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Space Coast Slayer
Total Fucking Noob

Registered: 09/19/16
Posts: 158
Loc: I come from the water.
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First time grower facing a decision
#23667646 - 09/22/16 10:42 AM (7 years, 4 months ago) |
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Here is my friend's situation..
7 days ago he inoculated 4 quart jars of rye berries with 2.5 cc each spore solution via syringe.. The spores in the syringe were somewhat clumpy but he agitated the water in the syringe plenty beforehand.. After inoculation he pulled the plunger from the syringe and observed a few remaining drops of water that were deep purple/black in color..
7 days after inoculation he has observed no mycelial development thus far in the jars which are kept in a house that stays around 75-77 degrees.. He is worried those few black drops left behind in the syringe were the spores, perhaps the needle got blocked during inoculation. Common sense tells him that the spores are microscopic and odds are a few HAD to make it in the jars..
The decision he is faced with is whether or not to re-inoculate the jars as he has one more syringe of spore solution.. His concerns with this option is that the substrate was prepared 10 days ago and he is not sure if it has lost too much moisture to be effectively colonized.. Is my friend perhaps being too impatient and should keep waiting for signs of mycelium or should he make an executive decision and re-inoculate? He is not concerned about crossing strains as any spore prints he may create would be for his own personal studying..
My friend is a first time grower but studied the process and techniques for months before his first attempt.. He would just like some input on this situation from some seasoned cultivators.. Thank you for any help you can send his way!!
-------------------- Everything I post is pure fiction and all images were stolen from google.
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Tira



Registered: 11/20/10
Posts: 1,202
Loc: Turkey
Last seen: 6 years, 3 months
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spores are microscopic and odds are a few hundreds of thousands of them HAD to make it in the jars..
Yes you should keep waiting sometimes it takes longer than that and sometimes shorter.
Did you inoculate near the glass, or near the center of the jars?
If you have more syringes why not also get them going? I would. But I wouldn't use substrate that has been sitting around for 10 days since it surely has lost both moisture and nutrients.
-------------------- Useful Links for Beginners The Basics AMU Teks Frank''s Teks Agar Noob Forum Reccomended Teks Agar for guaranteed spawn, Proper pasteurization for guaranteed substrate.
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NumeroEno
I come from the land of lizards



Registered: 07/24/14
Posts: 9,652
Loc: Gamehendge
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It takes more than a week for spores to germinate a lot of times, so I wouldn't worry yet. It's okay to say it's your grow too. Law enforcement isn't going to come after a first time grower with a couple MS grain jars, and we don't have any rules about "self incrimination" here. If you're really worried about that just post from behind a VPN or something.
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Let it grow! Let it grow! Greatly yield! What shall we say, shall we call it by a name As well to count the angels dancing on a pin Water bright as the sky from which it came And the name is on the earth that takes it in DOG FOOD AGAR MY ELECTRIC INOCULATION LOOP
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Greg
always learning




Registered: 10/28/15
Posts: 1,536
Loc: an autoclave
Last seen: 3 months, 3 days
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Re: First time grower facing a decision [Re: NumeroEno]
#23667677 - 09/22/16 11:00 AM (7 years, 4 months ago) |
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Click the link titled "an abundance of spores" in my signature.
Spores definitely ended up in those jars. Now you just wait.
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Space Coast Slayer
Total Fucking Noob

Registered: 09/19/16
Posts: 158
Loc: I come from the water.
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Re: First time grower facing a decision [Re: Greg]
#23668113 - 09/22/16 01:29 PM (7 years, 4 months ago) |
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Quote:
Tira said: spores are microscopic and odds are a few hundreds of thousands of them HAD to make it in the jars..
Yes you should keep waiting sometimes it takes longer than that and sometimes shorter.
Did you inoculate near the glass, or near the center of the jars?
If you have more syringes why not also get them going? I would. But I wouldn't use substrate that has been sitting around for 10 days since it surely has lost both moisture and nutrients.
I inoculated through a self healing injection port about an inch off center of the lid and then shook the jars per the teks
-------------------- Everything I post is pure fiction and all images were stolen from google.
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NumeroEno
I come from the land of lizards



Registered: 07/24/14
Posts: 9,652
Loc: Gamehendge
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You should wait another week. Some syringes have bacteria and that will make shooting them straight into grain jars problematic but it can be done. Spores can take up to 3 weeks to germinate.
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Let it grow! Let it grow! Greatly yield! What shall we say, shall we call it by a name As well to count the angels dancing on a pin Water bright as the sky from which it came And the name is on the earth that takes it in DOG FOOD AGAR MY ELECTRIC INOCULATION LOOP
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Rhiozan
Stranger



Registered: 01/23/15
Posts: 35
Last seen: 5 years, 10 months
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Re: First time grower facing a decision [Re: NumeroEno]
#23668304 - 09/22/16 02:33 PM (7 years, 4 months ago) |
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Tira has the point, your jars are FULL of spores. During my first grow I had similar issue. Its worth saying that i used wheat as a substrate. Anyway, I could see the first signs of mycelium around the end of the 2nd week or even later, its hard to recall. Make sure your jars are in complete darkness, do not look at them more often than once in 2-3 days, although you will be dying to know how the process is going. Ensure that the temperature is right, 75-77F is on the lower side and this might delay the propagation and development of mycelium by a factor of many times!
I noticed that the cubes incubate the quickest at around 85F (29-30C). Well thermally insulated incubation box with terrarium heating pad ($7) and programmable thermostat ($20) are hardly a luxury . Just take a cardboard or a plastic box (or several of them, placed one into another), put inside the box(es) the pad and attach thermostat sensor to the pad with a duct tape, wrap your jars in old t-shirts and cover everything with more shirts and a lid. That never failed me.
-------------------- Ignorance is strength
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Tira



Registered: 11/20/10
Posts: 1,202
Loc: Turkey
Last seen: 6 years, 3 months
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Re: First time grower facing a decision [Re: Rhiozan]
#23668467 - 09/22/16 03:22 PM (7 years, 4 months ago) |
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Quote:
Space Coast Slayer said: I inoculated through a self healing injection port about an inch off center of the lid and then shook the jars per the teks
You shouldn't shake grains after multispore inoculation. Spores need to pair to germinate, so what you did just threw them around and seperated them. You want all your spores in one place so they can germinate easily, then you shake at around 30% colonization.
Quote:
Rhiozan said: Make sure your jars are in complete darkness, do not look at them more often than once in 2-3 days, although you will be dying to know how the process is going.
That darkness through colonization idea is outdated, you don't need total darkness during colonization.
And you don't need an incubator or a cardboard box, they'll colonize fine at room temp.
-------------------- Useful Links for Beginners The Basics AMU Teks Frank''s Teks Agar Noob Forum Reccomended Teks Agar for guaranteed spawn, Proper pasteurization for guaranteed substrate.
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Space Coast Slayer
Total Fucking Noob

Registered: 09/19/16
Posts: 158
Loc: I come from the water.
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Re: First time grower facing a decision [Re: Tira]
#23668581 - 09/22/16 03:59 PM (7 years, 4 months ago) |
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I just did some research and it seems there is some discrepancies as to whether you should shake, or inoculate it like a brf jar, hitting 4 sides and the middle with no shake, at the most a roll of the jar.. The many teks I read and the videos I watched did advise to shake though..
But even with shaking, you would figure that the chances are in your favor that spores would still find a pair..
-------------------- Everything I post is pure fiction and all images were stolen from google.
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Tira



Registered: 11/20/10
Posts: 1,202
Loc: Turkey
Last seen: 6 years, 3 months
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You don't need to hit 4 sides as you will shake at 30% colonization, breaking and distributing the mycelium.
But putting all your spores in one place will increase the chances of them easily germinating. Why shake and decrease your chances? There is no benefit in doing that.
Shaking is beneficial after you inoculate with live culture (LC, agar, g2g), but not after multispore.
-------------------- Useful Links for Beginners The Basics AMU Teks Frank''s Teks Agar Noob Forum Reccomended Teks Agar for guaranteed spawn, Proper pasteurization for guaranteed substrate.
Edited by Tira (09/22/16 04:06 PM)
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Space Coast Slayer
Total Fucking Noob

Registered: 09/19/16
Posts: 158
Loc: I come from the water.
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Re: First time grower facing a decision [Re: Tira]
#23668663 - 09/22/16 04:29 PM (7 years, 4 months ago) |
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Thanks for the insight everyone.. Just gonna wait it out and see how it shakes out, no pun intended..
-------------------- Everything I post is pure fiction and all images were stolen from google.
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Tira



Registered: 11/20/10
Posts: 1,202
Loc: Turkey
Last seen: 6 years, 3 months
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Quote:
Space Coast Slayer said: Just gonna wait it out and see how it shakes out, no pun intended..
.)
btw I just remembered that same thing happened to me when I first tried grains. I did oats and shook right after inoculation just like you. Didn't see any growth for about a month and was about to toss them when I decided to shake them and wait for another week or so. It actually worked, the mycelium started to grow but oats were too dry by then, so myc just dried after a few days.
So you could try shaking them again if you still see no growth a few days later.
-------------------- Useful Links for Beginners The Basics AMU Teks Frank''s Teks Agar Noob Forum Reccomended Teks Agar for guaranteed spawn, Proper pasteurization for guaranteed substrate.
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Space Coast Slayer
Total Fucking Noob

Registered: 09/19/16
Posts: 158
Loc: I come from the water.
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Re: First time grower facing a decision [Re: Tira]
#23672570 - 09/23/16 10:57 PM (7 years, 4 months ago) |
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Small update- Yesterday about the time I posted this, my a/c went out.. I'm from Florida and even though it's officially fall, it's still peak of summer hot here.. The house quickly got up to 85 degrees and stayed there more or less until today at about 7pm.. Checked the jars a few minutes ago and have a lot of growth popping up.. Looks like myc to me but very early to tell..
Noticed some condensation on the inside of the jar in the top above the rye where there wasn't any before, so hopefully the spike in heat kicked off the spores and not some form of contamination.. Only time will tell..
-------------------- Everything I post is pure fiction and all images were stolen from google.
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Tira



Registered: 11/20/10
Posts: 1,202
Loc: Turkey
Last seen: 6 years, 3 months
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Good to hear. Hope it's myc. Take pictures and upload as it grows.
-------------------- Useful Links for Beginners The Basics AMU Teks Frank''s Teks Agar Noob Forum Reccomended Teks Agar for guaranteed spawn, Proper pasteurization for guaranteed substrate.
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NDStepp84
Stellar nuclear waste


Registered: 04/23/15
Posts: 4,956
Last seen: 1 month, 4 days
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Re: First time grower facing a decision [Re: Tira]
#23673318 - 09/24/16 08:59 AM (7 years, 4 months ago) |
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Quote:
Tira said:
Quote:
Space Coast Slayer said: I inoculated through a self healing injection port about an inch off center of the lid and then shook the jars per the teks
You shouldn't shake grains after multispore inoculation. Spores need to pair to germinate, so what you did just threw them around and seperated them. You want all your spores in one place so they can germinate easily, then you shake at around 30% colonization.
Quote:
Rhiozan said: Make sure your jars are in complete darkness, do not look at them more often than once in 2-3 days, although you will be dying to know how the process is going.
That darkness through colonization idea is outdated, you don't need total darkness during colonization.
And you don't need an incubator or a cardboard box, they'll colonize fine at room temp.
^ This, also good link Greg Here's another link to put spores into perspective https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/21365919/fpart/1/vc/1 2.5 CC's is way overkill and with syringes less is more, syringes aren't clean the more you use the bigger the chance of introducing contams into each jar. Honestly you should get into agar, ensures you have a clean culture and you can do countless grows from one drop of a syringe.
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"I am free, no matter what rules surround me. If I find them tolerable, I tolerate them; if I find them too obnoxious, I break them. I am free because I know that I alone am morally responsible for everything I do. -Robert A. Heinlein
Links and teks ND's grow log and discussion Plant thread
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Inocuole
Scalpel of Evil's Bane



Registered: 11/21/11
Posts: 24,863
Loc: ★
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Quote:
Space Coast Slayer said: Thanks for the insight everyone.. Just gonna wait it out and see how it shakes out, no pun intended..
You can't go out of your way to make a pun and then say no pun intended... bad form..
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NumeroEno
I come from the land of lizards



Registered: 07/24/14
Posts: 9,652
Loc: Gamehendge
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Re: First time grower facing a decision [Re: Inocuole]
#23673750 - 09/24/16 11:52 AM (7 years, 4 months ago) |
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Technically that's a double entendre and not a pun 
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Let it grow! Let it grow! Greatly yield! What shall we say, shall we call it by a name As well to count the angels dancing on a pin Water bright as the sky from which it came And the name is on the earth that takes it in DOG FOOD AGAR MY ELECTRIC INOCULATION LOOP
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omgwtfstfu
Stranger

Registered: 10/27/15
Posts: 172
Last seen: 5 years, 10 months
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Re: First time grower facing a decision [Re: NumeroEno]
#23674251 - 09/24/16 03:02 PM (7 years, 4 months ago) |
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1 cc or less per quart (2.5 cc per quart is overkill). Never shake spores to grain, shake at ~30% colonization. Consider agar in the future, 1 drop is all you need to create lots of healthy myc to inoculate with. Plenty of spores made it into the jars, no doubt about it. It can take 2 weeks for spores to show, but I see you have some growth so congrats! Post some pics and we can tell you if things are progressing in the right direction or not. Best of luck!
Edited by omgwtfstfu (09/24/16 03:03 PM)
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Space Coast Slayer
Total Fucking Noob

Registered: 09/19/16
Posts: 158
Loc: I come from the water.
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Re: First time grower facing a decision [Re: omgwtfstfu]
#23676526 - 09/25/16 11:48 AM (7 years, 4 months ago) |
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Not sure how to upload more than one pic at a time
-------------------- Everything I post is pure fiction and all images were stolen from google.
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Space Coast Slayer
Total Fucking Noob

Registered: 09/19/16
Posts: 158
Loc: I come from the water.
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^ this one here has a spot in the bottom of the jar that looks a little strange.. Can't tell if its a contamination or a busted grain.. Seems like shaking these jars in the beginning really beats the grains up.. Won't make that mistake again.. Thanks yall..
-------------------- Everything I post is pure fiction and all images were stolen from google.
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