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Invisiblemoonrockmushy
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Registered: 07/01/05
Posts: 19,067
Re: Please Take Action to Stop the DEA from Scheduling Kratom [Re: Kenetic]
    #23704262 - 10/03/16 04:40 PM (7 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

kenetic said:
I know the dea (doesn't deserve capital letters) is a pita when it comes to a lot of things, but they definitely do some good.  If it wasn't for them the fucking cartels would run this country.




I really hope we're joking here.


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InvisibleNumeroEno
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Re: Please Take Action to Stop the DEA from Scheduling Kratom [Re: moonrockmushy]
    #23704291 - 10/03/16 04:48 PM (7 years, 3 months ago)

Oh and here's Chuck Rosenberg's employment timeline if anyone doubts his time as a lobbyist.

https://www.opensecrets.org/revolving/rev_summary.php?id=70942


--------------------

:gd_icon:  Let it grow! Let it grow! Greatly yield!  :gd_icon:
What shall we say, shall we call it by a name
As well to count the angels dancing on a pin
Water bright as the sky from which it came
And the name is on the earth that takes it in

DOG FOOD AGAR

MY ELECTRIC INOCULATION LOOP


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OfflineKenetic
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Re: Please Take Action to Stop the DEA from Scheduling Kratom [Re: NumeroEno]
    #23704331 - 10/03/16 04:58 PM (7 years, 3 months ago)

I can understand your logic everyone but you can't expect me to believe that 100% of the dea is a conspiracy.  The world can't be that fucking bad.  Every single government agency has a conspiracy theory behind it.  People always see the worst in everything

Maybe you're right though, who knows.


--------------------
Todo Cambia
   

               
                                                :cookiemonster::elmo:



DMT said: Everyone know's me, they just don't know it yet


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Offlinemusiclover420
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Re: Please Take Action to Stop the DEA from Scheduling Kratom [Re: Kenetic] * 2
    #23704353 - 10/03/16 05:05 PM (7 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

kenetic said:
I can understand your logic everyone but you can't expect me to believe that 100% of the dea is a conspiracy.  The world can't be that fucking bad.  Every single government agency has a conspiracy theory behind it.  People always see the worst in everything

Maybe you're right though, who knows.




Its not even a conspiracy man. Think about it, why would cartels bother pushing drugs that are legal in the USA? Alcohol is legal where are the alcohol cartels?

Oh that's right they ended with alcohol prohibition decades ago :lol: people still home brew but even that has come a long ways and is all around considerably safer now.

If we legalized heroin why would the cartels bother smuggling it in? Why would people by shitty street heroin when they could get pharma stuff prescribed?

Price is one reason but even that is hugely inflated becouse of prohibition sadly.


--------------------
Don't worry about me, I've got all that I need. And I'm singing my song to the sky

You know how it feels, With the breeze of the sun in your eyes. Not minding that time's passing by

I've got all and more, My smile, just as before. Is all that I carry with me

I talk to myself, I need nobody else. I'm lost and I'm mine, yes I'm free



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Offlinemusiclover420
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Re: Please Take Action to Stop the DEA from Scheduling Kratom [Re: NumeroEno]
    #23704502 - 10/03/16 05:56 PM (7 years, 3 months ago)

Ok here are some notes:

1:
Quote:

Kratom was first outlawed in Thailand in 1943. The reason for its ban was because it was cutting into the profits of the government controlled opium trade. Yes, people were using kratom instead of opium, and that made the Thai government unhappy. Now, there’s an old adage – history repeats.




That should be its own section where you should elaborate further IMO. Talk about the safety and effectiveness of kratom and maybe even touch of how the Thai government was essentially a dictatorship similiar to Hitler and Mussolini's reigns... Here is a great article about the history of the kratom ban in thailand I saw earlier:

Why Kratom Was Banned In Thailand

Everything else looks great I would say.

Maybe add a section about the demographic of kratom users, how its not just junkies but veterans, cripples, single mothers, and hard workers.


--------------------
Don't worry about me, I've got all that I need. And I'm singing my song to the sky

You know how it feels, With the breeze of the sun in your eyes. Not minding that time's passing by

I've got all and more, My smile, just as before. Is all that I carry with me

I talk to myself, I need nobody else. I'm lost and I'm mine, yes I'm free



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OfflineNDStepp84
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Re: Please Take Action to Stop the DEA from Scheduling Kratom [Re: musiclover420]
    #23704675 - 10/03/16 06:53 PM (7 years, 3 months ago)

Good stuff Eno:thumbup: Here's a good podcast with Dr. Hart if anyone is interested in watching it's really interesting and touches on these points well
Joe rogan experience dr. Carl hart

Edit: The second video is great as well, maybe better


--------------------

"I am free, no matter what rules surround me. If I find them tolerable, I tolerate them; if I find them too obnoxious, I break them. I am free because I know that I alone am morally responsible for everything I do.
-Robert A. Heinlein 

:takingnotes: Links and teks:takingnotes:
ND's grow log and discussion
Plant thread


Edited by NDStepp84 (10/03/16 07:14 PM)


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InvisibleNumeroEno
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Re: Please Take Action to Stop the DEA from Scheduling Kratom [Re: NDStepp84]
    #23704733 - 10/03/16 07:11 PM (7 years, 3 months ago)

Sweet. Thanks for the input. I'll work on the letter a little more before I submit it to the paper.


--------------------

:gd_icon:  Let it grow! Let it grow! Greatly yield!  :gd_icon:
What shall we say, shall we call it by a name
As well to count the angels dancing on a pin
Water bright as the sky from which it came
And the name is on the earth that takes it in

DOG FOOD AGAR

MY ELECTRIC INOCULATION LOOP


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Invisiblebirdeatingspider
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Re: Please Take Action to Stop the DEA from Scheduling Kratom [Re: NumeroEno]
    #23704872 - 10/03/16 07:58 PM (7 years, 3 months ago)

Great piece, reading that was quite inspiring!

Aside from polishing some of the wording I'd offer more evidence for claims.

Perhaps elaborate more on Kratom's medicinal value.  Specifically pain patients and those enduring opiate cessation.  The DEA fuels the heroin epidemic, the public needs to know Kratom's potential for easing withdrawal and allowing a safe and effective means to get clean.


--------------------

From all I may be, or have been before,
To mingle with the Universe, and feel
What I can ne’er express, yet cannot all conceal.


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InvisibleNumeroEno
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Re: Please Take Action to Stop the DEA from Scheduling Kratom [Re: birdeatingspider]
    #23704875 - 10/03/16 08:00 PM (7 years, 3 months ago)

Thanks. Yeah all really good input guys. Much appreciated :cool:


--------------------

:gd_icon:  Let it grow! Let it grow! Greatly yield!  :gd_icon:
What shall we say, shall we call it by a name
As well to count the angels dancing on a pin
Water bright as the sky from which it came
And the name is on the earth that takes it in

DOG FOOD AGAR

MY ELECTRIC INOCULATION LOOP


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OfflineNDStepp84
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Re: Please Take Action to Stop the DEA from Scheduling Kratom [Re: birdeatingspider]
    #23704915 - 10/03/16 08:15 PM (7 years, 3 months ago)

Yeah here we are doing the same thing as Thailand, except our government's opium is pharms. I'm sure if Kratom isn't available many will go back to opiates and many OD's will result, but they are looking out for our safety:stonedjerk:


--------------------

"I am free, no matter what rules surround me. If I find them tolerable, I tolerate them; if I find them too obnoxious, I break them. I am free because I know that I alone am morally responsible for everything I do.
-Robert A. Heinlein 

:takingnotes: Links and teks:takingnotes:
ND's grow log and discussion
Plant thread


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Offlinemusiclover420
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Re: Please Take Action to Stop the DEA from Scheduling Kratom [Re: NDStepp84] * 1
    #23704946 - 10/03/16 08:30 PM (7 years, 3 months ago)

"serious public health crisis"

:pleasetellmemore:


--------------------
Don't worry about me, I've got all that I need. And I'm singing my song to the sky

You know how it feels, With the breeze of the sun in your eyes. Not minding that time's passing by

I've got all and more, My smile, just as before. Is all that I carry with me

I talk to myself, I need nobody else. I'm lost and I'm mine, yes I'm free



Edited by musiclover420 (10/03/16 08:31 PM)


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InvisibleMoonshoe
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Re: Please Take Action to Stop the DEA from Scheduling Kratom [Re: Kenetic] * 1
    #23705992 - 10/04/16 08:28 AM (7 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

kenetic said:
I can understand your logic everyone but you can't expect me to believe that 100% of the dea is a conspiracy.  The world can't be that fucking bad.  Every single government agency has a conspiracy theory behind it.  People always see the worst in everything

Maybe you're right though, who knows.




Ouch.

This post truly hurt me.

As an introduction, I recommend you start by watching the entertaining documentary "how to make money selling drugs".

Make sure you watch it to the end.


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InvisibleCosmicJokeM
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Re: Please Take Action to Stop the DEA from Scheduling Kratom [Re: Moonshoe] * 1
    #23706024 - 10/04/16 08:49 AM (7 years, 3 months ago)

Shit like the DEA seems totally unconstitutional, imho.  You'd think the 10th amendment would put a stop to drug czars and let states individually decide what drugs are legal or illegal....  " The powers not delegated to the United States by the Constitution, nor prohibited by it to the States, are reserved to the States respectively, or to the people."  :shrug:


--------------------
Everything is better than it was the last time.  I'm good.

If we could look into each others hearts, and understand the unique challenges each of us faces, I think we would treat each other much more gently, with more love, patience, tolerance, and care.

It takes a lot of courage to go out there and radiate your essence.

I know you scared, you should ask us if we scared too.  If you was there, and we just knew you cared too.


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InvisibleCookieCrumbsM
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Re: Please Take Action to Stop the DEA from Scheduling Kratom [Re: musiclover420]
    #23706051 - 10/04/16 08:58 AM (7 years, 3 months ago)

Also legalizing, or medical marijuana has made huge cuts into cartel and street gangs profits. I think some drugs should be regulated but banning them doesn't stop all that many people from doing drugs. Instead they buy street drugs with who knows what in it which often comes as a primary business for real criminals, the real bad guys. With the way things are the DEA may as well be paying them.

What would gangs and cartels do for money if drugs were legal?

They're in business because they fill a niche. If that niche is replaced by authorized and regulated shops and medical offices... Think about it.


--------------------
          :dancingbear: Free time is the only time :dancingbear:                    :thatsinteresting:


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InvisibleCookieCrumbsM
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Re: Please Take Action to Stop the DEA from Scheduling Kratom [Re: CosmicJoke]
    #23706054 - 10/04/16 08:59 AM (7 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

CosmicJoke said:
Shit like the DEA seems totally unconstitutional, imho.  You'd think the 10th amendment would put a stop to drug czars and let states individually decide what drugs are legal or illegal....  " The powers not delegated to the United States by the Constitution, nor prohibited by it to the States, are reserved to the States respectively, or to the people."  :shrug:




That would theoretically make large portions of the government unconstitutional.


--------------------
          :dancingbear: Free time is the only time :dancingbear:                    :thatsinteresting:


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InvisibleMoonshoe
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Re: Please Take Action to Stop the DEA from Scheduling Kratom [Re: CookieCrumbs] * 1
    #23706069 - 10/04/16 09:06 AM (7 years, 3 months ago)

The partial legalization of Marijuana in the states was such a massive blow to cartel profits they had to resort to hijacking avocado farms in Mexico.

No dea = no prohibition
No prohibition  = no black market profits
No black market profits = no cartel

And that's without even getting into the extensive history of proven CIA/DEA cartel collusion and CIA drug and arms dealing


--------------------


Everything I post is fiction.


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InvisibleMoonshoe
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Re: Please Take Action to Stop the DEA from Scheduling Kratom [Re: CookieCrumbs]
    #23706071 - 10/04/16 09:07 AM (7 years, 3 months ago)

"Theoretically"


--------------------


Everything I post is fiction.


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OfflineKenetic
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Re: Please Take Action to Stop the DEA from Scheduling Kratom [Re: Moonshoe]
    #23706202 - 10/04/16 09:45 AM (7 years, 3 months ago)

Very good points


--------------------
Todo Cambia
   

               
                                                :cookiemonster::elmo:



DMT said: Everyone know's me, they just don't know it yet


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InvisibleNumeroEno
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Re: Please Take Action to Stop the DEA from Scheduling Kratom [Re: Kenetic]
    #23706270 - 10/04/16 10:08 AM (7 years, 3 months ago)

Yeah. That's what I've been saying for years. The only way to put the cartels out of business is by legalizing and taxing drugs. That's never gonna happen with cocaine, meth, and heroin, so it's all just wishful thinking, but as long as those things are illegal and there's a demand for them the cartels will keep running rampant.


--------------------

:gd_icon:  Let it grow! Let it grow! Greatly yield!  :gd_icon:
What shall we say, shall we call it by a name
As well to count the angels dancing on a pin
Water bright as the sky from which it came
And the name is on the earth that takes it in

DOG FOOD AGAR

MY ELECTRIC INOCULATION LOOP


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Offlinecoffeenap
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Re: Please Take Action to Stop the DEA from Scheduling Kratom [Re: NumeroEno] * 1
    #23706918 - 10/04/16 01:47 PM (7 years, 3 months ago)

Sounds like the reaching out did help slow them down at least:

The decision was delayed after 51 Republican and Democratic members of the House of Representatives sent a letter urging the DEA to delay the ban and give the public a chance to comment.

"Everything is to be determined right now," and there is no timetable, a DEA spokesman said Oct. 4.


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