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Offlineakira_akuma
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Modernising Religion
    #23686279 - 09/28/16 11:33 AM (7 years, 4 months ago)



interesting video -- go to 7 minutes in to see a really interesting conversation that nails the point home about what is truly wrong in religions today. applies to Islam as well.

PS: there is another conversation that is relevant on the issue of a "personal God" -- ie the personal relationship people invoke with their chosen "God" -- which is insightful as well; seeing as it's the truth.

but just thought maybe we could discuss this, this is a still very relevant topic on the world stage, these days, in my opinion.


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Offlinehostileuniverse
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Re: Modernising Religion [Re: akira_akuma]
    #23686386 - 09/28/16 12:11 PM (7 years, 4 months ago)



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Offlineakira_akuma
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Re: Modernising Religion [Re: hostileuniverse]
    #23686411 - 09/28/16 12:18 PM (7 years, 4 months ago)

it's not gonna be an easy thread to get off the ground, it's not a basic highlight of something that's got a spotlight shined on it, but i'm sure i can get a view insights eventually, even if this thread doesn't become very big.


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Offlinehostileuniverse
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Re: Modernising Religion [Re: akira_akuma]
    #23686427 - 09/28/16 12:24 PM (7 years, 4 months ago)

:cuteshit:


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Offlineakira_akuma
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Re: Modernising Religion [Re: hostileuniverse]
    #23686443 - 09/28/16 12:28 PM (7 years, 4 months ago)

stop spamming your idiocy in my thread, please. stay on topic.


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Offlinehostileuniverse
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Re: Modernising Religion [Re: akira_akuma]
    #23686460 - 09/28/16 12:31 PM (7 years, 4 months ago)

"Christianity bad, Islam good", that is the modernization of religion


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Offlineakira_akuma
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Re: Modernising Religion [Re: hostileuniverse] * 4
    #23686469 - 09/28/16 12:34 PM (7 years, 4 months ago)

no, you are just displaying your absolute lack of comprehension when it comes to religion, politics, anthropology, humanity, realism, philosophy, reasoning, logic, ethics, morality, and cognitive sense -- you are also displaying your lack of a fluent and well-adjusted psychology.


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Offlinehostileuniverse
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Re: Modernising Religion [Re: akira_akuma]
    #23686479 - 09/28/16 12:37 PM (7 years, 4 months ago)

Psychology? Am I supposed to be a psychologist to participate in your idiotic topic?


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Offlineakira_akuma
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Re: Modernising Religion [Re: hostileuniverse]
    #23686497 - 09/28/16 12:41 PM (7 years, 4 months ago)

everyone has a psychology...i am so liable to call someone numb nuts right now. :facepalm:


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Offlinehostileuniverse
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Re: Modernising Religion [Re: akira_akuma]
    #23686515 - 09/28/16 12:45 PM (7 years, 4 months ago)

You can insult all you like, only conservatives get banned for insulting  people, progressives are free to insult at will, as constantly evidenced by these threads


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Offlineakira_akuma
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Re: Modernising Religion [Re: hostileuniverse]
    #23686532 - 09/28/16 12:50 PM (7 years, 4 months ago)

no, i just don't flame you. plus, by you doing this trolly nonsense, which frankly, i should just notify Enlil, so he can sort this out, but i don't know why i don't...honestly...but anyways, you're just trolling my thread, i asked you to leave, you won't, this is causing offence to me...i'm greatly vexed...i think that'll cover me with the 'numb nuts' comment, especially since it wasn't levelled at you, as a flame, nor was anything to be taken seriously, as in the context i put it in, it's clearly a joke, and not directly at your expense, though you make the correlation easy to define when you won't leave me alone, and stop trolling my thread. i mean, you make it so obvious, there's no really denying it. :shrug:


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OfflineThe Ecstatic
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Re: Modernising Religion [Re: hostileuniverse]
    #23686546 - 09/28/16 12:53 PM (7 years, 4 months ago)

I'll watch the vid when I get to a place where I can.


But for now, I'll have to side with Hitchens and say religion poisons everything.

The idea that faith (believing things regardless of the evidencd) is a virtue is one of the biggest problems facing humanity, imo.


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OfflineThe Ecstatic
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Re: Modernising Religion [Re: The Ecstatic] * 6
    #23686554 - 09/28/16 12:55 PM (7 years, 4 months ago)

If religion wants to modernize itself, it needs to drop the superstitition and become what Jesus intended: a champion for the disenfranchised.

Pope Francis and his buddies see this. Thats why hes going around being Bernie Sanders in a funny hat.


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Offlinehostileuniverse
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Re: Modernising Religion [Re: The Ecstatic]
    #23686555 - 09/28/16 12:55 PM (7 years, 4 months ago)

I believe in govt, they will heal us, keep us safe, and give us everything we need

All hail big govt!


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OfflineThe Ecstatic
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Re: Modernising Religion [Re: hostileuniverse] * 3
    #23686568 - 09/28/16 12:59 PM (7 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

hostileuniverse said:
I believe in govt, they will heal us, keep us safe, and give us everything we need

All hail big govt!




If I gave a homeless man a penny I'd be doing more than god is.


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Offlineakira_akuma
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Re: Modernising Religion [Re: The Ecstatic]
    #23686573 - 09/28/16 01:00 PM (7 years, 4 months ago)

i'd say that trying to comprehend things that are no evidenced is akin to belief, though...so there is a thin line, essentially, between justified true belief and outright superstition and outright assumption.

though, it says in the scriptures, thou shalt not commit false witness (most people do, unless you're talking extremely precise secular centers where people perhaps do not do so, ie, in the video, you'll see some well-reasoned secular Jews, that's what is interesting...) really, it seems from what i've read, there is a good enough reason to believe that there is a calling, even within the religions, for those who can, to abrogate the dominion of the religious elite and have a personal relationship and more importantly stake with "God". there is also plenty of room for secular thought within the context of religion. from a political purview, it'd be noteworthy to see how we can promote more secularism, and more understanding, between these religions, and also, between these religions and atheists.

of course, this is the goal...not to simply do away with religion, but to phase it out, or make, altogether, not so harmful to the political sphere of influence.


Edited by akira_akuma (09/28/16 01:12 PM)


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OfflineThe Ecstatic
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Re: Modernising Religion [Re: akira_akuma]
    #23686604 - 09/28/16 01:07 PM (7 years, 4 months ago)

Good point. Harris makes a similar argument. The goal isnt to chastise religion into obscurity, but to find common enough ground with the moderates so they do so from within these instutions (Martin Luther comes to mind).

And its definitely a good sign that people are moving away from the authorities in these circles. I'm confident we're picking up steam in the right direction, and no matter religions' reaction to this, theyre helping.

If they continue to dull down their doctrine, we win.

If they try to silence dissent, get violent, or be otherwise wildly reactionary, theyll be exposed as hypocrites, and we win.


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Offlineqman
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Re: Modernising Religion [Re: The Ecstatic] * 1
    #23686637 - 09/28/16 01:15 PM (7 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

The Ecstatic said:
If religion wants to modernize itself, it needs to drop the superstitition and become what Jesus intended: a champion for the disenfranchised.

Pope Francis and his buddies see this. Thats why hes going around being Bernie Sanders in a funny hat.




The Pope and his child raping buddies are a bunch of retards. :shrug:


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OfflineThe Ecstatic
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Re: Modernising Religion [Re: qman] * 4
    #23686653 - 09/28/16 01:17 PM (7 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

qman said:
Quote:

The Ecstatic said:
If religion wants to modernize itself, it needs to drop the superstitition and become what Jesus intended: a champion for the disenfranchised.

Pope Francis and his buddies see this. Thats why hes going around being Bernie Sanders in a funny hat.




The Pope and his child raping buddies are a bunch of retards. :shrug:




That they are. But the see whats in store for backward ass religion. His entire papalcy has been a PR campaign. When the most powerful man of the most powerful religious organization in the world decides they need to start talking about income inequality instead of scripture, I'd call that a win for us secular folk.


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Offlineakira_akuma
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Re: Modernising Religion [Re: The Ecstatic]
    #23686683 - 09/28/16 01:24 PM (7 years, 4 months ago)

right. i mean, the Rationalists in India are making huge headway, for example...and Atheist blogs are popping up in places where, frankly, it's a life or death situation to be Atheist.

and really, i must say...there is a lot of conflicting things i see in scripture and literature, that the adepts in the religions would use, that denote a more free-thinking attitude then what is more normally allowed in sects that are more orthodox with whom are simply aiming to live a very...superstitious life; one that allows them to hold a control over their family, for the most part...seeing as though they are now a minority.

and i find evidence for that train of though, honestly. though, it's clear to me, however, that the Torah, funnily enough, is more akin to taking Sumerian myth, and putting it upside down on it's head, ie, making it instead of Enki freeing people from their bondage, it's God holds bonded man to wander until he's freed.

it's essentially a flip around. but again, i see reason to believe that that is to hold only to those whom are children to begin with, no unable to the head of their own kind. at the very least, this is a retroactive effect, but presumably from de-conditioning oneself; otherwise, it seems to be a natural effect of the secular elements that can be derived from the literature coming more to the forefront, and the secular finding methodology to figure out a more secular means of portraying the law of Jewish customs.

then you get into the whole Christianity thing, and it even more so secularises the world. Islam -- check this out

here's an interesting argument for Muslims: if Jesus was also a messenger of Allah, then the successor to him is "the Prophet Muhammad". if Allah had sent a succession of messengers, which is agreed to be true, then we can posit that Allah had revised or altered the message sent forth to us throughout the two successions of messenger to Earth. now let us postulate that Allah has given us free-will, agreed? if all of the above is true then it follows that it's distinctly probable that Allah would not previse, with our free-will that has been given, that Muslims could not choose to cooperate, and unite, with all religions and people through the will to do so, being that "all that is predestined is open to Allah"; is this not a true statement?

i constructed this argument. it holds up theologically, i believe.

even in Islam there is a rationalisation that God MUST be able to be comprehended rationally, even if it can't be understood by 'our meagre understanding'. this is preordained in the Quran.


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