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Offlinestarfire_xes
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Taxes
    #23707548 - 10/04/16 05:24 PM (7 years, 3 months ago)

Federal income tax
State income tax
Local income tax
Employee social security tax (your employer pays the other half)
Employee Medicare tax (your employer pays the other half)
Property taxes
Road toll charges
State sales tax
Driver's license renewal fee
TV Cable/Satellite fees & taxes
Federal telephone surtax, excise tax, and universal surcharge
State telephone excise tax and surcharge
Telephone minimum usage and recurring/nonrecurring charges tax
Gas/electric bill fees & taxes
Water/sewer fees & taxes
Cigarette tax
Alcohol tax
Federal gasoline tax
State gasoline tax
Local gasoline tax
Federal inheritance tax
State inheritance tax
Gift tax
Bridge toll charges
Marriage license
Hunting license
Fishing license
Bike license fee
Dog permit/license
State park permit
Watercraft registration & licensing fees
Sports stadium tax
Bike/nature trail permit
Court case filing fee
Retirement account early withdrawal penalty
Individual health insurance mandate tax
Hotel stay tax
Plastic surgery surcharge
Soda/fatty-food tax
Air transportation tax
Electronic transmission of tax return fees
Passport application/renewal fee
Luxury & gas-guzzler car taxes
New car surcharge
License plate and car ownership transfer taxes
Yacht and luxury boat taxes
Jewelry taxes & surcharges
State/local school tax
Recreational vehicle tax
Special assessments for road repairs or construction
Gun ownership permit
Kiddie tax (IRS form 8615)
Fuel gross receipts tax
Waste Management tax
Oil and gas assessment tax
Use taxes (on out-of-state purchase)
IRA rollover tax/withdrawal penalties
Tax on non-qualified health saving account distributions
Individual and small business surtax (page 336 of Obamacare)
Estimated income tax underpayment penalty
Alternative Minimum Tax on income
Business Taxes & Fees
Federal corporate income tax
State corporate income tax
Tax registration fee for new businesses
Employer social security tax
Employer Medicare tax
Federal unemployment tax
State unemployment tax
Business registration renewal tax
Worker's compensation tax
Tax on imported/exported goods
Oil storage/inspection fees
Employer health insurance mandate tax
Excise Tax on Charitable Hospitals (page 2001/Sec. 9007 of Obamacare)
Tax on Innovator Drug Companies (Page 2010/Sec. 9008 of Obamacare)
Tax on Medical Device Manufacturers (Page 2020/Sec. 9009 of Obamacare)
Tax on Health Insurers (Page 2026/Sec. 9010 of Obamacare)
Excise Tax on Comprehensive Health Insurance Plans, i.e. "Cadillac" plans
Tax on indoor tanning services
Utility users tax
Internet transaction fee (passed in California; being considered in other states and at federal level)
Professional license fee (accountants, lawyers, barbers, dentists, plumbers, etc.)
Franchise business tax
Tourism and concession license fee
Wiring inspection fees
Household employment tax
Biodiesel fuel tax
FDIC tax (insurance premium on bank deposits)
Electronic waste recycling fee
Hazardous material disposal fee
Food & beverage license fee
Estimated income tax underpayment penalty
Building/construction permit
Zoning permit
Fire inspection fee
Well permit tax
Sales and Use tax seller's permit
Commercial driver's license fee
Bank ATM transaction tax
Occupation taxes and fees (annual charges required for a host of professions)


It's a good thing we have all these taxes now.  I don't even see how the country survived without them. :smirk:


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OfflinePatlal
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Re: Taxes [Re: starfire_xes]
    #23707565 - 10/04/16 05:29 PM (7 years, 3 months ago)

It's obvious based n this list that at least 20 more taxes are needed.


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InvisibleDividedQuantumM
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Re: Taxes [Re: starfire_xes]
    #23707607 - 10/04/16 05:42 PM (7 years, 3 months ago)

You forget that for the median income, average tax rates were lower in 2009, 2010 and 2011 than any year back to 1955 except for 2008.

In other words, taxes for most haven't been lower than they are now since the Eisenhower administration.

During the first three years of Obama’s presidency, all personal taxes were 9.6 percent, 9.7 percent and 10.8 percent of personal income, respectively. Those are on the low end of this 50-year time span. The only other years to fall below the 2011 rate were 1964, 1965, 2003 and 2004.


http://www.politifact.com/truth-o-meter/statements/2012/sep/28/barack-obama/barack-obama-says-taxes-families-are-their-lowest-/


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Offlinehostileuniverse
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Re: Taxes [Re: DividedQuantum]
    #23707653 - 10/04/16 06:05 PM (7 years, 3 months ago)

That's just conservative talking points!:psycrankey:


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InvisibleDividedQuantumM
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Re: Taxes [Re: hostileuniverse] * 3
    #23707792 - 10/04/16 06:56 PM (7 years, 3 months ago)

It's not conservative or liberal, it's just the facts.  Point is, taxes are historically low right now, despite the fact that all the conservatives here feel it's otherwise.


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Offlinestarfire_xes
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Re: Taxes [Re: DividedQuantum]
    #23707850 - 10/04/16 07:18 PM (7 years, 3 months ago)

you have to be kidding, right? 

tax freedom day and percent of taxes.  note that this doesn't include all the hidden taxes and fees, just income taxes

Year TFD Percentage tax burden
1900 January 22 5.9%
1910 January 19 5.0%
1920 February 13 12.0%
1930 February 12 11.7%
1940 March 7 17.9%
1950 March 31 24.6%
1960 April 11 27.7%
1970 April 19 29.6%
1980 April 21 30.4%
1990 April 21 30.4%
2000 May 1 33.0%
2001 April 27 31.8%
2002 April 17 29.2%
2003 April 14 28.4%
2004 April 15 28.5%
2005 April 21 30.2%
2006 April 26 31.2%
2007 April 24 31.1%
2008 April 16 29.0%
2009 April 8 26.6%
2010 April 9 26.9%
2011 April 12 27.7%
2012 April 13 29.2%
2013 April 18 29.4%[4]
2014 April 21 30.2%[5]
2015 April 24 31%[6]


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InvisibleDividedQuantumM
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Re: Taxes [Re: starfire_xes]
    #23707896 - 10/04/16 07:37 PM (7 years, 3 months ago)

Is that for the median income level?  I provide very different numbers from Politifact above.


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Offlinestarfire_xes
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Re: Taxes [Re: DividedQuantum]
    #23708010 - 10/04/16 08:21 PM (7 years, 3 months ago)

That's the aggregate for everyone in the country--high and low income.  kind of a 'moving average' which goes up every year


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Offlineqman
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Re: Taxes [Re: DividedQuantum]
    #23708031 - 10/04/16 08:27 PM (7 years, 3 months ago)

For the past 70 years, tax revenue relative to GDP has been averaging 17-18%. https://fred.stlouisfed.org/series/FYFRGDA188S

If you want to increase tax revenue, you have to increase economic growth, the 1% GDP growth we have been experiencing for years is essentially going backwards.


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Invisibledemiu5
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Re: Taxes [Re: starfire_xes]
    #23708766 - 10/05/16 01:46 AM (7 years, 3 months ago)

my experience with toll roads is that they are NOT a tax.  Toll roads are generally owned by independent companies.  that would then be a service fee, not a tax.  same for waste management services.  that is an optional service one can choose to pay for or not, as there are independent waste companies not contracted through municipalities, as well as you could take your own waste to the dump/landfill


also, my seller's permit was provided free of charge by the state (BOE).  while i do pay sales/use tax when applicable, there is no tax/fee for the permit itself.  this is in CA


i'm not so sure your list is accurate


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InvisibleballsalsaMDiscord
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Re: Taxes [Re: demiu5] * 1
    #23709343 - 10/05/16 09:27 AM (7 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

demiu5 said:
my experience with toll roads is that they are NOT a tax.  Toll roads are generally owned by independent companies. 




Yeah, thats not so bad.  The one that gets me is the new toll section of the 110fwy.  The 110 is literally the first freeway built in this town.  Freeway.  They are called freeways because you don't have to pay a toll.  Freeways were built with taxes, and they are maintained with taxes, and now they're trying to sell the damn things to us twice.  Chaps my ass just thinking about it.


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OfflineFalcon91Wolvrn03
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Re: Taxes [Re: ballsalsa]
    #23711971 - 10/06/16 01:33 AM (7 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

ballsalsa said:
The one that gets me is the new toll section of the 110fwy.  The 110 is literally the first freeway built in this town.  Freeway.  They are called freeways because you don't have to pay a toll.  Freeways were built with taxes, and they are maintained with taxes, and now they're trying to sell the damn things to us twice.  Chaps my ass just thinking about it.



How else should we pay for Republican tax cuts for the rich?  :shrug:


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I am in a minority on the shroomery, as I frequently defend the opposing side when they have a point about something or when my side make believes something about them.  I also attack my side if I think they're wrong.  People here get very confused by that and think it means I prefer the other side.


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Offlinehostileuniverse
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Re: Taxes [Re: Falcon91Wolvrn03]
    #23712130 - 10/06/16 05:01 AM (7 years, 3 months ago)

Tax cuts for the rich? At least they pay them, 48% of Americans pay ZERO taxes, try to stop being a partisan hack for a minute, will ya?


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OfflineFalcon91Wolvrn03
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Re: Taxes [Re: hostileuniverse]
    #23713150 - 10/06/16 12:57 PM (7 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

hostileuniverse said:
48% of Americans pay ZERO taxes, try to stop being a partisan hack for a minute, will ya?



I'll quote someone who rips your argument to shreds:

Quote:

hostileuniverse said:
Is federal income tax the only tax we pay? No, it is not. Some states have a state income tax as high as 13%. Now add in gas tax, sales taxes, "luxury" taxes, real estate taxes, cell phone taxes, investment taxes, internet taxes, and the list goes on and on and on...




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I am in a minority on the shroomery, as I frequently defend the opposing side when they have a point about something or when my side make believes something about them.  I also attack my side if I think they're wrong.  People here get very confused by that and think it means I prefer the other side.


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Offlinehostileuniverse
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Re: Taxes [Re: Falcon91Wolvrn03]
    #23713513 - 10/06/16 03:15 PM (7 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

Falcon91Wolvrn03 said:
Quote:

hostileuniverse said:
48% of Americans pay ZERO taxes, try to stop being a partisan hack for a minute, will ya?



I'll quote someone who rips your argument to shreds:

Quote:

hostileuniverse said:
Is federal income tax the only tax we pay? No, it is not. Some states have a state income tax as high as 13%. Now add in gas tax, sales taxes, "luxury" taxes, real estate taxes, cell phone taxes, investment taxes, internet taxes, and the list goes on and on and on...







Your post is retarded, clearly I was referring to federal income taxes, not all taxes:facepalm:

Does pretending to not know what is being discussed make you feel smarter? Or are you just so desperate for a "gotcha" line you don't care?


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OfflineFalcon91Wolvrn03
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Re: Taxes [Re: hostileuniverse]
    #23713631 - 10/06/16 03:51 PM (7 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

hostileuniverse said:
Your post is retarded, clearly I was referring to federal income taxes, not all taxes:facepalm:



Crumist was VERY clear in his post that he was referring to Federal Income taxes; he even had a Federal income tax talbe in his post.

You, on the other hand, only said "48% of Americans pay ZERO taxes".  You said nothing about Federal income taxes.


--------------------
I am in a minority on the shroomery, as I frequently defend the opposing side when they have a point about something or when my side make believes something about them.  I also attack my side if I think they're wrong.  People here get very confused by that and think it means I prefer the other side.


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Offlinehostileuniverse
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Re: Taxes [Re: Falcon91Wolvrn03]
    #23714143 - 10/06/16 07:25 PM (7 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

Falcon91Wolvrn03 said:
Quote:

hostileuniverse said:
Your post is retarded, clearly I was referring to federal income taxes, not all taxes:facepalm:



Crumist was VERY clear in his post that he was referring to Federal Income taxes; he even had a Federal income tax talbe in his post.

You, on the other hand, only said "48% of Americans pay ZERO taxes".  You said nothing about Federal income taxes.






Good job man, instead of discussing the issue, you've derailed the thread again:thumbup:


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OfflineThe Ecstatic
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Re: Taxes [Re: hostileuniverse]
    #23715420 - 10/07/16 07:28 AM (7 years, 3 months ago)

Yeah, once again, its everybody else's fault that you cant follow a simple conversation.


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OfflineFalcon91Wolvrn03
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Re: Taxes [Re: hostileuniverse]
    #23715958 - 10/07/16 10:51 AM (7 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

The Ecstatic said:
Quote:

hostileuniverse said:
Quote:

Falcon91Wolvrn03 said:
Quote:

hostileuniverse said:
Your post is retarded, clearly I was referring to federal income taxes, not all taxes:facepalm:



Crumist was VERY clear in his post that he was referring to Federal Income taxes; he even had a Federal income tax talbe in his post.

You, on the other hand, only said "48% of Americans pay ZERO taxes".  You said nothing about Federal income taxes.



Good job man, instead of discussing the issue, you've derailed the thread again:thumbup:



Yeah, once again, its everybody else's fault that you cant follow a simple conversation.



HU always thinks he is the victim.  We point out the flaws in his argument, and instead of a "thanks man, I'll be more careful next time", he cries to the mods that people are being mean for pointing out the flaws in his logic.


--------------------
I am in a minority on the shroomery, as I frequently defend the opposing side when they have a point about something or when my side make believes something about them.  I also attack my side if I think they're wrong.  People here get very confused by that and think it means I prefer the other side.


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OfflineThe Ecstatic
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Re: Taxes [Re: Falcon91Wolvrn03] * 2
    #23716159 - 10/07/16 12:00 PM (7 years, 3 months ago)

You have to be super emotional to lash out at people who are trying to help you.


My girlfriend always does it when she's on her period.


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Offlinehostileuniverse
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Re: Taxes [Re: The Ecstatic]
    #23716246 - 10/07/16 12:40 PM (7 years, 3 months ago)

I don't cry to the mods, I already know they don't give a fuck about your trolling

Quote:

The Ecstatic said:
Yeah, once again, its everybody else's fault that you cant follow a simple conversation.




Follow a convo? You're the one who is nitpicking shit


Quote:

The Ecstatic said:
You have to be super emotional to lash out at people who are trying to help you.


My girlfriend always does it when she's on her period.




Aren't you gay?


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Offlinehostileuniverse
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Re: Taxes [Re: hostileuniverse]
    #23716252 - 10/07/16 12:42 PM (7 years, 3 months ago)

Notice how the trolls here have completely derailed this thread from discussing tax policy to attacking me?

It's all part of their plan, they can't defend progressives and their theft of america's resources so they derail the thread to deflect from it

Y'all so transparent on this shit


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OfflineFalcon91Wolvrn03
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Re: Taxes [Re: hostileuniverse]
    #23716266 - 10/07/16 12:46 PM (7 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

hostileuniverse said:
I don't cry to the mods, I already know they don't give a fuck about your trolling



Oh, you cry to the mods all the time.  Just do a keyword search for "mods" posted by you.

I was banned for three days starting this past weekend because of a comment I made to you.


--------------------
I am in a minority on the shroomery, as I frequently defend the opposing side when they have a point about something or when my side make believes something about them.  I also attack my side if I think they're wrong.  People here get very confused by that and think it means I prefer the other side.


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Offlinehostileuniverse
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Re: Taxes [Re: Falcon91Wolvrn03]
    #23716267 - 10/07/16 12:46 PM (7 years, 3 months ago)

Gay as fuck


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OfflineFalcon91Wolvrn03
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Re: Taxes [Re: Falcon91Wolvrn03]
    #23716310 - 10/07/16 12:59 PM (7 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

hostileuniverse said:
Notice how the trolls here have completely derailed this thread from discussing tax policy to attacking me?



We were talking about how there isn't enough money to pay for things like freeways.  Then you derailed the thread by defending tax cuts for the rich.  Maybe you can help get us back on topic by explaining how to pay for such things by cutting taxes on the rich?


--------------------
I am in a minority on the shroomery, as I frequently defend the opposing side when they have a point about something or when my side make believes something about them.  I also attack my side if I think they're wrong.  People here get very confused by that and think it means I prefer the other side.


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OfflineThe Ecstatic
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Re: Taxes [Re: Falcon91Wolvrn03] * 1
    #23716328 - 10/07/16 01:05 PM (7 years, 3 months ago)

This thread is derailed enough because people, once again, are having to plot out your baby steps towards understanding conversations, we dont need your projected homosexuality on top of it. Take that to the pub.


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OfflineFalcon91Wolvrn03
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Re: Taxes [Re: The Ecstatic]
    #23716343 - 10/07/16 01:10 PM (7 years, 3 months ago)

:thatsaten:


--------------------
I am in a minority on the shroomery, as I frequently defend the opposing side when they have a point about something or when my side make believes something about them.  I also attack my side if I think they're wrong.  People here get very confused by that and think it means I prefer the other side.


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OfflineThe Ecstatic
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Re: Taxes [Re: hostileuniverse] * 2
    #23716405 - 10/07/16 01:25 PM (7 years, 3 months ago)

For the record, everyone was discussing tax policy until HU barged in witu his typical misunderstanding:

Quote:

hostileuniverse said:
Tax cuts for the rich? At least they pay them, 48% of Americans pay ZERO taxes, try to stop being a partisan hack for a minute, will ya?





And then when Fal calmly explains where he went wrong, HU responds with this:

Quote:

hostileuniverse said:
Quote:

Falcon91Wolvrn03 said:
Quote:

hostileuniverse said:
48% of Americans pay ZERO taxes, try to stop being a partisan hack for a minute, will ya?



I'll quote someone who rips your argument to shreds:

Quote:

hostileuniverse said:
Is federal income tax the only tax we pay? No, it is not. Some states have a state income tax as high as 13%. Now add in gas tax, sales taxes, "luxury" taxes, real estate taxes, cell phone taxes, investment taxes, internet taxes, and the list goes on and on and on...







Your post is retarded, clearly I was referring to federal income taxes, not all taxes:facepalm:

Does pretending to not know what is being discussed make you feel smarter? Or are you just so desperate for a "gotcha" line you don't care?








Again. This thread was going fine until all the towns people had to stop what they were doing to rescue you from your ignorance. You're like an animal who keeps puttinf bear traps on your own legs, and then snapping at people when they try to help you get them off.

Stop being so persistent in your ignorance. Pay attention to the conversation. Ask questions for clarifications instead of making brash assumptions and constructing straw men.


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OfflineFalcon91Wolvrn03
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Re: Taxes [Re: The Ecstatic]
    #23716433 - 10/07/16 01:38 PM (7 years, 3 months ago)

:whathesaid:


--------------------
I am in a minority on the shroomery, as I frequently defend the opposing side when they have a point about something or when my side make believes something about them.  I also attack my side if I think they're wrong.  People here get very confused by that and think it means I prefer the other side.


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InvisibleballsalsaMDiscord
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Re: Taxes [Re: Falcon91Wolvrn03] * 1
    #23717870 - 10/07/16 09:26 PM (7 years, 3 months ago)

I think that the whole conservative vs liberal paradigm that people seem to love so much is a big factor in the difficulties in communication.  Everyone wants to treat politics like football.  They have their team already, and they cheer for the home team, and boo the visitors.  That is fine for sports, because sports don't matter in the big scheme of things.  Politics do, and as such, they require a higher application of reason.  The political spectrum is more of a guideline than a hard and fast rule, and it makes sense that a given individual would hold opinions that are all over the map on varying issues.  What doesn't make sense is for a person to confine their opinions to a pre-ordained set of choices that fit neatly within little boxes labeled "conservative" and "liberal"


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Offlinehostileuniverse
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Re: Taxes [Re: ballsalsa]
    #23718483 - 10/08/16 05:44 AM (7 years, 3 months ago)

https://www.atr.org/full-list-ACA-tax-hikes-a6996

Is your healthcare costs rising? You can thank Obama and the democrats


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Re: Taxes [Re: Falcon91Wolvrn03]
    #23718488 - 10/08/16 05:49 AM (7 years, 3 months ago)

All those Obama care taxes aren't hikes on the rich, they are hikes on the middle class, the exact ones the democrats "pretend" to care about every four years


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Offlineviktor
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Re: Taxes [Re: starfire_xes]
    #23718499 - 10/08/16 06:00 AM (7 years, 3 months ago)

You guys have absolutely fucked this forum with your compulsive urges to feed the troll.


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Re: Taxes [Re: hostileuniverse]
    #23720417 - 10/08/16 07:11 PM (7 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

ballsalsa said:
I think that the whole conservative vs liberal paradigm that people seem to love so much is a big factor in the difficulties in communication.  Everyone wants to treat politics like football.  They have their team already, and they cheer for the home team, and boo the visitors.  That is fine for sports, because sports don't matter in the big scheme of things.  Politics do, and as such, they require a higher application of reason.  The political spectrum is more of a guideline than a hard and fast rule, and it makes sense that a given individual would hold opinions that are all over the map on varying issues.  What doesn't make sense is for a person to confine their opinions to a pre-ordained set of choices that fit neatly within little boxes labeled "conservative" and "liberal"




Quote:

hostileuniverse said:
https://www.atr.org/full-list-ACA-tax-hikes-a6996

Is your healthcare costs rising? You can thank Obama and the democrats




:trekfacepalm:


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Offlinehostileuniverse
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Re: Taxes [Re: ballsalsa]
    #23720516 - 10/08/16 07:59 PM (7 years, 3 months ago)

I never said anything about conservatives or liberals, only Obama and his merry band of demoshits, yes this law was partisan as fuck, not one single republican voted for it, deal with it


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OfflineThe Ecstatic
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Re: Taxes [Re: hostileuniverse]
    #23720562 - 10/08/16 08:16 PM (7 years, 3 months ago)

Except the idea itself came from a Republican Governor.


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Re: Taxes [Re: hostileuniverse] * 1
    #23720655 - 10/08/16 08:52 PM (7 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

hostileuniverse said:
I never said anything about conservatives or liberals, only Obama and his merry band of demoshits, yes this law was partisan as fuck, not one single republican voted for it, deal with it




how about we focus less on pointing fingers and focus more on suggesting solutions?

do you have any suggestions?


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Offlinehostileuniverse
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Re: Taxes [Re: The Ecstatic]
    #23721359 - 10/09/16 07:18 AM (7 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

The Ecstatic said:
Except the idea itself came from a Republican Governor.




Yes,  republicans can be liberal as well, were you not aware of that?


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OfflineThe Ecstatic
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Re: Taxes [Re: hostileuniverse] * 1
    #23721444 - 10/09/16 08:36 AM (7 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

hostileuniverse said:
Quote:

The Ecstatic said:
Except the idea itself came from a Republican Governor.




Yes,  republicans can be liberal as well, were you not aware of that?




Yes, are you?

You're the one who claimed it had no Republican support. While true for the ACA specifically, its origins are wholly Republican.


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Re: Taxes [Re: The Ecstatic]
    #23721457 - 10/09/16 08:41 AM (7 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

The Ecstatic said:
Quote:

hostileuniverse said:
Quote:

The Ecstatic said:
Except the idea itself came from a Republican Governor.




Yes,  republicans can be liberal as well, were you not aware of that?




Yes, are you?

You're the one who claimed it had no Republican support. While true for the ACA specifically, its origins are wholly Republican.




The Republicans were in on it, the fact that their arguments against it were completely disingenuous was another giveaway.


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Re: Taxes [Re: The Ecstatic]
    #23721512 - 10/09/16 09:07 AM (7 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

The Ecstatic said:
Quote:

hostileuniverse said:
Quote:

The Ecstatic said:
Except the idea itself came from a Republican Governor.




Yes,  republicans can be liberal as well, were you not aware of that?




Yes, are you?

You're the one who claimed it had no Republican support. While true for the ACA specifically, its origins are wholly Republican.




Of course, I single out liberal republicans all the time, (it's usually just ignored here because it don't fit the "stereotype" some here want to pidgeon hole me in)

The origins are republican, not surprising, the GOP isn't much conservative anymore, look at the bush support for Hildabeast, it's disgusting

Just another example of republicans acting like democrats, I often wonder why we call them "opposition parties" anymore,

Another great reason to vote Trump, break up the damn Washington oligarchy


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OfflineThe Ecstatic
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Re: Taxes [Re: hostileuniverse]
    #23721551 - 10/09/16 09:29 AM (7 years, 3 months ago)

Hows he gonna do that?


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Re: Taxes [Re: The Ecstatic] * 1
    #23721606 - 10/09/16 09:59 AM (7 years, 3 months ago)

Yeah, people seem to think that if Trump is elected, he can just fire everyone in Washington.  That's not quite how it works.


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Re: Taxes [Re: DividedQuantum]
    #23721659 - 10/09/16 10:20 AM (7 years, 3 months ago)

You're Fired!


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Offlinehostileuniverse
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Re: Taxes [Re: DividedQuantum]
    #23721951 - 10/09/16 12:07 PM (7 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

DividedQuantum said:
Yeah, people seem to think that if Trump is elected, he can just fire everyone in Washington.  That's not quite how it works.




It's a good start, my ch better than Hildabeast who will for sure continue fucking the middle class and keep up the war machine that liberals "claim"  to oppose

Trump has been very vocal about limited intervention and not fighting everyone else's wars


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Re: Taxes [Re: hostileuniverse] * 1
    #23725514 - 10/10/16 03:12 PM (7 years, 3 months ago)

There are really few flaws in peoples arguments.  Some people believe lower taxes on corporations bring increased investiment and revenue, as I do.  Some believe lower corporate taxes are a 'giveaway'

I don't believe that, because a dollar taken out of the private economy is a dollar not invested in growth.  I also believe a big part of the 'corporate taxes are a giveaway' is merely envy by people who don't make much money.

With that said, I believe the one thing that is really neglected is that corporations PAY NO TAXES.  It is all passed along in the cost of goods or services the corporations provide, and the consumer pays it. 

Secondly, a corporate tax, which raises the cost of a product, makes a product more expensive on the GLOBAL market. 


Why tax a company that exports products? People bitch about subsidized foreign products but turn around and say "Tax the fuck out of our companies"  Why?  So we can put an export tax on our products?  That's what it comes down to.  make our shit cheap, so we can sell it overseas, and bingo! gROWTH!!!!  hOW Aboout that?


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Re: Taxes [Re: starfire_xes]
    #23725593 - 10/10/16 03:41 PM (7 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

starfire_xes said:
There are really few flaws in peoples arguments.  Some people believe lower taxes on corporations bring increased investiment and revenue, as I do.  Some believe lower corporate taxes are a 'giveaway'

I don't believe that, because a dollar taken out of the private economy is a dollar not invested in growth.  I also believe a big part of the 'corporate taxes are a giveaway' is merely envy by people who don't make much money.

With that said, I believe the one thing that is really neglected is that corporations PAY NO TAXES.  It is all passed along in the cost of goods or services the corporations provide, and the consumer pays it. 

Secondly, a corporate tax, which raises the cost of a product, makes a product more expensive on the GLOBAL market. 


Why tax a company that exports products? People bitch about subsidized foreign products but turn around and say "Tax the fuck out of our companies"  Why?  So we can put an export tax on our products?  That's what it comes down to.  make our shit cheap, so we can sell it overseas, and bingo! gROWTH!!!!  hOW Aboout that?




Yet, corporations have trillions in cash and haven't been reinvesting it back into the company, there's not a supply problem, there's a demand problem. That's why corporations have been hoarding cash for the past decade.

Investors don't want management to increase production with an economy that barely grows at 1%, that could cost the company its very existence.

"passed along in the cost of goods"

Not in a competitive market place, smaller profit margins are the most likely outcome.


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OfflineFalcon91Wolvrn03
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Re: Taxes [Re: qman] * 1
    #23725928 - 10/10/16 05:37 PM (7 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

qman said:
Yet, corporations have trillions in cash and haven't been reinvesting it back into the company, there's not a supply problem, there's a demand problem.



Excellent point.  Moving those trillions into the hands of consumers would spur demand.  Now, how can that be accomplished...  :smirk:


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OfflineThe Ecstatic
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Re: Taxes [Re: Falcon91Wolvrn03] * 2
    #23725950 - 10/10/16 05:45 PM (7 years, 3 months ago)

Its almost like the public have a mechanism for redistributinc wealth in a progressive, bracketed way.


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Re: Taxes [Re: Falcon91Wolvrn03] * 1
    #23725955 - 10/10/16 05:46 PM (7 years, 3 months ago)

maybe we should give tax breaks to the wealthiest people and hope that they trickle a few crumbs down to the rest of us.


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OfflineThe Ecstatic
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Re: Taxes [Re: ballsalsa] * 2
    #23725959 - 10/10/16 05:47 PM (7 years, 3 months ago)

And when it doesnt, give them more to hypothetically accelerate the trickling.


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Offlineqman
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Re: Taxes [Re: Falcon91Wolvrn03] * 2
    #23725991 - 10/10/16 05:56 PM (7 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

Falcon91Wolvrn03 said:
Quote:

qman said:
Yet, corporations have trillions in cash and haven't been reinvesting it back into the company, there's not a supply problem, there's a demand problem.



Excellent point.  Moving those trillions into the hands of consumers would spur demand.  Now, how can that be accomplished...  :smirk:




I think some sort of royalty stream from US corporations for citizens, either at the State or Federal level. http://www.reuters.com/article/alaska-payment-fund-idUSL1N11N03U20150917

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alaska_Permanent_Fund

I would say to companies like Ford, GM, Apple, Nike, ect.  If you want to ship jobs out of the US, go ahead.  Not only will there be economic tariffs, US citizens get a percentage of your profits.

Of course the very wealthy would not be eligible for this program.  I say fuck having the government collecting corporate/individual taxes and then trying to "redistribute" the proceeds, this would be direct deposit into peoples bank accounts.

Something has to be done to save "capitalism" from imploding on itself, maybe capitalists would even be receptive to this policy.


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Re: Taxes [Re: qman]
    #23726012 - 10/10/16 06:06 PM (7 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

qman said:
Quote:

Falcon91Wolvrn03 said:
Quote:

qman said:
Yet, corporations have trillions in cash and haven't been reinvesting it back into the company, there's not a supply problem, there's a demand problem.



Excellent point.  Moving those trillions into the hands of consumers would spur demand.  Now, how can that be accomplished...  :smirk:




I think some sort of royalty stream from US corporations for citizens, either at the State or Federal level. http://www.reuters.com/article/alaska-payment-fund-idUSL1N11N03U20150917

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alaska_Permanent_Fund

I would say to companies like Ford, GM, Apple, Nike, ect.  If you want to ship jobs out of the US, go ahead.  Not only will there be economic tariffs, US citizens get a percentage of your profits.

Of course the very wealthy would not be eligible for this program.  I say fuck having the government collecting corporate/individual taxes and then trying to "redistribute" the proceeds, this would be direct deposit into peoples bank accounts.

Something has to be done to save "capitalism" from imploding on itself, maybe capitalists would even be receptive to this policy.




Norway does something similar with their hybrid public/private national oil trust fund


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Offlinehostileuniverse
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Re: Taxes [Re: ballsalsa]
    #23727464 - 10/11/16 06:14 AM (7 years, 3 months ago)

You wanna put "more money into the hands of the middle class"? Lower their fucking taxes!

We already have almost the worlds highest corporate tax rate, how's that working out for the middle class?


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OfflineThe Ecstatic
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Re: Taxes [Re: hostileuniverse]
    #23728101 - 10/11/16 12:01 PM (7 years, 3 months ago)

How many people in the middle class have corporations?

How do you even define the middle class? 50 years ago middle class was business owners, general practitioners, engineers.

Now it seems middle class is anyone who isnt rich or who isnt kept alive on government subsidy.



Either way, the corporate tax rate is a red herring because almost no corporations pay anywhere near that number. Otherwise, corporations like Boeing and GE wouldnt have NEGATIVE effective tax rates.


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OfflineFalcon91Wolvrn03
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Re: Taxes [Re: hostileuniverse]
    #23728199 - 10/11/16 12:53 PM (7 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

hostileuniverse said:
You wanna put "more money into the hands of the middle class"? Lower their fucking taxes!



Then who pays for schools, roads, police, etc???

Quote:

hostileuniverse said:
We already have almost the worlds highest corporate tax rate, how's that working out for the middle class?



And it's already been pointed out to you that we don't have anywhere near the highest effective corporate tax rate in the world, because most companies don't pay that much.


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Re: Taxes [Re: Falcon91Wolvrn03]
    #23728554 - 10/11/16 03:01 PM (7 years, 3 months ago)

Because a handful of mega corporations get out of paying a higher tax rate, most do not, most cannot.

The mega corporations slant that "effective tax rate"


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OfflineFalcon91Wolvrn03
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Re: Taxes [Re: hostileuniverse]
    #23728677 - 10/11/16 03:49 PM (7 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

hostileuniverse said:
The mega corporations slant that "effective tax rate"



THAT'S the problem.  Not that the tax rate is too high.


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Offlinehostileuniverse
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Re: Taxes [Re: Falcon91Wolvrn03]
    #23730205 - 10/12/16 04:13 AM (7 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

Falcon91Wolvrn03 said:
Quote:

hostileuniverse said:
The mega corporations slant that "effective tax rate"



THAT'S the problem.  Not that the tax rate is too high.




The second highest in the world isn't high enough for you?

:facepalm:


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OfflineThe Ecstatic
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Re: Taxes [Re: hostileuniverse] * 1
    #23730617 - 10/12/16 09:21 AM (7 years, 3 months ago)

For the third time now, he's not advocating raising the corporate tax rate.


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OfflineFalcon91Wolvrn03
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Re: Taxes [Re: The Ecstatic]
    #23730918 - 10/12/16 11:15 AM (7 years, 3 months ago)

:cookiemonster:


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OfflineKillaloting
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Re: Taxes [Re: Falcon91Wolvrn03] * 1
    #23732940 - 10/13/16 12:37 AM (7 years, 3 months ago)

higher tax usally is good, but in the states im not so sure since most of it goes to the military


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Re: Taxes [Re: Killaloting] * 1
    #23733612 - 10/13/16 09:53 AM (7 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

Killaloting said:
higher tax usally is good, but in the states im not so sure since most of it goes to the military




Thats a good point, but mostly a budget issue.

Would you cut military spending and give the tax savings back to citizens in the form of tax cuts? Or divert the military spending to other areas?


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