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TedTheHighlighter
Cheshire Cat


Registered: 12/09/14
Posts: 490
Last seen: 2 months, 7 days
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Re: Being a white person [Re: qman]
#23676150 - 09/25/16 09:21 AM (7 years, 4 months ago) |
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Quote:
qman said:
Quote:
CookieCrumbs said: And many public schools in poor communities are severely under funded shitholes.
Here's two stories about public schools in minority communities, it has NOTHING to do with money.
My buddy had a co-worker at his insurance company, he is a brilliant math genius and left his job to teach high school math at a large high school with a high minority population. This guy lasted a whole two weeks at the job, all he got was insults and ridicule from the black students, nobody was there to learn.
A friend of my family (26 year old woman with 2 graduate degrees) just took a teaching job at a middle school with a high minority population. She has only been on the job for 3 weeks and she's also ready to quit. All she gets is shit from all of the students and the administration because she has standards, they truly resent a white woman trying to get things done the proper way, they don't want any standards.
She was also trying to report abuse that a student said was happening in their home life, the administration told her to mind her own business and her job was to teach.
Unfortunately, this points out big problems. Schools do need to be better in America. I've often thought how kids should get more individual focus. As far as the minority children go, it's a shame when they don't take school seriously, something that happens a lot. This certaintly isn't always the case, as many minority students show to be exceptionally hard working. However, many do not. I don't think it's the kids faults. Part of it lies on the parents to push their kids to work hard for their education, something that can literally take them anywhere in life. School becomes a free meal for many children when they aren't motivated and are influenced by their peers and culture to focus on other things.
-------------------- Alice asked the Cheshire Cat, who was sitting in a tree, “What road do I take?” The cat asked, “Where do you want to go?” “I don’t know,” Alice answered. “Then,” said the cat, “it really doesn’t matter, does it?”
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ballsalsa
Universally Loathed and Reviled



Registered: 03/11/15
Posts: 20,876
Loc: Foreign Lands
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Re: Being a white person [Re: qman] 1
#23676199 - 09/25/16 09:50 AM (7 years, 4 months ago) |
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Quote:
qman said:
Quote:
CookieCrumbs said: And many public schools in poor communities are severely under funded shitholes.
Here's two stories about public schools in minority communities, it has NOTHING to do with money.
My buddy had a co-worker at his insurance company, he is a brilliant math genius and left his job to teach high school math at a large high school with a high minority population. This guy lasted a whole two weeks at the job, all he got was insults and ridicule from the black students, nobody was there to learn.
A friend of my family (26 year old woman with 2 graduate degrees) just took a teaching job at a middle school with a high minority population. She has only been on the job for 3 weeks and she's also ready to quit. All she gets is shit from all of the students and the administration because she has standards, they truly resent a white woman trying to get things done the proper way, they don't want any standards.
She was also trying to report abuse that a student said was happening in their home life, the administration told her to mind her own business and her job was to teach.
Oh, well, i suppose 2 anecdotes about white folks who did not enjoy teaching at schools with high percentage minorities is enough evidence to prove that blacks are mentally and culturally inferior to whites...wait, no it isn't.
--------------------
Like cannabis topics? Read my cannabis blog here
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CookieCrumbs
Fucked off to the pub


Registered: 12/10/11
Posts: 14,146
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Re: Being a white person [Re: qman] 1
#23676381 - 09/25/16 10:57 AM (7 years, 4 months ago) |
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Quote:
qman said:
Quote:
CookieCrumbs said: And many public schools in poor communities are severely under funded shitholes.
Here's two stories about public schools in minority communities, it has NOTHING to do with money.
My buddy had a co-worker at his insurance company, he is a brilliant math genius and left his job to teach high school math at a large high school with a high minority population. This guy lasted a whole two weeks at the job, all he got was insults and ridicule from the black students, nobody was there to learn.
A friend of my family (26 year old woman with 2 graduate degrees) just took a teaching job at a middle school with a high minority population. She has only been on the job for 3 weeks and she's also ready to quit. All she gets is shit from all of the students and the administration because she has standards, they truly resent a white woman trying to get things done the proper way, they don't want any standards.
She was also trying to report abuse that a student said was happening in their home life, the administration told her to mind her own business and her job was to teach.
Actually that does have something to do with money. Smaller classes / higher teacher to student ratio equals more individualized attention. Which provides a higher chance of a sense of care from the teacher to the student and therefore more incentive to learn. It's hard to care about yourself when you feel no one cares about you. And the condition of many of these schools sends a pretty clear message - if merit of a person is based on money then no one who really matters cares about you as a poor person in a poverty stricken community.
Furthermore, what incentive do teachers and administration have to do a better job? I remember reading, last year I think, Detroit teachers went on strike because the city did not have the funds to pay them. We live in a society where every sense of social standing is largely determined by money.
As a teacher who at a school in poor structural condition, severely limited resources, students with no incentive to learn and less to respect their environment, students who often can't provide their own materials and a school system that does not, parents constantly antagonizing them (as is common in most public schools these days), and a public funding system that gives them the scrapings from the bottom of the barrel and are promised only that even after the barrel has been wiped clean.... Do you really think that has absolutely nothing to do with money?
Money goes a long way in improving people's attitudes and willingness to participate and put effort into their work. Because our society is designed around that. Money is incentive. Hire more teachers and pay them more and fix just the infrastructure of these schools and provide pens and paper free of charge and I can almost guarantee you statistics on minority education would drastically improve in less than a decade.
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Free time is the only time
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CookieCrumbs
Fucked off to the pub


Registered: 12/10/11
Posts: 14,146
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But we can't have that. Our society and our economic model requires a lower class with the upper class we have. High school diplomas don't mean what they used to. If the rate of high school drop outs were the same in the lower class as the middle class then inflation would reflect that. Instead of bringing the lower class up to the middle class you'd be bringing the middle class down to the lower class.
Limited number of jobs means that if almost all people have a certain level of education then employers would pay the lowest wages they could at what would be a standard education. In fact, thanks to Obama's no child left behind shit this is already happening. And we are seeing a very similar trend in the bachelor's degree job market. Minimum wage is an arbitrary number that doesn't actually mean all that much. Consumerism has prices that people can afford to pay. If everyone can afford to pay more then everything will cost more. That's exactly why a 15 dollar minimum wage is so rediculous. Even bumping it up to 10 would seriously hurt the middle class.
We honestly need an entire economic overhaul if anything is ever going to really change for the better.
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Free time is the only time
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Revok
I Am OTD

Registered: 08/29/12
Posts: 10,355
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Re: Being a white person [Re: Ifishhigh]
#23676431 - 09/25/16 11:14 AM (7 years, 4 months ago) |
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What's is the devil's price of shit in American dollars honkey racist?
Edited by Revok (09/25/16 11:14 AM)
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tyrannicalrex
Strange R



Registered: 04/24/03
Posts: 38,323
Loc: subtropics
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Quote:
CookieCrumbs said: But we can't have that. Our society and our economic model requires a lower class with the upper class we have. High school diplomas don't mean what they used to. If the rate of high school drop outs were the same in the lower class as the middle class then inflation would reflect that. Instead of bringing the lower class up to the middle class you'd be bringing the middle class down to the lower class.
Limited number of jobs means that if almost all people have a certain level of education then employers would pay the lowest wages they could at what would be a standard education. In fact, thanks to Obama's no child left behind shit this is already happening. And we are seeing a very similar trend in the bachelor's degree job market. Minimum wage is an arbitrary number that doesn't actually mean all that much. Consumerism has prices that people can afford to pay. If everyone can afford to pay more then everything will cost more. That's exactly why a 15 dollar minimum wage is so rediculous. Even bumping it up to 10 would seriously hurt the middle class.
We honestly need an entire economic overhaul if anything is ever going to really change for the better.
I am sure it was Bush's "no child left behind" shit, not Obama's. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/No_Child_Left_Behind_Act
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CookieCrumbs
Fucked off to the pub


Registered: 12/10/11
Posts: 14,146
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Oh yeah my bad. I'm sure Obama would have done it if Bush didn't tho
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Free time is the only time
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TNK
Pleasures of Africa



Registered: 01/30/10 
Posts: 14,237
Loc: I AM THUNDERBOT
Last seen: 1 month, 18 days
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Yeah, that program was around way before Obama.
-------------------- Edited by TNK (02/22/22 22:22 PM)
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Cognitive_Shift
CS actual




Registered: 12/11/07
Posts: 29,591
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Quote:
I_was_the_walrus said: The term "the most qualified person should get the job" was recently added to some bullshit list of "micro aggressions" that should be avoided. Apparently, its an insult to people who arent qualified to get the job, but feel they deserve the job because they arent cis white males and therefore live a life a constant repression.
They should add micro aggressions to the recent list of some bullshit. The concept of a microaggression wasn't invented and taken seriously till like 2013. Before that the concept was so absurd it literally didn't exist. But now you're using "cis" to describe a normal male. We no longer have anything to discuss Sooooo crazy.
-------------------- L'enfer est plein de bonnes volontés et désirs
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qman
Stranger

Registered: 12/06/06
Posts: 34,927
Last seen: 10 hours, 24 minutes
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Quote:
TedTheHighlighter said:
Quote:
qman said:
Quote:
CookieCrumbs said: And many public schools in poor communities are severely under funded shitholes.
Here's two stories about public schools in minority communities, it has NOTHING to do with money.
My buddy had a co-worker at his insurance company, he is a brilliant math genius and left his job to teach high school math at a large high school with a high minority population. This guy lasted a whole two weeks at the job, all he got was insults and ridicule from the black students, nobody was there to learn.
A friend of my family (26 year old woman with 2 graduate degrees) just took a teaching job at a middle school with a high minority population. She has only been on the job for 3 weeks and she's also ready to quit. All she gets is shit from all of the students and the administration because she has standards, they truly resent a white woman trying to get things done the proper way, they don't want any standards.
She was also trying to report abuse that a student said was happening in their home life, the administration told her to mind her own business and her job was to teach.
Unfortunately, this points out big problems. Schools do need to be better in America. I've often thought how kids should get more individual focus. As far as the minority children go, it's a shame when they don't take school seriously, something that happens a lot. This certaintly isn't always the case, as many minority students show to be exceptionally hard working. However, many do not. I don't think it's the kids faults. Part of it lies on the parents to push their kids to work hard for their education, something that can literally take them anywhere in life. School becomes a free meal for many children when they aren't motivated and are influenced by their peers and culture to focus on other things.
"I don't think it's the kids fault"
Their parents really suck and as a result the kids end up sucking. Even at a young age, these kids end up as damaged goods.
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qman
Stranger

Registered: 12/06/06
Posts: 34,927
Last seen: 10 hours, 24 minutes
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Quote:
CookieCrumbs said:
Quote:
qman said:
Quote:
CookieCrumbs said: And many public schools in poor communities are severely under funded shitholes.
Here's two stories about public schools in minority communities, it has NOTHING to do with money.
My buddy had a co-worker at his insurance company, he is a brilliant math genius and left his job to teach high school math at a large high school with a high minority population. This guy lasted a whole two weeks at the job, all he got was insults and ridicule from the black students, nobody was there to learn.
A friend of my family (26 year old woman with 2 graduate degrees) just took a teaching job at a middle school with a high minority population. She has only been on the job for 3 weeks and she's also ready to quit. All she gets is shit from all of the students and the administration because she has standards, they truly resent a white woman trying to get things done the proper way, they don't want any standards.
She was also trying to report abuse that a student said was happening in their home life, the administration told her to mind her own business and her job was to teach.
Actually that does have something to do with money. Smaller classes / higher teacher to student ratio equals more individualized attention. Which provides a higher chance of a sense of care from the teacher to the student and therefore more incentive to learn. It's hard to care about yourself when you feel no one cares about you. And the condition of many of these schools sends a pretty clear message - if merit of a person is based on money then no one who really matters cares about you as a poor person in a poverty stricken community.
Furthermore, what incentive do teachers and administration have to do a better job? I remember reading, last year I think, Detroit teachers went on strike because the city did not have the funds to pay them. We live in a society where every sense of social standing is largely determined by money.
As a teacher who at a school in poor structural condition, severely limited resources, students with no incentive to learn and less to respect their environment, students who often can't provide their own materials and a school system that does not, parents constantly antagonizing them (as is common in most public schools these days), and a public funding system that gives them the scrapings from the bottom of the barrel and are promised only that even after the barrel has been wiped clean.... Do you really think that has absolutely nothing to do with money?
Money goes a long way in improving people's attitudes and willingness to participate and put effort into their work. Because our society is designed around that. Money is incentive. Hire more teachers and pay them more and fix just the infrastructure of these schools and provide pens and paper free of charge and I can almost guarantee you statistics on minority education would drastically improve in less than a decade.
There's a charter school in a city not far from where I live, it has the best school with the best teachers, computers, school uniforms, ect.
The school is also full of Hispanic and black children, they might have to close the school because the children can NOT pass the basic state tests. The money did NOT make any difference, this situation is a perfect example.
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MrBlueYoMind
Don't do drugs (Without me)


Registered: 04/27/11
Posts: 3,753
Last seen: 1 month, 26 days
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Re: Being a white person [Re: qman]
#23677697 - 09/25/16 07:16 PM (7 years, 4 months ago) |
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Quote:
qman said:
Quote:
CookieCrumbs said: And many public schools in poor communities are severely under funded shitholes.
Here's two stories about public schools in minority communities, it has NOTHING to do with money.
My buddy had a co-worker at his insurance company, he is a brilliant math genius and left his job to teach high school math at a large high school with a high minority population. This guy lasted a whole two weeks at the job, all he got was insults and ridicule from the black students, nobody was there to learn.
A friend of my family (26 year old woman with 2 graduate degrees) just took a teaching job at a middle school with a high minority population. She has only been on the job for 3 weeks and she's also ready to quit. All she gets is shit from all of the students and the administration because she has standards, they truly resent a white woman trying to get things done the proper way, they don't want any standards.
She was also trying to report abuse that a student said was happening in their home life, the administration told her to mind her own business and her job was to teach.
When people claim that students that live in poverty have "no incentive to learn" they sound like a fool. Living in poverty is the highest incentive to learn- in order to bring oneself out of poverty. Stop making excuses for shitty cultural values. It isn't necessarily about race, but culture certainly plays a role. If the parents aren't teaching the children anything while playing music that glorifies violence and drug use then what the fuck do you think is going to happen? You learn your ABC's through song, what do you think the 4 year old who memorizes the lyrics to Jeezy songs is learning?
-------------------- Confucius say: He who sticks drugs in butthole has head up ass. EVOLUTION REQUIRES REPRODUCTION
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xbloodwhipx

Registered: 02/24/12
Posts: 12,791
Last seen: 4 years, 5 months
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Quote:
RobZombie68 said: Where I live there is a mexican guy, we both have lived here 10+ years. We always use to say hi and smile, you know, normal neighbor stuff, past few times I have seen him I smile and say hello, he just looks straight ahead and keeps walking. 
Next time say "Hey motherfucker im talking to you". You're sure to get some kind of reaction from him.
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pirate-blues


Registered: 10/15/12
Posts: 13,656
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Quote:
RJ Tubs 202 said:
Quote:
luvdemboomers said:
Being anybody is hard.

yup. That being said, I have never not been white(obviously)...so I have like..no frame of reference, and I can't pretend I do. As South Park so eloquently stated on racism "I don't get it". I don't understand what it feels like to navigate the world as a black person, and I understand that they are coming out of decades, no, centuries of disdvantage and it's not a binary thing(white=oppressor black= victim/good) either, it's a very complex and complicated history - I abhor the recent wave of social justice and political correctness because I feel like it infantilizes minorities, women, discourages real discussion, and is overall more racist and sexist than not and I think people as a whole deserve better than what it brings to the table, but I'm not gonna immediately swing to the other side of the fence and deny that black people don't face obstacles and racism that white people don't.
On another note, I don't think my life is hard at all though, not compared to other folks out there in the world. I think we are at a unique time in our history where for us particularly(first world nations) life is, as a whole, quite easy - there is nothing but abundance, and while some people here that I run into are going through what to me are unimaginable hardships....we are at a time in human history where we have so many resources at our fingertips, and we shouldn't take it forgranted because personally, I think our children and grandchildren will struggle immensely on this earth when the implications of climate change and the resulting global unrest begin to become more apparent to the average consumer in industrialized nations.
I cannot discount a person's struggle with societal prejudice due to skin color either, because I know it is there but I don't know nor can I pretend to know what it's like to live in anyone's skin but my own.
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zZZz
jesus


Registered: 12/28/07
Posts: 33,478
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U don't smile and say hello, u just nod ur head like
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tyrannicalrex
Strange R



Registered: 04/24/03
Posts: 38,323
Loc: subtropics
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Quote:
MrBlueYoMind said:
Quote:
qman said:
Quote:
CookieCrumbs said:
When people claim that students that live in poverty have "no incentive to learn" they sound like a fool. Living in poverty is the highest incentive to learn- in order to bring oneself out of poverty. Stop making excuses for shitty cultural values. It isn't necessarily about race, but culture certainly plays a role. If the parents aren't teaching the children anything while playing music that glorifies violence and drug use then what the fuck do you think is going to happen? You learn your ABC's through song, what do you think the 4 year old who memorizes the lyrics to Jeezy songs is learning?
This is a disturbing reality. I experienced this in MS, 3 y.o.'s and up listening to "my neck, my back, lick my pussy and my crack" while grandma (who looked in her 50's) was doing to hump/fuck dance.
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CookieCrumbs
Fucked off to the pub


Registered: 12/10/11
Posts: 14,146
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So it's probably not the right way to phrase it. But rather they don't understand why they should learn. If you believe you have no hope to go anywhere in life, that all your hope is going to be in looking cool and acting hard, then they often have incentive to do the opposite. It's hard to be self motivated, especially when most of the people you grow up with are dejected, and insincere motivation tends to only build up resentment for authorities and educators.
I do agree that "thug life" has a glorification problem in poor communities. But that's extended beyond the poor. Even growing up in the lower middle class I saw alot of that mentality. I'd always enjoyed learning and challenging myself, my biggest problem in school was that it had eventually lost all it's challenge because they school insisted on holding my hand and walking me through with all the other kids that didn't want to learn. Even for people who are motivated and do want to learn it's very hard not to get sucked up into that lifestyle when you're around it all day every day. Which is where individualized learning would go a long way. It's about more than just throwing nice things at them, its about being sincere about helping them and challenging and engaging them. American education as a whole has a problem with this. The way things are taught and learned, it feels like generic regurgitating garbage. So these kids feel they have a choice between developing street smarts, which will definitely serve them, or meaningless fact memorization, which they definitely don't feel will ever serve them (and lets be honest most higher level math, a majority of history, and complex literature/composition skills are something most of us very rarely use.)
They already resent authority. All they often see school as is working hard and sucking up to authority so that they can grow up and suck up to authority. Tbh that doesn't give me alot of incentive to work hard either. And the way American education functions now, that's basically all it really is.
There's another thread where I addressed some of this. Something about how can so educated people be so stupid. That's why. Education is meant to be a ladder you climb to kiss up to people above you so you can kiss up more and slowly climb your way up to them, but most likely will never reach them anyway.
At the very bottom you see alot of the contradictions in the ideals other people live by. Pretty much nothing in our system works the way we like to think it works. Degradation of society as a whole is happening.
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Free time is the only time
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tyrannicalrex
Strange R



Registered: 04/24/03
Posts: 38,323
Loc: subtropics
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I would also add that the "bucket of crabs" theory is prevalent within some or most of the communities that are "poor".
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Niffla



Registered: 06/09/08
Posts: 46,494
Loc: Texas
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Re: Being a white person [Re: Asante]
#23678751 - 09/26/16 04:48 AM (7 years, 4 months ago) |
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Quote:
Asante said:
Quote:
Ifishhigh said: Being white is hard these days.
These days huh? So you measure how easy it is to be a race not by other racial groups difficulties but by the past of how easy white people used to have it.
So what were the good ole days?
The years where blacks were supposed to STFU and not complain? War on drugs era? Pre civil rights era? Lynching era? Jim Crow era? Back in the days of slavery?
What were the golden days for being white and why was it so?
Why was it so?
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HAIL OUR NEW OTD KING
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Asante
Mage


Registered: 02/06/02
Posts: 86,797
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Quote:
tyrannicalrex said: I would also add that the "bucket of crabs" theory is prevalent within some or most of the communities that are "poor".
Thats very true. The poor are holding themselves down or the elite would be done for.
Its one of the mechanisms that made slavery work. Very apparent in much of hiphop today.
-------------------- Omnicyclion.org higher knowledge starts here
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