|
viktor
psychotechnician



Registered: 11/03/10
Posts: 4,293
Loc: New Zealand
Last seen: 1 year, 9 months
|
American vs. Empire attitudes to free speech
#23660918 - 09/20/16 07:54 AM (7 years, 4 months ago) |
|
|
Here's something I noticed that you guys might find interesting.
In my travels I have noticed a big difference between the American attitude to free speech and the attitude in the rest of the English-speaking world. The American attitude seems to be much more egalitarian.
On the Shroomery I noticed this: American posters rarely put anyone on ignore, unlike other posters. Duncan Rowhl and zzripz both have a tremendous number of people on ignore, whereas American posters seldom do this.
Is this a fluke, or does it represent a distinction between a colonial American attitude that every man can have his say and a class-system based British system where one's inferiors are dismissed as worthless?
-------------------- "They consider me insane but I know that I am a hero living under the eyes of the gods."
|
DividedQuantum
Outer Head


Registered: 12/06/13
Posts: 9,819
|
Re: American vs. Empire attitudes to free speech [Re: viktor]
#23661112 - 09/20/16 09:38 AM (7 years, 4 months ago) |
|
|
That's very interesting. Yeah, we in the U.S. don't promulgate concepts of class as much as many other countries. We have rich, poor and middle class, but the belief is that anyone can become rich at any time (which is obviously false). But this tends to create some sort of brotherhood of capitalism that no one is more worthy than anyone else of making money and striking it rich. Instead of class concepts we have the "American Dream," which, as George Carlin pointed out, you'd have to be asleep to believe in, but everyone is considered to have equal access to the means of success, which does generate a form of egalitarian thinking.
I think that you could very well be right that that psychology lends itself to less ignoring of others by Americans, where more class-conscious citizens of other countries might want to dismiss the "rabble." Interesting, in any case.
-------------------- Vi Veri Universum Vivus Vici
|
zzripz
Stranger


Registered: 12/23/08
Posts: 8,292
Loc: Manchester, UK
Last seen: 4 years, 7 months
|
Re: American vs. Empire attitudes to free speech [Re: viktor]
#23661204 - 09/20/16 10:14 AM (7 years, 4 months ago) |
|
|
Quote:
viktor said: Here's something I noticed that you guys might find interesting.
In my travels I have noticed a big difference between the American attitude to free speech and the attitude in the rest of the English-speaking world. The American attitude seems to be much more egalitarian.
On the Shroomery I noticed this: American posters rarely put anyone on ignore, unlike other posters. Duncan Rowhl and zzripz both have a tremendous number of people on ignore, whereas American posters seldom do this.
Is this a fluke, or does it represent a distinction between a colonial American attitude that every man can have his say and a class-system based British system where one's inferiors are dismissed as worthless?
... 
well seeing you are using me as an example of...anti-free speech, I simply must respond. AND you must wonder if that is so how come your not on it, because you have challenged my views in the past....riiight?
So how come I have seemingly a few people on ignore? Well for one that is a freedom we ALL have. you can use it against trolls for instance. It is a great button to have. If you read the explanation I gave to my latest ignored poster, it was NOT that I am against free speech. I would LOVE there to no no moderation at ANY forum, and then we would all be on a level playing field. So eg if someone called me a fool --which he did, and which is against this forums rules (I got banned once here for calling someone 'kiddo'!!!), IF it were not moderated I woulda let him have it. Giving as good as I get and also dropping knowledge. But it is not cool for some people to get away with that whereas if I reacted I could be in trouble. true?
As well as that, Desmond is a typical person who doesn't understand what is even being explained, and so my time would be taken up trying to talk to a brickwall. I had already proven that even shrinks are admitting the 'chemical imbalance' theory of 'mental illness' was quackery all along, though they don't say 'quackery'. Does Desmond absorb that vital information? No. So look, i have NOT stopped his free speech have I. Mods can and do. What I have done is me personally ignoring him. Everyone else and their aunty can read his rants till the cows come home. How is that stopping free speech? it is rather exercising my rights to not have to deal with someone will not understand.
A lot of the ones I ignore were trolls who somehow slipped through the net of moderation which forbids trolling. So MY power is removing them so their annoying posts don't get in my face.
As for your worldview that 'Americans' are more accepting of free speech than 'Europeans', I will have more to say about that if thread continues.
|
viktor
psychotechnician



Registered: 11/03/10
Posts: 4,293
Loc: New Zealand
Last seen: 1 year, 9 months
|
Re: American vs. Empire attitudes to free speech [Re: DividedQuantum]
#23663019 - 09/20/16 08:20 PM (7 years, 4 months ago) |
|
|
Quote:
DividedQuantum said: I think that you could very well be right that that psychology lends itself to less ignoring of others by Americans, where more class-conscious citizens of other countries might want to dismiss the "rabble." Interesting, in any case.
It's just something I've observed. An unpopular opinion expressed to Americans is argued about. An unpopular opinion expressed to people in the rest of the Empire often leads to calls of one being insane, unworthy of being listened to, a pleb etc.
The British attitude appears to be: as soon as someone irritates me in the slightest, I shut them out of my life entirely and immediately.
Duncan Rowhl, for example, I can't even recall talking to on this forum ever, yet he has me on ignore. It's extremely unlikely that an American would ever do that.
Maybe it's because Britain is massively overpopulated and so people learn to be very ruthless with strangers?
-------------------- "They consider me insane but I know that I am a hero living under the eyes of the gods."
|
zzripz
Stranger


Registered: 12/23/08
Posts: 8,292
Loc: Manchester, UK
Last seen: 4 years, 7 months
|
Re: American vs. Empire attitudes to free speech [Re: viktor]
#23664144 - 09/21/16 05:27 AM (7 years, 4 months ago) |
|
|
The ['American'] attitude appears to be:
They do not read what you explain and just carry on with uniformed opinion...
Quote:
Frank Zappa: "The illusion of freedom [in America] will continue as long as it’s profitable to continue the illusion. At the point where the illusion becomes too expensive to maintain, they will just take down the scenery, they will pull back the curtains, they will move the tables and chairs out of the way and you will see the brick wall at the back of the theater."
|
Withinity
Untitled


Registered: 04/11/10
Posts: 1,357
Loc: Côte d’Ivoire
Last seen: 1 year, 10 months
|
Re: American vs. Empire attitudes to free speech [Re: viktor]
#23665800 - 09/21/16 05:36 PM (7 years, 4 months ago) |
|
|
Both are champions in their own right in my travel experience. The Americans surely are the most stupid people at least compared to other Europeans it's really amazing at times, whilst the Brits are most consistently the most disrespectful of other cultures. The stupidity of Americans and the arrogance of the Brits never ceases to amaze me.
It doesn't apply to all but generally speaking as you do find Brits who carry themselves with respect (usually not part of a big group), as for the Americans..... Sometimes I really can't believe it , wtf are you people doing over there, I met some Harvard students and was not impressed. In theory everyone can say what they want, in practicality it doesn't really mean shit even if they do.
Win some you loose some I guess.
--------------------
|
DividedQuantum
Outer Head


Registered: 12/06/13
Posts: 9,819
|
Re: American vs. Empire attitudes to free speech [Re: Withinity]
#23665895 - 09/21/16 06:13 PM (7 years, 4 months ago) |
|
|
Yes, we're really fucking dumb.
-------------------- Vi Veri Universum Vivus Vici
|
Withinity
Untitled


Registered: 04/11/10
Posts: 1,357
Loc: Côte d’Ivoire
Last seen: 1 year, 10 months
|
Re: American vs. Empire attitudes to free speech [Re: DividedQuantum]
#23665971 - 09/21/16 06:45 PM (7 years, 4 months ago) |
|
|
I'm sorry man. My bias experience with Americans abroad.
--------------------
|
DividedQuantum
Outer Head


Registered: 12/06/13
Posts: 9,819
|
Re: American vs. Empire attitudes to free speech [Re: Withinity]
#23666059 - 09/21/16 07:15 PM (7 years, 4 months ago) |
|
|
No need to apologize, I was being serious.
-------------------- Vi Veri Universum Vivus Vici
|
viktor
psychotechnician



Registered: 11/03/10
Posts: 4,293
Loc: New Zealand
Last seen: 1 year, 9 months
|
Re: American vs. Empire attitudes to free speech [Re: DividedQuantum] 1
#23666209 - 09/21/16 08:09 PM (7 years, 4 months ago) |
|
|
I don't know if Americans are dumb, although I do believe that dumb Americans are not discouraged to express their opinions like dumb Europeans are.
I say this because I have met Americans with absolutely no self-awareness before, but have never met such a European.
-------------------- "They consider me insane but I know that I am a hero living under the eyes of the gods."
|
redgreenvines
irregular verb


Registered: 04/08/04
Posts: 37,539
|
Re: American vs. Empire attitudes to free speech [Re: viktor] 1
#23667203 - 09/22/16 05:30 AM (7 years, 4 months ago) |
|
|
I'm Canadian, I give a person 13 years before I cut them out of my life completely. just trying to be fair
--------------------
_ 🧠 _
|
viktor
psychotechnician



Registered: 11/03/10
Posts: 4,293
Loc: New Zealand
Last seen: 1 year, 9 months
|
Re: American vs. Empire attitudes to free speech [Re: redgreenvines]
#23667483 - 09/22/16 09:16 AM (7 years, 4 months ago) |
|
|
Another thing I noticed is that American forums very rarely permaban someone. You generally have to be a genuine fuckwit to get banned from the Shroomery.
Other nationalities tend to run forums in which you get banned for not fitting in.
-------------------- "They consider me insane but I know that I am a hero living under the eyes of the gods."
|
Hobozen


Registered: 11/03/11
Posts: 10,634
Loc:
|
Re: American vs. Empire attitudes to free speech [Re: viktor]
#23669613 - 09/22/16 10:06 PM (7 years, 4 months ago) |
|
|
Quote:
viktor said: Here's something I noticed that you guys might find interesting.
In my travels I have noticed a big difference between the American attitude to free speech and the attitude in the rest of the English-speaking world. The American attitude seems to be much more egalitarian.
On the Shroomery I noticed this: American posters rarely put anyone on ignore, unlike other posters. Duncan Rowhl and zzripz both have a tremendous number of people on ignore, whereas American posters seldom do this.
Is this a fluke, or does it represent a distinction between a colonial American attitude that every man can have his say and a class-system based British system where one's inferiors are dismissed as worthless?
What's happeneing now in the US with Trump vs the Establishment will never happen in Canada. Our politics are a dark path with 0 light at the end of the tunnel.
|
Cognitive_Shift
CS actual




Registered: 12/11/07
Posts: 29,591
|
Re: American vs. Empire attitudes to free speech [Re: zzripz]
#23669649 - 09/22/16 10:17 PM (7 years, 4 months ago) |
|
|
Not only are dumb americans not discouraged from sharing their dumb opinions, they are applauded for their "bravery" in doing so.
It's also how in america people who are heavily overweight aren't ridiculed into living a more healthy lifestyle. They are applauded for their "bravery" for being themselves in the face of prejudice.
Not all americans are dumb, fat, stupid and lazy. There are people like that in all countries. There just so happens to be a higher portion of the culture at large which fits the dumb, fat, stupid and lazy character traits.
Just my opinion as a career american whose lived all over the USA except the PNW and the rocky mountain west.
-------------------- L'enfer est plein de bonnes volontés et désirs
|
|