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Offlinecandela
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Bulk Pasteurization in AA Inner Basket
    #23658754 - 09/19/16 01:14 PM (7 years, 4 months ago)

Has anybody ever pasteurized there substrate by filling up there inner basket with sub (Not inside of the jars), but I mean putting the substrate directly inside the basket and just place some aluminum foil over the top of the basket, w/ a thermometer punched into the middle of the foil



Might take a while  for the center of the substrate to heat up with so much in  there at once.  Does/ Has anyone here used this method, and does it work ? 

I read that AGAR uses/ used a similar method, but with pots: https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Cat/0/Number/6753298


Edited by candela (09/19/16 01:57 PM)


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Re: Bulk Pasteurization in AA Inner Basket [Re: candela]
    #23658807 - 09/19/16 01:33 PM (7 years, 4 months ago)

what kind of substrate?


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Re: Bulk Pasteurization in AA Inner Basket [Re: mushboy]
    #23658814 - 09/19/16 01:34 PM (7 years, 4 months ago)

Poo, CVG, etc


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Re: Bulk Pasteurization in AA Inner Basket [Re: candela]
    #23658822 - 09/19/16 01:36 PM (7 years, 4 months ago)

for poo i boiled it in a pillow case. worked fine. i wouldnt want straight
shit in my AA pc.

CVG doesnt need to be pasteurized. just boiling water and a home depot painters bucket. 5bucks.

ive also pasteurized poo inside quart jars and use a candy thermometer to keep
temp at 160.


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Offlinecandela
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Re: Bulk Pasteurization in AA Inner Basket [Re: mushboy]
    #23658861 - 09/19/16 01:48 PM (7 years, 4 months ago)

So, Let me get this straight.  You have not tried it, and had no opinion if this will work; or not.

Why oh why ?
:facepalm3:


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Re: Bulk Pasteurization in AA Inner Basket [Re: candela]
    #23658887 - 09/19/16 01:56 PM (7 years, 4 months ago)

of course it will 'work' by bringing your substrate to 160f

i said i used poo in a pillow case in my pc.
and i said i wouldnt want straight shit in my pc.

i could imagine some might burn to the bottom. eww.

so no i have not dumped poo into my pc like a stew and turned up the heat.


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Re: Bulk Pasteurization in AA Inner Basket [Re: candela]
    #23658895 - 09/19/16 01:58 PM (7 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

candela said:
Has anybody ever pasteurized there substrate by filling up there inner basket with sub (Not inside of the jars), but I mean putting the substrate directly inside the basket and just place some aluminum foil over the top of the basket, w/ a thermometer punched into the middle of the foil



Might take a while  for the center of the substrate to heat up with so much in  there at once.  Does/ Has anyone here use this method, and does it work ? 




I think it may be a bit tedious. The space between the inner basket and cooker sidewalls isn't very much. So the available boiling water to heat the basket won't be alot and you will probably have to add water often as it boils off and the level drops. It will probably take a long time to get the center up to temp. I've found using one larger XL bags with ~15-20lbs of substrate to be harder to keep the internal temp in check than smaller bags in one run. I bet using the whole basket may have similar issues as large bags.

If you have an AA941 I'd suggest pasteurizing in bags the way I do my casing soil in the link below in my sig.


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How I make 15 lbs of casing in a 941. How I line 12 shoeboxes with 1 39gal bag. How I Deep Fry Cubes!
RogerRabbit said:You need a bigger pressure cooker for this hobby. RR


Edited by Juiceh (09/19/16 01:59 PM)


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Re: Bulk Pasteurization in AA Inner Basket [Re: candela]
    #23658898 - 09/19/16 01:59 PM (7 years, 4 months ago)

It would take a couple of years to get up to temp in the middle this way. The outer part of the sub in the basket will probably get way over-temperature unless you maintain the actual water temp right at 150-160, which will be difficult since there will be only a small amount of water in the pc. You could just fill up ziplocks...or jars.. with sub and go that route...more water in the pot, keeping water temp right will be much easier.


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Re: Bulk Pasteurization in AA Inner Basket [Re: sandy_vag]
    #23658918 - 09/19/16 02:05 PM (7 years, 4 months ago)

also OP you had a thread going where you said you DONT pasteurize your
poo and have 95% success but you had bug issues. gross...

and you got numerous tips for easy pasteurizing teks.


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Re: Bulk Pasteurization in AA Inner Basket [Re: sandy_vag]
    #23658921 - 09/19/16 02:05 PM (7 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

sandy_vag said:
It would take a couple of years to get up to temp in the middle this way. The outer part of the sub in the basket will probably get way over-temperature unless you maintain the actual water temp right at 150-160, which will be difficult since there will be only a small amount of water in the pc. You could just fill up ziplocks...or jars.. with sub and go that route...more water in the pot, keeping water temp right will be much easier.



It does not matter if the outer part of substrate exceed 160f. You can sterilize the exterior layers, this is what happens during most bag & jar pasteurization teks. The only thing that matters is the core. As long as the core temperature is maintained at the correct temp, the surviving good bacteria in the core will spread throughout the rest of the substrate as it cools back down and should be ready for use in 24 hours.


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How I make 15 lbs of casing in a 941. How I line 12 shoeboxes with 1 39gal bag. How I Deep Fry Cubes!
RogerRabbit said:You need a bigger pressure cooker for this hobby. RR


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Re: Bulk Pasteurization in AA Inner Basket [Re: mushboy]
    #23659010 - 09/19/16 02:41 PM (7 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

mushboy said:
also OP you had a thread going where you said you DONT pasteurize your
poo and have 95% success but you had bug issues. gross...




Bugs are just extra protein.  Win/ Win

Yes it has worked out pretty good without any pasteurization.  I just had to run a lot of tubs at once, because my yields per tub was low, and running a lot of tubs balanced it out, but it does work well, without any mold issues  at all!

1. Ive tried the bucket tek w/ CVG and boiling water,  with nightmarish results. Failure after Failure

2. Ive tried this no pasteurization tek with success, but yields are very low per tub, and needs to be compensated with a lot of tubs going at once.


I need to finally pasteurize my shit the right way, and see the difference.  I envy you people who only run 1 or 2 tubs and  get those huge, nice monster flushes. :bow2:  I wanna be like you!





Edited by candela (09/19/16 02:58 PM)


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Re: Bulk Pasteurization in AA Inner Basket [Re: candela]
    #23659032 - 09/19/16 02:56 PM (7 years, 4 months ago)

If you can't pull off a bucket tek with CVG and your yields are poor, my money is on your spawn being as nasty as a 50 year old hooker. Clean up your spawn, chances are everything else will improve.

Quote:

I envy you people who only run 1 or 2 tubs and  get those huge, nice monster flushes. 






Bucket tek. Coir and verm. 2810 grams wet first flush. Clean spawn man. Clean spawn.


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Re: Bulk Pasteurization in AA Inner Basket [Re: Pastywhyte]
    #23659051 - 09/19/16 03:05 PM (7 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

Pastywhyte said:
If you can't pull off a bucket tek with CVG and your yields are poor, my money is on your spawn being as nasty as a 50 year old hooker. Clean up your spawn, chances are everything else will improve.

Quote:

I envy you people who only run 1 or 2 tubs and  get those huge, nice monster flushes. 






Bucket tek. Coir and verm. 2810 grams wet first flush. Clean spawn man. Clean spawn.



There you go, Rub that beautiful tub in my face you mother'effer. Dam you  make me jealous dude. 

BTW Last time, You kicked my ass about my spawn being bad, and I switched and learned agar work, my cultures are clean.  Now, your kicking my ass about my spawn being bad, again. 

Any other possible vectors? Can I really suck this bad!

`


Edited by candela (09/19/16 03:09 PM)


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Re: Bulk Pasteurization in AA Inner Basket [Re: candela]
    #23659060 - 09/19/16 03:09 PM (7 years, 4 months ago)

If you are failing consistently with coir then it's your spawn. Post pics of the spawn so people can try to help you. Test your spawn regularly, put grains of it on plates to see what comes up. Narrow the vectors.


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Re: Bulk Pasteurization in AA Inner Basket [Re: candela]
    #23659063 - 09/19/16 03:09 PM (7 years, 4 months ago)

Ya not pasteurising your poo ... or youre using shitty coir that has grains in it


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Re: Bulk Pasteurization in AA Inner Basket [Re: Boogieman47]
    #23659115 - 09/19/16 03:34 PM (7 years, 4 months ago)

unless you get lucky it takes a bit of time to get the massive
flushes..at least IME cause of dirty spores and being noobish.
such as not knowing what bacterial spawn means or thinking higher
humidity was the most important fruiting factor(this was 10years ago)

its taken me about a month to transfer and grow clean cultures to
make master jars with. and a week or 2 for those jars to grow plus
another few weeks for the main spawn jars to grow.. plus another
week after that for the tubs to colonize..all the while ive got a
mini mono and some basic trays going but they are giving subpar results...why??

DIRTY SPAWN


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Re: Bulk Pasteurization in AA Inner Basket [Re: mushboy]
    #23659190 - 09/19/16 03:57 PM (7 years, 4 months ago)

Let's be realistic, making really clean spawn is probably the hardest part of the whole process. I am always my own biggest critic on my spawn. Its served me well.

People are always so defensive about their spawn and look to blame pretty much anything else. I don't understand it. The hardest part of the whole process and the instinct is to blame your fail on the easy stuff? It's laughable.


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Re: Bulk Pasteurization in AA Inner Basket [Re: Pastywhyte]
    #23659239 - 09/19/16 04:10 PM (7 years, 4 months ago)

back when i was a mega noob it was like a denial reaction..

'not my spawn! its the shit... it must be that b+ strain. should of done golden teachers in bags! it worked once... pssshhhh shroomery ego jerks thinking they know everything' -not a direct quote :p


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Re: Bulk Pasteurization in AA Inner Basket [Re: mushboy]
    #23659345 - 09/19/16 04:42 PM (7 years, 4 months ago)

Ya even if you think its clean it probably isnt ive been checking my agar before even using it if it has bumps and isnt flat i try to find a flat clean spot make a small transfer and toss the rest and i still get shit depending on how long grain sat before pc and other stuff


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Re: Bulk Pasteurization in AA Inner Basket [Re: Boogieman47]
    #23659732 - 09/19/16 06:53 PM (7 years, 4 months ago)

Oven pasteurization is the easiest and best way to go. Even cooking straight coir shortens my run times a few days.


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Re: Bulk Pasteurization in AA Inner Basket [Re: tump]
    #23659862 - 09/19/16 07:40 PM (7 years, 4 months ago)

When possible, I will post a flick of my spawn jars, so you may take a look at it .

Am getting an average of 15gm dry per quart jar, with my no pasteurization tek. Sucks, but better than growing contams; or nothing at all.

In the meantime, I like the idea of checking my spawn, never thought of it.  Am assuming to do a grain transfer into an agar plate ?


Edited by candela (09/19/16 07:43 PM)


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Re: Bulk Pasteurization in AA Inner Basket [Re: candela]
    #23659879 - 09/19/16 07:47 PM (7 years, 4 months ago)

Transfer a few grains from a colonized jar to a plate and also have a few uninoculated jars and after 3 weeks transfer some grains from those. You need to test vectors and limit variables.

Believe it or not that's closer to real experimentation than what 90% of people call an experiment.


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Re: Bulk Pasteurization in AA Inner Basket [Re: Pastywhyte]
    #23659896 - 09/19/16 07:54 PM (7 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

Pastywhyte said:
Transfer a few grains from a colonized jar to a plate and also have a few uninoculated jars and after 3 weeks transfer some grains from those. You need to test vectors and limit variables.

Believe it or not that's closer to real experimentation than what 90% of people call an experiment.




Hope I am reading this correct, transfer some colonized grains to agar.

Also make some uninoculated grains, and after 3 weeks, take some of my uninoculated grains to agar.


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Re: Bulk Pasteurization in AA Inner Basket [Re: candela]
    #23659904 - 09/19/16 07:59 PM (7 years, 4 months ago)

Yup that's a good place to start.


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Re: Bulk Pasteurization in AA Inner Basket [Re: Pastywhyte]
    #23659927 - 09/19/16 08:08 PM (7 years, 4 months ago)

Ive seen you and others say before wuth our equipment we cant kill every thing in grain just gives us that window to get a few flushes .. is there technically any way to do so? And also if you had some fast colonizing myc that colonized a jar in a week or so plus the sub in another week being fully colonized it really cuts the chances of anything from forming right?


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Re: Bulk Pasteurization in AA Inner Basket [Re: Boogieman47]
    #23659936 - 09/19/16 08:11 PM (7 years, 4 months ago)

Yes it is possible to fully sterilize the grain. Aloha does but they have an autoclave the size of a bus that can hit 60psi.

Yes fast colonization will help. Bacteria is only a big vector if the colony is broken. Then the bacteria inhibits the recovery and allows mold a foothold. If the grain and then bulk is colonized before the bacteria can really recover and get a foothold then there is no real risk and you will see good strong flushes.


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Re: Bulk Pasteurization in AA Inner Basket [Re: Pastywhyte]
    #23659944 - 09/19/16 08:15 PM (7 years, 4 months ago)

I wish i had that, 2 day pc runs suck haha so thats why its only recommended one shake per jar then huh?


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Re: Bulk Pasteurization in AA Inner Basket [Re: Pastywhyte]
    #23660042 - 09/19/16 09:03 PM (7 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

Pastywhyte said:
Transfer a few grains from a colonized jar to a plate and also have a few uninoculated jars and after 3 weeks transfer some grains from those. You need to test vectors and limit variables.

Believe it or not that's closer to real experimentation than what 90% of people call an experiment.




Here are pictures of my spawn, any black or grey spots are just sunflowers seeds that I left in. Please, Let me know how they look to you.


Ive been thinking of what you said, about testing my grains, so am assuming:

1. If my uninoculated grains pop up dirty on my agar, my vector is somewhere in my prep, either my lids, filter or pcing. But if it clean am ok

2. But if my colonized grain pops up dirty on my agar, then my vector is somewhere in the sab, such as my sterile techniques or transfer methods.

Correct?


Edited by candela (09/19/16 09:09 PM)


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Re: Bulk Pasteurization in AA Inner Basket [Re: candela]
    #23660066 - 09/19/16 09:13 PM (7 years, 4 months ago)

All of those are a tad bit bacterial see the grain thats greasy up against the glass? How are you prepping your grain? Maybe you should take out the sunflower seeds?? I myself would just use hpoo since its free and use them but its not a recommendation


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Edited by Boogieman47 (09/19/16 09:14 PM)


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Re: Bulk Pasteurization in AA Inner Basket [Re: Boogieman47]
    #23660073 - 09/19/16 09:16 PM (7 years, 4 months ago)

I think its in your grain personally could be a bit of something from agar do you use petris or pastyplates?


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Re: Bulk Pasteurization in AA Inner Basket [Re: Boogieman47]
    #23660089 - 09/19/16 09:21 PM (7 years, 4 months ago)

Those look unhappy for sure. Bacteria. What are you doing for a PC cycle?


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Re: Bulk Pasteurization in AA Inner Basket [Re: Pastywhyte]
    #23660096 - 09/19/16 09:26 PM (7 years, 4 months ago)

These are 3rd gen transfers. My masters grew good.

But as for my pc cycle, 2 hours at 15-17psi


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Re: Bulk Pasteurization in AA Inner Basket [Re: candela]
    #23660101 - 09/19/16 09:28 PM (7 years, 4 months ago)

Hmmm. There is a vector somewhere. Start looking. As for those you might be able to spawn em but it will be a coin flip. I would probably just case them in the jar and top fruit.


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Re: Bulk Pasteurization in AA Inner Basket [Re: Pastywhyte]
    #23660109 - 09/19/16 09:33 PM (7 years, 4 months ago)

Id say its your technique man if they are g2g i always unscrew the outer ring then carefully wipe around the edge before opening the main lid ..


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Re: Bulk Pasteurization in AA Inner Basket [Re: Pastywhyte]
    #23660113 - 09/19/16 09:34 PM (7 years, 4 months ago)

Ok. Thank you all!


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