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DGB
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graph of alkaloid content of named Trichocereus clones and anecdotal potency reports. 1
#23708569 - 10/04/16 11:36 PM (7 years, 3 months ago) |
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most recent graphs should be posted at the top of this thread with each new update.
as of this writing I do not personally preform any measurements, i simply gather the data from all over the net and try to centralize it in a single location. the data is not meant to be taken as guarantee of alkaloid levels in a cut but simply a rough approximation of how the known clones compare to each other, alkaloid content changes with many factors so the data just sets a high bar for each clone, potency of a particular cut may be more/less then what it was tested at but at least we establish that each cut is at least capable of being a certain level of potency.
This thread was named and intended as something slightly different but has changed since its creation, I’ll leave the original post just in case someone might find it useful.

(Anyone have any experience with any of the named clones and how they rate? I know potency is a product of both good genetics and proper care so I wanted to eliminate the variable of genetics. Originally I wanted to grow bridgesii ss02 from seed as it apparently has less variation in potency then the other cacti but the prospect of having to wait 3 years before having a respectable size and then having to test each one only to have the potential of ending up with a bunch of weak plants I decided getting a clone would be better, but buying a noname clone off some auction site seemed like a crap shoot also, so if I could source a clone of a known potent strain it would theoretically ensure the genetic side of the potency, it would at least ensure I didn’t get a genetic dud.
I'm not looking for exact measurement as I know only a few have actually been tested, im just looking to see if anyone has had experience with 1 or more named clones and how they would rank them in potency, so far from everything iv read most of the talk is about generic peruvianus vs pachanoi vs bridgesii but little to nothing about actual established clones, and when they do mention clones they usually just say "get a high quality clone" but don’t mention what clones are high quality.
I know juul's giant has supposedly tested high so the genetics seem to be there, but what about things like ss02? Its used in almost everything when making hybrids, and people keep referring to it as having "good genetics" does it actually have high potency potential or are they just talking about hardiness and fast growth? does everyone just use it because its been on the market reliably for years? Or is it actually potent enough to warrant the use? Iv been reading the Trichocereus.net database on all the named clones out there so I figure if there so common and sought after and keep seeing many of them pop up on ethnobotanical sites they must be good and there are bound to be people out there that know about which ones are or arnt. Basically if you had to choose a single known clone as your workhorse what would you choose? Or should I just grow bridgesii from seed?
I just want to ensure I don’t end up with a bunch of duds or low producers after putting all the time and energy into growing a patch.)
Edited by DGB (12/13/17 12:21 AM)
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nuentoter
conduit



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Re: any experience with any of the named Trichocereus clones? [Re: DGB]
#23708618 - 10/05/16 12:09 AM (7 years, 3 months ago) |
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Just posting for similar interest
--------------------
The geometry of us is no chance. We are antennae, we are tuning forks, we are receiver and transmitters of all energy. We are more than we know. - @entheolove "I found I could say things with color and shapes that I couldn't say any other way - things I had no words for" - Georgia O'Keefe I think the word is vagina
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Spellbound
PegasusTheFlyingHorse



Registered: 02/13/16
Posts: 2,341
Loc: England
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Re: any experience with any of the named Trichocereus clones? [Re: nuentoter]
#23708625 - 10/05/16 12:17 AM (7 years, 3 months ago) |
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Well all i can add is that even if you have ten of the same clone, they will vary in potency. Bridgesii is often referred to as most reliable potency wise.
If you look up the trichocereus growers unite thread here - https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/18005647 theres many on there who all grow trichs. I do have many trich hybrids im growing, but have not tested any as theyre still seedlings i only started growing this year 
Im sure someone more knowledgable will chime in. But all i ever hear is you gotta try it to be sure as they can all vary even of the same type.
-------------------- Mescaline Tea - the one singular occasion of my entire life I cooked for 9 hours The trick is to be yourself, in a world trying to make you like everyone else
 
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DGB
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Re: any experience with any of the named Trichocereus clones? [Re: Spellbound]
#23708814 - 10/05/16 02:59 AM (7 years, 3 months ago) |
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Well yes but isn’t that down to the care side? I mean if you do have multiple clones all from the same mother plant then they all have the exact same genetics i.e. the same potential to reach a certain potency level right? I'm sure there would be variation in potency between clones of the same origin but it would be down to variations in things like sun/nutrient/water exposure ect. My goal is to identify a known clone that has "good genetics" a plant that has shown to be able with proper care to be a potent cactus, I want to eliminate the limiting factor of "bad genetics" from the equation. That way I know if I give it proper care it can deliver, as opposed to getting say a PC clone and no matter how well cared for it is, will never go above a certain potency simply because its genetics limits it to be low.
I saw the trichocereus growers unite thread and there are a lot of people there who grow quite a collection on different stains, so at least I know there's a lot of people here who have access to these names clones, hopefuls some have tried one or two and can comment of the potential of each. the thread seemed more to be for people showing off their grows so I decided to create my own thread as asking there would be out of place.
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jimmyBbuffet
Registered: 02/20/16
Posts: 558
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Re: any experience with any of the named Trichocereus clones? [Re: DGB]
#23709091 - 10/05/16 07:16 AM (7 years, 3 months ago) |
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From my understanding "The Mallacht Cut" and "OTB" are both serious stuff.
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DGB
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Re: any experience with any of the named Trichocereus clones? [Re: jimmyBbuffet]
#23710450 - 10/05/16 04:29 PM (7 years, 3 months ago) |
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Thread with similar content.
https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/21326744
someone mentioned SS02, Psycho.0 are potent strains.
Also bioassay is just a fancy way of saying "take some" or "try it" right?
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jimmyBbuffet
Registered: 02/20/16
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Re: any experience with any of the named Trichocereus clones? [Re: DGB]
#23711801 - 10/05/16 11:28 PM (7 years, 3 months ago) |
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Yeah, "taste it" basically. Generally one could assume more bitter is more better as far as alkaloids go.
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DGB
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Re: any experience with any of the named Trichocereus clones? [Re: jimmyBbuffet]
#23711833 - 10/05/16 11:43 PM (7 years, 3 months ago) |
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Quote:
p0stij said: Yeah, "taste it" basically. Generally one could assume more bitter is more better as far as alkaloids go.
so theoretically if i were to get a cuttings or grow a bunch of seeds i would just nick them one by one and propagate whatever is the most bitter?
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Spanishfly
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Re: any experience with any of the named Trichocereus clones? [Re: jimmyBbuffet] 1
#23714078 - 10/06/16 06:51 PM (7 years, 3 months ago) |
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Quote:
p0stij said: Yeah, "taste it" basically. Generally one could assume more bitter is more better as far as alkaloids go.
BITTER is BETTER !!!!
-------------------- I am currently BANNED from using Private Messages - so can anyone who wants to contact me do it via my Journal thread. Link is https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/23831115 Maybe some mod or whatever might think this has now been long enough.
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DGB
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Re: any experience with any of the named Trichocereus clones? [Re: Spanishfly]
#23714960 - 10/07/16 01:51 AM (7 years, 3 months ago) |
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ill keep that in mind but iv read conflicting about the bitter test. some are saying its a reliable indicator while others are saying its bunk.
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nuentoter
conduit



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Re: any experience with any of the named Trichocereus clones? [Re: DGB]
#23715199 - 10/07/16 05:56 AM (7 years, 3 months ago) |
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I think it is a general indication, but genetics of taste of fruiting body can sometimes over power the bitterness? I do not doubt one but though the bitter taste of alkaloids, holds true almost anywhere you look.
--------------------
The geometry of us is no chance. We are antennae, we are tuning forks, we are receiver and transmitters of all energy. We are more than we know. - @entheolove "I found I could say things with color and shapes that I couldn't say any other way - things I had no words for" - Georgia O'Keefe I think the word is vagina
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Spore Ninja
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Re: any experience with any of the named Trichocereus clones? [Re: jimmyBbuffet]
#23785616 - 10/30/16 02:11 PM (7 years, 2 months ago) |
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Quote:
p0stij said: From my understanding "The Mallacht Cut" and "OTB" are both serious stuff.
Hmmm..seems those are the most expensive ones too..probably just a coincidence... His FB page looks new- anyone know his background or history??
Been thinking about cropping some cactus, and I'm also wondering about reliable. proven genetics. So this is an old school tag. ( is there a way to bookmark or subscribe to threads here?)
-------------------- I'm interested in Dr. Pollock's work and his (especially older) strains. Anyone have pix of his Shroommobile RV?? PSA: Protonmail offers free, encrypted email hosted in privacy loving Switzerland. Red Phone / Signal offer free encrypted phone calls and texting between users. All of these programs are available free for PC and Android or apple and are available in the respective stores or online by googling the names. Stay safe out there! The Electronic Freedom Foundation's review of text and messaging program's security is here>>> https://www.eff.org/node/82654
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Stupendous-Yappi
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Re: any experience with any of the named Trichocereus clones? [Re: Spore Ninja]
#23785769 - 10/30/16 02:54 PM (7 years, 2 months ago) |
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Quote:
Spore Ninja said: ... is there a way to bookmark or subscribe to threads here?
At the bottom of posts, there's "Post Extras" with a 'remind me' button to subscribe. At the bottom of the page there's "[ Toggle Favorite" to add to your favorites/bookmarks.
--------------------
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GreenFingers
Exotic collector


Registered: 02/01/14
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Re: any experience with any of the named Trichocereus clones? *DELETED* [Re: Spore Ninja]
#23785900 - 10/30/16 03:27 PM (7 years, 2 months ago) |
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Post deleted by Mostly_HarmlessReason for deletion: Source discussion/request is NOT allowed. In order to preserve both our sources and the Shroomery's sponsors. So please do not create threads, or post in others, specifically asking for sources. Even if your intent is for users to send you that info in a PM, it is still not permitted.
Vendor discussion is also not permitted, whether it is good or bad makes no difference. If you find info on a vendor page, please just copy and paste it into your post. We want to keep our sponsors.
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Spore Ninja
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Re: any experience with any of the named Trichocereus clones? [Re: DGB]
#23787263 - 10/30/16 11:46 PM (7 years, 2 months ago) |
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Quote:
DGB said: ill keep that in mind but iv read conflicting about the bitter test. some are saying its a reliable indicator while others are saying its bunk.
The active alkaloids in cactus should react with the Marquis reagent test to give a bright orange color....not sure how much the color can reveal the potency though. It might be more of a 'yes/no' result.
Looks like the test kits are available on Amazon now... lol.. $5-$15.
-------------------- I'm interested in Dr. Pollock's work and his (especially older) strains. Anyone have pix of his Shroommobile RV?? PSA: Protonmail offers free, encrypted email hosted in privacy loving Switzerland. Red Phone / Signal offer free encrypted phone calls and texting between users. All of these programs are available free for PC and Android or apple and are available in the respective stores or online by googling the names. Stay safe out there! The Electronic Freedom Foundation's review of text and messaging program's security is here>>> https://www.eff.org/node/82654
Edited by Spore Ninja (10/30/16 11:48 PM)
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ferrel_human
stone eater



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Loc: Texas
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Re: any experience with any of the named Trichocereus clones? [Re: Spanishfly]
#23787327 - 10/31/16 12:25 AM (7 years, 2 months ago) |
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Quote:
Spanishfly said:
Quote:
p0stij said: Yeah, "taste it" basically. Generally one could assume more bitter is more better as far as alkaloids go.
BITTER is BETTER !!!!
Coming from the old man. Solidifies my reasoning.
-------------------- Nature is my church and walking through it is gospel. It tells no lies and reveals all to those who look, and listen, closely. -Karode
 Looking for Mimosa tenuiflora seeds. Buttons for trade
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Spore Ninja
PsychoMycoPhile


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Re: any experience with any of the named Trichocereus clones? [Re: ferrel_human]
#23788275 - 10/31/16 11:30 AM (7 years, 2 months ago) |
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Quote:
ferrel_human said:
Quote:
Spanishfly said:
Quote:
p0stij said: Yeah, "taste it" basically. Generally one could assume more bitter is more better as far as alkaloids go.
BITTER is BETTER !!!!
Coming from the old man. Solidifies my reasoning. 
What about science???  I wonder how much it costs to run a sample through a gas chromatograph or mass spectrum analysis? Surely here's a lab that will analyze samples for us?
-------------------- I'm interested in Dr. Pollock's work and his (especially older) strains. Anyone have pix of his Shroommobile RV?? PSA: Protonmail offers free, encrypted email hosted in privacy loving Switzerland. Red Phone / Signal offer free encrypted phone calls and texting between users. All of these programs are available free for PC and Android or apple and are available in the respective stores or online by googling the names. Stay safe out there! The Electronic Freedom Foundation's review of text and messaging program's security is here>>> https://www.eff.org/node/82654
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ferrel_human
stone eater



Registered: 06/26/09
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Re: any experience with any of the named Trichocereus clones? [Re: Spore Ninja] 1
#23788289 - 10/31/16 11:36 AM (7 years, 2 months ago) |
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Man FUCK science! Taste it. Eat it. Live it.
-------------------- Nature is my church and walking through it is gospel. It tells no lies and reveals all to those who look, and listen, closely. -Karode
 Looking for Mimosa tenuiflora seeds. Buttons for trade
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Spore Ninja
PsychoMycoPhile


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Re: any experience with any of the named Trichocereus clones? [Re: ferrel_human]
#23789682 - 10/31/16 07:35 PM (7 years, 2 months ago) |
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Quote:
ferrel_human said: Man FUCK science! Taste it. Eat it. Live it. 
I NEED NUMBERS!!!
-------------------- I'm interested in Dr. Pollock's work and his (especially older) strains. Anyone have pix of his Shroommobile RV?? PSA: Protonmail offers free, encrypted email hosted in privacy loving Switzerland. Red Phone / Signal offer free encrypted phone calls and texting between users. All of these programs are available free for PC and Android or apple and are available in the respective stores or online by googling the names. Stay safe out there! The Electronic Freedom Foundation's review of text and messaging program's security is here>>> https://www.eff.org/node/82654
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GreenFingers
Exotic collector


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Re: any experience with any of the named Trichocereus clones? [Re: Spore Ninja]
#23789843 - 10/31/16 08:42 PM (7 years, 2 months ago) |
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I'm surprised there aren't more accounts of popular clones that have been bioassied. For as popular as clone collecting is I would expect to see some more reviews on a few.
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ferrel_human
stone eater



Registered: 06/26/09
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Re: any experience with any of the named Trichocereus clones? [Re: Spore Ninja]
#23789900 - 10/31/16 09:07 PM (7 years, 2 months ago) |
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Quote:
Spore Ninja said:
Quote:
ferrel_human said: Man FUCK science! Taste it. Eat it. Live it. 
I NEED NUMBERS!!! 
I knowthere is one clone by some african guy that was tested at 4%? Ogund something. It comes on ebay from time to time but real wxpensive thoigh.
-------------------- Nature is my church and walking through it is gospel. It tells no lies and reveals all to those who look, and listen, closely. -Karode
 Looking for Mimosa tenuiflora seeds. Buttons for trade
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Spore Ninja
PsychoMycoPhile


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Re: any experience with any of the named Trichocereus clones? [Re: ferrel_human]
#23790161 - 10/31/16 11:31 PM (7 years, 2 months ago) |
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Quote:
ferrel_human said:
Quote:
Spore Ninja said:
Quote:
ferrel_human said: Man FUCK science! Taste it. Eat it. Live it. 
I NEED NUMBERS!!! 
I knowthere is one clone by some african guy that was tested at 4%? Ogund something. It comes on ebay from time to time but real wxpensive thoigh.
If only we could find people that know how to do tissue cultures and agar work....
-------------------- I'm interested in Dr. Pollock's work and his (especially older) strains. Anyone have pix of his Shroommobile RV?? PSA: Protonmail offers free, encrypted email hosted in privacy loving Switzerland. Red Phone / Signal offer free encrypted phone calls and texting between users. All of these programs are available free for PC and Android or apple and are available in the respective stores or online by googling the names. Stay safe out there! The Electronic Freedom Foundation's review of text and messaging program's security is here>>> https://www.eff.org/node/82654
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DGB
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Re: any experience with any of the named Trichocereus clones? [Re: Spore Ninja]
#23790371 - 11/01/16 03:13 AM (7 years, 2 months ago) |
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Quote:
GreenFingers said: I'm surprised there aren't more accounts of popular clones that have been bioassied. For as popular as clone collecting is I would expect to see some more reviews on a few.
That's my exact though too, I even mention it in my other thread about how I just don't understand how this information isn't already widely documented on these type of forums, with all the cuttings people are constantly buying you would think what is and isn't active would me plastered all over and common knowledge.
https://mycotopia.net/topic/99267-whats-the-best-vendor-to-get-reliably-potent-cacti-cuttings/
I did have a thread over on another forum that I posted what I've been finding in terms of clones and which seem to have activity per "reports" since shroomery is a little stricter about sourcing, but I've kind of given up posting there for obvious reasons if you choose to read though the thread, I've pretty much settled on what I plan on doing but I still think there should be an easily found list of active cuttings, the exact potency would be hard to pin down for many reasons but at least knowing a cutting is active or not would be a good start and if enough people come forward to give their impression of strength it may be possible to estimate an average of strength for a particular cut, especially if said person has a number of different clones in the same environment to compare it to.
so, people can have an easier time deciding what they want to look for instead of just blindly ordering no name cuts off some auction site. That just never seemed like a legit answer to me, at least for what I was looking for, sure if you want to experiment and try your luck at getting something new it would be a good option but just like growing from seeds, it's an investment/gamble were you could turn up with something great, something meh or something terrible, you don’t know until you've already put down the time/money, I just think there should be an easier option that offers a little more predictability other than playing roulette with internet vendors.
correct me if I'm wrong but my understanding is we can talk about specific clones here even if they are only available from one source but as long as we don't say that exact source it's still allowed, right? because you haven't sourced the cut, just that a cut exists under a name and is of certain activity.
if so I might just copy over the info I have there into this thread. Its basically the result of scouring a bunch of forums and books for mentions of specific clones and if they are active or not, as some have mentioned its anonymous and from a few sources and as such isn't the absolute greatest source on confirmation but as mentioned if we could get enough people to come forward to say "yes, X and Y are active" the evidence for that being true strengthens.
Edited by DGB (11/01/16 03:17 AM)
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Mostly_Harmless
wyrd bið ful aræd



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Re: any experience with any of the named Trichocereus clones? [Re: DGB]
#23790413 - 11/01/16 04:18 AM (7 years, 2 months ago) |
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Quote:
DGB said: correct me if I'm wrong but my understanding is we can talk about specific clones here even if they are only available from one source but as long as we don't say that exact source it's still allowed, right? because you haven't sourced the cut, just that a cut exists under a name and is of certain activity.
Correct, no source or vendor discussion, good or bad. Or dosage advice. We try to stick to the growing and gardening of plants.
I wonder if folks don't eat their named clones as they do seem to trade for inflated prices. They are selected for their growth forms and other characteristics, and have as much chance of being weak, average, strong, as any other active trich, probably.
I see some of the named clones and can't help but think well they don't seem too far different from other exemplars, but give something a unique name and people want them more!
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DGB
Stranger
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Re: any experience with any of the named Trichocereus clones? [Re: Mostly_Harmless]
#23790429 - 11/01/16 04:36 AM (7 years, 2 months ago) |
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All the info iv found so far.
Per sacredcacti.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/02/SanPedro_2006_with_pachanoi_pachanot_addendum.pdf "trout's notes on san pedro 3rd addition" Trichocereus bridgesii RS0005 A form known as the Eusaporus clone is reputed to be extremely potent and nearly palatable but I lack any details beyond it originating from the defunct cactus nursery Sticky Business. It is said to lack slime but this is apparently seasonal as our lone assessment of this feature was rather slimy. San Pedro & related Trichocereus species Trichocereus cv. (Lumberjack) Unlabeled form obtained in a Sacramento, CA Lumberjack store. Proven to be a potent mescaline container by human bioassay. Now cultivated for sacramental purposes. Appearance suggest that this may be a hybrid or intermediate of T. bridgesii with T. peruvianus or something similar. T. peruvianusXbridgesii and T. pachanoiXbridgesii hybrids are known to exist in horticulture but we have never encountered any that were actually labeled as such. http://www.spiritplants.org/forums/the-desert/a-trichocereus-so-strong-one-only-needs-to-eat-3-inches/
per JRL
" Lumberjack is definitely stronger than PC but not three inches strong. On another note, it is gratifying to see that that the appellation Lumberjack has become common knowledge, my humble contribution." Trichocereus macrogonus Macrogonus as represented in the US appears to be quite active although variable in potency and degree of slime. The RS0004 is purported to yield a nearly nonslimy beverage that is palatable and potent. The solid pulp is claimed to spontaneously separate from the liquid when run in a blender; unlike the nonspontaneously separating thick foamy mucus-like slime that results from most macrogonus forms if treated that way. We have been told this rather than witnessing it. Trichocereus pachanoi (Dave) is said to be a slendergrowing form of T. pachanoi. It is reported to be potent in human bioassay. It needs analysis. -----------------------------------------------------------------------
https://www.dmt-nexus.me/forum/default.aspx?g=posts&t=3985 per 'Coatl " Name- Trichocereus pachanoi "Torres & Torres"
Description- Typical non-predominant cultivator Trichocereus pachanoi with "V"-shaped notchs above the areoles.
Dosage and Effects- inchs for a moderate to intense trip. Similair to other Trichocereus pachanoi in effects, but often much stronger. The effects are very euphoric, smooth ride, and long lasting, not as purgative as Trichocereus bridgeii or other species.
Origin- Chile
----------------------------------------------------------------------- https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/23708569/page/2 per p0stij " From my understanding "The Mallacht Cut" and "OTB" are both serious stuff." ----------------------------------------------------------------------- https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/21326744
per BigHeart
" I believe the theory behind all of the Juul's hybrids is that you take a fast grower (Juul's) and mix it with a high potency (SS02, Psycho.0, etc.) and you could end up with a fast growing, high potency hybrid. " -----------------------------------------------------------------------
http://www.lycaeum.org/forum/index.php?topic=25659.0
per Teotzlcoatl
" Some potent clones include- Trichocereus pachanoi "Torres & Torres", Trichocereus peruvianus SS01, Trichocereus pachanoi "Kimnach"."
Cactus Chemistry By Species 2014 Light https://archive.org/stream/CactusChemistryBySpecies2014Light/CactusChemistryBySpecies_2014_Light_djvu.txt "Trichocereus pachanoi cv. 'Tom Juul's Giant' Unclear in origin prior to Tom Juul. Peru seems probable. 1.4% Ogunbedede 2010 (using dried green outer layer) Presence of Mescaline was both demonstrated by human bioassay and confirmed previously by gc-ms. but it should be emphasized that there are conflicting reports ranging from full activity at 4-6 inches to powerful trips with 1 foot to complete inactivity with 2 feet." "Trichocereus peruvianus KK242 Pardanani et al. 1977 (Using intact plant) 0.24% K242 propagated from a live cutting "Trichocereus sp. SS02 (a T. bridgesii form) Reported to be a reliably effective form in multiple human bioassays; presence of mescaline demonstrated in GC-MS (seemingly as sole alkaloid?) Needs taxonomic study and an analysis. Anonymous 1999 & 2000. " "Trichocereus sp. N.Chile (Torres & Torres) Presence of Mescaline has been proven by human bioassay" "The monstrose forms of T. bridgesii have been purported to be especially active in human bioassays." Trout’s Notes on The Cactus Alkaloids Nomenclature, Physical properties, Pharmacology & Occurrences
sacredcacti.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/02/CactusAlkaloids_2013.pdf "Trichocereus sp. SS01 (macrogonoid) Reported to contain mescaline based on human bioassays. Correspondent requesting anonymity; 2000" "Trichocereus sp. SS02 (bridgesioid) Reported to contain mescaline based on human bioassays. Correspondent requesting anonymity; 2000" "Trichocereus sp. SS03 (peruvianoid) Reported to contain mescaline based on human bioassays. Correspondent requesting anonymity; 2000" "Trichocereus sp. W.Baker 5452 (this is a bridgesii) (%?) Mescaline confirmed in analysis but unpublished. Bioassay & analytical information from sources requesting an¬onymity."
TLDR, so far either through direct hearsay or reliable sources some confirmed active clones are
RS0005, Lumberjack, RS0004, Dave, Torres & Torres, Kimnach, Juul's Giant, KK242, bridgesii monstrose, SS01, SS02, SS03, and 5452.
with honorable mentions for "The Mallacht Cut" "OTB" and "Psycho0"
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Mostly_Harmless
wyrd bið ful aræd



Registered: 05/12/09
Posts: 5,043
Loc: Perfidious Albion
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Re: any experience with any of the named Trichocereus clones? [Re: DGB]
#23790441 - 11/01/16 04:56 AM (7 years, 2 months ago) |
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Quote:
DGB said: "Trichocereus sp. SS01 (macrogonoid) Reported to contain mescaline based on human bioassays. Correspondent requesting anonymity; 2000" "Trichocereus sp. SS02 (bridgesioid) Reported to contain mescaline based on human bioassays. Correspondent requesting anonymity; 2000" "Trichocereus sp. SS03 (peruvianoid) Reported to contain mescaline based on human bioassays. Correspondent requesting anonymity; 2000"
I thought SS01 was a peruvian, and SS03 a possible knuthianus or hybrid. Trich taxonomy is fun
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modern.shaman
San Mescalito




Registered: 05/09/12
Posts: 3,224
Loc: Zone 13
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Re: any experience with any of the named Trichocereus clones? [Re: DGB]
#23790466 - 11/01/16 05:30 AM (7 years, 2 months ago) |
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There has been conversations of this issue in the community before and the general consensus is subtly is key. Top breeders and collectors don't want the community to go the way of weed cult. Names like super killer dank fire blastoff clone would defeat the point. Not all growers are interested in that singular aspect.
Having stated all that... rest assured that popular clones are popular for a reason. Bridgesii in general are accepted as reliable and named clones more so. Now a named clone may not necessarily be stronger than a no name clone but it is popular/named for a reason.
Most clones are named either for special traits (girth, speed, water tolerance), visuals (color, spine, beauty, crest/monstrose), tracking reference for how it spreads, breeding purposes ( using the same clone in different crosses, or even to shorten the cross name (instead of calling it ((ss02xpach)x(ss02xss01))xpsych0) you can just call it Mustang. It can also be named due to potency.
Now be aware there are also some unscrupulous sellers that will name some just so it has a higher perceived value like j12 or w.e. jimmz calls them. Not even sure they are all the same clone and Ive also seen people name a random cutting and sell it as a known clone. (A seller named a spiney bridgesii as lumberjack but it was not and people paid big bucks for it; after community called them out he renamed it caterpillar.)
Other clones have been named in memorial to some one who may have passed like Eileen, Psycho, chemical dick and others. Named after family member who died or a prominent forum member who passed.
Most named clones are no more special then others with a few exceptions like obode clone which is tested near 5%.
Most Nonpc pachanoi are potent and bridgesii are reliable. Peruvianus as a mixed batch due to misidentified Cuzcos.
seed crosses with known parents are 'special' because there is higher chance of select plants arising with traits similar to parents if not better. Now in day most people are aware that the common pc clone is weak but with enough it does the trick and is very water tolerant, cold tolerant and fast growing.
Another thing worth mentioning is clones originally should be giveaway or spread very cheap.the purpose is to get it in as many hands as possible so it spreads. Very rare clones may be desired but cost will be too high and risk of not being worthy clone.
I've given away a few small clones of a seed grown clone to people and sold a few cuttings. Those that I feel overpaid due to it being an auction I would send extra clones and gifts like candles I've made. I was wary of the name I chose due to the obvious correlation but it is my mothers name and she saved it from killing it off so potency on that clone has not been tested yet but named it due to it being crested and from bridgesii seed. It now clearly looks like a Bridgesii x Pach/Peru with grafts looking differ then own roots clones. Very water tolerant and fast growing IME. To my eyes it looks like it has the perfect mix of pach and bridgesii and if it tests to have pachanoi power with bridgesii spirit the name will stick and it will become an established clone. If not it may spread as a crest or just not spread further.
My suggestion to most is get a named Pachanoi and named bridgesii and just grow those out and forget the rest. Growing from seed is fun and after a few years you are overrun with cacti and sometimes find a special one. If you have space and plan on breeding get more clones also sellers should have a few clones.
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ferrel_human
stone eater



Registered: 06/26/09
Posts: 16,318
Loc: Texas
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Re: any experience with any of the named Trichocereus clones? [Re: Mostly_Harmless]
#23790700 - 11/01/16 08:53 AM (7 years, 2 months ago) |
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Quote:
Mostly_Harmless said:
I see some of the named clones and can't help but think well they don't seem too far different from other exemplars, but give something a unique name and people want them more!
"This" clone and "that" clone. Well grow it from seed.
I think hybrids are all the rage these days. I could care less of activity and more about spination. Spination to me is a thing of beauty. Long wicked spined? Lovely. Spineless? Lovely. I tend to go for regular spine length whe. Strong activity is present. Other than that, im not gonna pay out the ass for anything no more. Well maybe. But not a trich.
-------------------- Nature is my church and walking through it is gospel. It tells no lies and reveals all to those who look, and listen, closely. -Karode
 Looking for Mimosa tenuiflora seeds. Buttons for trade
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Grey Fox

Registered: 01/22/15
Posts: 2,652
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Re: any experience with any of the named Trichocereus clones? [Re: ferrel_human]
#23790877 - 11/01/16 10:13 AM (7 years, 2 months ago) |
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Great info here! Thank you to everyone who is contributing knowledge.
The only named clone that I am familiar with is Juul's Giant. It definitely has a gentle, uplifting pachanoi spirit and is of moderate strength... about 4 or 5 on a scale of 1 (pc pach) to 10 (very potent bridg).
-------------------- IT WAS ALL A DREAM
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ShroomeryReader
Stranger

Registered: 09/21/16
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Re: any experience with any of the named Trichocereus clones? [Re: ferrel_human]
#23791395 - 11/01/16 01:40 PM (7 years, 2 months ago) |
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Quote:
ferrel_human said:
I knowthere is one clone by some african guy that was tested at 4%? Ogund something. It comes on ebay from time to time but real wxpensive thoigh.
Ogunbodede In my experience, i can believe the 4%. I'm growing this clone.
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ferrel_human
stone eater



Registered: 06/26/09
Posts: 16,318
Loc: Texas
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Re: any experience with any of the named Trichocereus clones? [Re: ShroomeryReader]
#23791414 - 11/01/16 01:43 PM (7 years, 2 months ago) |
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Quote:
ShroomeryReader said:
Quote:
ferrel_human said:
I knowthere is one clone by some african guy that was tested at 4%? Ogund something. It comes on ebay from time to time but real wxpensive thoigh.
Ogunbodede In my experience, i can believe the 4%. I'm growing this clone.
Thats it.
Dont know if its a pach, torch, or bridge. I know ita a trich so there goes.
-------------------- Nature is my church and walking through it is gospel. It tells no lies and reveals all to those who look, and listen, closely. -Karode
 Looking for Mimosa tenuiflora seeds. Buttons for trade
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ShroomeryReader
Stranger

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Re: any experience with any of the named Trichocereus clones? [Re: ferrel_human]
#23791438 - 11/01/16 01:52 PM (7 years, 2 months ago) |
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It's a pachanoi, ferrel. K Trout has a page about it on his web site
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DGB
Stranger
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Re: any experience with any of the named Trichocereus clones? [Re: ShroomeryReader]
#23791449 - 11/01/16 01:55 PM (7 years, 2 months ago) |
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Quote:
ShroomeryReader said: It's a pachanoi, ferrel. K Trout has a page about it on his web site
is yours spineless like that too? or was that just despined for shipping?
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ShroomeryReader
Stranger

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Re: any experience with any of the named Trichocereus clones? [Re: DGB]
#23791512 - 11/01/16 02:16 PM (7 years, 2 months ago) |
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This is an Ogunbodede tip I grafted onto a PC pachanoi.
 Other pictures I've seen growers post on forums have looked similar, always showing spines.
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ferrel_human
stone eater



Registered: 06/26/09
Posts: 16,318
Loc: Texas
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Re: any experience with any of the named Trichocereus clones? [Re: ShroomeryReader]
#23791572 - 11/01/16 02:36 PM (7 years, 2 months ago) |
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Quote:
ShroomeryReader said: This is an Ogunbodede tip I grafted onto a PC pachanoi.
 Other pictures I've seen growers post on forums have looked similar, always showing spines.
Seems like all other trichs. Or pachs. Most vendors will ass rape. But its just the way ot goes.
-------------------- Nature is my church and walking through it is gospel. It tells no lies and reveals all to those who look, and listen, closely. -Karode
 Looking for Mimosa tenuiflora seeds. Buttons for trade
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DGB
Stranger
Registered: 09/19/16
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Re: any experience with any of the named Trichocereus clones? [Re: ferrel_human]
#23791611 - 11/01/16 02:53 PM (7 years, 2 months ago) |
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well hopefully one of the reliable vendors gets a cutting and start offering it.
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Spore Ninja
PsychoMycoPhile


Registered: 10/25/16
Posts: 161
Last seen: 5 years, 6 months
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Re: any experience with any of the named Trichocereus clones? [Re: GreenFingers]
#23793076 - 11/01/16 09:15 PM (7 years, 2 months ago) |
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Quote:
GreenFingers said: I'm surprised there aren't more accounts of popular clones that have been bioassied. For as popular as clone collecting is I would expect to see some more reviews on a few.
I think one major obstacle is the extended time frame it takes for growing and testing. Here's Dr. Shulgin on the Juuls variety:
Quote:
You have a sample of one of the most understudied and controversial cacti that I am aware of. What is the origin of its name, its botanical classification, the alkaloidal composition and its possible psychopharmacological activity? Let me put together what I can from Trout's notes from his Sacred Cacti book, and a small amount of unpublished analytical lab work that I did a few years ago.
Quote:
I am aware of three reported bioassays, with psychedelic effects stated to be inactive, weak, or twice as potent as San Pedro. I have personally not tasted this cactus. However, I have run gas chromatography mass spectroscopy (GCMS) analyses on extracts from five samples of dried specimens from three different sources. All five showed the presence of mescaline (one as a trace component only) but all five samples displayed totally different composition portraits.
Quote:
This is the frustrating aspect of plant analysis. One has to be reasonably competent in chemistry, in botany and in pharmacology, all at the same time. If you hope to identify new alkaloids in a plant, you have to take a decade or two...
Quote:
And of course, the bottom line is the area of pharmacology. Is the plant active? You are not sure just what is in the plant. And you are not sure just what the plant is. And, if the plant is not a psychoactive thing, do you really want to spend time and effort on the analysis of pharmacologically inactive things that are in it? So you have to grow it, name it, synthesize its possible components, and eat it, to begin to understand why this sacred plant of an almost unknown tribe of Indians, in the upper deserts of Bolivia, worshipped it. That is a lot of dedication and a lot of decades.
There is no easy answer.
-- Dr. Shulgin
http://www.cognitiveliberty.org/shulgin/blg/2005/01/juuls-giant-cactus-aka-jewels-giant.html
-------------------- I'm interested in Dr. Pollock's work and his (especially older) strains. Anyone have pix of his Shroommobile RV?? PSA: Protonmail offers free, encrypted email hosted in privacy loving Switzerland. Red Phone / Signal offer free encrypted phone calls and texting between users. All of these programs are available free for PC and Android or apple and are available in the respective stores or online by googling the names. Stay safe out there! The Electronic Freedom Foundation's review of text and messaging program's security is here>>> https://www.eff.org/node/82654
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DGB
Stranger
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Re: any experience with any of the named Trichocereus clones? [Re: Spore Ninja]
#23793175 - 11/01/16 09:47 PM (7 years, 2 months ago) |
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I think towards the end there he started talking about identifying new alkaloids, which would take a lot of time but he's also going after exact spectrum analysis, to give exact % of contents and which is or isn't present and what each does. Because from the way he's talking about it sounds like he's describing isolation of unknown alkaloids.
The list we were talking about is less about exact spectrum break down and identification values and more just is said plant active or not.
*obtain X known cutting from known vendor Y* *eat X cutting from known vendor Y* *Wait* *Report* " X cutting from known vendor Y was active for me" or " X cutting from known vendor Y was not active for me" *repeat with multiple people* if 2 or more people come back to say "X cutting from known vendor Y was active for me" we can probably add it to the list of active clones. The hang up is currently very few people are willing to come forward and say " X cutting from known vendor Y was active for me"
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Spore Ninja
PsychoMycoPhile


Registered: 10/25/16
Posts: 161
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Re: any experience with any of the named Trichocereus clones? [Re: Spore Ninja]
#23793252 - 11/01/16 10:15 PM (7 years, 2 months ago) |
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Dun Dun DUUUNNNN
From the link on Trout's page:
Quote:
New mescaline concentrations from 14 taxa/cultivars of Echinopsis spp. (Cactaceae) (“San Pedro”) and their relevance to shamanic practice
Unfortunatly, it's $35 for the write up of the results, but some universities may get free access to it. It was on the Science Direct site. Free access if you are: " healthcare practitioner interested in pay-per-view article purchase researcher or librarian student or faculty member visitor or subscriber to the website"
Not sure what that last line means. But hopefully someone here can qualify to grab a copy and share some results.
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Spore Ninja
PsychoMycoPhile


Registered: 10/25/16
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Re: any experience with any of the named Trichocereus clones? [Re: DGB]
#23793271 - 11/01/16 10:22 PM (7 years, 2 months ago) |
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Quote:
DGB said: I think towards the end there he started talking about identifying new alkaloids, which would take a lot of time but he's also going after exact spectrum analysis, to give exact % of contents and which is or isn't present and what each does. Because from the way he's talking about it sounds like he's describing isolation of unknown alkaloids.
The list we were talking about is less about exact spectrum break down and identification values and more just is said plant active or not.
*obtain X known cutting from known vendor Y* *eat X cutting from known vendor Y* *Wait* *Report* " X cutting from known vendor Y was active for me" or " X cutting from known vendor Y was not active for me" *repeat with multiple people* if 2 or more people come back to say "X cutting from known vendor Y was active for me" we can probably add it to the list of active clones. The hang up is currently very few people are willing to come forward and say " X cutting from known vendor Y was active for me"
I understand what you're saying, but I think the same methods would be used for testing just for the primary alkaloid. and A) There's a LOT of variety and even outright misrepresentation of different strains/species. B) there are a LOT of variables that affect the alkaloid score.
So using a top quality source/vendor would be the best way to guarantee quality. It's still somewhat of a crapshoot- but at least you have much better odds that way.
or go the budget route and take your chances. Buy a bunch of different types and keep working through them until you find one you like.
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DGB
Stranger
Registered: 09/19/16
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Re: any experience with any of the named Trichocereus clones? [Re: Spore Ninja]
#23793283 - 11/01/16 10:26 PM (7 years, 2 months ago) |
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Quote:
Spore Ninja said: Dun Dun DUUUNNNN
From the link on Trout's page:
Quote:
New mescaline concentrations from 14 taxa/cultivars of Echinopsis spp. (Cactaceae) (“San Pedro”) and their relevance to shamanic practice
Unfortunatly, it's $35 for the write up of the results, but some universities may get free access to it. It was on the Science Direct site. Free access if you are: " healthcare practitioner interested in pay-per-view article purchase researcher or librarian student or faculty member visitor or subscriber to the website"
Not sure what that last line means. But hopefully someone here can qualify to grab a copy and share some results.
https://www.researchgate.net/publication/45269732_New_mescaline_concentrations_from_14_taxacultivars_of_Echinopsis_spp_Cactaceae_San_Pedro_and_their_relevance_to_shamanic_practice
problem is aside from Juul’s Giant most of the cuttings they used were random pach from market or no name plant from wherever. it gives a good overview of the average range for each species but not the activity of a established known clone...cept Juul’s Giant, which is good as we know its at least capable of reaching 1.4% but then again Juul’s Giant was a name people used to use for any fat pach so that particular cut might not be the best. i was thinking more something like SS01-01-03 ect since the original vendor is still around and you know if you get it from them you get the real thing.
Edited by DGB (11/01/16 10:35 PM)
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DGB
Stranger
Registered: 09/19/16
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Re: any experience with any of the named Trichocereus clones? [Re: Spore Ninja]
#23793290 - 11/01/16 10:31 PM (7 years, 2 months ago) |
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Quote:
Spore Ninja said:
Quote:
DGB said: I think towards the end there he started talking about identifying new alkaloids, which would take a lot of time but he's also going after exact spectrum analysis, to give exact % of contents and which is or isn't present and what each does. Because from the way he's talking about it sounds like he's describing isolation of unknown alkaloids.
The list we were talking about is less about exact spectrum break down and identification values and more just is said plant active or not.
*obtain X known cutting from known vendor Y* *eat X cutting from known vendor Y* *Wait* *Report* " X cutting from known vendor Y was active for me" or " X cutting from known vendor Y was not active for me" *repeat with multiple people* if 2 or more people come back to say "X cutting from known vendor Y was active for me" we can probably add it to the list of active clones. The hang up is currently very few people are willing to come forward and say " X cutting from known vendor Y was active for me"
I understand what you're saying, but I think the same methods would be used for testing just for the primary alkaloid. and A) There's a LOT of variety and even outright misrepresentation of different strains/species. B) there are a LOT of variables that affect the alkaloid score.
So using a top quality source/vendor would be the best way to guarantee quality. It's still somewhat of a crapshoot- but at least you have much better odds that way.
or go the budget route and take your chances. Buy a bunch of different types and keep working through them until you find one you like.
well yes that's why i wanted to create a database for known cuttings, assuming you get it though the original seller or other reputable vendor and are in fact getting what its advertised as you would have a point of reference on activity. at least on shroomery you would not be able to include the vendor or source but that could easily be found if you know what your looking for. im kinda assuming people would be getting said cutting though a good verified vendor and not some auction site with a seller based out of china selling "rare super special mega Juuls Giant"
Edited by DGB (11/01/16 11:51 PM)
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Teemo 6T3
႟тнe мedιcιne мan ☼



Registered: 07/21/14
Posts: 1,570
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Re: any experience with any of the named Trichocereus clones? [Re: ferrel_human]
#23793659 - 11/02/16 03:59 AM (7 years, 2 months ago) |
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Quote:
ferrel_human said: Seems like all other trichs. Or pachs. Most vendors will ass rape. But its just the way ot goes.
I would go with what ferrel says, he knows his shit.
Most marketers tend to name their products differently just to sell it for more. Which works like a charm tbh.
-------------------- Shrooming Is Of The Essence   Rest In Peace Dankington
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DGB
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Re: any experience with any of the named Trichocereus clones? [Re: Teemo 6T3]
#23793698 - 11/02/16 04:48 AM (7 years, 2 months ago) |
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Quote:
Teemo 6T3 said:
Quote:
ferrel_human said: Seems like all other trichs. Or pachs. Most vendors will ass rape. But its just the way ot goes.
I would go with what ferrel says, he knows his shit.
Most marketers tend to name their products differently just to sell it for more. Which works like a charm tbh.
Well yes, and that’s kind of why I'm trying to gather this type of information in one place, so people can come forward and say if a named cut is bunk or not, too give feedback on what theve tried and I'm assuming you're going to buy said cutting from a known/reputable vendor and not an auction site or something like that. It’s a little hard with shroomerys no vendor rule but say for something like SS01 if you get it from a "certain vendor" you can be pretty confident you're getting what was advertised.
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ShroomeryReader
Stranger

Registered: 09/21/16
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Re: any experience with any of the named Trichocereus clones? [Re: DGB]
#23793810 - 11/02/16 06:55 AM (7 years, 2 months ago) |
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Quote:
DGB said: ..i was thinking more something like SS01-01-03 ect since the original vendor is still around and you know if you get it from them you get the real thing.
And this was why I had confidence in the correct identification of the Ogunbodede clone I obtained.
These desired clones are out there, and it will just take time for there to be enough to go around.
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Spore Ninja
PsychoMycoPhile


Registered: 10/25/16
Posts: 161
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Re: any experience with any of the named Trichocereus clones? [Re: DGB]
#23794593 - 11/02/16 01:31 PM (7 years, 2 months ago) |
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Quote:
DGB said:
Quote:
Spore Ninja said:
Quote:
DGB said: I think towards the end there he started talking about identifying new alkaloids, which would take a lot of time but he's also going after exact spectrum analysis, to give exact % of contents and which is or isn't present and what each does. Because from the way he's talking about it sounds like he's describing isolation of unknown alkaloids.
The list we were talking about is less about exact spectrum break down and identification values and more just is said plant active or not.
*obtain X known cutting from known vendor Y* *eat X cutting from known vendor Y* *Wait* *Report* " X cutting from known vendor Y was active for me" or " X cutting from known vendor Y was not active for me" *repeat with multiple people* if 2 or more people come back to say "X cutting from known vendor Y was active for me" we can probably add it to the list of active clones. The hang up is currently very few people are willing to come forward and say " X cutting from known vendor Y was active for me"
I understand what you're saying, but I think the same methods would be used for testing just for the primary alkaloid. and A) There's a LOT of variety and even outright misrepresentation of different strains/species. B) there are a LOT of variables that affect the alkaloid score.
So using a top quality source/vendor would be the best way to guarantee quality. It's still somewhat of a crapshoot- but at least you have much better odds that way.
or go the budget route and take your chances. Buy a bunch of different types and keep working through them until you find one you like.
well yes that's why i wanted to create a database for known cuttings, assuming you get it though the original seller or other reputable vendor and are in fact getting what its advertised as you would have a point of reference on activity. at least on shroomery you would not be able to include the vendor or source but that could easily be found if you know what your looking for. im kinda assuming people would be getting said cutting though a good verified vendor and not some auction site with a seller based out of china selling "rare super special mega Juuls Giant"
Great find on the article!
So next you have to decide on a methodology- do you want to pick 3-5 varieties/cultivars and concentrate on them, or- do you ant to try to screen 10 or more to find some good ones??
We also need to somehow account for fluctuations in content due to season , watering patterns and who know hat other variables.
I'd say picking 3 or 4 well known ones and finding good representative samples would be the best route.
We're going to need solid vendors for this though...not just random ebay guys.
Has anyone done any DNA analysis on the cacti? I saw Rockefeller post some genetic tree charts of mushrooms awhile back...anything similar for the cactus?
-------------------- I'm interested in Dr. Pollock's work and his (especially older) strains. Anyone have pix of his Shroommobile RV?? PSA: Protonmail offers free, encrypted email hosted in privacy loving Switzerland. Red Phone / Signal offer free encrypted phone calls and texting between users. All of these programs are available free for PC and Android or apple and are available in the respective stores or online by googling the names. Stay safe out there! The Electronic Freedom Foundation's review of text and messaging program's security is here>>> https://www.eff.org/node/82654
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Spore Ninja
PsychoMycoPhile


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Re: any experience with any of the named Trichocereus clones? [Re: Spore Ninja]
#23795989 - 11/02/16 09:34 PM (7 years, 2 months ago) |
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OK, so far if I had to pick what to put my money on, I think I'd pick some Juuls, the mallacht OTB, and Lumberjack. Not sure if that last one is an exclusive or not. Those would be the ones from cuttings, but seeds open up more possibilities, especially with regard to hybrids. I'd probably avoid any of the F2 hybrids though. One of the vendors has 3 or more pages of seeds, so it's taking me awhile to compare them all. I was surprised at how vast a selection they had.
And I'd include Ogunbodede in the list, but it seems to be grown in unobtainium...so only time will tell on that one
Edit to add: yeahh.. Juuls may have been a hasty decision...maybe I'd add a hybrid to the list instead. The bridgesii seem to to be the best bets so far... still looking through the seed list... this makes cannabis looks simple...
-------------------- I'm interested in Dr. Pollock's work and his (especially older) strains. Anyone have pix of his Shroommobile RV?? PSA: Protonmail offers free, encrypted email hosted in privacy loving Switzerland. Red Phone / Signal offer free encrypted phone calls and texting between users. All of these programs are available free for PC and Android or apple and are available in the respective stores or online by googling the names. Stay safe out there! The Electronic Freedom Foundation's review of text and messaging program's security is here>>> https://www.eff.org/node/82654
Edited by Spore Ninja (11/03/16 01:29 PM)
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Grey Fox

Registered: 01/22/15
Posts: 2,652
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Re: any experience with any of the named Trichocereus clones? [Re: Spore Ninja]
#23796259 - 11/02/16 11:08 PM (7 years, 2 months ago) |
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There are several different plants in trade under the name Juul's Giant. However the original, authentic one matches the variety described as Juul's Giant (A) in Trout's Notes on San Pedro. While it is certainly active it is weaker than a standard bridgesii, though the quality of the experience is very nice. Not sure that it would go at the top of the list for a must have variety.
-------------------- IT WAS ALL A DREAM
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DGB
Stranger
Registered: 09/19/16
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Re: any experience with any of the named Trichocereus clones? [Re: Grey Fox]
#23796272 - 11/02/16 11:13 PM (7 years, 2 months ago) |
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https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/18005647/fpart/290/vc/1#18005647
per milktruck
"Have personally eaten ss01, ss02, juuls, fields macro, some typical peru, and a few typical bridgesii and pachanoi. All prepared the same. Way, boiled down over six hours or so to a couple shots Worth of snotty goop (bridgesii "shots" tend to be MUCH thinner consistency and much easier to get down faster as well. Also lends itself to less stomach discomfort because it passes through the GI much quicker than the usual thick, goopy, snot like liquid)
On the whole, bridgesii and the brige hybrids, IMO of course, are by far the trichos with the highest shamanic efficacy
Ss02 was on the potent side of average for bridgesii, juuls is pretty good but ss02 and ss01 are more potent, Fields Macro is pretty insanely potent for a torch variety. And I've heard through the grape vine,from respectable people, the OTB Bridgesii is the most potent cactus pretty much anyone that's had it has ever had, a few inches is good and strong..but sadly this is only hear-say coming from me..haven't been able to get ahold of it...I also hear great things is psycho and Eileen.. Yowie Pachanoi is supposed to be insanely good,as well as landfill.
Out of cacti I've eaten that have been well active juuls was the weakest, but still active enough to boil to an easily drinkable amount. I tend to dose everything but bridgesii by weight, but that's just because bridgesii IS consistent enough to dose by length 90% of the time
There seem to be three main things that lend to naming a clone, abnormally high weather and cold resistance, oddity in appearance, or ridiculous fuck off levels of potency xD "
Edited by DGB (11/02/16 11:13 PM)
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theMallacht
Clandestine Hero


Registered: 04/25/09
Posts: 3,428
Last seen: 1 year, 30 days
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Re: any experience with any of the named Trichocereus clones? *DELETED* [Re: Spore Ninja]
#23796429 - 11/03/16 12:14 AM (7 years, 2 months ago) |
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Post deleted by Mostly_HarmlessReason for deletion: Source discussion/request is NOT allowed. In order to preserve both our sources and the Shroomery's sponsors. So please do not create threads, or post in others, specifically asking for sources. Even if your intent is for users to send you that info in a PM, it is still not permitted.
Vendor discussion is also not permitted, whether it is good or bad makes no difference. If you find info on a vendor page, please just copy and paste it into your post. We want to keep our sponsors.
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DGB
Stranger
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Re: any experience with any of the named Trichocereus clones? [Re: Spore Ninja]
#23796572 - 11/03/16 02:23 AM (7 years, 2 months ago) |
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Quote:
Spore Ninja said: OK, so far if I had to pick what to put my money on, I think I'd pick some Juuls, the mallacht OTB, and Lumberjack. Not sure if that last one is an exclusive or not. Those would be the ones from cuttings, but seeds open up more possibilities, especially with regard to hybrids. I'd probably avoid any of the F2 hybrids though. One of the vendors has 5 or more pages of seeds, so it's taking me awhile to compare them all. I was surprised at how vast a selection they had.
And I'd include Ogunbodede in the list, but it seems to be grown in unobtainium...so only time will tell on that one
Originally when I first started researching the clones out there I decided early on I wanted an SS02 at the least, and since I was going to be getting that from a ..certain vendor, I figured I might as well get some other things, because of my area I wanted a Pachanoi because of its water resistance and fast growth, I was thinking of maybe Torres & Torres or a Kimnach cut and depending on the price maybe an SS01 too just so I could say I own a Peruvian torch.
After more researching I decided instead of the SS01 I wanted to get a Lumberjack instead since it kept coming up as very potent every time it was mentioned. Like juul's giant The OTB was of interest but at the time I considered it to have too many unknows, too many variables to seriously consider it without more 3rd party feedback.
Although due to multiple resent…revelations in the past day I think I'm going to rethink my plan.
I'm thinking, I still want to go for the SS02 and try my luck with getting a small Ogunbodode cut, that would cover a Bridgesii and a future Pachanoi once it gets up to size, if either one lives up to the hype that should basically make me set, everything after whether it turns out bunk or not is just research so from there I would forgo the SS01 and save up for either a Lumberjack, OTB, or maybe a landfill but I would hopefully already have a Pachanoi so probably not, I guess it depends on how OTB compares to a Lumberjack. Does it really live up to the hype and is it really that much better genetics to warrant the price difference.
Hopefully there's more info out there and people willing to come forward on what thieve tried.
TLDR I think I'll try for an SS02, Ogunbodode and +- OTB or lumberjack.
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modern.shaman
San Mescalito




Registered: 05/09/12
Posts: 3,224
Loc: Zone 13
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Re: any experience with any of the named Trichocereus clones? [Re: DGB]
#23796680 - 11/03/16 04:16 AM (7 years, 2 months ago) |
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Another thing is people have reported that Elieen, and psycho are really strong but these where from the original mother plant that was very thick cuttings. Most people consider them common potency but with fast growth which is a plus. If you have tye time growing from seed is a great route to go
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El Torcho
Time for tea?


Registered: 04/16/15
Posts: 1,365
Loc: Lone Pine Hill
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Re: any experience with any of the named Trichocereus clones? [Re: modern.shaman]
#23796707 - 11/03/16 04:57 AM (7 years, 2 months ago) |
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Lots of free advertising in this thread.
I thought we weren't supposed to discuss commercial suppliers.
Huh........weird.
--------------------
"Well it sounds trivial, but the key insight is . . . . . you don't know shit" ~Dennis McKenna "There is more to human existence and to reality itself than science can ever give us access to." ~His Holiness, The 14th Dalai Lama
Edited by El Torcho (11/03/16 05:08 AM)
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DGB
Stranger
Registered: 09/19/16
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Re: any experience with any of the named Trichocereus clones? [Re: modern.shaman]
#23797197 - 11/03/16 10:52 AM (7 years, 2 months ago) |
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Quote:
modern.shaman said: Another thing is people have reported that Elieen, and psycho are really strong but these where from the original mother plant that was very thick cuttings. Most people consider them common potency but with fast growth which is a plus. If you have tye time growing from seed is a great route to go
i ordered 30something s pachXpach seeds about 2 weeks ago. when they came in there ware actually 300+. so i have those all growing now, as far as i can see most if not all have sprouted already. so in 3-4 years ill have more then enough to go though. iv been also thinking of getting some Bridgesii seeds when i get my ss02
Edited by DGB (11/03/16 10:53 AM)
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DGB
Stranger
Registered: 09/19/16
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Re: any experience with any of the named Trichocereus clones? [Re: DGB]
#23898777 - 12/06/16 12:59 AM (7 years, 1 month ago) |
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So, I ended up getting an SS01,SS02,penis plant,OTB,Lumberjack,juuls giant, pach crested clone A, and a cuzcoensis. I'm still looking at getting an SS-Ogunbodode but at $45 for a 6inch cut I'm a little uncertain, like if this is actually the same cut that everyone talks about and if it is actually as good as the hype says. I know there are a bunch of cuttings floating around the community from multiple people showing pics but so far no one seems to have tried it yet, I've seen a bunch of "I've heard" or "my friend said" but no firsthand accounts.
What do people think? Is it worth getting?
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ferrel_human
stone eater



Registered: 06/26/09
Posts: 16,318
Loc: Texas
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Re: any experience with any of the named Trichocereus clones? [Re: DGB]
#23898782 - 12/06/16 01:06 AM (7 years, 1 month ago) |
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Quote:
DGB said: So, I ended up getting an SS01,SS02,penis plant,OTB,Lumberjack,juuls giant, pach crested clone A, and a cuzcoensis. I'm still looking at getting an SS-Ogunbodode but at $45 for a 6inch cut I'm a little uncertain, like if this is actually the same cut that everyone talks about and if it is actually as good as the hype says. I know there are a bunch of cuttings floating around the community from multiple people showing pics but so far no one seems to have tried it yet, I've seen a bunch of "I've heard" or "my friend said" but no firsthand accounts.
What do people think? Is it worth getting?
Meh. Get it. Fuckit. Why not?
-------------------- Nature is my church and walking through it is gospel. It tells no lies and reveals all to those who look, and listen, closely. -Karode
 Looking for Mimosa tenuiflora seeds. Buttons for trade
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DGB
Stranger
Registered: 09/19/16
Posts: 437
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Re: any experience with any of the named Trichocereus clones? [Re: ferrel_human]
#23898789 - 12/06/16 01:14 AM (7 years, 1 month ago) |
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Quote:
ferrel_human said:
Quote:
DGB said: So, I ended up getting an SS01,SS02,penis plant,OTB,Lumberjack,juuls giant, pach crested clone A, and a cuzcoensis. I'm still looking at getting an SS-Ogunbodode but at $45 for a 6inch cut I'm a little uncertain, like if this is actually the same cut that everyone talks about and if it is actually as good as the hype says. I know there are a bunch of cuttings floating around the community from multiple people showing pics but so far no one seems to have tried it yet, I've seen a bunch of "I've heard" or "my friend said" but no firsthand accounts.
What do people think? Is it worth getting?
Meh. Get it. Fuckit. Why not?
Because it’s a $45 plus shipping cutting that is the hype is real would make it worth a try. But if it is just hype I might as well just buy something else. people do have them just wondering if anyone has verified the hype or not.
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ferrel_human
stone eater



Registered: 06/26/09
Posts: 16,318
Loc: Texas
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Re: any experience with any of the named Trichocereus clones? [Re: DGB]
#23898806 - 12/06/16 01:31 AM (7 years, 1 month ago) |
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People by the cut. Named cut. Tried cut. Its expensive but worth it, it seems. Why dont you just find a clone? Somwthing good that you know.
Goodluck with what wver you decide.
-------------------- Nature is my church and walking through it is gospel. It tells no lies and reveals all to those who look, and listen, closely. -Karode
 Looking for Mimosa tenuiflora seeds. Buttons for trade
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drakenov
Wandering Dude

Registered: 04/05/10
Posts: 290
Last seen: 2 years, 7 months
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Re: any experience with any of the named Trichocereus clones? [Re: ferrel_human]
#23899388 - 12/06/16 09:36 AM (7 years, 1 month ago) |
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I can't wait to try Ogunbodede I'm patient with him though I'm just propogating the shit out of him right now. gonna straight up eat a foot and let him have at me lol
anyone know if the BBB clone from ma "buthole"is strong?
Edited by drakenov (12/06/16 02:08 PM)
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El Torcho
Time for tea?


Registered: 04/16/15
Posts: 1,365
Loc: Lone Pine Hill
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Re: any experience with any of the named Trichocereus clones? [Re: drakenov]
#23899463 - 12/06/16 10:12 AM (7 years, 1 month ago) |
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Reputable purveyors I would trust.
I wouldn't buy an SS-Ogunbodode cut off eBay and think I got the real thing though...
And mine should be here soon.
--------------------
"Well it sounds trivial, but the key insight is . . . . . you don't know shit" ~Dennis McKenna "There is more to human existence and to reality itself than science can ever give us access to." ~His Holiness, The 14th Dalai Lama
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DGB
Stranger
Registered: 09/19/16
Posts: 437
Last seen: 9 months, 2 days
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Re: any experience with any of the named Trichocereus clones? [Re: El Torcho]
#23899883 - 12/06/16 01:04 PM (7 years, 1 month ago) |
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Well it would come from a specific very reputable vendor/nursery, they gave me an estimate when it would be ready for cuttings again, the question is, is this actually the same 4.7% cut that Ogunbodede tested in his 14 taxa paper? He's tested and worked with quite a few cuttings how do we know this is that one and not some other random cut he had? As I've mentioned a bunch of people have cuts but everyone still seems to be in the propagation phase of ownership. I don’t know if anyone has actually tried and bioassay their cuts yet to confirm.
There's also "landfill" it has a little more info about it out there but the same problem as Ogunbodede, all the feedback on it is "I heard" "my friend said" "rumor says" "I'll eat some and report back. ~posted 2 years ago," I see it pop up on the internet all the time, people citing them as the best available but when pressed for more detail it always comes back to, "well I've never but my friend said" and I'm kind of wondering how much of that actually is a friend who tried verses everyone reading the same exact post and just parroting that every time the subject comes up. Like a meme bouncing around the echo chamber that is the cacti community. They may in fact be as potent as rumored but how much of the feedback was real verses not.
But then again, I did have to read though how many of trout's books and crawled how many internet forums just to get like 2 quotes about SS02 and that cut is everywhere, everyone seems to have one. So, I guess I really shouldn’t be too surprised there's minimal out there about Ogunbodede and landfill.
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ShroomeryReader
Stranger

Registered: 09/21/16
Posts: 32
Last seen: 7 years, 1 month
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Re: any experience with any of the named Trichocereus clones? [Re: DGB]
#23904292 - 12/07/16 04:59 PM (7 years, 1 month ago) |
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I don't think the sole supplier of Ogunbodede cuttings on the market would mislabel any of their clones. If you have confidence in their ID and in the researchers HPLC tests, then this clones is the highest alkaloid Trichocereus yet tested.
That being said, it would require only a very small amount ( <1g ) of a plant sample to verify. Quantity of alkaloid through weighed extraction, and a basic home TLC kit to verify the identity the specific alkaloid(s).
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DGB
Stranger
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Re: any experience with any of the named Trichocereus clones? [Re: ShroomeryReader] 1
#23904788 - 12/07/16 07:28 PM (7 years, 1 month ago) |
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What i mean is less if the supplier is mislabeleing and more how do we know this Ogunbodede is the clone that was in the study? Because it's not like the supplier can say yes this is the 4.7 -5% clone from that paper. As mentioned Ogunbodede has done work with many other trichocereus cuttings how do we knew is not one of those?
Basicly the supplier just sells it under the name Ogunbodede, were did "this is the 4.7% cut" claim come from? Was there any form of direct confirmation or are we just filling in blanks and assumeing that's what this cut is?
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El Torcho
Time for tea?


Registered: 04/16/15
Posts: 1,365
Loc: Lone Pine Hill
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Re: any experience with any of the named Trichocereus clones? [Re: DGB]
#23904841 - 12/07/16 07:39 PM (7 years, 1 month ago) |
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Their description says something along the lines of 'the cut that tested highest in Ogunbodede study'.
--------------------
"Well it sounds trivial, but the key insight is . . . . . you don't know shit" ~Dennis McKenna "There is more to human existence and to reality itself than science can ever give us access to." ~His Holiness, The 14th Dalai Lama
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DGB
Stranger
Registered: 09/19/16
Posts: 437
Last seen: 9 months, 2 days
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Re: any experience with any of the named Trichocereus clones? [Re: El Torcho]
#23904891 - 12/07/16 07:49 PM (7 years, 1 month ago) |
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They acctally said that? Kinda surprised they would be so blatant or obvious about that. I would have exspected them to dance around the description a little more like they do with their other cuts....i assume we Are talking about the same largescale ethnobotanical cacti nursery right?
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El Torcho
Time for tea?


Registered: 04/16/15
Posts: 1,365
Loc: Lone Pine Hill
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Re: any experience with any of the named Trichocereus clones? [Re: DGB]
#23905101 - 12/07/16 08:44 PM (7 years, 1 month ago) |
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I only saw it in their rare collection catalog once and that was like 2 years ago. But yeah, it said something to that effect.
--------------------
"Well it sounds trivial, but the key insight is . . . . . you don't know shit" ~Dennis McKenna "There is more to human existence and to reality itself than science can ever give us access to." ~His Holiness, The 14th Dalai Lama
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ferrel_human
stone eater



Registered: 06/26/09
Posts: 16,318
Loc: Texas
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Re: any experience with any of the named Trichocereus clones? [Re: El Torcho]
#23905108 - 12/07/16 08:49 PM (7 years, 1 month ago) |
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There are so many other good clones out there that that time tracking this clone down is wasted. I have many good potent clones. I rarely partake but what the deal with trying to find this magical cut that is so potent? Maybe they are wrong. Maybe its just something to make money. People will say anything to make a quick buck.
-------------------- Nature is my church and walking through it is gospel. It tells no lies and reveals all to those who look, and listen, closely. -Karode
 Looking for Mimosa tenuiflora seeds. Buttons for trade
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El Torcho
Time for tea?


Registered: 04/16/15
Posts: 1,365
Loc: Lone Pine Hill
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Re: any experience with any of the named Trichocereus clones? [Re: ferrel_human]
#23905220 - 12/07/16 09:29 PM (7 years, 1 month ago) |
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I trust this supplier. It's a full scale operation, of which trichos are only a tiny part of their collection. I'm sure they can keep cuttings straight. I mean I can, it's not too hard. They charge more for the rarer and more high demand cultivars. Simple economics.
Really all you gotta do is send them a check and tell them to put you on the list, and then wait. Hopefully I'll have a pup or two next fall to trade.
--------------------
"Well it sounds trivial, but the key insight is . . . . . you don't know shit" ~Dennis McKenna "There is more to human existence and to reality itself than science can ever give us access to." ~His Holiness, The 14th Dalai Lama
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Grey Fox

Registered: 01/22/15
Posts: 2,652
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Re: any experience with any of the named Trichocereus clones? [Re: ferrel_human]
#23905532 - 12/07/16 11:41 PM (7 years, 1 month ago) |
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Quote:
ferrel_human said: There are so many other good clones out there that that time tracking this clone down is wasted. I have many good potent clones. I rarely partake but what the deal with trying to find this magical cut that is so potent? Maybe they are wrong. Maybe its just something to make money. People will say anything to make a quick buck.
-------------------- IT WAS ALL A DREAM
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DGB
Stranger
Registered: 09/19/16
Posts: 437
Last seen: 9 months, 2 days
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Re: any experience with any of the named Trichocereus clones? [Re: El Torcho]
#23905607 - 12/08/16 12:28 AM (7 years, 1 month ago) |
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Quote:
El Torcho said: I trust this supplier. It's a full scale operation, of which trichos are only a tiny part of their collection. I'm sure they can keep cuttings straight. I mean I can, it's not too hard. They charge more for the rarer and more high demand cultivars. Simple economics.
Really all you gotta do is send them a check and tell them to put you on the list, and then wait. Hopefully I'll have a pup or two next fall to trade. 
They do wait lists? I thought it was first come first served kind of thing...just with 2 weeks shipping snail mail and waiting for a response.
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El Torcho
Time for tea?


Registered: 04/16/15
Posts: 1,365
Loc: Lone Pine Hill
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Re: any experience with any of the named Trichocereus clones? [Re: DGB]
#23905889 - 12/08/16 06:30 AM (7 years, 1 month ago) |
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I emailed them and asked. They estimated early next year.... I sent the check, they cashed it, now I wait....
--------------------
"Well it sounds trivial, but the key insight is . . . . . you don't know shit" ~Dennis McKenna "There is more to human existence and to reality itself than science can ever give us access to." ~His Holiness, The 14th Dalai Lama
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ShroomeryReader
Stranger

Registered: 09/21/16
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Re: any experience with any of the named Trichocereus clones? [Re: El Torcho]
#23905928 - 12/08/16 07:04 AM (7 years, 1 month ago) |
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Quote:
El Torcho said: I emailed them and asked. They estimated early next year.... I sent the check, they cashed it, now I wait....
Same here. Luckily, they had one left at the time. The cuts are very small, but the genetics are what you're after.
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Grey Fox

Registered: 01/22/15
Posts: 2,652
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Re: any experience with any of the named Trichocereus clones? [Re: ShroomeryReader]
#23905961 - 12/08/16 07:33 AM (7 years, 1 month ago) |
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I've heard that all bridgesii are potent. I know that isn't the case with pachanoi or peruvianus. But isn't it true that any healthy bridgesii will be strong? If so then why are named clones in so much demand?
-------------------- IT WAS ALL A DREAM
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Mostly_Harmless
wyrd bið ful aræd



Registered: 05/12/09
Posts: 5,043
Loc: Perfidious Albion
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Re: any experience with any of the named Trichocereus clones? [Re: Grey Fox]
#23905968 - 12/08/16 07:37 AM (7 years, 1 month ago) |
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Because they are something else for label collectors to buy
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ShroomeryReader
Stranger

Registered: 09/21/16
Posts: 32
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Re: any experience with any of the named Trichocereus clones? [Re: Grey Fox]
#23905996 - 12/08/16 07:50 AM (7 years, 1 month ago) |
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Yes, Bridgesii are the most consistent. They are easier to identify and furthermore also contain other alkaloids that have additional interesting effects.
Some Bridgesii clones are said to be more desirable if they are believed / claimed to have higher concentrations or demonstrate strong growth traits, such as resistance to rot. However, clones that were once universally thought be the most superior (such as Eileen) have later been said (by long term Trichophiles) to seem no different than the average Bridgesii.
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Grey Fox

Registered: 01/22/15
Posts: 2,652
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Re: any experience with any of the named Trichocereus clones? [Re: ShroomeryReader]
#23906079 - 12/08/16 08:37 AM (7 years, 1 month ago) |
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That is good to know. I'm fortunate enough to live in an area where bridgesii and peruvianus and non pc pach pop up from time to time in local nurseries. Sometimes even nice sized, healthy plants at reasonable prices. I've been focusing on trying to acquire healthy specimens from these local sources, especially bridgesii. They arent the super elite clones that people talk about. But i think that if i treat them really well they will reward me over time.
By the way I've seen a similar phenomenom with fig tree varieties. Almost a decade ago i got into collecting different varieties of fig trees (ficus carica). It seemed like every year there were one or two brand new varieties in trade that people would go crazy over and pay huge sums on ebay to acquire. The next year it would be something different. It just seemed like there were a handful of sellers getting pretty rich on all the hype.
-------------------- IT WAS ALL A DREAM
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El Torcho
Time for tea?


Registered: 04/16/15
Posts: 1,365
Loc: Lone Pine Hill
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Re: any experience with any of the named Trichocereus clones? [Re: Grey Fox]
#23906261 - 12/08/16 10:18 AM (7 years, 1 month ago) |
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Eileen is the most problematic cacti I have. . .
I can see why it's named after a woman.... Doesn't take full sun, most problems with rotting cuts, always worried about cuts... she finicky. No idea of her potency though.
--------------------
"Well it sounds trivial, but the key insight is . . . . . you don't know shit" ~Dennis McKenna "There is more to human existence and to reality itself than science can ever give us access to." ~His Holiness, The 14th Dalai Lama
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drakenov
Wandering Dude

Registered: 04/05/10
Posts: 290
Last seen: 2 years, 7 months
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Re: any experience with any of the named Trichocereus clones? [Re: El Torcho]
#23906581 - 12/08/16 11:47 AM (7 years, 1 month ago) |
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most finicky for me is baker5452 they just kept rotting until I grafted them then they seemed to stabilize and are now kinda thriving.
Eileen I just ignore and shes just growing along hopefully she takes off next year.
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nolongrlurkin
pre-shamanic warrior



Registered: 07/23/16
Posts: 611
Loc: florida
Last seen: 1 year, 6 months
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Re: any experience with any of the named Trichocereus clones? [Re: drakenov]
#23911763 - 12/09/16 10:59 PM (7 years, 1 month ago) |
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I've started my collection this year and I have quite a few names.. L.Jack, psycho0, validus, eileen.. The list goes on. I'm growing all these guys for the express purpose of extraction. Although I'm very New to the scene and just completed my first extraction with generic torch chips. 250G has yielded 1.65g of impure mescaline acetate. I will continue to use the d.limo tel for future extractions. I recently sourced 2 rs0004s from the oc kakster which I will dice and dry in the coming week. Il have wet, and dry weights, pictures and of course all the data of my yields from first pull to infinity until nothing is left to evaporate. I'm just waiting on my New Sep. Funnel..Stay tuned for more!!
-------------------- Cannabis for the body, cubensis for the mind, cactus for the spirit.
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DGB
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Re: any experience with any of the named Trichocereus clones? [Re: nolongrlurkin]
#23911802 - 12/09/16 11:18 PM (7 years, 1 month ago) |
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Quote:
nolongrlurkin said: I've started my collection this year and I have quite a few names.. L.Jack, psycho0, validus, eileen.. The list goes on. I'm growing all these guys for the express purpose of extraction. Although I'm very New to the scene and just completed my first extraction with generic torch chips. 250G has yielded 1.65g of impure mescaline acetate. I will continue to use the d.limo tel for future extractions. I recently sourced 2 rs0004s from the oc kakster which I will dice and dry in the coming week. Il have wet, and dry weights, pictures and of course all the data of my yields from first pull to infinity until nothing is left to evaporate. I'm just waiting on my New Sep. Funnel..Stay tuned for more!! 
Remember to document everything. It would be great to have numbers of dried weight to final exstration weight for multiple cuts. Even if that does very naturaly it would give a general idea, specialy if you have multiple results from the same clones to give a better average.
You should consider trying it on pc pach as well to set a baseline.
It would be great to have a little more information on potency of certain clones other then "it potent" or "its weak" i mean of course 1 or 2 exstraction results arnt definitive but as more mesurments are taken the better the adverage data becomes especialy if others start adding their results. Im still in my aquasition and propogation phase but hope to get to extracting sooner then later. Perhaps ill grab a rs0004s or two in the near future and try the same method you did and compair results. Altho i may plant and let them grow a little first to see uow my enviroment changes the contents. Well have too see.
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nolongrlurkin
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Re: any experience with any of the named Trichocereus clones? [Re: DGB]
#23911864 - 12/09/16 11:59 PM (7 years, 1 month ago) |
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That's a bet!! Not nearly enough people are willing to contribute by actually putting in work..
I'm most excited about a clone I got from a friend who collected It from an active ceremony in peru. Julio was the name of guide and so its name shall be julio forever more.. A 6 inch piece is what I was gifted, to which he said was a large enough piece for ceremonial purposes. He's a pach and he's put on a few inches since then and threw out roots almost instantly after callousing! Maybe I have a pic..

That's him on the left.
Don't you guys get it? True ceremonial genetics straight from the source. Not for sale.. Lol!
I did one more pull on my generic peruvian chips and it yielded a much different product.. Light tan slightly waxy substance.. I haven't weighed it yet but looks to be about .25g.. It looks completely different from what I've been getting.. I wonder what gives..
-------------------- Cannabis for the body, cubensis for the mind, cactus for the spirit.
Edited by nolongrlurkin (12/10/16 05:52 AM)
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modern.shaman
San Mescalito




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Re: any experience with any of the named Trichocereus clones? [Re: nolongrlurkin]
#23912614 - 12/10/16 09:57 AM (7 years, 1 month ago) |
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May be different in your case but ceremonial pachanoi were more symbolic then 'medicinal' in use.
Popular clones are popular for a reason people. Unnamed cacti don't mean it is weak just not a clone; most likely seed grown. Most bridgesii and non-pc pachanoi are powerful. I have no peruvianus cacti as they are extremely variable and would only grown one if it was a popular clone from a trusted member/seller.
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DGB
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Re: any experience with any of the named Trichocereus clones? [Re: modern.shaman]
#23912752 - 12/10/16 10:53 AM (7 years, 1 month ago) |
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Hmm. And i was thinking of grabbing some icaros dna since i have like 1000 bridg seeds on order. But i guess i should just stick with that for now.
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modern.shaman
San Mescalito




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Re: any experience with any of the named Trichocereus clones? [Re: DGB]
#23912806 - 12/10/16 11:24 AM (7 years, 1 month ago) |
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icaros are different as they are almost considered a cultivar from seed. They are pretty uniform from seed; potency does differ a bit but visually quite uniform from seed.
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mandrin13
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Re: any experience with any of the named Trichocereus clones? [Re: modern.shaman]
#23912956 - 12/10/16 12:16 PM (7 years, 1 month ago) |
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Quote:
modern.shaman said: I have no peruvianus cacti as they are extremely variable and would only grown one if it was a popular clone from a trusted member/seller.
I bought mine for its appearance and had no intention of sampling it originally, but changed my mind as was pleasantly surprised even though it did yield less than other types, it was a pretty good result for something I had no expectations for. Yay
-------------------- Even Jesus got stoned.
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ShroomeryReader
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Re: any experience with any of the named Trichocereus clones? [Re: mandrin13]
#23912978 - 12/10/16 12:24 PM (7 years, 1 month ago) |
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I find the appearance of the Icaros cacti to be my favorite by far, especially the way they look growing there in the Peruvian mountains. Stunning.
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DGB
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Re: any experience with any of the named Trichocereus clones? [Re: mandrin13]
#23912986 - 12/10/16 12:26 PM (7 years, 1 month ago) |
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<SNIP>
- Links to sponsors are allowed as long as it adds to the value of the thread and is not marketing the product. No non sponsor links are allowed, this includes links to auction sites!
- If you need to show a pic that is on a non sponsor, vendor web-page, either embed the picture in your post or upload it (if it is not copyrighted). No names of non sponsor vendors may be posted in the pic.
I like the way a lot of them look. Not sure how likely it would be to get one that looks like this from seed tho. I already have a bunch of bridg seeds, a few pure pach seeds and a juuls×bertha comeing. Might as well get some pruvianus too. More for the look then potency. Put them next to my pilocereus they can be blue together.
Edited by Mostly_Harmless (12/10/16 01:38 PM)
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ferrel_human
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Re: any experience with any of the named Trichocereus clones? [Re: modern.shaman]
#23913009 - 12/10/16 12:39 PM (7 years, 1 month ago) |
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Quote:
modern.shaman said: icaros are different as they are almost considered a cultivar from seed. They are pretty uniform from seed; potency does differ a bit but visually quite uniform from seed.
So true. I have 2 sets of genes but the blue on these is amazing. Not very uniform in growth. One grows to the size of a mans arm and the other grows to the size of a mans thigh. The rest i had looked the same but i eventually gave them away.
-------------------- Nature is my church and walking through it is gospel. It tells no lies and reveals all to those who look, and listen, closely. -Karode
 Looking for Mimosa tenuiflora seeds. Buttons for trade
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nolongrlurkin
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Re: any experience with any of the named Trichocereus clones? [Re: ferrel_human]
#23913440 - 12/10/16 03:15 PM (7 years, 1 month ago) |
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2Ft of rs0004!! I feel like I'm having deja vu just thinking about it!!
-------------------- Cannabis for the body, cubensis for the mind, cactus for the spirit.
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DGB
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Re: any experience with any of the named Trichocereus clones? [Re: nolongrlurkin]
#23917991 - 12/11/16 09:21 PM (7 years, 1 month ago) |
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Quote:
nolongrlurkin said: 2Ft of rs0004!! I feel like I'm having deja vu just thinking about it!!

those destined for the blender of the flower pot?
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nolongrlurkin
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Re: any experience with any of the named Trichocereus clones? [Re: DGB]
#23918020 - 12/11/16 09:34 PM (7 years, 1 month ago) |
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Tey are headed to the chop shop.. In a post above I mentioned Il be extracting these two for science.. And me.. And my psyche.. And for you guys!! Good info is hard to come by so I figured Il help out. They are macrogonus rs0004 from the original cultivator.
-------------------- Cannabis for the body, cubensis for the mind, cactus for the spirit.
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amp244
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Re: any experience with any of the named Trichocereus clones? [Re: nolongrlurkin]
#23936504 - 12/17/16 08:51 PM (7 years, 1 month ago) |
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Quote:
nolongrlurkin said: I'm just waiting on my New Sep. Funnel..Stay tuned for more!! 
Yea, I had a separatory funnel once... Got a base, rod, and clamp to hold it up. Filled it up and it began to tip. I had a mason jar in my right hand. My natural reaction was to prevent the funnel from falling. I contacted the funnel with the mason jar. The funnel shattered. Xylene spilled everywhere. I salvaged what HCL I could, and was pissed about the whole ordeal. I got the 1000ml funnel, so I had a lot of fluid in it before it began to tip.
-------------------- How to Convert a Normal 24-hour Light Timer into a Short Cycle Repeating Timer "Monopoly, besides, is a great enemy to good management, which can never be universally established but in consequence of that free and universal competition which forces everybody to have recourse in it for the sake of self-defense." -Adam Smith
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DGB
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Re: any experience with any of the named Trichocereus clones? [Re: amp244]
#23936597 - 12/17/16 09:29 PM (7 years, 1 month ago) |
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I plan on getting a funnel eventually but I'm more concerned with sourcing the reagents for extraction, because crystal meth is such a major problem in my area that anything even remotely used in it production isn't available anymore. Like they don’t sell sodium hydroxide here anymore, stores don’t sell it as drain cleaner, hardware stores stopped carrying it, hobby shops and soap making stores don’t sell it anymore ect ect, most solvents are limited to small amounts, and because both are flammable or caustic almost no one is willing to ship it here, can't ship it on a plane so you gotta ship by ground..cept there's no ground shipping to my area only plane. The very few places that do have it will raise an eyebrow unless you're in construction.
I can still get these thigs but its going to be expensive, so got to keep researching on the best way to extract with the least amount of reagent use or the ability to recycle reagents. That would be the next roadblock to creating a log of weight to extract for me, after sourcing and prorogating a supply of genetics anyways.
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amp244
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Re: any experience with any of the named Trichocereus clones? [Re: DGB]
#23936607 - 12/17/16 09:33 PM (7 years, 1 month ago) |
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where are you? Cali? You can always just go to another state. Nevada sells 100% NaOH
-------------------- How to Convert a Normal 24-hour Light Timer into a Short Cycle Repeating Timer "Monopoly, besides, is a great enemy to good management, which can never be universally established but in consequence of that free and universal competition which forces everybody to have recourse in it for the sake of self-defense." -Adam Smith
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DGB
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Re: any experience with any of the named Trichocereus clones? [Re: amp244]
#23936614 - 12/17/16 09:35 PM (7 years, 1 month ago) |
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im on an island
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amp244
Sporocarp Stretching


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Re: any experience with any of the named Trichocereus clones? [Re: DGB]
#23936682 - 12/17/16 10:02 PM (7 years, 1 month ago) |
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I see. Meth is a pretty big problem everywhere huh?
There are methods for separating the NaOH from some of the drain clearing products that aren't 100% lye. I can't help you with any of that, and I imagine it is dangerous.
-------------------- How to Convert a Normal 24-hour Light Timer into a Short Cycle Repeating Timer "Monopoly, besides, is a great enemy to good management, which can never be universally established but in consequence of that free and universal competition which forces everybody to have recourse in it for the sake of self-defense." -Adam Smith
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nolongrlurkin
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Re: any experience with any of the named Trichocereus clones? [Re: amp244]
#23939896 - 12/19/16 08:55 AM (7 years, 1 month ago) |
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Pickling salt, also known as lime or calcium hydroxide can be used with a lot of teks replacing NaOH. I've heard sunflower seed oil can replace xylene or d.limonine but a little research would be in order for that route.
-------------------- Cannabis for the body, cubensis for the mind, cactus for the spirit.
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spaceman101
Friend to all



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Re: any experience with any of the named Trichocereus clones? [Re: nolongrlurkin]
#23940713 - 12/19/16 04:04 PM (7 years, 1 month ago) |
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Fucking AMAZING info in this thread 
I want in on this
-------------------- ------------- Check out my Pollen Trade thread for spreading Good genetics far and wide Great Vendors thread where we can discuss "Non Shroomery" Vendors that sell good products worth checking into A few things I wanna get my hands on check it out and let me know if you have any of these Need help getting started growing mushrooms Here's The Noob Forum
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DGB
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Re: any experience with any of the named Trichocereus clones? [Re: spaceman101]
#23940759 - 12/19/16 04:25 PM (7 years, 1 month ago) |
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Quote:
spaceman101 said: Fucking AMAZING info in this thread 
I want in on this 
Just remember to add and exsperiences or comparisons you may find.
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nolongrlurkin
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Re: any experience with any of the named Trichocereus clones? [Re: DGB]
#23941578 - 12/19/16 08:11 PM (7 years, 1 month ago) |
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2 ft of fresh macrogonus rs0004 weighing approx 2000g (4.6lbs) was diced (nothing removed except for spines)and Boiled in lemon water thrice, along with a few hours of condensing left me with 8oz of watery juices. I filtered through an ultra fine steel mesh screen to remove extremely tiny particals. 8 oz of liquid is still observed after multiple filter runs. I have decided to add a lye or similar solution to raise the ph and pull the alks out with d.limo and salt with acetic acid. I almost lost my will to extract when my first attempt yielded such a poor product, nearly void of mescaline. But the more I thought about it, the more I realized it was a successful attempt as other alkaloids were strongly influencing The experience. I think I just got some weak San Pedro chips. So I will try again but since I have an aqueous solution, I won't be able to use CaOH because it doesn't dissolve in water so I'm waiting to find a good source of NaOH or KOH.
-------------------- Cannabis for the body, cubensis for the mind, cactus for the spirit.
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amp244
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Re: any experience with any of the named Trichocereus clones? [Re: nolongrlurkin]
#23941770 - 12/19/16 09:19 PM (7 years, 1 month ago) |
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If they sell it in your area, and they have a lowes, get the crystal drain cleaner.
http://images.lowes.com/product/converted/033051/033051120878.jpg This jaunt
-------------------- How to Convert a Normal 24-hour Light Timer into a Short Cycle Repeating Timer "Monopoly, besides, is a great enemy to good management, which can never be universally established but in consequence of that free and universal competition which forces everybody to have recourse in it for the sake of self-defense." -Adam Smith
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DGB
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Re: any experience with any of the named Trichocereus clones? [Re: amp244]
#23941790 - 12/19/16 09:28 PM (7 years, 1 month ago) |
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Quote:
amp244 said: If they sell it in your area, and they have a lowes, get the crystal drain cleaner.
http://images.lowes.com/product/converted/033051/033051120878.jpg This jaunt
Ya, iv tried. Noone carries anything like that. Iv tryed lows, home depo, ace, ect ect iv looked though all brands and ingredients lists. They just dont sell it here at all. Even the soap/hobby stores said they dont/cant carry it anymore.
The only kind they sell is the one whoes ingredients lists the sodium hydroxide as "caustic" (like there really fooling anyone) but have a bunch of other crap like clorine,dye,some gel emulsifier ect.
Edited by DGB (12/19/16 09:42 PM)
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drakenov
Wandering Dude

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Re: any experience with any of the named Trichocereus clones? [Re: DGB]
#23941871 - 12/19/16 10:06 PM (7 years, 1 month ago) |
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I would try making my own lye if I were in your shoes or idk fucked?
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amp244
Sporocarp Stretching


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Re: any experience with any of the named Trichocereus clones? [Re: drakenov] 1
#23942022 - 12/19/16 11:32 PM (7 years, 1 month ago) |
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Just make sure you wear safety goggles, whatever you do.
-------------------- How to Convert a Normal 24-hour Light Timer into a Short Cycle Repeating Timer "Monopoly, besides, is a great enemy to good management, which can never be universally established but in consequence of that free and universal competition which forces everybody to have recourse in it for the sake of self-defense." -Adam Smith
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nolongrlurkin
pre-shamanic warrior



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Re: any experience with any of the named Trichocereus clones? [Re: amp244]
#23998502 - 01/10/17 03:15 PM (7 years, 19 days ago) |
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More on named clones-- pachanoi LER traits include fat growth and easy flowering. Its been around since the nineties--who knows if it's more or less magical than the next..
-------------------- Cannabis for the body, cubensis for the mind, cactus for the spirit.
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mandrin13
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Re: any experience with any of the named Trichocereus clones? [Re: nolongrlurkin]
#23999250 - 01/10/17 07:33 PM (7 years, 18 days ago) |
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Quote:
nolongrlurkin said: More on named clones-- pachanoi LER traits include fat growth and easy flowering. Its been around since the nineties--who knows if it's more or less magical than the next..
The heavy flowering is reason enough for any cactus grower living in a flower growing region. Aside from that, I only have 1 rooting at the moment, but it is a nice thick cut.....so 50% confirmed lol
-------------------- Even Jesus got stoned.
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nolongrlurkin
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Re: any experience with any of the named Trichocereus clones? [Re: mandrin13]
#23999256 - 01/10/17 07:35 PM (7 years, 18 days ago) |
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Thanks for the input mandrin!
-------------------- Cannabis for the body, cubensis for the mind, cactus for the spirit.
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SHROOMYG
Strange



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Re: any experience with any of the named Trichocereus clones? [Re: nolongrlurkin]
#24002456 - 01/11/17 09:20 PM (7 years, 17 days ago) |
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Out of 7 different crosses I started the Lers took off first
-------------------- “Plants are the missing link in the search to understand the human mind and its place in nature.” - Terrence McKenna
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DGB
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Re: any experience with any of the named Trichocereus clones? [Re: SHROOMYG]
#24002672 - 01/11/17 11:01 PM (7 years, 17 days ago) |
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Quote:
SHROOMYG said: Out of 7 different crosses I started the Lers took off first
Same, my oscar x ler seeds seemed to have the fastest germination of any of my crosses that iv planted.
Edited by DGB (01/11/17 11:04 PM)
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spaceman101
Friend to all



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Re: any experience with any of the named Trichocereus clones? [Re: DGB]
#24002850 - 01/12/17 12:23 AM (7 years, 17 days ago) |
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I noticed my Ler cross has had some of the best germination than almost any of the others (if not equal to the Icaros X (SS02XSS01))
-------------------- ------------- Check out my Pollen Trade thread for spreading Good genetics far and wide Great Vendors thread where we can discuss "Non Shroomery" Vendors that sell good products worth checking into A few things I wanna get my hands on check it out and let me know if you have any of these Need help getting started growing mushrooms Here's The Noob Forum
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SHROOMYG
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Re: any experience with any of the named Trichocereus clones? [Re: spaceman101]
#24003457 - 01/12/17 09:10 AM (7 years, 17 days ago) |
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Mine were the sso2xsso1 X ler a few seedlings are up and the others are just starting
-------------------- “Plants are the missing link in the search to understand the human mind and its place in nature.” - Terrence McKenna
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SHROOMYG
Strange



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Re: any experience with any of the named Trichocereus clones? [Re: SHROOMYG]
#24003486 - 01/12/17 09:23 AM (7 years, 17 days ago) |
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And back to named genetics, how much does it cost to test your cutting? And if someone was growing a garden solely for extraction where/if legal of course which cuttings would you run? Or would you try n start from scratch and pheno hunt in a sense.
SsO2 scop Pc Bridg Tqpc X juuls A San Pedro from Greece Pach X Peru
Those are the bigger cuttings I have 4-12"in and I have a pretty sweet seed collection /small seedlings of crosses , loph but I'm very interested in there magical properties & finding more info out on tested genetics and testing my own I'll be Gettn some more Wild pach cuttings like the ogun cut while I learn more but I would almost feel like it b a waste of time if I grew out a Peru and it turned out Cuzco where as other members wouldn't mind, maybe that will change soon, I'm baked like a cake good morning guys
-------------------- “Plants are the missing link in the search to understand the human mind and its place in nature.” - Terrence McKenna
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naum



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Re: any experience with any of the named Trichocereus clones? [Re: SHROOMYG]
#24003541 - 01/12/17 09:42 AM (7 years, 17 days ago) |
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If you're starting from seed, I would run a little of everything.
Let survival in your climate be the first test, then let phenotypic appearance and good healthy growth be the next, and then once you have enough you can start to select based on standardized bioassay results.
-------------------- Let's upgrade our security practices and move toward client-side PGP for encrypted PMs. My Public PGP Key: hxxps://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/24002249#24002249
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SHROOMYG
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Re: any experience with any of the named Trichocereus clones? [Re: naum]
#24003548 - 01/12/17 09:45 AM (7 years, 17 days ago) |
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I'm in the high desert , thanks I'll def be doing that, so looks like I have some albinos not my icaros X Icaros how long can the albino seedlings hang out before they die/need to be grafted? I think I have a fat one in the ler X too
-------------------- “Plants are the missing link in the search to understand the human mind and its place in nature.” - Terrence McKenna
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mandrin13
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Re: any experience with any of the named Trichocereus clones? [Re: SHROOMYG]
#24004212 - 01/12/17 02:01 PM (7 years, 17 days ago) |
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Quote:
SHROOMYG said: how much does it cost to test your cutting?
While it seems you can test with a TLC, I don't know if there are places that really do this, I assume when most people say "testing", they mean consuming or extracting.
-------------------- Even Jesus got stoned.
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DGB
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Re: any experience with any of the named Trichocereus clones? [Re: SHROOMYG] 1
#24004224 - 01/12/17 02:05 PM (7 years, 17 days ago) |
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Quote:
SHROOMYG said: And back to named genetics, how much does it cost to test your cutting? And if someone was growing a garden solely for extraction where/if legal of course which cuttings would you run? Or would you try n start from scratch and pheno hunt in a sense.
SsO2 scop Pc Bridg Tqpc X juuls A San Pedro from Greece Pach X Peru
Those are the bigger cuttings I have 4-12"in and I have a pretty sweet seed collection /small seedlings of crosses , loph but I'm very interested in there magical properties & finding more info out on tested genetics and testing my own I'll be Gettn some more Wild pach cuttings like the ogun cut while I learn more but I would almost feel like it b a waste of time if I grew out a Peru and it turned out Cuzco where as other members wouldn't mind, maybe that will change soon, I'm baked like a cake good morning guys
If you plan on bulk extraction a super high potency strain probably isn't as important to you as opposed to if you were going to just eat it, since your processing the plant matter instead of having to eat all of it.
I mean an extraction would obviously output more from plant matter that has a high mescaline content to begin with but isn't as important as the eating route since you're not chugging 3 cups of cactus slime. What I've read/been told and what I am doing is collecting and researching clones to help determine a high-quality stain to focus future propagation on but that is going to take a while once I settle on one. But in the mean time I ordered a fuckton of bridge seeds and have planted those so in a few years I should have a reliable supply of plant matter to process.
I would basically keep growing until I run out of designated cacti room, then as time went on I would slowly test and start replacing the weakest cacti with clones from my other plants that are more powerful, each time you would replace the weakest with something stronger, eventually you would end up with a bunch of potent plant material, but that’s a very far out long term goal.
So it's up to you how you want to go about that, you said you had an ss02 already, according to anecdotal reports that one tends to be on the high side of potency, so you could always focus on growing and propagating that out, or if you plan on going for something supposedly stronger, the rumors are OTB,Landfill, and Ogunbode are more potent, by how much isn't really clear at this time, there isn't a lot of direct comparisons out there and only a few strains have been actually tested for mescaline percentages, we know Ogunbode tested at 5% at one time and juuls giant tested at 1.4% but that’s kind of all we have for named clones and ten there's the question of which juuls giant was tested since there are a bunch of cuts out there with that name and may not all be the same plant, and then you come back to the argument does it really matter which is most potent? Is it really that much more potent than the next cut, and is that worth the time and effort to get one, would it be better to have 1 expensive cut or just grow a bunch of cheaper cuts to get the same content? It could be arguing that multiple cuts would grow faster and produce more mescaline by weight then the single cut.
I guess it comes down to how much do you want to spend, or how much space do you have or how long are you willing to wait. As I mentioned iv settled on the plan of bulk grow some cheap stuff, buy and test some expensive stuff and slowly replace weak cuts with better ones from high end clones as those grow out. And again, I would probably prioritize a potent patch over a potent bridge because of the faster/thicker growth so my end result would probably be a back yard full of Ogunbode assuming it lives up to the hype.
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SHROOMYG
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Re: any experience with any of the named Trichocereus clones? [Re: DGB]
#24004568 - 01/12/17 03:45 PM (7 years, 17 days ago) |
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Awesome info thanks guys, I'm doing both starting seeds and trying to get the more potent named clones once established I can decided for myself what I wanna keep
-------------------- “Plants are the missing link in the search to understand the human mind and its place in nature.” - Terrence McKenna
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nolongrlurkin
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Re: any experience with any of the named Trichocereus clones? [Re: SHROOMYG]
#24004790 - 01/12/17 04:59 PM (7 years, 17 days ago) |
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Same story here but I've also fallen love with some that are claimed to be nearly inactive. Those spines though.
Ide like to get an otb and landfill but it seems I'm out of room for now..
Growing from seed builds character!
-------------------- Cannabis for the body, cubensis for the mind, cactus for the spirit.
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naum



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Re: any experience with any of the named Trichocereus clones? [Re: mandrin13]
#24004822 - 01/12/17 05:11 PM (7 years, 17 days ago) |
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We know enough to know that we don't know that much about the chemistry of cactus potency. A lot of the magic/potency is apparently not mescaline. As such, any sort of standardized assay should be a bioassay of tea or flesh always prepared the same way. A basic extract or even TLC based approach would only allow you to select primarily for mescaline content, not the other yet to be identified compounds which play a role in the full spectrum experience.
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naum



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Re: any experience with any of the named Trichocereus clones? [Re: modern.shaman]
#24004848 - 01/12/17 05:17 PM (7 years, 17 days ago) |
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Quote:
modern.shaman said: icaros are different as they are almost considered a cultivar from seed. They are pretty uniform from seed; potency does differ a bit but visually quite uniform from seed.
I think icaros are distinctive, but I would hesitate to call them uniform. They had a lot of phenotypic variation at least back from the original seeds that I saw sourced as IcarosDNA.
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Grey Fox

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Re: any experience with any of the named Trichocereus clones? [Re: naum]
#24005550 - 01/12/17 08:51 PM (7 years, 16 days ago) |
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There's a lot of good knowledge being shared here today. Thanks to all.
Best luck to all.
-------------------- IT WAS ALL A DREAM
Edited by Grey Fox (01/13/17 06:38 AM)
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modern.shaman
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Re: any experience with any of the named Trichocereus clones? [Re: Grey Fox]
#24006398 - 01/13/17 07:13 AM (7 years, 16 days ago) |
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For those asking about LER potency. I've never had a nonpc pachanoi disappoint me. I do tend to use 18 inches of thick cuttings but it provides a very strong experience; 12 inches should be enough of any nonpc if it is mature.
For those that have the patience to grow from seed I'd do what another member suggested. Grow bulk from any cross or generic seeds you like and the strongest and healthiest in your climate should be prioritized then choose potency and appearance. I've grown clones in the past but tend to do shitty here due to high humidity but my seed grown and localized clones do amazing and grow faster. If I'm lucky might test my favorite seed grown bridgessi this year or next. Grew more then 20 inches last year beating everything else I have by more then a foot.
For those in AZ desert use shade your sun is too intense.
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nolongrlurkin
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Re: any experience with any of the named Trichocereus clones? [Re: modern.shaman]
#24006570 - 01/13/17 08:48 AM (7 years, 16 days ago) |
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Thanks for the info shaman!! Effing pc.. 18 inches of some kind of pach was enough fo my first experience! I've been chasing it ever since.
-------------------- Cannabis for the body, cubensis for the mind, cactus for the spirit.
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SHROOMYG
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Re: any experience with any of the named Trichocereus clones? [Re: nolongrlurkin]
#24008560 - 01/14/17 12:25 AM (7 years, 15 days ago) |
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So Icaros would be the most potent named Peruvian?
-------------------- “Plants are the missing link in the search to understand the human mind and its place in nature.” - Terrence McKenna
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modern.shaman
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Re: any experience with any of the named Trichocereus clones? [Re: SHROOMYG]
#24008976 - 01/14/17 06:34 AM (7 years, 15 days ago) |
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No icaros is more of a locality then anything else. There are multiple clones of icaros all varying in potency. Now which is the strongest Peruvian idk but icaros. Rosii 1-2, are the most popular and they are all visually stunning with nice spines and hue.
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nolongrlurkin
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Re: any experience with any of the named Trichocereus clones? [Re: modern.shaman]
#24010988 - 01/14/17 10:14 PM (7 years, 14 days ago) |
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Il leave these here as well!
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SHROOMYG
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Re: any experience with any of the named Trichocereus clones? [Re: nolongrlurkin] 1
#24011572 - 01/15/17 09:12 AM (7 years, 14 days ago) |
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Same Icaros X Icaros & sso2xsso1x LER pictured
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sidvivius
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Re: any experience with any of the named Trichocereus clones? [Re: SHROOMYG]
#24012114 - 01/15/17 12:29 PM (7 years, 14 days ago) |
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you graft'em young !!! the seed coat is still stick to that poor embryon haha !
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SHROOMYG
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Re: any experience with any of the named Trichocereus clones? [Re: sidvivius]
#24012122 - 01/15/17 12:31 PM (7 years, 14 days ago) |
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I hear you don't have much time w albinos!
-------------------- “Plants are the missing link in the search to understand the human mind and its place in nature.” - Terrence McKenna
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DGB
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Re: any experience with any of the named Trichocereus clones? [Re: SHROOMYG]
#24012201 - 01/15/17 01:09 PM (7 years, 14 days ago) |
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Quote:
SHROOMYG said:

Same Icaros X Icaros & sso2xsso1x LER pictured
So your icarosXicaros poped out some albinos? Mine was like 90% but i did start getting a few normals.
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SHROOMYG
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Re: any experience with any of the named Trichocereus clones? [Re: DGB]
#24012216 - 01/15/17 01:16 PM (7 years, 14 days ago) |
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Yep! I'd say 60 percent were albino! And still coming up
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LSoares
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Re: any experience with any of the named Trichocereus clones? [Re: SHROOMYG]
#24013660 - 01/16/17 02:15 AM (7 years, 13 days ago) |
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Quote:
SHROOMYG said: Yep! I'd say 60 percent were albino! And still coming up
Those are more than likely not albinos, they are not that common in any circumstance. I would wait a couple of weeks before grafting them or you'll soon run out of grafting stock with seedlings that will soon turn out pretty normal (and besides, the failure rate with seedlings that young is pretty high).
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modern.shaman
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Re: any experience with any of the named Trichocereus clones? [Re: LSoares]
#24014093 - 01/16/17 09:14 AM (7 years, 13 days ago) |
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Lsoares there have been some trichocereus crosses that have produced very high albino seedlings which I personally don't like as I see them as weak genetics. Variegated is alright by me and some of those albinos may in fact be variegated.
BTW you can wait at least two weeks to graft them Any that die before wouldn't sure survive grafting anyways. IME
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SHROOMYG
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Re: any experience with any of the named Trichocereus clones? [Re: modern.shaman]
#24014158 - 01/16/17 09:42 AM (7 years, 13 days ago) |
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Do those graft pics not look albino to you? I heard u have about a week after they sprout, I checked the grafts today not looking too bad hopefully one takes
My sso2xsso1 X ler put out only 1 albino out of 50 or so
-------------------- “Plants are the missing link in the search to understand the human mind and its place in nature.” - Terrence McKenna
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spaceman101
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Re: any experience with any of the named Trichocereus clones? [Re: SHROOMYG]
#24014757 - 01/16/17 01:34 PM (7 years, 13 days ago) |
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Yea these are albinos and there are a couple companies right now producing a LOT of albino seedlings. I understand your view of them Modern but I want to grow 1 out to adult size being as they're so rare and spread the genetics as a rarity although I know there are others working on the same thing. I wonder if the color has anything to do with the potency???
-------------------- ------------- Check out my Pollen Trade thread for spreading Good genetics far and wide Great Vendors thread where we can discuss "Non Shroomery" Vendors that sell good products worth checking into A few things I wanna get my hands on check it out and let me know if you have any of these Need help getting started growing mushrooms Here's The Noob Forum
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Heyowana
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Re: any experience with any of the named Trichocereus clones? [Re: spaceman101] 1
#24078968 - 02/10/17 06:25 AM (6 years, 11 months ago) |
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It sure is frustrating seeing all the named clones with hardly any bioassay info. In Australia it is worse I think. Legislation makes it liable for someone from Qld for instance to write anything about their experiences.
NSW peyote is legal to grow along with Victoria. Shaman Australis forums had info about Trichocereus named clones alkaloid content. Then for legal reasons it was all wiped off their forums.
From what I have read there is plenty of people in the know about cactus potency in Australia but they can't talk about it on the internet. Eileen was listed as having greater than 2% alkaloids on extraction. When you think its a bridge cross it kind of leads to pachanoi having been the crossing partner with a bridgesii to get such a high assay.
Of course that's just assumption on my part. All I can say is don't trust the named clone because a lot of the time the name was coined just to keep track of it. I'm wondering if pachanoi clone Yowie has some bridgesii in it. Or if it's some kind a hybrid. The weird downward spines look different.
It even starts like a bridgesii and finishes like a pachanoi. My favourite pachanoi is an un named one.
What I don't like is tasting named clones that are weak. So far they have one thing in common to me. They taste worse than potent ones. That disgusting tangy liquid spew taste of cuzcoensis masquerading as a peruvianus.
Lance tastes foul. Not worth the trouble. More like weak dope in effect. Con was really up for a bridgesii. Tig was powerful and a bit too dark for me. Huanucoensis x bridgesii was more up than bridgesii.
People that won't cut their cactus are not profiting from all the pups that they can produce. The speed the pups grow at certainly makes up for the sacrifice.
I like this thread because its at the heart of why most people grow trichocereus in the first place. I'm a new comer to cactus so I don't have the reservations of those who are wise and in the know. That's my disclaimer along with the diagnosis that I have mental problems.
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Grey Fox

Registered: 01/22/15
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Re: any experience with any of the named Trichocereus clones? [Re: Heyowana]
#24079117 - 02/10/17 08:28 AM (6 years, 11 months ago) |
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Quote:
Heyowana said: It sure is frustrating seeing all the named clones with hardly any bioassay info. In Australia it is worse I think. Legislation makes it liable for someone from Qld for instance to write anything about their experiences.
NSW peyote is legal to grow along with Victoria. Shaman Australis forums had info about Trichocereus named clones alkaloid content. Then for legal reasons it was all wiped off their forums.
From what I have read there is plenty of people in the know about cactus potency in Australia but they can't talk about it on the internet. Eileen was listed as having greater than 2% alkaloids on extraction. When you think its a bridge cross it kind of leads to pachanoi having been the crossing partner with a bridgesii to get such a high assay.
Of course that's just assumption on my part. All I can say is don't trust the named clone because a lot of the time the name was coined just to keep track of it. I'm wondering if pachanoi clone Yowie has some bridgesii in it. Or if it's some kind a hybrid. The weird downward spines look different.
It even starts like a bridgesii and finishes like a pachanoi. My favourite pachanoi is an un named one.
What I don't like is tasting named clones that are weak. So far they have one thing in common to me. They taste worse than potent ones. That disgusting tangy liquid spew taste of cuzcoensis masquerading as a peruvianus.
Lance tastes foul. Not worth the trouble. More like weak dope in effect. Con was really up for a bridgesii. Tig was powerful and a bit too dark for me. Huanucoensis x bridgesii was more up than bridgesii.
People that won't cut their cactus are not profiting from all the pups that they can produce. The speed the pups grow at certainly makes up for the sacrifice.
I like this thread because its at the heart of why most people grow trichocereus in the first place. I'm a new comer to cactus so I don't have the reservations of those who are wise and in the know. That's my disclaimer along with the diagnosis that I have mental problems. 
Thanks for sharing your perspective. Its crazy how knowledge is surpressed. And that suppression always comes with threat of force. Unfortunately many people's perspectives on plants and liberty are still very backwards.
-------------------- IT WAS ALL A DREAM
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spaceman101
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Re: any experience with any of the named Trichocereus clones? [Re: Heyowana]
#24080834 - 02/10/17 09:00 PM (6 years, 11 months ago) |
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Quote:
Heyowana said: It sure is frustrating seeing all the named clones with hardly any bioassay info. In Australia it is worse I think. Legislation makes it liable for someone from Qld for instance to write anything about their experiences.
NSW peyote is legal to grow along with Victoria. Shaman Australis forums had info about Trichocereus named clones alkaloid content. Then for legal reasons it was all wiped off their forums.
From what I have read there is plenty of people in the know about cactus potency in Australia but they can't talk about it on the internet. Eileen was listed as having greater than 2% alkaloids on extraction. When you think its a bridge cross it kind of leads to pachanoi having been the crossing partner with a bridgesii to get such a high assay.
Of course that's just assumption on my part. All I can say is don't trust the named clone because a lot of the time the name was coined just to keep track of it. I'm wondering if pachanoi clone Yowie has some bridgesii in it. Or if it's some kind a hybrid. The weird downward spines look different.
It even starts like a bridgesii and finishes like a pachanoi. My favourite pachanoi is an un named one.
What I don't like is tasting named clones that are weak. So far they have one thing in common to me. They taste worse than potent ones. That disgusting tangy liquid spew taste of cuzcoensis masquerading as a peruvianus.
Lance tastes foul. Not worth the trouble. More like weak dope in effect. Con was really up for a bridgesii. Tig was powerful and a bit too dark for me. Huanucoensis x bridgesii was more up than bridgesii.
People that won't cut their cactus are not profiting from all the pups that they can produce. The speed the pups grow at certainly makes up for the sacrifice.
I like this thread because its at the heart of why most people grow trichocereus in the first place. I'm a new comer to cactus so I don't have the reservations of those who are wise and in the know. That's my disclaimer along with the diagnosis that I have mental problems. 
Thank you for sharing Bro! That is sad to know the Government is suppressing info on potency's. Especially on the Highly sought after Aus clones
-------------------- ------------- Check out my Pollen Trade thread for spreading Good genetics far and wide Great Vendors thread where we can discuss "Non Shroomery" Vendors that sell good products worth checking into A few things I wanna get my hands on check it out and let me know if you have any of these Need help getting started growing mushrooms Here's The Noob Forum
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Heyowana
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Re: any experience with any of the named Trichocereus clones? [Re: modern.shaman]
#24081302 - 02/11/17 02:22 AM (6 years, 11 months ago) |
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Quote:
modern.shaman said: For those asking about LER potency. I've never had a nonpc pachanoi disappoint me. I do tend to use 18 inches of thick cuttings but it provides a very strong experience; 12 inches should be enough of any nonpc if it is mature.
For those that have the patience to grow from seed I'd do what another member suggested. Grow bulk from any cross or generic seeds you like and the strongest and healthiest in your climate should be prioritized then choose potency and appearance. I've grown clones in the past but tend to do shitty here due to high humidity but my seed grown and localized clones do amazing and grow faster. If I'm lucky might test my favorite seed grown bridgessi this year or next. Grew more then 20 inches last year beating everything else I have by more then a foot.
For those in AZ desert use shade your sun is too intense.
I agree about growing seedlings. I started off 100 Matucana pachanoi seeds. They are about 15 months old now. 36 are out in the garden and thriving. Tallest is 4 inches. Plus another 20 or more spare ones.
I acquired 10 Icaro seedlings averaging 4 inches height 2 years ago. Tallest are 2 feet now and very thick. So those Matucana pachanoi seedlings might be two feet in a couple of years. Then add another year and they should be right for sampling.
Thanks Grey Fox and spaceman101
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DGB
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Re: any experience with any of the named Trichocereus clones? [Re: DGB] 3
#24384044 - 06/06/17 11:44 PM (6 years, 7 months ago) |
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Some more in-depth info, analysis done by user Urtica on dmt nexus, (full write up see original posts) https://www.dmt-nexus.me/forum/default.aspx?g=posts&t=71353 ; seems to be an ongoing project, last post was today. (content edited to remove vendor source and extraction tek) #1 = T bridgesii
RESULTS: Yield 0.06% fresh, if dried it would have contained 1.2% dry Quantification of extract showed 59% mescaline + (unquantified) DMPEA
#2 = T pachanoi 'PC'
RESULTS: Yield 0.00816% fresh, 0.16% dry weight, out of which only 1.6% was mescaline (In other words final yield of dry cact = 0.0016% mescaline)
[gradient:#C7D4C8,#]#3 = T pachanoi x peruvianus[/gradient]
RESULTS: Yield extremely low, unmeasured, but the content of the extract was 84% mescaline + palmitic acid
[gradient:#C7D4C8,#]#4 = T cuzcoensis JS04 cutting[/gradient]
RESULTS: Insignificant yield containing only traces mescaline (below limit of detection by GC-MS, traces detected by LC-MS but not quantified due to too low amounts)
#5 Trichocereus 'JS05'
I used a center cut, about one foot long, 3-4 inches wide, very spiny. It does have the swollen spines at the bottom like a lot of cuzcoensis.
The cut weighed in at 1340g fresh.
The product of this was a gooey oil that stilled smelled like oranges when I scraped it up, that smell faded however and now it smells like alkaloid.
The goo weighed ~ 125 mg. This weight may be very off because I tared the scale with a different razor blade than the one that the goo was on when I weighed it. Picture included.
This would make a fresh yield of 0.000093%. If 95% of this cactus is water weight, than it would be 0.0019% from dry material...
ENERGY CONTROL RESULTS: 1% of the crude extract is mescaline, there are also 3 other unknown alkaloids present
#6: Trichocereus spp "JS350"
810g center cut, I scraped up 413 mg of a beautiful clear powder, picture included.
Extraction #2
Same procedure. The cut weighed 720g
Weighed out to 134 mg. Picture included.
So, 0.0186% fresh, maybe 0.37% dry. I am assuming that the cactus would dry down the same as the one that I tested.
ENERY CONTROL RESULTS:54% of this extract was mescaline, with no other alkaloids present. So 0.01% fresh weight is mescaline, or ~100 mgs mescaline per kilo of cactus fresh. The powder from distilling off the d-limonene was 0% mescaline. 0.2% presumed dry weight of mescaline.
#7 Trichocereus werdermannianus
This is a big fat cut, ten inches long weighed in at 1820g, log cut, picture included.
I got 230 mg of a nice looking tannish powder at the end of it, picture included.
So, this would be a fresh yield of 0.013%, assumed dry yield of 0.25%.
ENERGY CONTROL RESULTS:48% of this extract was mescaline, another alkaloid was present which has been tentatively ID'd as hordenine. So 0.006% mescaline fresh or 60.65 mg mescaline per kilogram of fresh cactus. 0.12% presumed dry weight of mescaline.
#8 Trichocereus lumberjackius
I used two 10 inch cuttings, the two shown in the picture. They weighed 1430g total.
881 mg of a darker tan colored powder, picture included.
So that is a fresh yield of 0.0616%, presumed dry yield of 1.23%
ENERGY CONTROL RESULTS: 62% of this extract was mescaline, and there was another unknown alkaloid peak. So 0.038% mescaline fresh, or 380 mg mescaline per kilo of fresh cactus. 0.77% mescaline from dry material (presumed).
#9Trichocereus macrogonus 'RS0004'
A four inch cutting weighed 375g.
The other was sixteen and a half inches long, weighed 610g, and was very skinny and green colored.
I ended up with 458 mg of a light tannish powder, smells right. Picture included.
RS0004's had a fresh yield of 0.0468%, and a presumed dry yield of 0.9299%, ENERGY CONTROL RESULTS: 57% of this extract was mescaline, so 0.027% mescaline by fresh weight, presumed 0.53% mescaline by dry weight. 267.9 mg mescaline per kilogram fresh plant material. No other peaks.
#10 Trichocereus pachanoi 'LER'
I used a 12" cutting which weighed precisely 1000g
I got 255mg of tan xstals,
That is a fresh yield of 0.025%, presumed dry yield of 0.51%. Much better than the PC!
ENERGY CONTROL RESULTS: 43% of this extract was mescaline. So 0.011% mescaline by fresh weight, 0.22% mescaline by presumed dry weight. 107.5 mg mescaline per kilo of fresh cactus. No other peaks.
#11 T. cuzcoensis/peruvianus 'KK338'
I used 2 cuts, about 18 inches in total length. They weighed in at 1340g.
Yielded 191 mg of brown goo. Picture enclosed. So, yield of 0.014% of presumably inactive goo, fresh.
Presumed 0.28% dry.
#12 Trichocereus sp. 'SS01 x SS02'
A one foot cutting and a ten inch cutting together weighed 1000g.
Yield was 475 mg of a yellowish crystalline powder.
So, 0.0475% fresh, 0.095% presumed dry of the crude extract.
#13 Trichocereus peruvianus "John"
A ten inch cutting weighed 1060g.
Yield was 187 mg of a tannish powder.
So, 0.018% fresh. 0.35% presumed dry.
#14 Trichocereus peruvianus JS209 "Poots #2"
Six inches weighed 1230g! It was the bottom six inches of a tip cut, so it was not woody, cut easily. This cut also sat for over a month.
Yield was 380 mg of a tannish powder.
So, 0.031% fresh. 0.62% presumed dry.
#15 Trichocereus pachanoi P.C Hutchinson 1597 Peru 57.0884
This 7.5 inch cutting weighed 990g.
Yield was 433 mg of really clean looking crystally powder.
That makes for a fresh % of 0.0437%. Presumed dry is 0.87%
#16 Trichocereus spp. "Ohlone"
This 1 foot cutting weighed 1820 g! Big fat guy, pretty blue. It does have big fuzzy areoles but it does have some kinda cuzco-y spination, some swollen bases.
I extracted as usual and ended up with 299 mg of a tannish crystalline powder.
So fresh is 0.017%, presumed dry is 0.33%.
#17Trichocereus bridgesii 'SS02'
Three cutting totaling 31 inches weighed 1130g.
904 mg of crude extract
This makes for a fresh yield of 0.08%, presumed dry yield of 1.6%.
Edited by DGB (06/24/17 10:23 PM)
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DGB
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Re: any experience with any of the named Trichocereus clones? [Re: DGB] 2
#24389964 - 06/09/17 12:59 AM (6 years, 7 months ago) |
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ok, so i had to re hand type the original graph and add all the new numbers so it would be a lot easier to look at everything, again i used the numbers and graph format originally created by Urtica on dmt nexus.
there is still a bunch of info still missing in the graph, right now the new additions only have a percentages of crude alkaloids per cactus but we don't know yet how much of that is mescaline vs other alkaloids, so if/when that info comes out i'll update the graph again, unless Urtica does it first.
(edit) also reordered them based on highest alkaloid % but again just keep in mind that the current grouping is based on crude% and the order may change when the exact mescaline percentages come out.
Edited by DGB (06/24/17 10:24 PM)
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DGB
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Re: any experience with any of the named Trichocereus clones? [Re: DGB] 1
#24402591 - 06/13/17 02:26 PM (6 years, 7 months ago) |
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updated the graph again, made it bigger, filled in some spaces, corrected a placement error, added a new category and added 3 new clones from the 14 taxa paper, they are measured differently then the way the other cutting are measured so the numbers are not directly comparable but among those cutting you can see how they rank, the 14 taxa paper included multiple past studies as well however they all seem to be random cuts from different sources, so unless anyone knows and has proof showing that a unnamed cut from those studies now has a name and is floating around in the community in going to leave the rest of the papers tests out of the graph.
(edit) a quick edit, right when i posted i realized in the original paper for the 14 taxa in methods they gave a standard weight of material tested so a percentage of mescaline per green skin weight could be calculated. also did it very quick but i believe i did it right, 1.4% of 2G extrapolated out to 28.3495 grams (1oz) and converted to MG is 396.9mg right? oh also added the new category mescaline per oz of dried outer green skin.
Edited by DGB (06/24/17 10:24 PM)
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nolongrlurkin
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Re: any experience with any of the named Trichocereus clones? [Re: DGB] 2
#24422317 - 06/20/17 10:45 PM (6 years, 7 months ago) |
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Dgb, you are doing amazing things for us here!! I, for one, find this priceless information!!! Thank you, from the center of my infinite soul!
-------------------- Cannabis for the body, cubensis for the mind, cactus for the spirit.
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DGB
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Re: any experience with any of the named Trichocereus clones? [Re: nolongrlurkin] 1
#24422680 - 06/21/17 01:59 AM (6 years, 7 months ago) |
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I did think of you when I read about the rs004 results.
I do hope people benefit from my collecting of information from different places into a single thread. But I just catalog the info I find, make sure you support the people doing the actual studies and ground work.
But hopefully all this information helps people when considering what cuts to get if they choose to go with a known clone from a trusted vendor, I know potency changes with almost every possible variable but as long as the results are accurate and consistent enough to give a general idea of where things fall in relation to each other its worth looking into. Even if the number have a wide margin of error the fact that using the same technique they got numbers that seem to confirm what we've already known from anecdotal evidence should show that there's something to the data. I mean we know anecdotally pc is extremally weak, lumberjack and ss02 are high end of potent, LER is on the low end of medium and rs0005 is somewhere in the middle. there's no way its just coincidence that all the data on these cutting seem to put theme right where they belong, the only thing that’s changed is we now have numbers to put to and back up the anecdotal ranking. And if you don’t want to concede that point, at the very least we come back to my original argument that this gives us a high water mark for each cut, they may not be this exact mg/kg of alkaloids at all times but at least now we know this particular cutting can at least reach this level of alkaloid content, i.e. would you rather have a cutting that only ever tests between option A, 0.0008% - 0.0006% or option B, one that tests 0.02%-0.026? yes there may be some fluxuations in alkaloid content due to external factors but you don’t need 100% accurate mg/kg numbers to say option two is probably going to be a more reliable producer of alkaloids then option A.
Sorry went off on a mini rant, been meaning to post this since I know the argument against this data is coming again sooner or later, just needed an excuse to post it without being the only one posting in my thread for the past 5 posts lol.
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El Torcho
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Re: any experience with any of the named Trichocereus clones? [Re: DGB]
#24422941 - 06/21/17 06:05 AM (6 years, 7 months ago) |
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Is the Kate bridge a named clone, or is that the supplier name? Preceded by 'Cactus'?
--------------------
"Well it sounds trivial, but the key insight is . . . . . you don't know shit" ~Dennis McKenna "There is more to human existence and to reality itself than science can ever give us access to." ~His Holiness, The 14th Dalai Lama
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nolongrlurkin
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Re: any experience with any of the named Trichocereus clones? [Re: DGB]
#24422948 - 06/21/17 06:09 AM (6 years, 7 months ago) |
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Have you shared your data on any other site?? If not, then I'm about to link this shit up..!!
-------------------- Cannabis for the body, cubensis for the mind, cactus for the spirit.
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DGB
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Re: any experience with any of the named Trichocereus clones? [Re: nolongrlurkin]
#24422995 - 06/21/17 06:50 AM (6 years, 7 months ago) |
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the most recent numbers and original graph format came from DMT nexus, the previous quotes came from multiple forums and web site as well as from the 14 taxa paper and a few of trouts books. a lot of the quotes from the start of the thread were posted on my Mycotopia thread but i don't go there anymore because of a certain A-hole mod, i posted a link to that at eh beinging of the thread.
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DGB
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Re: any experience with any of the named Trichocereus clones? [Re: DGB] 1
#24428431 - 06/23/17 06:37 AM (6 years, 7 months ago) |
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Another update, BIGGER GRAPH, also changed around the categories to make more seance in placement, or at least grouped them, also color coded the groups, I also added and calculated the dry mescaline % into MG per oz of dried plant. Also changed the working to include whole plant…cept looking back the % mescaline dry weight is missing "whole plant" but too lazy to re do it now. I also added peyote to the list and all its calculated numbers just too give an idea on how tricheocerus stacks up to it, numbers came as average ranges from a study cited by trouts notes.
As always I hate math, so if anyone notices any miss calculations let me know. I did round a few things but tried to to it in 0.00s
i also heard from urtica the one doing the analysis. "This is a work in progress & I will have more data here soon."
(edit) so next time i ll have to change the wording of that catagory, also the peyote numbers look a little weird since its a range, not sure if in the next update i should leave it as is, do just the average, or add the average to the range
Edited by DGB (06/24/17 10:24 PM)
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cactamateur
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Re: any experience with any of the named Trichocereus clones? [Re: DGB]
#24432617 - 06/24/17 07:18 PM (6 years, 7 months ago) |
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This is a fantastic work in progress - keep it up!
Small suggestion - reference the data with footnotes, ex. by the lumberjack where it says 0.062% write it as:
0.062%3
and so on, and have the list of reference sources at the bottom.
It'll look more..scientific.. and it'll save the trouble of answering any source questions down the road since you've already sourced the info.

[edit: like this chart has the superscript and 'footnotes' -https://www.elsevier.com/__data/promis_images/table1_jds.jpg]
Edited by cactamateur (06/24/17 07:21 PM)
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DGB
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Re: any experience with any of the named Trichocereus clones? [Re: cactamateur]
#24433045 - 06/24/17 10:26 PM (6 years, 7 months ago) |
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a few citations added, changed some wording again and corrected other issues mentioned in previous post.
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amp244
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Re: any experience with any of the named Trichocereus clones? [Re: DGB]
#24447785 - 06/30/17 05:55 PM (6 years, 6 months ago) |
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My brother works with gas chromatographs. He told me I could bring him some samples and he could determine the percentages. I have an Old Town Bridgesii in my collection that I wanted to get tested. I also have a standard PC Pach and a few other random unknown trichs I picked up form home depot. I figure we might as well all take advantage of this opportunity, and pool our resources together. If anyone has any of the popular named clones, they should pm me for instructions on how to send me a small cutting so that I may include it.
Once we determine the trichs with the highest potency, we can start crossing them and further select for potency.
-------------------- How to Convert a Normal 24-hour Light Timer into a Short Cycle Repeating Timer "Monopoly, besides, is a great enemy to good management, which can never be universally established but in consequence of that free and universal competition which forces everybody to have recourse in it for the sake of self-defense." -Adam Smith
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DGB
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Re: any experience with any of the named Trichocereus clones? [Re: amp244]
#24447964 - 06/30/17 07:17 PM (6 years, 6 months ago) |
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You should also make a post on the cactus analisis thread on dmt nexus.
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spaceman101
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Re: any experience with any of the named Trichocereus clones? [Re: amp244]
#24448255 - 06/30/17 08:45 PM (6 years, 6 months ago) |
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Quote:
amp244 said: My brother works with gas chromatographs. He told me I could bring him some samples and he could determine the percentages. I have an Old Town Bridgesii in my collection that I wanted to get tested. I also have a standard PC Pach and a few other random unknown trichs I picked up form home depot. I figure we might as well all take advantage of this opportunity, and pool our resources together. If anyone has any of the popular named clones, they should pm me for instructions on how to send me a small cutting so that I may include it.
Once we determine the trichs with the highest potency, we can start crossing them and further select for potency.
Are you fucking serious??? What exactly would you need? how much should be cut off and what all info would he need to classify the potency of said plant?
-------------------- ------------- Check out my Pollen Trade thread for spreading Good genetics far and wide Great Vendors thread where we can discuss "Non Shroomery" Vendors that sell good products worth checking into A few things I wanna get my hands on check it out and let me know if you have any of these Need help getting started growing mushrooms Here's The Noob Forum
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amp244
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Re: any experience with any of the named Trichocereus clones? [Re: spaceman101]
#24450173 - 07/01/17 04:52 PM (6 years, 6 months ago) |
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I'm gonna ask him and figure all that out. I'll let you know the process.
-------------------- How to Convert a Normal 24-hour Light Timer into a Short Cycle Repeating Timer "Monopoly, besides, is a great enemy to good management, which can never be universally established but in consequence of that free and universal competition which forces everybody to have recourse in it for the sake of self-defense." -Adam Smith
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amp244
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Re: any experience with any of the named Trichocereus clones? [Re: amp244]
#24450196 - 07/01/17 05:08 PM (6 years, 6 months ago) |
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Apparently this wont be as easy as I thought... The gas chromatographs that he is using use different columns to separate specific components. Each column is specific to the application, so that components completely separate and reliable analysis is achieved. I'm assuming that we'd need to make/buy a special column that he does not have available.
We can still do it, we just need to figure out what we need, and see how much its going to cost. I'm in the process of asking more questions.
-------------------- How to Convert a Normal 24-hour Light Timer into a Short Cycle Repeating Timer "Monopoly, besides, is a great enemy to good management, which can never be universally established but in consequence of that free and universal competition which forces everybody to have recourse in it for the sake of self-defense." -Adam Smith
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amp244
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Re: any experience with any of the named Trichocereus clones? [Re: amp244]
#24450244 - 07/01/17 05:26 PM (6 years, 6 months ago) |
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Ok let me break down the process:
We need to dissolve the cacti in a solvent and make a liquid tincture. The machine only requires a small amount of fluid, so only a small piece of cactus would be needed. Use a fixed weight of dried material and a fixed volume of solvent for every test.
The machine functionality itself is relatively simple: You inject a liquid or gas into the inlet, the liquid vaporizes and enters the column. The column is a very tiny bore tubing that is coated with something called a stationary phase. The stationary phase is selected with a certain polarity and other properties such that the molecules of your injected sample interact with it. Some molecules that don't have an affinity for the column rush right through, others are restrained because they have interactions with the column; thus, separation. Eventually everything makes its way through the column and reaches the detector that shows a response or how much of that component there is.
So all we need is the right column for the job.
-------------------- How to Convert a Normal 24-hour Light Timer into a Short Cycle Repeating Timer "Monopoly, besides, is a great enemy to good management, which can never be universally established but in consequence of that free and universal competition which forces everybody to have recourse in it for the sake of self-defense." -Adam Smith
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amp244
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Re: any experience with any of the named Trichocereus clones? [Re: amp244]
#24450372 - 07/01/17 06:22 PM (6 years, 6 months ago) |
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Ok, he has the columns we need. This is all ready to happen.
http://www.unodc.org/pdf/publications/st-nar-19.pdf The pertinent information is at the bottom of page 17 under "capillary column technique".
We can get maybe 5 or so samples together. I don't want to be too long fucking around with these. Perhaps we can keep these runs specifically focusing on the potent bridges.
So far I have an Old Town Bridge to throw in. Another shroomery collector has contacted me and offered other nice bridges, such as Eileen, Killer Green Cactus, Kai, and more.
Lets try to compile a list of the top bridges that we would like to see tested, and then arrange for their testing!
-------------------- How to Convert a Normal 24-hour Light Timer into a Short Cycle Repeating Timer "Monopoly, besides, is a great enemy to good management, which can never be universally established but in consequence of that free and universal competition which forces everybody to have recourse in it for the sake of self-defense." -Adam Smith
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DualWieldRake
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Re: any experience with any of the named Trichocereus clones? [Re: amp244]
#24451349 - 07/02/17 05:34 AM (6 years, 6 months ago) |
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How are you planning to prepare the samples
Take a small piece of skin? flesh? both? I would say the best is to use a good size column and homogenize it
Also take notes on the age and conditions of the sample you use, it supposedly has a great effect on alkaloid contents
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spaceman101
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Re: any experience with any of the named Trichocereus clones? [Re: DualWieldRake]
#24451566 - 07/02/17 09:05 AM (6 years, 6 months ago) |
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Ok! This is something I would like to do and I'd imaging some others would enjoy it as well.
I have a few different genetics over here but my original Bridge which I do not believe has a name (or it just was traded as T. bridgesii) but is a true blue Bridge that I have been cloning for years.
Each clone is in different stages of growth from Old (huge pot) growth and has been on its own roots for somewhere around 5 years at this point and so on down the line to freshly rooted.
1 year, 2 year, 3 year and so on.
This could answer the age old question of "does time, size and time in the soil play any role in potency"?
I have MANY other experiments just as such with other types of trichos so I could continue for ages with this 
MY question that I'm trying to find answers for is what plays the largest roles in obtaining a potent plant other than the simple genetics atm.
-------------------- ------------- Check out my Pollen Trade thread for spreading Good genetics far and wide Great Vendors thread where we can discuss "Non Shroomery" Vendors that sell good products worth checking into A few things I wanna get my hands on check it out and let me know if you have any of these Need help getting started growing mushrooms Here's The Noob Forum
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DualWieldRake
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Re: any experience with any of the named Trichocereus clones? [Re: spaceman101]
#24451621 - 07/02/17 09:43 AM (6 years, 6 months ago) |
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A guy on the nook recently tested the same plant 3 months later having it stored in the dark and got twice the levels of mescaline from lab test
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DualWieldRake
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Re: any experience with any of the named Trichocereus clones? [Re: spaceman101]
#24451628 - 07/02/17 09:51 AM (6 years, 6 months ago) |
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Quote:
spaceman101 said: Ok! This is something I would like to do and I'd imaging some others would enjoy it as well.
I have a few different genetics over here but my original Bridge which I do not believe has a name (or it just was traded as T. bridgesii) but is a true blue Bridge that I have been cloning for years.
Each clone is in different stages of growth from Old (huge pot) growth and has been on its own roots for somewhere around 5 years at this point and so on down the line to freshly rooted.
1 year, 2 year, 3 year and so on.
This could answer the age old question of "does time, size and time in the soil play any role in potency"?
I have MANY other experiments just as such with other types of trichos so I could continue for ages with this 
MY question that I'm trying to find answers for is what plays the largest roles in obtaining a potent plant other than the simple genetics atm.
I think (natural) selection will get you better genetics. Then you need to make it grow well ofcourse, more plant produces more alkaloids And so apparently this is only half the story...you could double it by stressing before consumption
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spaceman101
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Re: any experience with any of the named Trichocereus clones? [Re: DualWieldRake]
#24451666 - 07/02/17 10:04 AM (6 years, 6 months ago) |
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Quote:
DualWieldRake said:
Quote:
spaceman101 said: Ok! This is something I would like to do and I'd imaging some others would enjoy it as well.
I have a few different genetics over here but my original Bridge which I do not believe has a name (or it just was traded as T. bridgesii) but is a true blue Bridge that I have been cloning for years.
Each clone is in different stages of growth from Old (huge pot) growth and has been on its own roots for somewhere around 5 years at this point and so on down the line to freshly rooted.
1 year, 2 year, 3 year and so on.
This could answer the age old question of "does time, size and time in the soil play any role in potency"?
I have MANY other experiments just as such with other types of trichos so I could continue for ages with this 
MY question that I'm trying to find answers for is what plays the largest roles in obtaining a potent plant other than the simple genetics atm.
I think (natural) selection will get you better genetics. Then you need to make it grow well ofcourse, more plant produces more alkaloids And so apparently this is only half the story...you could double it by stressing before consumption
Yes, yes, yes! These are my experiments but who knows until they consume said plants what each difference makes. That's where the Chromograph (or however it's spelled) comes into play over my experiments.
Honestly I could NEVER bioassay each of these experiments of mine to develop what works and what does not. First off I only allow myself to trip when I'm in dyer need of some introspection so possibly 2 or 3 times a year at max. I'm not actually fond of each experience neither because the thoughts these compounds induce inside me are 90% of the time extremely painful.
I was hoping that amp could find a way to test Named clones as so to put the information out into the consumption/collector community as well as to attempt to test what actions can increase and decrease these alkaloids.
Do you know what I mean?
-------------------- ------------- Check out my Pollen Trade thread for spreading Good genetics far and wide Great Vendors thread where we can discuss "Non Shroomery" Vendors that sell good products worth checking into A few things I wanna get my hands on check it out and let me know if you have any of these Need help getting started growing mushrooms Here's The Noob Forum
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Re: any experience with any of the named Trichocereus clones? [Re: spaceman101]
#24451731 - 07/02/17 10:34 AM (6 years, 6 months ago) |
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Haha yeah i see what you mean, wasn't quite suggesting to compare trips lol
I think this is a great initiative and very curious to see more lab results on this Not sure how exactly the guy from nook his samples were tested (just that they were lab tested), seeing the doubling of potency in same plant (2.0 to 4.1%) may give some insights to some of your questions.
That's why i'm saying if you want a good comparison between genetics should try to factor out the other things.
Ofcourse the other factors may also have to do with genetics, as in a certain plant may have a much higher stress response to similar conditions..
If at all possible in terms of testing capacity i guess ideally you'd wanna sample the sample plant over time having received different treatments
Edited by DualWieldRake (07/02/17 10:35 AM)
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spaceman101
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Re: any experience with any of the named Trichocereus clones? [Re: DualWieldRake]
#24451783 - 07/02/17 11:06 AM (6 years, 6 months ago) |
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Mostly Harmless, Karode, Naum, Ferrel, Zap and other Master Cultivators and cactus consumers!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Pop in here and share your Ideas on what Duel, I and DBG are conversing over.
We could really use you guys insight.
Someone else will have to message Ferrel because he has me on ignore but I'll try to get the others in here a little later.
-------------------- ------------- Check out my Pollen Trade thread for spreading Good genetics far and wide Great Vendors thread where we can discuss "Non Shroomery" Vendors that sell good products worth checking into A few things I wanna get my hands on check it out and let me know if you have any of these Need help getting started growing mushrooms Here's The Noob Forum
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amp244
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Re: any experience with any of the named Trichocereus clones? [Re: spaceman101]
#24452312 - 07/02/17 03:16 PM (6 years, 6 months ago) |
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If you want to test the "stress it in the dark" theory, you would need to take 2 clones of the same size, rooted at the same time, and subject one to the dark treatment, and treat the other as you normally would. Then analyze the two samples for total alkaloid content. You could do that with isopropyl alcohol and PC's at home.
For now we should just focus on 5 named bridgesii clones that we want to test. We'll be sure keep track of the age of each cutting, as well as other parameters, in case we want to investigate any other hypotheses later.
As far as getting consistent samples, something like the tentative procedures below could be used: dried core samples from 2" of de-spined, cut 2-4" from the branch tip would be taken, cut like star chips. The dried chips would be powderized and 5g of powder would be mixed with a yet to be determined amount of isopropyl alcohol. After 3 days of soaking, the alcohol will be strained through a coffee filter and collected in a dish, the plant material being discarded. The tincture will be loaded into a syringe for gas chromatography.
Pretty simple. I will use straight core samples, skin, flesh, xylem; all blended together. Unless there is an argument for using one specific portion. I figure this would give one the best estimation of total content of the whole plant(less the roots).
-------------------- How to Convert a Normal 24-hour Light Timer into a Short Cycle Repeating Timer "Monopoly, besides, is a great enemy to good management, which can never be universally established but in consequence of that free and universal competition which forces everybody to have recourse in it for the sake of self-defense." -Adam Smith
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spaceman101
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Re: any experience with any of the named Trichocereus clones? [Re: amp244]
#24452397 - 07/02/17 03:44 PM (6 years, 6 months ago) |
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My mind is saying there's something wrong with the method you described but I cannot quite put my finger on it for some reason. I'll have to see what I have but I do have some good Bridge crosses that maybe we could work with on down the road.
With your ability to test 'said' plants you could easily and single handedly clean up the low activity trich market and introduce well known to be Potent plants (hell possibly naming them yourself if seed grown by you or by the person that grew them) directly to the market with PROOF of their strength where MANY others have failed 
Removing the low activity 'named' plants from the market where they're desired due to their name and thought due to 'said' name to be potent and replacing them with entirely NEW freshly named but tested potent plants (whether pure breed or crossed) you could end this maybe/maybe not potent guess work.
I believe this may be possible if you do have the time, proper methods of full extraction and the materials constantly coming in from the members here wondering what exactly they have.
Maybe something to look into after your 5 named bridge clone experiment 
This could be good or even bad if the government realizes the influx of purely potent clones up into the market and easy to get. I would imagine considering the time and effort you put into this your name will become as well know as Paul Staments is in the mushroom cultivation world.
Just think about it Bro
-------------------- ------------- Check out my Pollen Trade thread for spreading Good genetics far and wide Great Vendors thread where we can discuss "Non Shroomery" Vendors that sell good products worth checking into A few things I wanna get my hands on check it out and let me know if you have any of these Need help getting started growing mushrooms Here's The Noob Forum
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DGB
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Re: any experience with any of the named Trichocereus clones? [Re: amp244] 1
#24452407 - 07/02/17 03:47 PM (6 years, 6 months ago) |
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As long as you carefully document every step and factor and repeat that exactly with every sample you should end up with useful data. It may not be directly comparable to the information we already have but if you have enough of it it can help paint a better picture. So far most of the info in the graph has come from A/B extraction of the whole plant and then sending the crude extract to be tested for mescaline content thus letting us extrapolate the mescaline content of the whole plant per a unit of weight. We have to take into account other factors that might change the results if a whole plant isn't used, for example I would think from the same plant 3 inches of tip might come back stronger then 3 inches of middle section based sonly on the tip having more green skin surface area, if done by a punch biopsy would the results change based on were its taken from the plant, does the side that faces the sun vs the side that gets less sun matter at all? Growth tip vs base, I would believe that even the length of a punch biopsy would change the results a 3mm punch would by weight have more green skin and more mescaline by weight as opposed to a 6mm punch which would be more low content white flesh by weight, you would get different potency results from the same plant based just on that. I just worry that when dealing with small samples and extrapolation out might result in warped results based on some un accounted for value, I like the idea of 1k whole plant process because that’s a lot of plant material and gives a lot to average any inconsistencies and it’s a whole plant extract, skin,pulp,core ect. But again the argument can be made that if you do the exact same thing for each plant the results may not be comparable to other data but with enough data using that method you can group that data and have it show a trend. I think if something is done it should be standardized and determined to be the best method so if anyone else wants to add anything they can be sure it will fit in with the data we already have.
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DualWieldRake
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Re: any experience with any of the named Trichocereus clones? [Re: DGB]
#24452463 - 07/02/17 04:23 PM (6 years, 6 months ago) |
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Great points DGB
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spaceman101
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Re: any experience with any of the named Trichocereus clones? [Re: DualWieldRake]
#24453454 - 07/02/17 11:14 PM (6 years, 6 months ago) |
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Quote:
DualWieldRake said: Great points DGB
-------------------- ------------- Check out my Pollen Trade thread for spreading Good genetics far and wide Great Vendors thread where we can discuss "Non Shroomery" Vendors that sell good products worth checking into A few things I wanna get my hands on check it out and let me know if you have any of these Need help getting started growing mushrooms Here's The Noob Forum
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DualWieldRake
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Re: any experience with any of the named Trichocereus clones? [Re: spaceman101]
#24461685 - 07/06/17 10:47 AM (6 years, 6 months ago) |
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Should make this a new thread btw
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DGB
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Re: any experience with any of the named Trichocereus clones? [Re: DualWieldRake]
#24524027 - 08/02/17 02:11 AM (6 years, 5 months ago) |
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new info added and order changed
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Grey Fox

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Re: any experience with any of the named Trichocereus clones? [Re: DGB]
#24524520 - 08/02/17 10:05 AM (6 years, 5 months ago) |
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Thanks for updating this and keeping the info flowing.
You know what would be really interesting would be to test samples of these clones taken from the same garden from plant material of the same age. That sure would go a long way to rule out other variables that could affect the potency of the samples used.
-------------------- IT WAS ALL A DREAM
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Heyowana
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Re: any experience with any of the named Trichocereus clones? [Re: Grey Fox]
#24564440 - 08/19/17 06:46 AM (6 years, 5 months ago) |
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I feel for you DGB after reading this thread here and at Mycotopia. My rejects about equal the number of keepers with named clones. I can't fault bridgesii however. Since my last post here I've tried another 4 bridgesii. All slow boiled on slow combustion stove in excess of 20 hrs.
Bruce - 920g. Good trip. Good visuals as well. Kind of got lost in paranoia for a while. Actually more calm than Tig.
33 - 950g. Softer trip that didn't last as long as Bruce. Fourteen hours after taking it I could nod off. Still had good visuals but no paranoia on this one.
Con - 1005g. Surprised me how the extra boiling time made it more intense this year than the same weight boiled for about 16 hrs last year. Quite fiery in effect. Great visuals. Meltdown for a while where I couldn't walk for a few or more hours. Best one this year.
Eileen - 822g. I must conclude that my dosage wasn't enough or its hyped up too much. Very nice effect. Softer than Con and Bruce. Lasted about 10-12 hours. Visuals were good. Not great visuals like Con and Bruce. Tig has incredible visuals but I'm a bit scared of its potency.
Found a decent Icaro - 1200g or a bit more from memory. Less nausea than others with a more bridgesii type potency. Quite colourful trip unlike just feeling magical on the other Icaros without visuals to speak of.
Hope this helps. It would be great to get bioassays of these clones from someone else in a different part of my country or else where in the world. Keep up the good work. A lot of potency myths need to be dealt with in honest, open discussion.
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nolongrlurkin
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Re: any experience with any of the named Trichocereus clones? [Re: Heyowana]
#24564454 - 08/19/17 07:00 AM (6 years, 5 months ago) |
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Beautiful work, friends! Hayowana you sound like a far out dude!
-------------------- Cannabis for the body, cubensis for the mind, cactus for the spirit.
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Heyowana
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Re: any experience with any of the named Trichocereus clones? [Re: nolongrlurkin]
#24564511 - 08/19/17 08:08 AM (6 years, 5 months ago) |
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Thanks. I have to agree with you about cactus being for the spirit. Wish I'd known about that when I was younger. It's the best medicine for my spirit. Back in the 1980's I tried some crappy san pedro. Did nothing so I dismissed it until a couple of years ago. Better late than never I guess.
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DGB
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Re: any experience with any of the named Trichocereus clones? [Re: Heyowana]
#24565826 - 08/19/17 06:21 PM (6 years, 5 months ago) |
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i changed the name of the thread to better represent what its become, also added the most current graph to the top of the page with intent to continue to keep that updated there so its the first thing any new comers see without having to dig though the entire thread.
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nolongrlurkin
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Re: any experience with any of the named Trichocereus clones? [Re: DGB]
#24565957 - 08/19/17 07:41 PM (6 years, 5 months ago) |
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Whos got a report on medicine man? I would imagine it to be pretty close to any other bridge, but like hayowana points out, every cut has its own personality.
-------------------- Cannabis for the body, cubensis for the mind, cactus for the spirit.
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pinedownpioneer


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Re: any experience with any of the named Trichocereus clones? [Re: nolongrlurkin]
#24565983 - 08/19/17 08:03 PM (6 years, 5 months ago) |
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I saw that on ebay. Looked like a nice cut. Hope to get one someday but not the price the latest medicine mam went for.
-------------------- Trade list Need kratom? Message me now.
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Heyowana
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Re: any experience with any of the named Trichocereus clones? [Re: pinedownpioneer]
#24566971 - 08/20/17 09:31 AM (6 years, 5 months ago) |
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Bogan clone which has been said to be pachanoi or macrogonus I have an anecdotal report for. Tried more than anticipated due to two other people who were going to be testers not showing up.
I didn't like my method which consisted in pounding the chunks as they boil with a potato masher. C/O Mycotopia. Turns it into sludge. Okay maybe for the boiling time they recommend which is only 4 hours. I boiled up 3.3 kilos for 16 hours until the skin was peeling away from the flesh. Not pounded at all is better for that length boil. I find once bridge, peruvianus and pachanoi get past 20 hrs boil they disintegrate anyway.
Left the reduced and strained solution in the fridge. Week later I divided it in half and tried it. So dose was about 1650g. Had a fairly heavy effect due to the quantity I think. Visuals were pretty good like bridgesii. Some paranoia about 6 hrs in. Slow to come on. I actually found a new patch where Psilocybe papuana grow in my place then posted the photos on shroomery before I was too wasted to use the computer.
I took the dose at 10 am back in April. It was still going with visuals past midnight. 2.00-3.00 am I was getting anxious about not sleeping and kept shaking. Started seeing a white light high up above the CEV if that makes much sense. It pulled me into it and then I felt calm. Woke up late next morning very stiff and feeling old.
Bogan was no better than the bridgesii I have tried at 900g-1000g. Like Bruce it seemed to have a strong shamanic element to the trip once it got underway.
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jkz
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Re: any experience with any of the named Trichocereus clones? [Re: Heyowana]
#24567012 - 08/20/17 09:54 AM (6 years, 5 months ago) |
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happyjag
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Re: any experience with any of the named Trichocereus clones? [Re: Heyowana]
#24591144 - 08/30/17 03:53 PM (6 years, 4 months ago) |
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thanks for the report.
did you consume the entire amount of liquid strained from 3.3kg of cactus?
cheers-
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Heyowana
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Re: any experience with any of the named Trichocereus clones? [Re: happyjag]
#24599901 - 09/03/17 07:05 AM (6 years, 4 months ago) |
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You are welcome After consuming one half @ 1650 grams approx I evaporated the liquid from the other half. Ending up with a black tar like rock about 1.5 inches diameter.
One of the would be testers showed up about a month after this so I gave it to him. Haven't heard from him since. Most people don't like me when it comes to tripping. Always been that way. What I find an adequate dose is more than adequate it seems for others.
I'm very interested in slow boiling cactus for a long time. There is a lot of magic that comes out with a boil for twenty hours or more.
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GreenCraik17
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Re: graph of alkaloid content of named Trichocereus clones and anecdotal potency reports. [Re: DGB]
#24661232 - 09/26/17 11:08 AM (6 years, 4 months ago) |
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Thank you so much for this info. I created an account after lurking/lingering for over 15 years just to say this and get in on the info wave. Also added a pic of my newest baby just for fist post sake.
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DGB
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Re: any experience with any of the named Trichocereus clones? [Re: GreenCraik17]
#24682554 - 10/04/17 02:11 AM (6 years, 3 months ago) |
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Added a new column and 3 new cuttings from the DMT nexus thread. Debating if I should add a mg per kg of crude extract column or not, not really sure where it would fit in or if anyone really wants that breakdown as it seems less important than the pure mescaline pre- calculated col 8umb. Also updated front pager
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nolongrlurkin
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Re: any experience with any of the named Trichocereus clones? [Re: DGB]
#24683037 - 10/04/17 10:41 AM (6 years, 3 months ago) |
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Juuls is really showing out!! I might have to get some!!
-------------------- Cannabis for the body, cubensis for the mind, cactus for the spirit.
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DGB
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Re: any experience with any of the named Trichocereus clones? [Re: nolongrlurkin]
#24684194 - 10/04/17 06:17 PM (6 years, 3 months ago) |
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Quote:
nolongrlurkin said: Juuls is really showing out!! I might have to get some!!
Just remember, juuls used to be every thick patch, so it maybor may not be the same cut floating arround the current vendors.
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El Torcho
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Re: any experience with any of the named Trichocereus clones? [Re: DGB] 1
#24724817 - 10/20/17 02:59 PM (6 years, 3 months ago) |
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--------------------
"Well it sounds trivial, but the key insight is . . . . . you don't know shit" ~Dennis McKenna "There is more to human existence and to reality itself than science can ever give us access to." ~His Holiness, The 14th Dalai Lama
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nolongrlurkin
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Re: any experience with any of the named Trichocereus clones? [Re: El Torcho] 1
#24724914 - 10/20/17 03:29 PM (6 years, 3 months ago) |
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Good link, torcho!! Scops representing!!
-------------------- Cannabis for the body, cubensis for the mind, cactus for the spirit.
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El Torcho
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Re: any experience with any of the named Trichocereus clones? [Re: nolongrlurkin]
#24726322 - 10/21/17 06:23 AM (6 years, 3 months ago) |
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I just got me a scop! And a scop x bridge hybrid.
I found that searching for Hutchison 6212. Good to know that pach also has around .8%
--------------------
"Well it sounds trivial, but the key insight is . . . . . you don't know shit" ~Dennis McKenna "There is more to human existence and to reality itself than science can ever give us access to." ~His Holiness, The 14th Dalai Lama
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DGB
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Re: any experience with any of the named Trichocereus clones? [Re: El Torcho]
#24728228 - 10/21/17 10:26 PM (6 years, 3 months ago) |
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"Trichocereus spp. 'Juul's x peruvianus' AKA JS265" and "Trichocereus peruvianus? (cuzcoensis...) MB01" added to chart
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Heyowana
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Re: any experience with any of the named Trichocereus clones? [Re: DGB]
#24756228 - 11/03/17 04:51 AM (6 years, 2 months ago) |
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I have two "Eileen" bridgesoid clones in my garden from different vendors. First one was a bit of a disappointment at 822 grams. Tried the other one at 1000 grams and it was incredible. Electric, psychedelic to the max and unique. I danced with the sounds of nature and the reverberations coming out of the ground for six hours. OEV were so bright and fluoro coloured.
A really earthy trip in the sense that a chant reverberated through my body and made me dance until I was exhausted. I'd lay down after dancing most of the afternoon for a couple of hours. My body still kept trying to dance in the horizontal lying position. Felt like a million dollars with no fear at all. No nausea on the come up.
Appears like not all clones with the Eileen tag are in fact Eileen. This one kilo piece of Eileen was slow boiled for 24 hours over four nights. It's my favourite now and I want an Eileen garden but that will take a while.
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DGB
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Re: any experience with any of the named Trichocereus clones? [Re: Heyowana] 1
#24756314 - 11/03/17 06:48 AM (6 years, 2 months ago) |
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Quote:
Heyowana said: I have two "Eileen" bridgesoid clones in my garden from different vendors. First one was a bit of a disappointment at 822 grams. Tried the other one at 1000 grams and it was incredible. Electric, psychedelic to the max and unique. I danced with the sounds of nature and the reverberations coming out of the ground for six hours. OEV were so bright and fluoro coloured.
A really earthy trip in the sense that a chant reverberated through my body and made me dance until I was exhausted. I'd lay down after dancing most of the afternoon for a couple of hours. My body still kept trying to dance in the horizontal lying position. Felt like a million dollars with no fear at all. No nausea on the come up.
Appears like not all clones with the Eileen tag are in fact Eileen. This one kilo piece of Eileen was slow boiled for 24 hours over four nights. It's my favourite now and I want an Eileen garden but that will take a while.
ya, theres all kinds of factors, even if they are legit clones any number of factors could change the potency, iv been reading people have anecdotal reports that ageing a cutting will increase the mescline content. on the DMT nexus thread there was a post linking to the nook were someone did a test of sampling a cutting before and after ageing the cutting
"Sample collected and dried in end of November: concentration = 2.0% mescaline-HCl
Sample collected and dried in beginning of March: concentration = 4.1% mescaline-HCl
This is an increase of more than 100%, and this just because of storing the column for 3 month in the dark before drying!
We are quite proud of this finding and I think you might be interested in it as well. Its the first time that this behaviour is confirmed with a validated chemical analysis.
Entire original post here:
http://www.thenook.org/f...dex.php?showtopic=89234
EDIT: You have to be signed in as a member to view posts on the Nook. Well worth it though IMO! "
that was from a rooted cutting kept in a dark area, i wonder if the same could be done with a already calloused cutting, take a cutting, callous, store in closet for a few months to "age"
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Heyowana
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Re: any experience with any of the named Trichocereus clones? [Re: DGB]
#24758026 - 11/03/17 10:13 PM (6 years, 2 months ago) |
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Thanks, I remember seeing that one on DMT nexus. Crazy how the alkaloid content can double.
Both Eileen clones look alike. When I reduced the good one there was a thick salt like residue down the sides which I mixed in at the end. Next day I heated up the cup of reduced liquid and added it to water in another cup to make it easier to drink. I looked at the little pot I had the reduced liquid in later and there was more salty residue on the sides.
Haven't seen as much with any other clone so far. The weak Eileen didn't do this. It actually tasted insipid compared to other brews. Its action seemed very soft and enjoyable as a recreational drug. No way I'd call the strong Eileen recreational. I was that far gone. I couldn't interact with my dogs even. They just watched the dancing idiot doing his thing over and over again.
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Soulstice
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Re: any experience with any of the named Trichocereus clones? [Re: Heyowana]
#24764418 - 11/06/17 04:43 PM (6 years, 2 months ago) |
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SS01 has always been my favorite.
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Soulstice
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Re: any experience with any of the named Trichocereus clones? [Re: Soulstice]
#24764432 - 11/06/17 04:46 PM (6 years, 2 months ago) |
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There is a pdf of the complete Entheogen Review floating around out there with a three part series of articles by Trout entitled "Some Active Trichoceri."
Those interested in potency of known clones would do well to seek it out.
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MeanGreen
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Re: any experience with any of the named Trichocereus clones? [Re: Soulstice]
#24842991 - 12/12/17 10:03 PM (6 years, 1 month ago) |
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Looks like the pics are gone, does anyone have the chart please?
-------------------- Trade List
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DGB
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Re: any experience with any of the named Trichocereus clones? [Re: MeanGreen]
#24843114 - 12/13/17 12:21 AM (6 years, 1 month ago) |
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MeanGreen
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Re: any experience with any of the named Trichocereus clones? [Re: DGB]
#24843136 - 12/13/17 12:59 AM (6 years, 1 month ago) |
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Thanks a lot DGB!
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JayWise

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Re: any experience with any of the named Trichocereus clones? *DELETED* [Re: MeanGreen]
#24843202 - 12/13/17 03:06 AM (6 years, 1 month ago) |
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Post deleted by JayWise
Reason for deletion: .
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Mostly_Harmless
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Re: any experience with any of the named Trichocereus clones? [Re: JayWise] 2
#24843254 - 12/13/17 04:36 AM (6 years, 1 month ago) |
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Quote:
JayWise said: What is the current verdict on Trichocereus terscheckii alkaloid potential these days? Ive just got some seeds with the idea that they may be a Tricho capable of surviving long term in the ground in a UK garden.
They can be hardy enough to survive. I keep a few young'uns outside each year and none died off yet (after saying that, I'll probably lose some now!)

A flowering terscheckii in the ground in the UK, over 4m tall :
http://forum.bcss.org.uk/viewtopic.php?p=220931#p220931
Quote:

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JayWise

Registered: 11/05/17
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Re: any experience with any of the named Trichocereus clones? *DELETED* [Re: MeanGreen]
#24843392 - 12/13/17 07:41 AM (6 years, 1 month ago) |
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Post deleted by JayWise
Reason for deletion: .
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Spiny Cucumber
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Re: any experience with any of the named Trichocereus clones? [Re: JayWise]
#24843883 - 12/13/17 01:01 PM (6 years, 1 month ago) |
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I've read reports on Erowid about active terscheckii, for what they're worth. I have no personal experience with this species though.
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karode13
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Re: any experience with any of the named Trichocereus clones? [Re: Spiny Cucumber] 1
#24844652 - 12/13/17 08:41 PM (6 years, 1 month ago) |
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Some information regarding the chemical make up of T. terscheckii.
Taken from, The Garden Of Eden (2009)by Snu Voogelbreinder.
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DGB
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Re: any experience with any of the named Trichocereus clones? [Re: karode13]
#24844703 - 12/13/17 09:14 PM (6 years, 1 month ago) |
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I ended up getting a terscheckii little bit ago not because I planed of using it but because I wanted something comparable to a saguaro but faster growing and more water tolerant, I got mine from a no name eBay sale but other than that I don’t know anything about it. Its got the curved spines which seem to be common on some terscheckii but others seem to have straight thinner spines not sure what the different characteristics there are out there for terscheckii. There was also mention that terscheckii is an umbrella name that includes a bunch of other trichs like Validus and werdermannianus. I have to wonder what mine is
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karode13
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Re: any experience with any of the named Trichocereus clones? [Re: DGB]
#24844800 - 12/13/17 09:56 PM (6 years, 1 month ago) |
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Yeah. Validus and Werdermannianus often go under the Terschesckii name. You should post it somewhere so we can take a look. I've got an ok understanding of the species.
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DGB
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Re: any experience with any of the named Trichocereus clones? [Re: karode13]
#24844854 - 12/13/17 10:14 PM (6 years, 1 month ago) |
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posted it in the main trich thread a while ago. actually just repoted it yesterday, while it hasnt gotten taller its gotten a LOT fatter.
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Grey Fox

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Re: any experience with any of the named Trichocereus clones? [Re: DGB]
#24844929 - 12/13/17 11:03 PM (6 years, 1 month ago) |
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Nice young Terschesckii DGB.
I've seen mature ones get 15 feet. They're growth habit is similar to Saguaro but they're skinnier and don't get as tall.
-------------------- IT WAS ALL A DREAM
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karode13
Tāne Mahuta




Registered: 05/19/05
Posts: 15,290
Loc: LV-426
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Re: any experience with any of the named Trichocereus clones? [Re: DGB]
#24844936 - 12/13/17 11:10 PM (6 years, 1 month ago) |
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They're quite slow growing to begin with. I'd say it's a terscheckii, it's the same as one I've had for a while. Once it grows up we should know for sure.
My oldest one. Still a baby really.
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JayWise

Registered: 11/05/17
Posts: 199
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Re: any experience with any of the named Trichocereus clones? *DELETED* [Re: karode13]
#24845700 - 12/14/17 01:15 PM (6 years, 1 month ago) |
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Post deleted by JayWise
Reason for deletion: .
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pinedownpioneer


Registered: 03/28/10
Posts: 2,536
Loc: TX
Last seen: 4 years, 8 months
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Re: any experience with any of the named Trichocereus clones? [Re: JayWise]
#24845714 - 12/14/17 01:20 PM (6 years, 1 month ago) |
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I can't wait till my terscheckiiod's get huge. I think once fully rooted and put into the ground they will grow fairly quick.
-------------------- Trade list Need kratom? Message me now.
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nolongrlurkin
pre-shamanic warrior



Registered: 07/23/16
Posts: 611
Loc: florida
Last seen: 1 year, 6 months
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Re: any experience with any of the named Trichocereus clones? [Re: pinedownpioneer]
#24849425 - 12/16/17 08:31 AM (6 years, 1 month ago) |
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Terscheckii has seen better days!
-------------------- Cannabis for the body, cubensis for the mind, cactus for the spirit.
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WeAreMushroom
Ask Me About Bigfoot



Registered: 11/10/14
Posts: 1,405
Loc: Frying Like An Eagle
Last seen: 4 years, 10 months
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Re: any experience with any of the named Trichocereus clones? [Re: nolongrlurkin]
#24857088 - 12/20/17 05:53 AM (6 years, 1 month ago) |
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Hey guys, has anybody tried T. bridgesii var. Lee that can attest to it's medicinal value?
I'm thinking about buying myself a couple top cuts for Xmas.
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jingamin
Stranger

Registered: 01/28/21 
Posts: 59
Last seen: 14 days, 9 hours
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Re: any experience with any of the named Trichocereus clones? [Re: WeAreMushroom]
#27977897 - 10/02/22 11:12 AM (1 year, 3 months ago) |
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Between the two clones I used, the Trichocereus ''Tig'' strain had much more visual impact than the Trichocereus ''Juuls Giant'' strain.
I used, the Trichocereus ''Sharxx Blue'' strain caused much more nausea than the ''Bogan'' strain. But their effects and strengths were the same in both.
Trichocereus "HELON" strain; It was the worst of the Trichocereus strains I tried. Visual effects were almost absent and very poor. Goliath, again one of the weakest.
It gives a lot more excitement with named clones. For example, can't you share your new experiences with super pedro, psycho0, ss02, pachanoi monstrose, scopulucola X T. Pachanoi, scopulucola and even bruce and eileen?
I would be happy if you share your experiences like me. Has anyone experienced any of these?
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Heyowana
Hex10 line2


Registered: 04/01/14
Posts: 1,980
Last seen: 1 month, 14 days
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Re: any experience with any of the named Trichocereus clones? [Re: jingamin] 2
#28098043 - 12/14/22 10:15 PM (1 year, 1 month ago) |
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I liked Bruce. Think 950g slow boiled for 24hrs. Found Tig stronger but throw up each time I take 1000g. After that it's quite euphoric and strong. Comes on very fast once it gets going.
Bogan didn't do much for me compared to bridgesii. Lance if it is Super Pedro was very weak. SAB Eileen I love. It's strong like good bridgesii but much nicer. Kai at 1000g pretty convincing. A bit dark like Tig can be at times but strong. I throw up on it and it seems better after that.
Same for Tig. First time I tried it at 1000g boiled 14-16 hrs I think. Didn't throw up but had too much nausea to really enjoy it. 24 hrs boiled always throw up.
Bridgesii HB06 spewed and spewed for about an hour after it came on. 1000g 24hr boiled. After that it was different to other bridgesii I've tried. Good visuals that were distinctive to it. I've probably covered some of these way back in this thread.
SAB Eileen at 1080g 24 hr boiled. Threw up a lot after it came on. After that it was incredible. I felt like I was sprouting wings out of my back as I turned into a dragon. Except for Matucana pachanoi 9 & 11 it's the most out of it I've been on cactus.
Bridgesii seem the most reliable for a convincing trip. Matucana pachanoi 90 percent of the ones I've tried are as psychedelic as most good bridgesii. Plus they are so hardy to grow. Unlike some bridgesii.
Yowie was okay at 1250g. Bit short lived but a nice euphoric come down. Pachanoi Rod was weak. Huanucoensis X bridgesii was okay. Bridgesii is better. More effect. Not keen on crosses with peruvianus and scopulicola I've tried so far. Icaros 1 out of 6 was good for peruvianus. Nice spiritual mellow high for that one without any nausea. Others were weak with too much nausea for their mild effect.
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jingamin
Stranger

Registered: 01/28/21 
Posts: 59
Last seen: 14 days, 9 hours
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Re: any experience with any of the named Trichocereus clones? [Re: Heyowana]
#28402778 - 07/21/23 11:13 AM (6 months, 5 days ago) |
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Quote:
Heyowana said: I liked Bruce. Think 950g slow boiled for 24hrs. Found Tig stronger but throw up each time I take 1000g. Afte...
Hey bro Are you using only the outer green peels when doing these experiments? Or do you use white meat, which is close to green, except for the white core inside?
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