the length of the typical workweek but also retirement, vacation, unemployment, and other time spent out of the workforce.

Not all time spent at the office, shop, or factory is time well spent; output is also critical to the productivity equation. But it's important to have a reliable calculation of hours worked per person to accurately measure productivity, the amount of economic value nations get out of each hour their citizens spend working. The study's detailed data could help researchers figure out why Americans toil so much longer than Europeans and which factors most influence productivity.

One  theory is that Americans work longer hours because their additional effort is more likely to pay off. People earn a wider range of incomes in the U.S., so “workers have an incentive to try harder to move up the job ladder because a promotion is worth more,” said Dora Gicheva, an economist at the University of North Carolina-Greensboro, citing a study that compared the U.S. with Germany.

Taxes are an issue. Despite what Donald Trump has said, taxes in the U.S. are substantially lower than in Europe. Studies have suggested that this higher tax burden reduces the incentive to earn more by putting in extra hours.

“Americans are indeed richer than Europeans, and one reason why is because of taxes that depress the incentives to work in Europe,” said Lee Ohanian, an economist at the University of California-Los Angeles.

Maybe the key factor is that labor unions, along with other worker protections, are much stronger in Europe than in the U.S. “The data strongly suggest that labor regulation and unionization appear to be the dominant factors explaining the differences between the United States and Europe,” economists at Harvard and Dartmouth concluded in a 2006 study (PDF).

Generous pensions in Europe are also a strong factor in discouraging older people from working, the study said. In the U.S., more people over 65 are working than at any point in the past 50 years. The U.S.’s shift from traditional pensions to 401(k) plans makes it harder for Americans to know when it’s safe to retire.

One thing is clear. The difference in hours worked between Americans and Europeans is more than a difference in cultures. As recently as the early 1970s, according to several studies, people in the U.S. and Western Europe worked about the same number of hours per week.


https://www.yahoo.com/finance/news/americans-25-more-europeans-study-050010649.html





Seemed interesting, thought I'd share for anyone who might feel the same way.  Professional life in America is, apparently, much more grueling than that in Europe -- although Americans pay much less in taxes.


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InvisibleballsalsaMDiscord
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Re: Americans Work 25% More Than Europeans, Study Finds [Re: DividedQuantum] * 4
    #23750688 - 10/18/16 10:59 PM (7 years, 3 months ago)

Americans have to work more hours to sustain their lifestyles than the 1970's because wages have remained stagnant since then.  Also Americans have to work more hours to pay for medical insurance lest they get seriously ill at some point and be saddled with crushing medical debt for the rest of their lives.  higher taxes are part of what pays for that to not be an issue elsewhere.


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OfflineFalcon91Wolvrn03
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Re: Americans Work 25% More Than Europeans, Study Finds [Re: DividedQuantum] * 2
    #23750753 - 10/18/16 11:21 PM (7 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

DividedQuantum said:
Professional life in America is, apparently, much more grueling than that in Europe -- although Americans pay much less in taxes.



And yet, median wealth in Europe has grown much higher than it is in the United States.

http://www.middleclasspoliticaleconomist.com/2013/06/us-median-wealth-only-28th-in-world.html

Those Italians who work the least have the most wealth in Europe (after Luxembourg).


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OfflineBrian Jones
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Re: Americans Work 25% More Than Europeans, Study Finds [Re: Falcon91Wolvrn03] * 4
    #23751149 - 10/19/16 05:11 AM (7 years, 3 months ago)

Yes, this has been going on for a long time. They have huge vacation time and shorter work weeks.


    I do know the conservatives here  keep ranting and preaching that we have to work ourselves to death or we will never have a roof over our heads or medical care, and that the Social Democracies in Europe will collapse any minute.

    I have admired those foreign economies and ideologies for decades. And we all have our ups and downs, but on average they are now more or less, no more collapsing than we are. Maybe they learned their lesson from two world wars that cost them far more lives than us. They seem to have learned to avoid wars.

    I don't pretend to know enough about economics (and I'm not sure any experts know enough to answer this question), but it seems like war can be an economic stimulus in the short run, maybe, but after 60 or 70 years, what can it be but a drain on the economy.

    In any case, Go Europe! Teach our workers a lesson and maybe at some point it will sink in here.


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Offlineqman
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Re: Americans Work 25% More Than Europeans, Study Finds [Re: Brian Jones]
    #23751338 - 10/19/16 08:13 AM (7 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

Brian Jones said:
Yes, this has been going on for a long time. They have huge vacation time and shorter work weeks.


    I do know the conservatives here  keep ranting and preaching that we have to work ourselves to death or we will never have a roof over our heads or medical care, and that the Social Democracies in Europe will collapse any minute.

    I have admired those foreign economies and ideologies for decades. And we all have our ups and downs, but on average they are now more or less, no more collapsing than we are. Maybe they learned their lesson from two world wars that cost them far more lives than us. They seem to have learned to avoid wars.

    I don't pretend to know enough about economics (and I'm not sure any experts know enough to answer this question), but it seems like war can be an economic stimulus in the short run, maybe, but after 60 or 70 years, what can it be but a drain on the economy.

    In any case, Go Europe! Teach our workers a lesson and maybe at some point it will sink in here.




"They seem to have learned to avoid wars"

Or paying for their own military defense, thanks to US taxpayers they are getting a massive discount.  BTW, Trump mentioned this needs to change.  This is the reason why EU citizens can take vacations.

"war can be an economic stimulus"

Depends, pissing money away on tanks and jets while losing the "cause" is a horrible return on investment.

"I have admired those foreign economies and ideologies for decades"

They had a good run, but the EU is in very big social-economic trouble today, it's going to fall apart.


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OfflineFalcon91Wolvrn03
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Re: Americans Work 25% More Than Europeans, Study Finds [Re: qman] * 5
    #23751504 - 10/19/16 09:45 AM (7 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

qman said:
They had a good run, but the EU is in very big social-economic trouble today, it's going to fall apart.



You know, I've been arguing with conservatives for decades now, and they always say the same thing:  Liberal policies appear to be working better now (see Europe), but you just wait... that's all temporary.  Failed conservative policies (like trickle down) will win out in the end.

I'm still waiting... and waiting.


We have empirical evidence showing that the most successful cities in our states are liberal.  The most successful states in our country are liberal.  And the most successful countries in our world are liberal.  Yet conservatives keep warning - "you just wait!"  :whatever:


Now it's time for conservative to cherry pick a few counter examples...


--------------------
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Offlineqman
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Re: Americans Work 25% More Than Europeans, Study Finds [Re: Falcon91Wolvrn03]
    #23751519 - 10/19/16 09:54 AM (7 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

Falcon91Wolvrn03 said:
Quote:

qman said:
They had a good run, but the EU is in very big social-economic trouble today, it's going to fall apart.



You know, I've been arguing with conservatives for decades now, and they always say the same thing:  Liberal policies appear to be working better now (see Europe), but you just wait... that's all temporary.  Failed conservative policies (like trickle down) will win out in the end.

I'm still waiting... and waiting.


We have empirical evidence showing that the most successful cities in our states are liberal.  The most successful states in our country are liberal.  And the most successful countries in our world are liberal.  Yet conservatives keep warning - "you just wait!"  :whatever:




Did you not witness the Brexit a few months ago?

Will the US be able to provide free military security for the EU forever?

Will the EU nations be on the same page when the next financial crisis rocks their continent?

What will happen to the social services when these insolvent EU nations face economic reality?

Nobody is suggesting that "trick down" is the solution, I don't know why you always jump to the conclusion?

Yes, successful states do have the luxury of having social safety nets, how did they get successful in the first place?  Because they're winners on the global chess board.


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InvisibleballsalsaMDiscord
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Re: Americans Work 25% More Than Europeans, Study Finds [Re: qman] * 2
    #23751550 - 10/19/16 10:07 AM (7 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

Nobody is suggesting that "trick(le) down" is the solution, I don't know why you always jump to the conclusion?





maybe its because you won't post where you stand on the issues in the issues thread.


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OfflinePatlal
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Re: Americans Work 25% More Than Europeans, Study Finds [Re: ballsalsa] * 2
    #23751574 - 10/19/16 10:14 AM (7 years, 3 months ago)

If you guys work 25% more than European, why is there so much work left to do in your country?


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Offlineqman
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Re: Americans Work 25% More Than Europeans, Study Finds [Re: ballsalsa]
    #23751586 - 10/19/16 10:20 AM (7 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

ballsalsa said:
Quote:

Nobody is suggesting that "trick(le) down" is the solution, I don't know why you always jump to the conclusion?





maybe its because you won't post where you stand on the issues in the issues thread.




That hardly justifies labeling others because they challenge your outlook on a certain issue. :lol:

I have posted my stance on issues plenty of times, I don't find it necessary to be a card carrying member of those stances. :shrug:


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InvisibleballsalsaMDiscord
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Re: Americans Work 25% More Than Europeans, Study Finds [Re: qman] * 4
    #23751591 - 10/19/16 10:22 AM (7 years, 3 months ago)

if you play coy about it, people are gonna ascribe to you the stances that they perceive based on your posts. :shrug:


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Offlineqman
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Re: Americans Work 25% More Than Europeans, Study Finds [Re: Patlal]
    #23751604 - 10/19/16 10:27 AM (7 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

Patlal said:
If you guys work 25% more than European, why is there so much work left to do in your country?




Because companies would rather hire 10 people not taking more than 2 weeks vacation rather than 12 people taking 6-8 weeks in vacation.


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OfflineFalcon91Wolvrn03
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Re: Americans Work 25% More Than Europeans, Study Finds [Re: qman] * 2
    #23751843 - 10/19/16 12:07 PM (7 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

qman said:
Quote:

Falcon91Wolvrn03 said:
We have empirical evidence showing that the most successful cities in our states are liberal.  The most successful states in our country are liberal.  And the most successful countries in our world are liberal.  Yet conservatives keep warning - "you just wait!"  :whatever:



Did you not witness the Brexit a few months ago?



You mean the vote that caused the British Pound to plummet from $1.48 to $1.22:

https://www.google.com/finance?chdnp=1&chdd=1&chds=1&chdv=1&chvs=Linear&chdeh=0&chfdeh=0&chdet=1476900265095&chddm=285867&q=CURRENCY:GBPUSD&ntsp=0&ei=prUHWOG5DMnKmAG_kJBg

So what about Brexit???

Quote:

qman said:
What will happen to the social services when these insolvent EU nations face economic reality?



What insolvent nations are you talking about?  More "you just wait... one of these days my side will be right" nonsense.

Quote:

qman said:
Quote:

ballsalsa said:
Quote:

qman said:
Nobody is suggesting that "trick down" is the solution, I don't know why you always jump to the conclusion?



maybe its because you won't post where you stand on the issues in the issues thread.



I have posted my stance on issues plenty of times



Then PLEASE CLARIFY - Do you support a higher effective tax on the super rich or don't you???  I'm very confused about your position on this.

Quote:

qman said:
Yes, successful states do have the luxury of having social safety nets, how did they get successful in the first place?



Because of liberal economic policies.


--------------------
I am in a minority on the shroomery, as I frequently defend the opposing side when they have a point about something or when my side make believes something about them.  I also attack my side if I think they're wrong.  People here get very confused by that and think it means I prefer the other side.


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OfflineCrackingTheCode
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Re: Americans Work 25% More Than Europeans, Study Finds [Re: Falcon91Wolvrn03]
    #23752502 - 10/19/16 04:36 PM (7 years, 3 months ago)

I hate to be the one to inform you but the both the US and Europe are on the verge of going into the next recession and I think it's going to be a big one.


And this recession is being driven by liberal economic policies and (the big one) central banking.


Don't get me wrong, the conservatives fucked up too. We spend $100B annually to maintain our 800 over-seas military bases around the globe. The great holdover of our strategy to "contain" those evil Soviets.


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OfflineFalcon91Wolvrn03
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Re: Americans Work 25% More Than Europeans, Study Finds [Re: CrackingTheCode] * 3
    #23752865 - 10/19/16 06:52 PM (7 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

CrackingTheCode said:
I hate to be the one to inform you but the both the US and Europe are on the verge of going into the next recession and I think it's going to be a big one.



What makes you think that?  :shrug:


--------------------
I am in a minority on the shroomery, as I frequently defend the opposing side when they have a point about something or when my side make believes something about them.  I also attack my side if I think they're wrong.  People here get very confused by that and think it means I prefer the other side.


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OfflineCrackingTheCode
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Re: Americans Work 25% More Than Europeans, Study Finds [Re: Falcon91Wolvrn03] * 1
    #23754413 - 10/20/16 10:12 AM (7 years, 3 months ago)

Just look at the economy in the US and Europe.

The well paying middle class jobs are gone and have been replaced with service industry work. But in leftist America, "a job is a job" so the job you get at McDonalds is on the same standing as the engineering job.

Every month, we're at the lowest labor participation rate of the last 40+ years. (fewest % of working age Americans actually working)

Look at our stock market "appreciation" in relation to the Federal reserve balance sheet. The central banks (Fed and ECB in particular) have been propping up the stock and bond market, simultaneously, for years now.

What a lot of people don't seem to grasp this time around is the years of central bank "intervention" is there's going to be a price to pay. America, this is how you loose your country and thus your freedom.

What this chart shows is the "wealth" in the US in relation to GDP growth. It illustrates the current and preceding two bubbles, which always appear in the "growth" of assets". All you need to do is ask how can your wealth vastly out-pace your production? (answer: it can't, unless you're cooking the books)



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Offlineviktor
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Re: Americans Work 25% More Than Europeans, Study Finds [Re: qman] * 5
    #23754453 - 10/20/16 10:34 AM (7 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

qman said:

Or paying for their own military defense, thanks to US taxpayers they are getting a massive discount.  BTW, Trump mentioned this needs to change.  This is the reason why EU citizens can take vacations.




What absolute crap. Americans get small vacations because they have been completely and utterly cucked by their ruling class, for whom they will do absolutely anything.

Europeans have long holidays because they refuse to accept shitty working conditions. Unlike Americans, who will happily get fucked up the arse by their bosses as long as no-one calls them a socialist.


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Offlineqman
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Re: Americans Work 25% More Than Europeans, Study Finds [Re: Falcon91Wolvrn03]
    #23754531 - 10/20/16 11:03 AM (7 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

Falcon91Wolvrn03 said:
Quote:

qman said:
Quote:

Falcon91Wolvrn03 said:
We have empirical evidence showing that the most successful cities in our states are liberal.  The most successful states in our country are liberal.  And the most successful countries in our world are liberal.  Yet conservatives keep warning - "you just wait!"  :whatever:



Did you not witness the Brexit a few months ago?



You mean the vote that caused the British Pound to plummet from $1.48 to $1.22:

https://www.google.com/finance?chdnp=1&chdd=1&chds=1&chdv=1&chvs=Linear&chdeh=0&chfdeh=0&chdet=1476900265095&chddm=285867&q=CURRENCY:GBPUSD&ntsp=0&ei=prUHWOG5DMnKmAG_kJBg

So what about Brexit???

Quote:

qman said:
What will happen to the social services when these insolvent EU nations face economic reality?



What insolvent nations are you talking about?  More "you just wait... one of these days my side will be right" nonsense.

Quote:

qman said:
Quote:

ballsalsa said:
Quote:

qman said:
Nobody is suggesting that "trick down" is the solution, I don't know why you always jump to the conclusion?



maybe its because you won't post where you stand on the issues in the issues thread.



I have posted my stance on issues plenty of times



Then PLEASE CLARIFY - Do you support a higher effective tax on the super rich or don't you???  I'm very confused about your position on this.

Quote:

qman said:
Yes, successful states do have the luxury of having social safety nets, how did they get successful in the first place?



Because of liberal economic policies.




"What insolvent nations are you talking about?"

Playing dumb again? http://ec.europa.eu/eurostat/documents/2995521/6923259/2-22072015-AP-EN.pdf/bf173a0e-0eba-4ab9-878c-6db8d1f6452b ; http://www.tradingeconomics.com/euro-area/government-debt-to-gdp

Shall they make taxes even higher?  :rofl2:

"Do you support a higher effective tax rate on the super rich?"

Sure, but will it bring in more tax revenue?  History tells us it won't matter, I prefer pro-growth policies.  Most rich people don't voluntarily give their money away.


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Offlineqman
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Re: Americans Work 25% More Than Europeans, Study Finds [Re: viktor]
    #23754539 - 10/20/16 11:07 AM (7 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

viktor said:
Quote:

qman said:

Or paying for their own military defense, thanks to US taxpayers they are getting a massive discount.  BTW, Trump mentioned this needs to change.  This is the reason why EU citizens can take vacations.




What absolute crap. Americans get small vacations because they have been completely and utterly cucked by their ruling class, for whom they will do absolutely anything.

Europeans have long holidays because they refuse to accept shitty working conditions. Unlike Americans, who will happily get fucked up the arse by their bosses as long as no-one calls them a socialist.




You think not being taxed hundreds of billion of Euros every year for military defense doesn't serve as a massive social service advantage?  Guess what, if those companies and individuals pay 25% more in taxes for funding their own defense, those long paid vacations are toast.


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InvisibleDividedQuantumM
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Re: Americans Work 25% More Than Europeans, Study Finds [Re: CrackingTheCode]
    #23755437 - 10/20/16 04:25 PM (7 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

CrackingTheCode said:
Just look at the economy in the US and Europe.

The well paying middle class jobs are gone and have been replaced with service industry work. But in leftist America, "a job is a job" so the job you get at McDonalds is on the same standing as the engineering job.

Every month, we're at the lowest labor participation rate of the last 40+ years. (fewest % of working age Americans actually working)

Look at our stock market "appreciation" in relation to the Federal reserve balance sheet. The central banks (Fed and ECB in particular) have been propping up the stock and bond market, simultaneously, for years now.

What a lot of people don't seem to grasp this time around is the years of central bank "intervention" is there's going to be a price to pay. America, this is how you loose your country and thus your freedom.

What this chart shows is the "wealth" in the US in relation to GDP growth. It illustrates the current and preceding two bubbles, which always appear in the "growth" of assets". All you need to do is ask how can your wealth vastly out-pace your production? (answer: it can't, unless you're cooking the books)







"It is much to be wished  that every discouragement should be thrown in the way of men who undertake to trade without capital.  The consumers pay for it in the end, and the debts contracted, and bankruptcies occasioned by such commercial adventurers, bring burden and disgrace on our country."  --Thomas Jefferson


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Offlineblingbling
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Re: Americans Work 25% More Than Europeans, Study Finds [Re: viktor] * 1
    #23756089 - 10/20/16 08:44 PM (7 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

viktor said:
Quote:

qman said:

Or paying for their own military defense, thanks to US taxpayers they are getting a massive discount.  BTW, Trump mentioned this needs to change.  This is the reason why EU citizens can take vacations.




What absolute crap. Americans get small vacations because they have been completely and utterly cucked by their ruling class, for whom they will do absolutely anything.

Europeans have long holidays because they refuse to accept shitty working conditions. Unlike Americans, who will happily get fucked up the arse by their bosses as long as no-one calls them a socialist.




One of my friends that went to america says you guys get 2 weeks holiday per year. Is that true? Because if it is that's pretty fucked.

I live in Australia and I get 5. My girlfriend is a nurse so she gets 6.


--------------------
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let's fuel the robots with psilocybin.

cez said:
everyone should smoke dmt for religion.

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euthanasia and prostitution should be legal and located in the same building.

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if you see the buddha on the road, rape him, then kill him. then rape him again.


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Offlineviktor
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Re: Americans Work 25% More Than Europeans, Study Finds [Re: qman] * 3
    #23756168 - 10/20/16 09:05 PM (7 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

qman said:
Quote:

viktor said:
Quote:

qman said:

Or paying for their own military defense, thanks to US taxpayers they are getting a massive discount.  BTW, Trump mentioned this needs to change.  This is the reason why EU citizens can take vacations.




What absolute crap. Americans get small vacations because they have been completely and utterly cucked by their ruling class, for whom they will do absolutely anything.

Europeans have long holidays because they refuse to accept shitty working conditions. Unlike Americans, who will happily get fucked up the arse by their bosses as long as no-one calls them a socialist.




You think not being taxed hundreds of billion of Euros every year for military defense doesn't serve as a massive social service advantage?  Guess what, if those companies and individuals pay 25% more in taxes for funding their own defense, those long paid vacations are toast.




Europeans don't need to spend money on defence - they have nuclear weapons.

America only spends as much as it does on defence because its a worldwide empire that wants to project power everywhere at any time.

90% of USA defence spending is entirely unnecessary and mostly a matter of corrupt government shovelling money into the pockets of defence contractors.

The idea that Europe is letting the team down by not pissing away similar amounts of money is ludicrous and can only come from media brainwashing.


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Offlineviktor
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Re: Americans Work 25% More Than Europeans, Study Finds [Re: blingbling] * 1
    #23756174 - 10/20/16 09:06 PM (7 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

blingbling said:
Quote:

viktor said:
Quote:

qman said:

Or paying for their own military defense, thanks to US taxpayers they are getting a massive discount.  BTW, Trump mentioned this needs to change.  This is the reason why EU citizens can take vacations.




What absolute crap. Americans get small vacations because they have been completely and utterly cucked by their ruling class, for whom they will do absolutely anything.

Europeans have long holidays because they refuse to accept shitty working conditions. Unlike Americans, who will happily get fucked up the arse by their bosses as long as no-one calls them a socialist.




One of my friends that went to america says you guys get 2 weeks holiday per year. Is that true? Because if it is that's pretty fucked.

I live in Australia and I get 5. My girlfriend is a nurse so she gets 6.




I'm a Kiwi so for me it's 4 or 5 I think. Yeah America is two, I can't believe that they put up with that. Not enough time to properly live because the capital classes have their bitches out working all day.


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InvisibleballsalsaMDiscord
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Re: Americans Work 25% More Than Europeans, Study Finds [Re: blingbling]
    #23756238 - 10/20/16 09:32 PM (7 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

blingbling said:
Quote:

viktor said:
Quote:

qman said:

Or paying for their own military defense, thanks to US taxpayers they are getting a massive discount.  BTW, Trump mentioned this needs to change.  This is the reason why EU citizens can take vacations.




What absolute crap. Americans get small vacations because they have been completely and utterly cucked by their ruling class, for whom they will do absolutely anything.

Europeans have long holidays because they refuse to accept shitty working conditions. Unlike Americans, who will happily get fucked up the arse by their bosses as long as no-one calls them a socialist.




One of my friends that went to america says you guys get 2 weeks holiday per year. Is that true? Because if it is that's pretty fucked.

I live in Australia and I get 5. My girlfriend is a nurse so she gets 6.





2 weeks if you have a decent job.  It helps to be in a union.  At the shitty job i'm working while I go back to school, I get 24 hours paid sick leave per year.  That's it. There are many Americans with no paid time off from work and no medical or dental insurance.


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Offlineblingbling
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Re: Americans Work 25% More Than Europeans, Study Finds [Re: viktor]
    #23756250 - 10/20/16 09:35 PM (7 years, 3 months ago)

Yeah, we need to make sure that kind of thinking doesn't infect australasia otherwise we're fucked too.


--------------------
Kupo said:
let's fuel the robots with psilocybin.

cez said:
everyone should smoke dmt for religion.

dustinthewind13 said:
euthanasia and prostitution should be legal and located in the same building.

White Beard said:
if you see the buddha on the road, rape him, then kill him. then rape him again.


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Offlineblingbling
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Re: Americans Work 25% More Than Europeans, Study Finds [Re: ballsalsa]
    #23756254 - 10/20/16 09:36 PM (7 years, 3 months ago)

Man you guys get screwed. Too bad that people just think "well, that's the way things are" and don't try to change it.


--------------------
Kupo said:
let's fuel the robots with psilocybin.

cez said:
everyone should smoke dmt for religion.

dustinthewind13 said:
euthanasia and prostitution should be legal and located in the same building.

White Beard said:
if you see the buddha on the road, rape him, then kill him. then rape him again.


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InvisibleballsalsaMDiscord
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Re: Americans Work 25% More Than Europeans, Study Finds [Re: blingbling]
    #23756272 - 10/20/16 09:44 PM (7 years, 3 months ago)

yeah, most people are just treading water and hoping that they don't drown.  Not much time for changing things when you are busy trying to find a way to not get evicted from your house, put gas in your truck, and hopefully, eat.  Unless by trying to change things, you meant voting.  In that case, people i know vote all the time.  Never seems to change anything though.


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Offlineblingbling
what you chicken stew?

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Re: Americans Work 25% More Than Europeans, Study Finds [Re: ballsalsa]
    #23756287 - 10/20/16 09:48 PM (7 years, 3 months ago)

That's probably why your electoral system is going haywire.


--------------------
Kupo said:
let's fuel the robots with psilocybin.

cez said:
everyone should smoke dmt for religion.

dustinthewind13 said:
euthanasia and prostitution should be legal and located in the same building.

White Beard said:
if you see the buddha on the road, rape him, then kill him. then rape him again.


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Offlineviktor
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Re: Americans Work 25% More Than Europeans, Study Finds [Re: blingbling]
    #23756296 - 10/20/16 09:52 PM (7 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

blingbling said:
Yeah, we need to make sure that kind of thinking doesn't infect australasia otherwise we're fucked too.




I don't think it will. There is no other Western country that has two weeks of holiday, I don't know of any that have less than four. When I lived in Sweden it was six, that was really nice because it gave you the time to do a decent bit of travelling on the continent.

Countries don't seem to go backwards on number of holiday weeks, only forwards.

Americans probably wouldn't go travelling even with more holidays because they don't get paid enough in the first place.


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InvisibleballsalsaMDiscord
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Re: Americans Work 25% More Than Europeans, Study Finds [Re: blingbling]
    #23756299 - 10/20/16 09:53 PM (7 years, 3 months ago)

probably


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OfflineEzuma
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Re: Americans Work 25% More Than Europeans, Study Finds [Re: blingbling]
    #23756441 - 10/20/16 10:52 PM (7 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

blingbling said:
Quote:

viktor said:
Quote:

qman said:

Or paying for their own military defense, thanks to US taxpayers they are getting a massive discount.  BTW, Trump mentioned this needs to change.  This is the reason why EU citizens can take vacations.




What absolute crap. Americans get small vacations because they have been completely and utterly cucked by their ruling class, for whom they will do absolutely anything.

Europeans have long holidays because they refuse to accept shitty working conditions. Unlike Americans, who will happily get fucked up the arse by their bosses as long as no-one calls them a socialist.




One of my friends that went to america says you guys get 2 weeks holiday per year. Is that true? Because if it is that's pretty fucked.

I live in Australia and I get 5. My girlfriend is a nurse so she gets 6.




sadly we try to be americans here in canada, for god knows what reason, two-3 weeks holiday for office type jobs. If you work for the government of course you get oodles of time off, or schools


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Re: Americans Work 25% More Than Europeans, Study Finds [Re: viktor]
    #23757324 - 10/21/16 08:40 AM (7 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

viktor said:
Quote:

qman said:
Quote:

viktor said:
Quote:

qman said:

Or paying for their own military defense, thanks to US taxpayers they are getting a massive discount.  BTW, Trump mentioned this needs to change.  This is the reason why EU citizens can take vacations.




What absolute crap. Americans get small vacations because they have been completely and utterly cucked by their ruling class, for whom they will do absolutely anything.

Europeans have long holidays because they refuse to accept shitty working conditions. Unlike Americans, who will happily get fucked up the arse by their bosses as long as no-one calls them a socialist.




You think not being taxed hundreds of billion of Euros every year for military defense doesn't serve as a massive social service advantage?  Guess what, if those companies and individuals pay 25% more in taxes for funding their own defense, those long paid vacations are toast.




Europeans don't need to spend money on defence - they have nuclear weapons.

America only spends as much as it does on defence because its a worldwide empire that wants to project power everywhere at any time.

90% of USA defence spending is entirely unnecessary and mostly a matter of corrupt government shovelling money into the pockets of defence contractors.

The idea that Europe is letting the team down by not pissing away similar amounts of money is ludicrous and can only come from media brainwashing.





"they have nuclear weapons"

Then why do they seek the protection of the US?  Nuclear weapons don't work in conventional warfare.

I not saying the US doesn't piss away money on "defense", but in the real world military power makes the rules.


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Invisiblerelic
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Re: Americans Work 25% More Than Europeans, Study Finds [Re: qman] * 1
    #23757591 - 10/21/16 10:23 AM (7 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

qman said:

"they have nuclear weapons"

Then why do they seek the protection of the US?  Nuclear weapons don't work in conventional warfare.

I not saying the US doesn't piss away money on "defense", but in the real world military power makes the rules.




it's not so much that they seek protection by the US. it's that they're happy to let the US play Globocop since they get their cake and eat it, too.  they get to spend less on defense and get to show righteous indignation so their constituents stay satiated.

the broader point has been argued repeatedly by retired conservative military personnel.


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OfflineFalcon91Wolvrn03
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Re: Americans Work 25% More Than Europeans, Study Finds [Re: CrackingTheCode] * 1
    #23772175 - 10/26/16 02:22 AM (7 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

CrackingTheCode said:
Quote:

Falcon91Wolvrn03 said:
Quote:

CrackingTheCode said:
I hate to be the one to inform you but the both the US and Europe are on the verge of going into the next recession and I think it's going to be a big one.



What makes you think that?  :shrug:



Just look at the economy in the US and Europe.

The well paying middle class jobs are gone and have been replaced with service industry work. But in leftist America, "a job is a job" so the job you get at McDonalds is on the same standing as the engineering job.



The American left does not believe a McDonalds job is on the same standing as an engineering job.

Quote:

CrackingTheCode said:
Every month, we're at the lowest labor participation rate of the last 40+ years. (fewest % of working age Americans actually working)



So more people are going to college - big deal.  What's important is unemployment, and that's back to normal (including U6 unemployment).

Quote:

CrackingTheCode said:
Look at our stock market "appreciation" in relation to the Federal reserve balance sheet. The central banks (Fed and ECB in particular) have been propping up the stock and bond market, simultaneously, for years now.

What a lot of people don't seem to grasp this time around is the years of central bank "intervention" is there's going to be a price to pay. America, this is how you loose your country and thus your freedom.



Why?  Because you say so???  :shrug:

Quote:

CrackingTheCode said:
What this chart shows is the "wealth" in the US in relation to GDP growth. It illustrates the current and preceding two bubbles, which always appear in the "growth" of assets". All you need to do is ask how can your wealth vastly out-pace your production? (answer: it can't, unless you're cooking the books)





That's an interesting chart, but to answer your question of how wealth is growing faster than GDP, one reason could be Quantitative Easing.  The Fed created trillions of dollars and threw it into the economy, so household wealth should go up faster than GDP.


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Re: Americans Work 25% More Than Europeans, Study Finds [Re: viktor] * 1
    #23772178 - 10/26/16 02:24 AM (7 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

viktor said:
Quote:

qman said:

Or paying for their own military defense, thanks to US taxpayers they are getting a massive discount.  BTW, Trump mentioned this needs to change.  This is the reason why EU citizens can take vacations.




What absolute crap. Americans get small vacations because they have been completely and utterly cucked by their ruling class, for whom they will do absolutely anything.

Europeans have long holidays because they refuse to accept shitty working conditions. Unlike Americans, who will happily get fucked up the arse by their bosses as long as no-one calls them a socialist.



Well said!  You got five 'up-votes' on that comment.  :thumbup:


--------------------
I am in a minority on the shroomery, as I frequently defend the opposing side when they have a point about something or when my side make believes something about them.  I also attack my side if I think they're wrong.  People here get very confused by that and think it means I prefer the other side.


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Invisiblehowsyournaggerdoin
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Re: Americans Work 25% More Than Europeans, Study Finds [Re: Falcon91Wolvrn03]
    #23772188 - 10/26/16 02:41 AM (7 years, 3 months ago)

I work 35 hours a week and get 31 days of vacation a year. murrica is truly fucked


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OfflineFalcon91Wolvrn03
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Re: Americans Work 25% More Than Europeans, Study Finds [Re: qman] * 1
    #23772235 - 10/26/16 03:25 AM (7 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

qman said:
Quote:

Falcon91Wolvrn03 said:
What insolvent nations are you talking about?



Playing dumb again? http://ec.europa.eu/eurostat/documents/2995521/6923259/2-22072015-AP-EN.pdf/bf173a0e-0eba-4ab9-878c-6db8d1f6452b ; http://www.tradingeconomics.com/euro-area/government-debt-to-gdp



I missed the part about European nations going insolvent.  Can you quote it for me?

Quote:

qman said:
Quote:

Falcon91Wolvrn03 said:
Do you support a higher effective tax rate on the super rich?



Sure, but will it bring in more tax revenue?  History tells us it won't matter, I prefer pro-growth policies.



WRONG!!!  History shows tax revenue went WAY up in the early 1940s when the marginal tax rate went way up:



--------------------
I am in a minority on the shroomery, as I frequently defend the opposing side when they have a point about something or when my side make believes something about them.  I also attack my side if I think they're wrong.  People here get very confused by that and think it means I prefer the other side.


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Offlineqman
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Re: Americans Work 25% More Than Europeans, Study Finds [Re: Falcon91Wolvrn03]
    #23772551 - 10/26/16 08:13 AM (7 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

Falcon91Wolvrn03 said:
Quote:

qman said:
Quote:

Falcon91Wolvrn03 said:
What insolvent nations are you talking about?



Playing dumb again? http://ec.europa.eu/eurostat/documents/2995521/6923259/2-22072015-AP-EN.pdf/bf173a0e-0eba-4ab9-878c-6db8d1f6452b ; http://www.tradingeconomics.com/euro-area/government-debt-to-gdp



I missed the part about European nations going insolvent.  Can you quote it for me?

Quote:

qman said:
Quote:

Falcon91Wolvrn03 said:
Do you support a higher effective tax rate on the super rich?



Sure, but will it bring in more tax revenue?  History tells us it won't matter, I prefer pro-growth policies.



WRONG!!!  History shows tax revenue went WAY up in the early 1940s when the marginal tax rate went way up:






Great chart, they started FINALLY to collect taxes, what's your point?  It remained consistent relative to GDP REGARDLESS of the tax rate.


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OfflineFalcon91Wolvrn03
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Re: Americans Work 25% More Than Europeans, Study Finds [Re: qman] * 1
    #23772814 - 10/26/16 09:58 AM (7 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

qman said:
Quote:

Falcon91Wolvrn03 said:
WRONG!!!  History shows tax revenue went WAY up in the early 1940s when the marginal tax rate went way up:






Great chart, they started FINALLY to collect taxes, what's your point?  It remained consistent relative to GDP REGARDLESS of the tax rate.



WRONG again!!!  They started collecting income taxes in 1913.  When they raised the rates, they got way more revenue.  Over time, they cut the rates on the rich, shifting the tax burden to the middle class.

It's time to shift the tax burden back onto the rich once again and off the backs of the middle class.


--------------------
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Re: Americans Work 25% More Than Europeans, Study Finds [Re: Falcon91Wolvrn03]
    #23772878 - 10/26/16 10:18 AM (7 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

Falcon91Wolvrn03 said:
Quote:

qman said:
Quote:

Falcon91Wolvrn03 said:
WRONG!!!  History shows tax revenue went WAY up in the early 1940s when the marginal tax rate went way up:






Great chart, they started FINALLY to collect taxes, what's your point?  It remained consistent relative to GDP REGARDLESS of the tax rate.



WRONG again!!!  They started collecting income taxes in 1913.  When they raised the rates, they got way more revenue.  Over time, they cut the rates on the rich, shifting the tax burden to the middle class.

It's time to shift the tax burden back onto the rich once again and off the backs of the middle class.




"They started collecting income taxes in 1913"

That's true, but "during World War ll Congress introduced payroll withholding". https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Taxation_history_of_the_United_States

"time to shift the tax burden back to the rich once again"

That's not going to happen and even if it was attempted it's not likely to work, the elites aren't going to burden themselves with the debt issue, it will be placed on the working class.  My suggestion to people, stop whining about what SHOULD happen and prepare oneself for what is LIKELY going to happen.


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OfflineFalcon91Wolvrn03
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Re: Americans Work 25% More Than Europeans, Study Finds [Re: qman] * 1
    #23772964 - 10/26/16 10:59 AM (7 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

qman said:
Quote:

Falcon91Wolvrn03 said:
They started collecting income taxes in 1913



That's true, but "during World War ll Congress introduced payroll withholding". https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Taxation_history_of_the_United_States



That wouldn't change the taxes owed to the Government.

Quote:

qman said:
Quote:

Falcon91Wolvrn03 said:
time to shift the tax burden back to the rich once again



That's not going to happen and even if it was attempted it's not likely to work, the elites aren't going to burden themselves with the debt issue, it will be placed on the working class.  My suggestion to people, stop whining about what SHOULD happen and prepare oneself for what is LIKELY going to happen.



My suggestion to people is to vote for people who will do something about it.  Which is NOT republicans.


--------------------
I am in a minority on the shroomery, as I frequently defend the opposing side when they have a point about something or when my side make believes something about them.  I also attack my side if I think they're wrong.  People here get very confused by that and think it means I prefer the other side.


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Re: Americans Work 25% More Than Europeans, Study Finds [Re: Falcon91Wolvrn03]
    #23772982 - 10/26/16 11:08 AM (7 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

Falcon91Wolvrn03 said:
Quote:

qman said:
Quote:

Falcon91Wolvrn03 said:
They started collecting income taxes in 1913



That's true, but "during World War ll Congress introduced payroll withholding". https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Taxation_history_of_the_United_States



That wouldn't change the taxes owed to the Government.

Quote:

qman said:
Quote:

Falcon91Wolvrn03 said:
time to shift the tax burden back to the rich once again



That's not going to happen and even if it was attempted it's not likely to work, the elites aren't going to burden themselves with the debt issue, it will be placed on the working class.  My suggestion to people, stop whining about what SHOULD happen and prepare oneself for what is LIKELY going to happen.



My suggestion to people is to vote for people who will do something about it.  Which is NOT republicans.




Or Democrats! :cookiemonster:


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OfflineFalcon91Wolvrn03
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Re: Americans Work 25% More Than Europeans, Study Finds [Re: qman] * 1
    #23773002 - 10/26/16 11:18 AM (7 years, 3 months ago)

Democrats can do it if they win both the House and Senate.


--------------------
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Re: Americans Work 25% More Than Europeans, Study Finds [Re: Falcon91Wolvrn03]
    #23773027 - 10/26/16 11:30 AM (7 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

Falcon91Wolvrn03 said:
Democrats can do it if they win both the House and Senate.




So you're counting on the same bought and paid for Democratic Congressmen that voted and passed the ACA? :rofl2:  I admire your optimism.


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OfflineFalcon91Wolvrn03
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Re: Americans Work 25% More Than Europeans, Study Finds [Re: qman] * 1
    #23773129 - 10/26/16 12:20 PM (7 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

qman said:
So you're counting on the same bought and paid for Democratic Congressmen that voted and passed the ACA? :rofl2:  I admire your optimism.



Do you think there's a better chance that Republicans would pass a tax increase on the super rich?  :rofl2:


--------------------
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Re: Americans Work 25% More Than Europeans, Study Finds [Re: Falcon91Wolvrn03] * 3
    #23773144 - 10/26/16 12:25 PM (7 years, 3 months ago)

qman again scapegoating Dems to deflect from his extremely flawed socioeconomic philosophy.


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Re: Americans Work 25% More Than Europeans, Study Finds [Re: The Ecstatic]
    #23773306 - 10/26/16 01:22 PM (7 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

The Ecstatic said:
qman again scapegoating Dems to deflect from his extremely flawed socioeconomic philosophy.




Yeah, letting in tens of millions of illegal workers and exporting millions of high quality manufacturing jobs has worked out so well the past 35 years. :facepalm:

I want to reverse that outcome, begging the government to give you more is a lost cause, we need to change our labor markets for the benefit of US citizens, not the top .01%.

Hiking the minimum wage is not a long term solution for the working class, it's nothing more than a bandaid on a gunshot wound.


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Re: Americans Work 25% More Than Europeans, Study Finds [Re: Falcon91Wolvrn03]
    #23773316 - 10/26/16 01:25 PM (7 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

Falcon91Wolvrn03 said:
Quote:

qman said:
So you're counting on the same bought and paid for Democratic Congressmen that voted and passed the ACA? :rofl2:  I admire your optimism.



Do you think there's a better chance that Republicans would pass a tax increase on the super rich?  :rofl2:




Nope.  Like I said, make preparations instead of a holding onto the pipedream that politicians are going to start extracting money from the wealthy and all of our problems will go away, not gonna happen.


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Re: Americans Work 25% More Than Europeans, Study Finds [Re: qman] * 1
    #23773446 - 10/26/16 02:11 PM (7 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

qman said:
letting in tens of millions of illegal workers and exporting millions of high quality manufacturing jobs has worked out so well the past 35 years. :facepalm:



You have been unable to show that there is any significant correlation between illegal immigration and economic prosperity.  You have based your arguments on unsupported racism.  The fact is that in the last decade, more illegals have left the country than have come into the country, which actually appears to DISPROVE your argument.

Quote:

qman said:
I want to reverse that outcome, begging the government to give you more is a lost cause, we need to change our labor markets for the benefit of US citizens, not the top .01%.



I don't think anyone disagrees with you except you.  You want to elect people that will help the top .01% even more with greater tax cuts.


Quote:

qman said:
Hiking the minimum wage is not a long term solution for the working class, it's nothing more than a bandaid on a gunshot wound.



More than 25% of the entire country now earn LESS than the 1968 minimum wage.  A minimum wage hike wouldn't be a bandaid, it'd be open heart surgery.


--------------------
I am in a minority on the shroomery, as I frequently defend the opposing side when they have a point about something or when my side make believes something about them.  I also attack my side if I think they're wrong.  People here get very confused by that and think it means I prefer the other side.


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Offlineqman
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Re: Americans Work 25% More Than Europeans, Study Finds [Re: Falcon91Wolvrn03]
    #23773932 - 10/26/16 04:51 PM (7 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

Falcon91Wolvrn03 said:
Quote:

qman said:
letting in tens of millions of illegal workers and exporting millions of high quality manufacturing jobs has worked out so well the past 35 years. :facepalm:



You have been unable to show that there is any significant correlation between illegal immigration and economic prosperity.  You have based your arguments on unsupported racism.  The fact is that in the last decade, more illegals have left the country than have come into the country, which actually appears to DISPROVE your argument.

Quote:

qman said:
I want to reverse that outcome, begging the government to give you more is a lost cause, we need to change our labor markets for the benefit of US citizens, not the top .01%.



I don't think anyone disagrees with you except you.  You want to elect people that will help the top .01% even more with greater tax cuts.


Quote:

qman said:
Hiking the minimum wage is not a long term solution for the working class, it's nothing more than a bandaid on a gunshot wound.



More than 25% of the entire country now earn LESS than the 1968 minimum wage.  A minimum wage hike wouldn't be a bandaid, it'd be open heart surgery.




"more illegals have left...appears to DISPROVE your argument"

:facepalm:  Yeah, the outflow of 140,000 relative to 16 MILLION illegals disproves the facts, what a joke. http://www.nytimes.com/2015/11/20/us/more-mexican-immigrants-leaving-us-than-entering-report-finds.html?_r=0

The inability for 25% of workers to command more than minimum wage is very telling, so is the fact that in real terms it's very low. 

If only hiking the minimum wages around the globe could create economic prosperity, it's much more complicated than making a state mandate.

Since you don't care about basic supply and demand forces, I'm not surprised you ignore these realities.


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OfflineFalcon91Wolvrn03
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Re: Americans Work 25% More Than Europeans, Study Finds [Re: qman] * 1
    #23774439 - 10/26/16 07:33 PM (7 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

qman said:
Quote:

Falcon91Wolvrn03 said:
The fact is that in the last decade, more illegals have left the country than have come into the country, which actually appears to DISPROVE your argument.



:facepalm:  Yeah, the outflow of 140,000 relative to 16 MILLION illegals disproves the facts, what a joke.



What "facts"???  The fact is that the illegal population has been declining since 2007.  You haven't shown a correlation between immigration and economic problems.  We had far more immigrants as a percent of the population in the late 1800s/early 1900s than we do today.

Quote:

qman said:
The inability for 25% of workers to command more than minimum wage is very telling, so is the fact that in real terms it's very low.



It is very telling, but the question is what is it telling of?  It's been shown to you over and over the rich are richer than ever, because they're aren't sharing their profits with their workers like they used to with strong labor unions.  The money is there, but the unions aren't (and neither is the minimum wage).

Quote:

qman said:
If only hiking the minimum wages around the globe could create economic prosperity, it's much more complicated than making a state mandate.



But reality shows it does create prosperity.  Just look at the cities with the highest minimum wages as evidence.

Quote:

qman said:
Since you don't care about basic supply and demand forces, I'm not surprised you ignore these realities.



The problem is that reality itself doesn't appear to care about supply and demand forces.  I'll ask again, do wages go down with greater unemployment or don't they?



--------------------
I am in a minority on the shroomery, as I frequently defend the opposing side when they have a point about something or when my side make believes something about them.  I also attack my side if I think they're wrong.  People here get very confused by that and think it means I prefer the other side.


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Offlineqman
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Re: Americans Work 25% More Than Europeans, Study Finds [Re: Falcon91Wolvrn03]
    #23774557 - 10/26/16 08:02 PM (7 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

Falcon91Wolvrn03 said:
Quote:

qman said:
Quote:

Falcon91Wolvrn03 said:
The fact is that in the last decade, more illegals have left the country than have come into the country, which actually appears to DISPROVE your argument.



:facepalm:  Yeah, the outflow of 140,000 relative to 16 MILLION illegals disproves the facts, what a joke.



What "facts"???  The fact is that the illegal population has been declining since 2007.  You haven't shown a correlation between immigration and economic problems.  We had far more immigrants as a percent of the population in the late 1800s/early 1900s than we do today.

Quote:

qman said:
The inability for 25% of workers to command more than minimum wage is very telling, so is the fact that in real terms it's very low.



It is very telling, but the question is what is it telling of?  It's been shown to you over and over the rich are richer than ever, because they're aren't sharing their profits with their workers like they used to with strong labor unions.  The money is there, but the unions aren't (and neither is the minimum wage).

Quote:

qman said:
If only hiking the minimum wages around the globe could create economic prosperity, it's much more complicated than making a state mandate.



But reality shows it does create prosperity.  Just look at the cities with the highest minimum wages as evidence.

Quote:

qman said:
Since you don't care about basic supply and demand forces, I'm not surprised you ignore these realities.



The problem is that reality itself doesn't appear to care about supply and demand forces.  I'll ask again, do wages go down with greater unemployment or don't they?






Yeah, immigration over a hundred years ago is the same as today. :facepalm:  There's a clear correlation between our open southern border and lower wages. What do you think happens when you flood 15 million low skilled workers into a competitive labor market?  Again, economics 101.

"aren't sharing their profits"

Companies don't share their profits, they compensate their employees at the least amount they can get away with, if there's a pile of resumes on the desk the compensation naturally remains weaker than if there's a shortage of labor, again economics 101.

https://www.statista.com/statistics/192356/number-of-full-time-employees-in-the-usa-since-1990/

http://dailycaller.com/2014/12/19/fewer-us-born-americans-have-jobs-now-than-in-2007/

Yeah, employment for the natives is just wonderful.
http://cis.org/all-employment-growth-since-2000-went-to-immigrants


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OfflineFalcon91Wolvrn03
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Re: Americans Work 25% More Than Europeans, Study Finds [Re: qman] * 1
    #23774656 - 10/26/16 08:28 PM (7 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

qman said:
Quote:

Falcon91Wolvrn03 said:
We had far more immigrants as a percent of the population in the late 1800s/early 1900s than we do today.



Yeah, immigration over a hundred years ago is the same as today. :facepalm:



No, there were MORE immigrants back then as percentage of the population.

Quote:

qman said:
There's a clear correlation between our open southern border and lower wages.



Do you have any evidence of a correlation?  If you do, you can change my mind.  :cookiemonster:

Quote:

qman said:
What do you think happens when you flood 15 million low skilled workers into a competitive labor market?  Again, economics 101.



Again, econ 101 doesn't apply here, as the real world evidence I've presented shows.

Quote:

qman said:
Quote:

Falcon91Wolvrn03 said:
the rich are richer than ever, because they're aren't sharing their profits with their workers like they used to with strong labor unions.  The money is there, but the unions aren't (and neither is the minimum wage).



Companies don't share their profits, they compensate their employees at the least amount they can get away with



Absolutely.  And if there's a strong labor union, or a high minimum wage, the 'least amount' is much greater.  And I can show a very strong correlation between union membership and the share of profits companies give to workers:



Quote:

qman said:
if there's a pile of resumes on the desk the compensation naturally remains weaker than if there's a shortage of labor, again economics 101.



I get Econ 101.  You don't get reality.  I've repeatedly shown there is currently NO correlation between wages and how tight the labor market is.

Quote:

qman said:
https://www.statista.com/statistics/192356/number-of-full-time-employees-in-the-usa-since-1990/

http://dailycaller.com/2014/12/19/fewer-us-born-americans-have-jobs-now-than-in-2007/

Yeah, employment for the natives is just wonderful.
http://cis.org/all-employment-growth-since-2000-went-to-immigrants



I've explained why labor force participation is down many, many times.  Either refute what I've said, learn what I've said, or stop repeating nonsense.

The reason labor force participation is down is because more people are going to college and more people are retiring early.  It's an irrelevant statistic.  You should look at U6 unemployment as an indicator of how tight the labor market is.


--------------------
I am in a minority on the shroomery, as I frequently defend the opposing side when they have a point about something or when my side make believes something about them.  I also attack my side if I think they're wrong.  People here get very confused by that and think it means I prefer the other side.


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InvisibleShroomismM
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Re: Americans Work 25% More Than Europeans, Study Finds [Re: blingbling] * 1
    #23774981 - 10/26/16 10:14 PM (7 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

blingbling said:
Quote:

viktor said:
Quote:

qman said:

Or paying for their own military defense, thanks to US taxpayers they are getting a massive discount.  BTW, Trump mentioned this needs to change.  This is the reason why EU citizens can take vacations.




What absolute crap. Americans get small vacations because they have been completely and utterly cucked by their ruling class, for whom they will do absolutely anything.

Europeans have long holidays because they refuse to accept shitty working conditions. Unlike Americans, who will happily get fucked up the arse by their bosses as long as no-one calls them a socialist.




One of my friends that went to america says you guys get 2 weeks holiday per year. Is that true? Because if it is that's pretty fucked.

I live in Australia and I get 5. My girlfriend is a nurse so she gets 6.




lol... 2 weeks of vacation in most US jobs is like a dream job. I don't think there is even a mandatory minimum.. it's been different at every job I've had pretty much.
It's up to the employer to decide how much vacation to give... or IF they even give vacation at all. They don't even have to offer paid vacation if they don't want to.
My current company offer 15 paid days off a year, which goes up by a day or two for every year you are there, up to like 28 days off a year. That's considered pretty fucking amazing by most people's standards. 
I've had jobs where they give you maybe 2-3 days a year, if you are lucky.
If you have 2 weeks+ of paid vacation a year in the US then you got it pretty good. Lots of places don't offer even anywhere near that much unless you've been with the company for years and years.

I also pull like 55-60 hours a week on average. They just love to overwork us. Even at "good" companies... or especially at good companies?
At least where I'm at they give us some decent paid time off and good benefits.

Americans aren't addicted to their jobs. Some are.. Most people are just trying to make ends meet paycheck to paycheck, focused on survival and trying to play catch up.
Hard to 'transform' the system when you are just worried about keeping food in the fridge or keeping the lights on.


--------------------


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Invisiblehowsyournaggerdoin
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Re: Americans Work 25% More Than Europeans, Study Finds [Re: Shroomism]
    #23775663 - 10/27/16 05:38 AM (7 years, 3 months ago)

Why dont americans join labor unions ? Are they afraid of getting fired ?


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OfflineThe Ecstatic
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Re: Americans Work 25% More Than Europeans, Study Finds [Re: howsyournaggerdoin] * 3
    #23775718 - 10/27/16 06:37 AM (7 years, 3 months ago)

A lot of American workers are against unions :facepalm:


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Invisiblehowsyournaggerdoin
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Re: Americans Work 25% More Than Europeans, Study Finds [Re: The Ecstatic] * 2
    #23775743 - 10/27/16 06:56 AM (7 years, 3 months ago)

:lolwut:


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OfflineBrian Jones
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Re: Americans Work 25% More Than Europeans, Study Finds [Re: howsyournaggerdoin] * 1
    #23775807 - 10/27/16 07:39 AM (7 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

howsyournaggerdoin said:
Why dont americans join labor unions ? Are they afraid of getting fired ?




We don't have  Labor Unions, (I don't know if you are naïve, or to use to use a more polite term "misinformed" so you can't join them.)  My last graduate degree was the 2nd  rated Labor Institute in U.S. My late father and my late older brother  were both in industrial unions which are just about as dead as they are. My younger brother  is in a craft/ tradesman Union which are doing great all the way from Chicago across the top of the U.S to at least Boston. He's going to get a pension and an annuity, and he gets 40 something scale with time and a half, and double time, and he went to high school for 10 years. His knees are fucked, but he wouldn't trade his life away for anybody else. He knew a friend  in High School, which was the friend who got him in but the father and the uncle was  a union boss. So I don't know how the the trades work here. I think if you got some talent and you work hard you can probably can get on with somebody connected in an apprenticeship and then it's all up to you. In this part of the country the trades is a good middle class living; The industrial unions are mostly dead except in a couple facilities that are still running on the South Side or in Gary/Hammond,


--------------------
"The Rolling Stones will break up over Brian Jones' dead body"    John Lennon

I don't want no commies in my car. No Christians either.

The worst thing about corruption is that it works so well,


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OfflineFalcon91Wolvrn03
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Re: Americans Work 25% More Than Europeans, Study Finds [Re: The Ecstatic] * 2
    #23776181 - 10/27/16 10:17 AM (7 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

The Ecstatic said:
Quote:

howsyournaggerdoin said:
Why dont americans join labor unions ? Are they afraid of getting fired ?



A lot of American workers are against unions :facepalm:



Yup.  Corporations hate labor unions because they have so much more negotiating power than individuals, so many corporations offered non-union workers the same pay and benefits as union workers, and workers loved that because they didn't have to pay union dues.  But as the unions lost power, so did the workers, and their pay and benefits went down over time as the chart above shows.


--------------------
I am in a minority on the shroomery, as I frequently defend the opposing side when they have a point about something or when my side make believes something about them.  I also attack my side if I think they're wrong.  People here get very confused by that and think it means I prefer the other side.


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OfflineEzuma
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Re: Americans Work 25% More Than Europeans, Study Finds [Re: howsyournaggerdoin]
    #23776358 - 10/27/16 11:18 AM (7 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

howsyournaggerdoin said:
Why dont americans join labor unions ? Are they afraid of getting fired ?




the unions have been bled dry for a long time, in Canada too they're consistently being shit on


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