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The Random Word
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Tall vs Lots of surface area monotub yields + noob questions
#23709573 - 10/05/16 11:01 AM (7 years, 3 months ago) |
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Hey there. I am an aspiring grower (spores are on the way and I have around half of my mats already acquired) and plan to start with a few runs in a smallish 15 quart bin before trying for bulk with monotubs.
My big question (also for a friend as well) is whether you will see bigger yields from an extremely tall monotub (something like this), an extremely short but long monotub (like this) or just from a normal 60ish quart tub.
I know that substrate amounts would vary on size. If someone was to make a tub out of the 112 quart tub and used say 6-7 inches of substrate, would you get numerous, nice flushes? Or for a better yield, could you do the short 60 quart with 2-3 inches of sub and 3-4 inches of grow room?
Also, I have some noob questions:
- I took a liking to the Burma strain and ordered that. Anything I should know about this particular strain?
- I was planning on using this tek for my LC, but I have been reading more and more people say that the syringes are usually pretty unclean and agar is a must. If I bought my syringe from a reputable vendor, will a LC still possibly turn out poorly? Even if I do not inoculate any spawn with my LC before I give it the OK that nothing else is growing than my myc? Either way, I will probably be moving to agar around the time of going to monotubs.
- Will adding more nutrient to my substrate (noir vs noir + poo or coffee grounds) make for a better grow for any reason? Faster colonization, larger growth, more potent, etc.?
- It is my understanding that the benefit of using a monotub is mostly less maintenance. With enough filtered holes for FAE, many have said that you don't really need to mist or fan for at least every few days (especially if using a casing layer).
Sorry if I fucked anything up with formatting, I feel like this is just a mess.
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Inocuole
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Re: Tall vs Lots of surface area monotub yields + noob questions [Re: The Random Word]
#23709602 - 10/05/16 11:12 AM (7 years, 3 months ago) |
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That second one, the short one, isn't even tall enough for anything to grow in. You could fill it up halfway with substrate and expect some super tiny mushrooms but, where are they going to grow? The first one is taller than I like personally. It's better though.
A standard mono fruiting chamber has pretty basic rectangular dimensions, a lot like two cubes sat next to each other.
https://www.walmart.com/ip/Sterilite-66-Quart-Latch-Box-Case-of-6/44786146
So like those. That's almost a good deal for a 6 pack..
Oh man just saw the rest of your post... Burma is a cube like any other cube. So, don't expect anything that conflicts with common advice. Do not start with LC, under any circumstances. LC is for after you have mastered agar. Don't add stuff to basic substrates, there's no need, and it increases risk by quite a bit.
If you're unclear on monotubs still, read this over. http://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/20307891#20307891
And maybe give this a whirl too.
http://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/19140341#19140341
Edited by Inocuole (10/05/16 11:18 AM)
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Greg
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Re: Tall vs Lots of surface area monotub yields + noob questions [Re: The Random Word]
#23709648 - 10/05/16 11:30 AM (7 years, 3 months ago) |
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Quote:
My big question (also for a friend as well) is whether you will see bigger yields from an extremely tall monotub, an extremely short but long monotub or just from a normal 60ish quart tub.
Considering the yields people get from regular tubs, I would just go with those rather than trying non-standard shapes. The short one in particular sounds like a bad idea, you need enough vertical space for the mushrooms to grow after all. I think you're overthinking this part a bit. (no offense) You should take a look at mini-monos, they're pretty neat: https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/21032606
Quote:
I took a liking to the Burma strain and ordered that. Anything I should know about this particular strain?
A cube is a cube, Burma is just another cube with plenty of potential like all the other varieties. Really it's no different from the rest.
Quote:
I was planning on using this tek for my LC, but I have been reading more and more people say that the syringes are usually pretty unclean and agar is a must. If I bought my syringe from a reputable vendor, will a LC still possibly turn out poorly? Even if I do not inoculate any spawn with my LC before I give it the OK that nothing else is growing than my myc? Either way, I will probably be moving to agar around the time of going to monotubs.
That info looks old as shit. Microwave sterilization for LC? No thanks. Mind the date it was posted, over 10 years ago. Just asking for bacteria. The reason spores to LC is bad is because spores are grown and collected in open air. Open air as you know is full of mold and bacteria. Bacteria absolutely thrives in LC. You can't see it either, usually. Sometimes it coexists with the mushroom myc and then causes issues like stalled jars and poor yields. Worst case you could even get mold in the LC and not know until it sporulates... Even the cleanest syringe shouldn't be taken straight to LC. It isn't worth the risk. Agar has many, many benefits and uses aside from cleaning up spores. I wont go in to detail here, just keep that in mind.
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Will adding more nutrient to my substrate (noir vs noir + poo or coffee grounds) make for a better grow for any reason? Faster colonization, larger growth, more potent, etc.?
I assume you meant to type coir. C/V/G (coir/verm/gypsum) is a pretty standard mix that works excellent. No need to reinvent the wheel here, especially since you're just starting. Coffee IMO is just a huge vector, mold loves it. I would avoid it until you have a few good grows under your belt. Potency and colonization speed shouldn't be affected much by substrate. That's more of a genetics thing. Another reason to get in to agar! (cloning, refining/selecting cultures for their positive attributes)
Quote:
It is my understanding that the benefit of using a monotub is mostly less maintenance. With enough filtered holes for FAE, many have said that you don't really need to mist or fan for at least every few days (especially if using a casing layer).
That's one of the benefits yes.
Read through all those links Inocuole left, very good info.
Edited by Greg (10/05/16 12:10 PM)
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mushboy
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Re: Tall vs Lots of surface area monotub yields + noob questions [Re: Greg]
#23709659 - 10/05/16 11:35 AM (7 years, 3 months ago) |
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for the love of god do not start off with an LC. the benefits(faster colonizing times) is not worth the risk. unless you clean up some spores on agar plates the LC will be dirty as fuck like 9.8times out of 10.
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r.lutece
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Re: Tall vs Lots of surface area monotub yields + noob questions [Re: Greg]
#23709731 - 10/05/16 11:58 AM (7 years, 3 months ago) |
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Quote:
Greg said:
Quote:
I have around half of my mats already acquired
Mats? Like heating mats? If so, we don't use heating mats anymore. 68-78F aka normal room temp is the perfect temperature. Any higher and you favor the growth of bacteria over mushrooms. If you didn't mean heating mats, please elaborate.
I assume "mats" was meant to be short for materials?
-------------------- One goes into an experiment knowing one might fail. But one does not undertake an experiment knowing one HAS failed.
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Greg
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Re: Tall vs Lots of surface area monotub yields + noob questions [Re: r.lutece]
#23709742 - 10/05/16 12:00 PM (7 years, 3 months ago) |
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Yeah that could make sense. Seems odd to shorten than one word.
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mrmazdarx9
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Re: Tall vs Lots of surface area monotub yields + noob questions [Re: Greg]
#23709767 - 10/05/16 12:08 PM (7 years, 3 months ago) |
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Quote:
Greg said: Yeah that could make sense. Seems odd to shorten than one word.
God gramps can't you keep up with the modern slang we be using mats all the time
-------------------- COCA GROWERS come here and share your knowledge COCA GROWERS UNITE
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Greg
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Re: Tall vs Lots of surface area monotub yields + noob questions [Re: mrmazdarx9]
#23709774 - 10/05/16 12:09 PM (7 years, 3 months ago) |
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point taken
I'll edit my post
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mrmazdarx9
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Re: Tall vs Lots of surface area monotub yields + noob questions [Re: Greg]
#23709777 - 10/05/16 12:13 PM (7 years, 3 months ago) |
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Lol I was joking its a really weird word to shorten
-------------------- COCA GROWERS come here and share your knowledge COCA GROWERS UNITE
Click here for UK trades
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Greg
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Re: Tall vs Lots of surface area monotub yields + noob questions [Re: mrmazdarx9]
#23709782 - 10/05/16 12:14 PM (7 years, 3 months ago) |
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oh god it's too early for this lmao I actually put mats in the search to see if you were fucking with me too
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The Random Word
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Re: Tall vs Lots of surface area monotub yields + noob questions [Re: The Random Word]
#23709810 - 10/05/16 12:28 PM (7 years, 3 months ago) |
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OK a quick update. Yes, I meant mats as in materials, sorry for the mix-up. OK so a couple things since I posted originally.
First, I realized I already had a alright amount of agar in my house from something completely unrelated so I will definitely go right for that. My question about using agar is which tek is the "best?" I have seen people use everything from petri dishes to those little plastic condiment cups. I was planning on buying a tote to make into a SAB for doing most of the applicable steps in to minimize contam anyways, so which is the best to start with? I am plowing through as much info from the links posted as I can.
Also, Greg, as for the adding extra nutrient to the sub, I wasn't saying that I would start like that, just wondering if more nutrient in the sub would produce either easier or better mushies.
I just want to say thanks for all the help friendly internet strangers. Also, as everyone has suggested, I have completely thrown away the idea of starting with an LC. I was always interested in agar cultivation anyways and will just be getting a quicker introduction.
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mushboy
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Re: Tall vs Lots of surface area monotub yields + noob questions [Re: Greg]
#23709811 - 10/05/16 12:28 PM (7 years, 3 months ago) |
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the only time id use the term 'mats' is if im grinding for xp and chatting with my party using teamspeak
OP: use pasty plates. trust me. build the SAB. these two things alone have changed my life
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mrmazdarx9
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Re: Tall vs Lots of surface area monotub yields + noob questions [Re: Greg]
#23709823 - 10/05/16 12:31 PM (7 years, 3 months ago) |
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Quote:
Greg said: oh god it's too early for this lmao I actually put mats in the search to see if you were fucking with me too
 My British sarcasm doesn't really read easily
-------------------- COCA GROWERS come here and share your knowledge COCA GROWERS UNITE
Click here for UK trades
need some supplies in the UK check Here or PM me UK OTD uk members chat UK supplies and trade OTD place to chat shit Right Here If you use "SWIM" you should DROWN
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Greg
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Re: Tall vs Lots of surface area monotub yields + noob questions [Re: mushboy]
#23709829 - 10/05/16 12:34 PM (7 years, 3 months ago) |
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Pastyplates: https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/19208976/fpart/1/vc/1 Many people use this tek, definitely worth a try.
I do poured agar which is a bit different, but I like that I can just toss the petris when I'm done. They're also easier to see through compared to pastyplates or any no-pour tek. Bod's agar pouring tek: https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/21922023/page/1
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Inocuole
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Re: Tall vs Lots of surface area monotub yields + noob questions [Re: Greg]
#23709842 - 10/05/16 12:40 PM (7 years, 3 months ago) |
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NDStepp84
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Re: Tall vs Lots of surface area monotub yields + noob questions [Re: The Random Word]
#23710462 - 10/05/16 04:31 PM (7 years, 3 months ago) |
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Quote:
Inocuole said: http://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/20048771#20048771
^ SBJ's SAB build is awesome, get the biggest clear tote you can find, a 105 qt is great. Remember bigger the arm holes the better, like 5-6" causes less air currents than smaller arm holes when moving your hands in and out. The purpose is to have still air, not sterile air.
Glad you decided against the LC As said pastys agar tek is a great one to start with, super easy. As far as tub size, personally I prefer 2 mini monos (27qt) to one 66. Less eggs in one basket. Say you have 4-5 quarts of spawn and one is bad, spawn it all in one large tub you loose everything. split up between 2 minis you only loose half.
As said you don't need to add anything to your sub, the regular bucket tek with coir and verm with optional gypsum (CVG) is all you need. The mushrooms will get all the nutrients they need from the grain and the bulk sub is more of a water source, later down the road experiment with bulk additives if you wish.
--------------------
"I am free, no matter what rules surround me. If I find them tolerable, I tolerate them; if I find them too obnoxious, I break them. I am free because I know that I alone am morally responsible for everything I do. -Robert A. Heinlein
Links and teks ND's grow log and discussion Plant thread
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The Random Word
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Re: Tall vs Lots of surface area monotub yields + noob questions [Re: Inocuole]
#23710466 - 10/05/16 04:33 PM (7 years, 3 months ago) |
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Another noob question I have run into while delving into all these posts:
Is there really a "best" grain or other substance to spawn to? I see that general consensus is that Rye berries seem to be very easy yet yield good results. Are other mediums slower? For example, I have heard people use oats, WBS, and other grains.
I may have an easier/cheaper time getting oats and/or WBS. Will they colonize as fast in those as they would in rye?
edit: Also, what do you think of this tub.
Edited by The Random Word (10/05/16 04:41 PM)
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Greg
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Re: Tall vs Lots of surface area monotub yields + noob questions [Re: The Random Word]
#23710479 - 10/05/16 04:39 PM (7 years, 3 months ago) |
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Many people use oats without an issue. In fact, I'm probably going to be switching over from rye berries to whole oats once I run out. They're so much cheaper.
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NDStepp84
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Re: Tall vs Lots of surface area monotub yields + noob questions [Re: The Random Word]
#23710483 - 10/05/16 04:41 PM (7 years, 3 months ago) |
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Whatever's cheapest / easiest to source is what most go for. Oats are cheap and easy to prep, more "forgiving" than other grains as far as moisture content. There are a few oat preps out there that work great, one is in inoc's signiture above. Another is to bring them to a boil, time like 25 min and strain, load PC. I do recommend to PC oats for a full 2 hours.
--------------------
"I am free, no matter what rules surround me. If I find them tolerable, I tolerate them; if I find them too obnoxious, I break them. I am free because I know that I alone am morally responsible for everything I do. -Robert A. Heinlein
Links and teks ND's grow log and discussion Plant thread
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The Random Word
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Re: Tall vs Lots of surface area monotub yields + noob questions [Re: NDStepp84]
#23710512 - 10/05/16 04:50 PM (7 years, 3 months ago) |
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I have been looking at this tek for preping the oats. I have also seen a lot of other interesting stuff done by Tribal. They have some interesting teks like supercakes, slurries, and other cool stuff I may try down the road.
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NDStepp84
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Re: Tall vs Lots of surface area monotub yields + noob questions [Re: The Random Word]
#23710519 - 10/05/16 04:53 PM (7 years, 3 months ago) |
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Eat's the man and his prep is awesome If you want to get into liquids down the road his cornmeal mush plate LI is the shit.
--------------------
"I am free, no matter what rules surround me. If I find them tolerable, I tolerate them; if I find them too obnoxious, I break them. I am free because I know that I alone am morally responsible for everything I do. -Robert A. Heinlein
Links and teks ND's grow log and discussion Plant thread
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Mushierage
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Re: Tall vs Lots of surface area monotub yields + noob questions [Re: The Random Word]
#23710526 - 10/05/16 04:55 PM (7 years, 3 months ago) |
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Try this one. I stand by this tek 100%. It works very well, and it's almost impossible to make your jars too wet this way. Less wet means less bacteria means less fail means more universe exploration.
https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/21029762
-------------------- Don't like researching posts? Read this! . Also, if you're new and your posts contain the words: Humidifer, incubator, air-stone, or heater, then you need to read and UTFSE before asking people to review your setup. OR... You should be cultivating reptiles and fish, not mushrooms.
  
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Inocuole
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Re: Tall vs Lots of surface area monotub yields + noob questions [Re: Mushierage]
#23710574 - 10/05/16 05:11 PM (7 years, 3 months ago) |
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Might I kindly recommend... going bulk instead of fucking with supercakes.. and using LI instead of slurries.
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Premedman1
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Re: Tall vs Lots of surface area monotub yields + noob questions [Re: Inocuole] 1
#23710763 - 10/05/16 06:09 PM (7 years, 3 months ago) |
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You can't go wrong with black/gray Sterilite 18 gallon totes from Wal-Mart for $5. 2 quarts of colonized grain spawned to 4" of bulk horse manure substrate continually produces 1/4 lb.+ dry yields per tub. They also have a 10 gallon size for smaller grows.
-------------------- Build a man a fire, he is warm for the night. Set a man on fire, he is warm for the rest of his life.
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Inocuole
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Re: Tall vs Lots of surface area monotub yields + noob questions [Re: Premedman1]
#23710786 - 10/05/16 06:15 PM (7 years, 3 months ago) |
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I have a ton of those but if I could go back I'd get the clear ones, even if it meant having less of them overall. I have a bunch of the 5, 10, and 18 gallon ones, but I'm thinking of trashing or repurposing them. The opaque lid means I have to make a window which isn't so easy to clean and replace all the time.
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