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Ferather
Mycological



Registered: 03/19/15
Posts: 6,325
Loc: United Kingdom
Last seen: 1 year, 2 months
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Re: Why too many generations loses vitality/vigor? [Re: Ferather]
#23665604 - 09/21/16 04:28 PM (7 years, 4 months ago) |
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Ok so to answer your question, Golden oyster is renowned for losing genetics. Even more so the more it is expanded. You are looking at a G5 clone.
Scroll up and compare the fruits, which looks the best? You are looking at amplified, regained fruits.
I can now clone G6 or collect spores. Carbon variation is the key.
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flyontoast
Farming food; farming time


Registered: 08/20/16
Posts: 258
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Re: Why too many generations loses vitality/vigor? [Re: Ferather]
#23666135 - 09/21/16 07:34 PM (7 years, 4 months ago) |
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Quote:
Ferather said: I can now clone G6 or collect spores. Carbon variation is the key.
Ok, amazing, I love how this is fleshing out. When you say G5, and in this case take another G6 clone or spores, you are getting to G5 from cloning the FRUIT? Not G5 through 5 expansions of G2G transfers? If you take a G6 clone off that mushroom, you put that on grain, let it colonize, and then into a substrate? How many generations have you pushed from a fruit before you return to agar/culture? And do you find a G6 clones from fruit more vigorous than a G6 G2G? (if you can pontificate on that last one both in terms of your golden and fungi in general, that'd be great). Sorry if that's too demanding. I'm just really obsessed with growing and understanding fungi lately.
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My trade list Looking for strong terrestrial fruiters for an outdoor beds experiment: Agaricus Bitorquis, Agaricus Augustus, Agaricus blazei/subrufescens, Stropharia Rugoso-annulata, Clitocybe Nuda (blewits), and any species or other genus that you think work outdoors. Also, any commercially viable Pleurotus, cold or hot strains. Thanks for the Q&A, trades, and all the posters & teachers that have come before us
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TravelAgency
The ongoing "wow"


Registered: 12/25/10
Posts: 4,431
Last seen: 11 months, 23 days
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Re: Why too many generations loses vitality/vigor? [Re: flyontoast]
#23666863 - 09/22/16 12:00 AM (7 years, 4 months ago) |
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Gorgeous!
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Ferather
Mycological



Registered: 03/19/15
Posts: 6,325
Loc: United Kingdom
Last seen: 1 year, 2 months
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Re: Why too many generations loses vitality/vigor? [Re: flyontoast]
#23667303 - 09/22/16 07:14 AM (7 years, 4 months ago) |
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Quote:
flyontoast said: Ok, amazing, I love how this is fleshing out. When you say G5, and in this case take another G6 clone or spores, you are getting to G5 from cloning the FRUIT? Not G5 through 5 expansions of G2G transfers? If you take a G6 clone off that mushroom, you put that on grain, let it colonize, and then into a substrate? How many generations have you pushed from a fruit before you return to agar/culture? And do you find a G6 clones from fruit more vigorous than a G6 G2G? (if you can pontificate on that last one both in terms of your golden and fungi in general, that'd be great). Sorry if that's too demanding. I'm just really obsessed with growing and understanding fungi lately.
Yes this is generations of fruit clones, using the WL Tek. Start with wild bird seed spawn, fruit then clone.
No notable changes with growth or speed.
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Paul Stamets - Growing Gourmet and Medicinal Mushrooms
Sugars are essential for the healthy growth of mycelium. For media formulation, complex sources of sugars (carbohydrates and polysaccharides) are recommended. Cornsteep fermentative, cooked potatoes, wood, and barley malt extracts provide sugars and an assortment of basic minerals, vitamins, and salts helpful in the growth of the mushroom mycelium. From my experiences, simple sugars, while they may support growth, are not recommended as strains can not be maintained for long without promoting mutation factors, senescence, or loss of vitality.
A variety of nitrogen and carbohydrate based supplements can be added to fortify the media. Strains grown repeatedly on mono-specific media for prolonged periods risk limiting the repertoire of digestive enzymes to just that formulation. In other words, a strain grown on one medium adapts to it and may lose its innate ability to digest larger, more complex and variable substrates. To prevent a strain from becoming media-specific, the following compounds are added to 1 liter of MEA or PDA at various intervals, often in combinations:
Nitrogen & Carbohydrate Supplements
2 grams yeast or 1-2 grams peptone 2 grams oatmeal, oat bran 2 gram rye or wheat flour 1 gram soybean meal 1 gram spirulina 2 grams high quality dry dog food
Edited by Ferather (09/22/16 07:33 AM)
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Ferather
Mycological



Registered: 03/19/15
Posts: 6,325
Loc: United Kingdom
Last seen: 1 year, 2 months
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Re: Why too many generations loses vitality/vigor? [Re: Ferather]
#23667305 - 09/22/16 07:15 AM (7 years, 4 months ago) |
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The answer to big fruits is less humidity, more water content.

Fruits bring up more nutrition from the substrate.
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