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Offlineinvitro

Registered: 05/03/13
Posts: 2,529
Last seen: 1 month, 21 days
'One Straw revolution' Must read book * 1
    #23704372 - 10/03/16 05:13 PM (7 years, 3 months ago)

I think this book has been mentioned before but I think it's worth repeating, with emphasis!!

I case anyone here is not aware of this book 'One straw revolution', here is an online pdf.
https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=1&cad=rja&uact=8&ved=0ahUKEwiX9Kni27_PAhVDLmMKHfNwB6QQFggeMAA&url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.appropedia.org%2Fimages%2Fd%2Fd3%2FOnestraw.pdf&usg=AFQjCNHMWaHjX6F81SL7yJZFSCTo-1yV_Q&sig2=gMOA7lZ4TAWtaa9YPgPU4w

This book is incredible!!  If you do any work with plants even on a small scale, I think this book is worth a read.

People had told me about this book before, but they did not really emphasize the book as being as awesome as it
really is, so I delayed reading it for a looong time and finally got around to it.

In a nutshell, this book is about farmed crops like grains and fruits(orchards).
The author claims that he can meet or beat commercial farm yields without any fertilizer,
using all natural nitrogen fixing plants intermixed with his intended crop.

His method includes no compost piles, no tilling, no weeding, no spraying herbacides or pestacides (not even natural ones
like neem etc).

And all that with less overall labor!
More money, less labor, more biodiversity, all organic, better taste and more trace minerals.

This book claims the method has become very popular in Japan and in certain other places, proving its viability in every
prefecture(land area) in Japan. 

I personally know one large citrus orchard that switched from this method in the US about 10 years ago and his yields
did not drop compared to commercial fertilizers, according to the owner of the orchard.  He probably got his inspiration
from this book but he never mentioned it to me specifically.

There is also some philosophical discussion which I find interesting.

I don't have a great deal of experience with this method yet but I hope to very soon.  There are youtube videos of
this method in action for rice etc.  Apparently this idea has been around for a long long time but doesn't get the
attention it deserves, so I'm attempting to raise some awareness.

Anyone with experience please feel free to share what you have learned.


Edited by invitro (10/03/16 05:14 PM)


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OfflinePsilosopherr
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Registered: 02/15/12
Posts: 12,278
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Re: 'One Straw revolution' Must read book [Re: invitro]
    #23704413 - 10/03/16 05:24 PM (7 years, 3 months ago)

I got caught up in similar romantic claims when I first became interested in permaculture. Not saying this author is a hack as I've never read it. Merely pointing out that some of these people are full of it, look for facts and beware over-romanticizing.

That aside, is there more to the method other than not doing things? That's what always seemed odd to me about that book. I suppose you mentioned use of nitrogen fixers.

I hope I'm not coming off like a naysaying douche. Just seeking discussion


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Offlineinvitro

Registered: 05/03/13
Posts: 2,529
Last seen: 1 month, 21 days
Re: 'One Straw revolution' Must read book [Re: Psilosopherr]
    #23704473 - 10/03/16 05:48 PM (7 years, 3 months ago)

This seems legit to me, I consider myself extremely skeptical and able to tell when something is fake in general.

He has been doing it for 25 years (hes dead now) and it has spread all over Japan to
the point where western style farming with synthetic fertilizer is rare (where it once was used by most farmers).

The guy who re-printed the book who lives in India gives a long detailed explanation about he produced
many grains successfully using this method.

It's spread to the US as well including to my neighbors 100+ acre fruit orchard, and he said it works for him.

Most people read the book, and start with a small test patch, to prove it's effectiveness.
I plan to do the same.  I did hesitate to promote the book but to prove this sort of thing in an orchard setting might
take years.  I wanted to give you guys an opportunity to be exposed to the idea so you could do your own testing
instead of waiting for me.


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Offlineinvitro

Registered: 05/03/13
Posts: 2,529
Last seen: 1 month, 21 days
Re: 'One Straw revolution' Must read book [Re: Psilosopherr]
    #23704480 - 10/03/16 05:51 PM (7 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

rbalzer said:
I got caught up in similar romantic claims when I first became interested in permaculture. Not saying this author is a hack as I've never read it. Merely pointing out that some of these people are full of it, look for facts and beware over-romanticizing.

That aside, is there more to the method other than not doing things? That's what always seemed odd to me about that book. I suppose you mentioned use of nitrogen fixers.

I hope I'm not coming off like a naysaying douche. Just seeking discussion




Your questions on methodology will all(or mostly) be answered in full in the book,
It's not too long, well worth the read.


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OfflinePsilosopherr
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Registered: 02/15/12
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Re: 'One Straw revolution' Must read book [Re: invitro]
    #23704509 - 10/03/16 05:58 PM (7 years, 3 months ago)

Interesting, pretty sure my local library carries it, may have to give it a shot.

Don't you hate it when truly good books have titles/talking points that sound gimmicky?


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Offlineinvitro

Registered: 05/03/13
Posts: 2,529
Last seen: 1 month, 21 days
Re: 'One Straw revolution' Must read book [Re: Psilosopherr]
    #23704524 - 10/03/16 06:03 PM (7 years, 3 months ago)

Be sure to get the re-printed edition (copyright 1992) not the original 1975, because the guy who did the re-printing
has a lot of good commentary about how he followed the system, had some failures initially, then switched to
different grain types and overcame his problems.

Or you could just read the downloadable pdf. :smile:


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Invisibledemiu5
humans, lol
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Registered: 08/18/05
Posts: 43,948
Loc: the popcorn stadium Flag
Re: 'One Straw revolution' Must read book [Re: invitro]
    #23706696 - 10/04/16 12:32 PM (7 years, 3 months ago)

good book


:thumbup:


i would also recommend anything by gene logsdon


--------------------
channel your inner Larry David


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InvisibleDualWieldRake
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Registered: 07/17/16
Posts: 1,115
Loc: Zone 8b
Re: 'One Straw revolution' Must read book [Re: demiu5]
    #23706764 - 10/04/16 12:50 PM (7 years, 3 months ago)

without having read it, i call nonsense.

there are chemicals that will literally make your crop explode.

you talk about yield but i only see this knowledge usefull in sustainability.


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Offlineinvitro

Registered: 05/03/13
Posts: 2,529
Last seen: 1 month, 21 days
Re: 'One Straw revolution' Must read book [Re: DualWieldRake]
    #23707453 - 10/04/16 04:55 PM (7 years, 3 months ago)

I dunno if it works yet, let's find out!

One tree that is mentioned in the book as a tree that grows quickly and is a nitrogen fixer.  Morishima acacia he calls it,
Acacia mearnsii is the scientific name, black wattle is the common name.  I'm not familiar with this species.

There is a nitrogen fixing tree that is common here, https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Leucaena_leucocephala
aka 'haole koa's in Hawaiian.  It's listed as one of the best nitrogen fixers on the planet. 

Does anyone have familiarity with the black wattle and perhaps how it compares to Leucaena
(growth rate, drought resistance, N. Fixing capabilities etc.)?


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OfflineSpanishfly
$$$Rich€€€Bich£££
Male


Registered: 03/19/12
Posts: 1,851
Loc: Spain
Last seen: 6 years, 26 days
Re: 'One Straw revolution' Must read book [Re: DualWieldRake]
    #23708812 - 10/05/16 02:53 AM (7 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

DualWieldRake said:
without having read it, i call nonsense.





I call this post nonsense.  Go read it then comment.


--------------------
I am currently BANNED from using Private Messages - so can anyone who wants to contact me do it via my Journal thread.  Link is https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/23831115

Maybe some mod or whatever might think this has now been long enough.


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InvisibleDualWieldRake
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Registered: 07/17/16
Posts: 1,115
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Re: 'One Straw revolution' Must read book [Re: Spanishfly]
    #23709450 - 10/05/16 10:12 AM (7 years, 3 months ago)

Thanks for the advice but my knowledge surpasses simple japanese grandpa farming idea's.

Farming ain't about sustainability you know..

Sure this book might have useful ideas, just far from revolutionairy.


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Invisibleferrel_human
stone eater
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Registered: 06/26/09
Posts: 16,320
Loc: Texas
Re: 'One Straw revolution' Must read book [Re: DualWieldRake]
    #23709477 - 10/05/16 10:22 AM (7 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

DualWieldRake said:
Thanks for the advice but my knowledge surpasses simple japanese grandpa farming idea's.

Farming ain't about sustainability you know..

Sure this book might have useful ideas, just far from revolutionairy.




Can you give me the jist of it. Since i am so anxious and almost ADD like i cant sit still long enough to read anything. I just dont read. Even long as posts like OP's.:sorry:


--------------------
Nature is my church and walking through it is gospel. It tells no lies and reveals all to those who look, and listen, closely.
-Karode


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InvisibleEl Torcho
Time for tea?
I'm a teapot

Registered: 04/16/15
Posts: 1,365
Loc: Lone Pine Hill
Re: 'One Straw revolution' Must read book [Re: DualWieldRake]
    #23710420 - 10/05/16 04:13 PM (7 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

DualWieldRake said:
Thanks for the advice but my knowledge surpasses simple japanese grandpa farming idea's.

Farming ain't about sustainability you know..

Sure this book might have useful ideas, just far from revolutionairy.





:canthelpbutlaugh:


--------------------
"Well it sounds trivial, but the key insight is . . . . . you don't know shit"
~Dennis McKenna

"There is more to human existence and to reality itself than science can ever give us access to."
~His Holiness, The 14th Dalai Lama


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Offlineinvitro

Registered: 05/03/13
Posts: 2,529
Last seen: 1 month, 21 days
Re: 'One Straw revolution' Must read book [Re: ferrel_human]
    #23717349 - 10/07/16 06:52 PM (7 years, 3 months ago)

Ok the 'gist of it' is really hard to put in a nutshell, it varies with the crop grown
and the soil type, climatic conditions, latitude.  It takes training and experience to apply
it successfully, but the yield per unit of labor is higher than commercial agriculture.

He wrote a sequel book with exact yields for commercial fertilizer in grain cultivation,
showing it to be dramatically lower in yield per unit of energy used.  The sequel is
interesting, it goes into much more depth about his techniques, although you have to
get to pdf page # 120 to get past the philosophical talk and start getting to the details.

Natural way of farming (free pdf out there too) copyright 1976 I think.

You can sort of get away with commercial practices in the US because of the gigantic amount
of farmland available.  That's not the case in most countries, especially Japan.  Anyhow
there seem to be large gains to be realized in the US as well.

---
It's best not to formulate an opinion on any matter until you've done your homework.
I read the book twice before saying anything and even that is a pushing it, I hope to
run some experiments but it's a long slow process.


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Offlineashfiken
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Registered: 09/06/06
Posts: 3,073
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Re: 'One Straw revolution' Must read book [Re: invitro]
    #23717426 - 10/07/16 07:14 PM (7 years, 3 months ago)

Nah you're correct this book is great and the techniques are proven for years by this man. It's not simply the fact he has done this but that this is the simple way in which people must live to be least invasive and in contrast to their environment. While also producing the food that sustains them not anything like what western culture is allowing for ATM. He uses ideas of permaculture which for many years have been documented this is an appreciable piece of knowledge held by this Japanese man and it does not simply pertain to farming.
Def more about a taoistic outlook yet still thriving still producing as humans need to..
We should all have this ability. Sadly even with more farmland to be had in the USA.
Not many can afford a few acres nowadays

Cheers


--------------------
hmm...

"I'm naked and fearless... And my fear is naked."

"life isn't worth living without the threat of death"

"I got my plans in a ziploc bag, let's see how unproductive we can be"

"nobody lives their lives fully except for bull fighters"

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Offlinelwheidt
the bridgesii guy
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Registered: 08/11/08
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Last seen: 11 months, 4 days
Re: 'One Straw revolution' Must read book [Re: ashfiken] * 1
    #23717473 - 10/07/16 07:26 PM (7 years, 3 months ago)

Its actually a philosphy book, not a book on gardening.
Fukuoka was also a very sucessful farmer, every single person who put him down ahould check out how much he yielded. He had a huge surplus of grains, rice, oranges, and a bomb veggie patch. There is no on here who will every ou yield him.
But the main points he makes are philosophical points. And everyone ahoukd read his works and not judge him before you do.
A bunch of people on here are so close minded as to seem brainwashed. Fukuoka was a genius.


--------------------
-bridgesii guy


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