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OfflineMorel Guy
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Re: U.S. owes black people reparations for a history of ‘racial terrorism’ [Re: Prisoner#1]
    #23690888 - 09/29/16 02:44 PM (7 years, 4 months ago)

Not sure how a thread about reparations turned into a debate about democracy or communism.

There's always going to be people like me that do what's easy.  To do what they've been doing and taking the average at every turn. 

There is no easy solution to racial problems which are totally 100% cultural.  It's not race it is culture.  Nothing holds back a culture like itself and it's own doing.


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"in sterquiliniis invenitur in stercore invenitur"

In filth it will be found in dung it will be found

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OfflineEzuma
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Re: U.S. owes black people reparations for a history of ‘racial terrorism’ [Re: Morel Guy]
    #23690898 - 09/29/16 02:51 PM (7 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

Morel Guy said:
Not sure how a thread about reparations turned into a debate about democracy or communism.

There's always going to be people like me that do what's easy.  To do what they've been doing and taking the average at every turn. 

There is no easy solution to racial problems which are totally 100% cultural.  It's not race it is culture.  Nothing holds back a culture like itself and it's own doing.




its not a debate about democracy or communism. I was talking about socialism, more broadly, and I am pro democracy; the two are not opposed, democracy is not inherently anti socialist by any means and I think it's absence was the biggest problem with communism.
*just for the record

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OfflineMorel Guy
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Re: U.S. owes black people reparations for a history of ‘racial terrorism’ [Re: Ezuma]
    #23690920 - 09/29/16 03:01 PM (7 years, 4 months ago)

I believe Bernie would emphasize democratic socialism.  I don't know of any form of leadership that would work perfectly for everything.  It's going to be designed and operated by humans and will make human mistakes.


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"in sterquiliniis invenitur in stercore invenitur"

In filth it will be found in dung it will be found

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OfflineEzuma
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Re: U.S. owes black people reparations for a history of ‘racial terrorism’ [Re: Morel Guy]
    #23690927 - 09/29/16 03:03 PM (7 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

Morel Guy said:
I believe Bernie would emphasize democratic socialism.  I don't know of any form of leadership that would work perfectly for everything.  It's going to be designed and operated by humans and will make human mistakes.




indeed, that doesn't mean we can't improve though

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OfflineMorel Guy
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Re: U.S. owes black people reparations for a history of ‘racial terrorism’ [Re: Ezuma]
    #23690954 - 09/29/16 03:13 PM (7 years, 4 months ago)

Everyone has a different idea on what an improvement is. 

Last night I was having dinner with older people in my family.  The topic of the heroin problem came into conversation.  I kept my mouth shut because I have used many drugs in my life and been in jail.  There were some strong opinions such as letting the users die or going after dealers with the death penalty.  So not everyone's ideas how to go about other people's buisness and life's is going to solve anything.


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"in sterquiliniis invenitur in stercore invenitur"

In filth it will be found in dung it will be found

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OfflineEzuma
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Re: U.S. owes black people reparations for a history of ‘racial terrorism’ [Re: Morel Guy]
    #23690986 - 09/29/16 03:24 PM (7 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

Morel Guy said:
Everyone has a different idea on what an improvement is. 

Last night I was having dinner with older people in my family.  The topic of the heroin problem came into conversation.  I kept my mouth shut because I have used many drugs in my life and been in jail.  There were some strong opinions such as letting the users die or going after dealers with the death penalty.  So not everyone's ideas how to go about other people's buisness and life's is going to solve anything.




that's why we need a mixture of science, reason and logical argument as embodied by philosophical tradition and a rational approach to ethics imo, whatever secures the greatest good for the most people is the ideal course

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OfflineMorel Guy
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Re: U.S. owes black people reparations for a history of ‘racial terrorism’ [Re: Ezuma]
    #23691002 - 09/29/16 03:31 PM (7 years, 4 months ago)

Sounds like legislation to me.  Freedom flows!  It has to be here and now, we only have present moment.  You cannot secure a future or change a past.  Religion and law have in common several flaws.  They try to be authority on what is and what will forever be.  We know far to little about reality to be so stubborn.


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"in sterquiliniis invenitur in stercore invenitur"

In filth it will be found in dung it will be found

Edited by Morel Guy (09/29/16 03:31 PM)

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Offlinekoods
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Re: U.S. owes black people reparations for a history of ‘racial terrorism’ [Re: qman]
    #23691007 - 09/29/16 03:35 PM (7 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

qman said:
Quote:

koods said:
Quote:

Dark_Star said:
Nah. That shit was hundreds of years ago. They're not indirectly affected by slavery at all. The current racism is a different issue, and won't be solved by giving people money. If that was the case, affirmative action would've solved this problem. It didn't. And I don't buy into this white guilt bullshit. Wasn't even the sins of my father. My ancestors weren't even in this country until around WWII. Only slaves my ancestors may have owned were white Europeans they kidnapped during Viking raids.




You don't think that high levels of poverty in the black community is related to the fact that. for a few hundred years, most black people had no means to create wealth? Poverty is passed down through the generations just like wealth does. If you believe that coming from a rich family gives someone a great advantage in life, then you also must believe that coming from a poor family puts someone at a great disadvantage.

For the first few hundred years in this country, black families were legally prevented from acquiring wealth and property. They were the property. Yes it was 150 years ago, but that's only 5 generations or so.

Its like a relay race where one team has to wait for 20 seconds before they can start. Can we really expect the guy who runs the last leg to finish with the other runners? Is he lazy if he doesn't?




What wealth did the second wave of European immigration have when they arrived into the US?  Pretty much nothing.




Were they prevented from acquiring wealth? Was it illegal for them to learn how to read or write? Was it illegal for them to own land.? Was it illegal for them to attend university?

Black people were not allowed to participate in the American dream for hundreds of years, then when slavery ended, were subject to major restrictions to participation for another hundred. A white person fresh off the boat in 1920 had so much more opportunity than a black person who was born here. This is systemic disenfranchisement of a group of people. Of course that will have repercussions for multiple generations.


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NotSheekle said
“if I believed she was 16 I would become unattracted to her”

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OfflineEzuma
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Re: U.S. owes black people reparations for a history of ‘racial terrorism’ [Re: Morel Guy]
    #23691031 - 09/29/16 03:42 PM (7 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

Morel Guy said:
Sounds like legislation to me.  Freedom flows!  It has to be here and now, we only have present moment.  You cannot secure a future or change a past.  Religion and law have in common several flaws.  They try to be authority on what is and what will forever be.  We know far to little about reality to be so stubborn.




that sounds nice, but in practice we can't operate as a technical industrial society without regulations and oversight. If you want to return to semi nomadic non materialist living, the time for that is probably irrevocably past.
If you're talking about libertarianism, that will never work until human nature itself is transformed

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OfflineMorel Guy
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Re: U.S. owes black people reparations for a history of ‘racial terrorism’ [Re: Ezuma]
    #23691041 - 09/29/16 03:46 PM (7 years, 4 months ago)

If you want to live in a factory as a programmed robot I don't.  $16 an hour for your soul.


--------------------
"in sterquiliniis invenitur in stercore invenitur"

In filth it will be found in dung it will be found

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InvisiblezZZz
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Re: U.S. owes black people reparations for a history of ‘racial terrorism’ [Re: Morel Guy]
    #23691052 - 09/29/16 03:49 PM (7 years, 4 months ago)

Who've had it worse, African Americans or native Americans?..


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OfflineEzuma
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Re: U.S. owes black people reparations for a history of ‘racial terrorism’ [Re: Morel Guy]
    #23691053 - 09/29/16 03:50 PM (7 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

Morel Guy said:
If you want to live in a factory as a programmed robot I don't.  $16 an hour for your soul.




I believe in personal freedoms to a degree. No rules doesn't mean freedom, it means oligarchy and feudalism, it's just impossible so far for large groups of humans to self organize without a structure. Democracy after all requires a structure in order to work. What do you propose, disband all armies and government institutions and say 'sort your shit out people' ? The private sector?
It is strange to me people often see government as inherently corrupt and evil, and somehow the same laws don't apply to corporations, which in any case are originally formed for profit and profit alone? In what way does that sound preferable I wonder

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OfflineEzuma
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Re: U.S. owes black people reparations for a history of ‘racial terrorism’ [Re: zZZz]
    #23691056 - 09/29/16 03:50 PM (7 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

zZZz said:
Who've had it worse, African Americans or native Americans?..




Natives easily over long term, more recently I dunno. In Canada all around natives. We fucked them over right proper

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OfflineMorel Guy
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Re: U.S. owes black people reparations for a history of ‘racial terrorism’ [Re: Ezuma] * 1
    #23691069 - 09/29/16 03:57 PM (7 years, 4 months ago)

None if it has to do with anything else.  The state of the world is that economies are geared towards war.  Can't back out as that would be suicide.  I have no great philosophy and don't claim to have ever heard one.  I just don't find that humans are smart as we can be destructive. I'm guilty of that. 

I just think there should be more freedom provided to those of us that don't want to control everything.  People that want to live high and free and not bothered by all the complicated rules it takes to win wars.  Not everyone is going to conform to religion, be a factory model tool or a perfect model citizen.  Some of us want to smoke weed and relax contemplating our own role and culture that we want.  Not being born a prisoner or draftee.


--------------------
"in sterquiliniis invenitur in stercore invenitur"

In filth it will be found in dung it will be found

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InvisiblePrisoner#1
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Re: U.S. owes black people reparations for a history of ‘racial terrorism’ [Re: Morel Guy]
    #23691090 - 09/29/16 04:08 PM (7 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

Morel Guy said:
It's not race it is culture.  Nothing holds back a culture like itself and it's own doing.




DO NOT MUDDY THE ARGUMENT WITH YOUR TRUTH AND FACTS CRAP!!!

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OfflineTNK
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Re: U.S. owes black people reparations for a history of ‘racial terrorism’ [Re: Ezuma]
    #23691118 - 09/29/16 04:13 PM (7 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

Ezuma said:
Quote:

zZZz said:
Who've had it worse, African Americans or native Americans?..




Natives easily over long term, more recently I dunno. In Canada all around natives. We fucked them over right proper





Lol, natives in the long run.

They were enslaved, genocide, loss and cultural destruction.

All negatives blacks suffered natives did as well, they just got compensated with land


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Edited by TNK (02/22/22 22:22 PM)

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InvisiblePrisoner#1
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Re: U.S. owes black people reparations for a history of ‘racial terrorism’ [Re: TNK]
    #23691126 - 09/29/16 04:18 PM (7 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

TheNatureKid said:
Quote:

Ezuma said:
Quote:

zZZz said:
Who've had it worse, African Americans or native Americans?..




Natives easily over long term, more recently I dunno. In Canada all around natives. We fucked them over right proper





Lol, natives in the long run.

They were enslaved, genocide, loss and cultural destruction.

All negatives blacks suffered natives did as well, they just got compensated with land





natives were not compensated with land, they havent been compensated with
anything, natives were stripped of their land and permitted to live in
areas of confinement

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OfflineTNK
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Re: U.S. owes black people reparations for a history of ‘racial terrorism’ [Re: Prisoner#1]
    #23691132 - 09/29/16 04:19 PM (7 years, 4 months ago)

True, your right that wasn't a compensation, often the land they were "given" was taken away from them in the following years.


--------------------
Edited by TNK (02/22/22 22:22 PM)

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Offlineakira_akuma
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Re: U.S. owes black people reparations for a history of ‘racial terrorism’ [Re: Astral Pain]
    #23691360 - 09/29/16 05:45 PM (7 years, 4 months ago)

anyone who was effected from colonialism and barbarism, should receive reparations...yeah, i'm looking at Spain, more than anybody.

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Offlineakira_akuma
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Re: U.S. owes black people reparations for a history of ‘racial terrorism’ [Re: Prisoner#1]
    #23691365 - 09/29/16 05:46 PM (7 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

Prisoner#1 said:
Quote:

akira_akuma said:
thing is, those people that were directly effected by slavery (and can prove it, obviously) can help get those communities richen and prosper by being given reparations...to do with what they will.

in any event, at the very least, if it's all squandered, just imagine the headlines, and think about that concept. :shrug:






you're free to give them reparations if you so choose so they can get their communities richen and prosper



you liked that didn't you? like when koods gets your ladder midget richen and prosper.

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