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OfflineDuncan Rowhl
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To the Vapers..
    #23632989 - 09/10/16 04:12 PM (7 years, 4 months ago)

During the 'ease down' from recent mushrooms experiences whilst relaxing as the sun rises, I had a sudden bizzare, strong urge and idea of a hookah completing the deal to make things even more relaxing. The thought stemmed from an experience sitting in a pub a few years ago whilst smoking a berry flavoured hookah what was the center peice of every table. I enjoyed it thoroughly whilst drinking lager. 

In light of this, I seen that the vape pens on EBay were cheap and so invested in a Zeltu Lite vape and bottle of non nicotine Detab blueberry juice to smoke only in those times mentioned above.

I received it today, loaded it with juice and inhaled a slight amount, then a standard amount which I would have usually taken on a cigarette (ex smoker of 13 years Drum tobacco, quit 8 years ago).Enjoyable as it was, my heart has been aching and palpitating for 10 hours right after the last inhalation.  Very prominent sickness and discomfort throughout that time.

Although I'm inclined to just avoid it given the severity of the side effect, My question is; is this likely to have been caused by the device or the juice?

Are there bad brands of juice?

Do new devices need to be warmed in? I.e am I inhaling toxins?

Is it just the consequence of using a cheap device? - same again, inhaling toxins perhaps?

As mentioned, the juice is non-nictotine.


Edited by Duncan Rowhl (09/10/16 04:28 PM)


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Invisibleplasma
ɹoʇɐɹǝpoɯ

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Posts: 10,001
Re: To the Vapers.. [Re: Duncan Rowhl]
    #23633007 - 09/10/16 04:17 PM (7 years, 4 months ago)

Yeah man, a vape is a godsend during a trip.

I've read that there is a chemical in juice that is used on microwave popcorn and can cause "popcorn lung"
But, of course, it is unhealthier to smoke cigarettes for the slew of chemicals it contains


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OfflineDuncan Rowhl
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Re: To the Vapers.. [Re: plasma]
    #23633034 - 09/10/16 04:26 PM (7 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

plasma said:
Yeah man, a vape is a godsend during a trip.

I've read that there is a chemical in juice that is used on microwave popcorn and can cause "popcorn lung"
But, of course, it is unhealthier to smoke cigarettes for the slew of chemicals it contains




Good to hear. I thought the feeling was justified. :smile:

I'm just now dissapointed that I perhaps can't do it.

I previously read that it's generally clean additives in the juice, hence giving it a shot with the non nicotine.  My lungs were definately effected too, but that's perhaps expected, given the effect on the heart, though it could be vice-versa.


Edited by Duncan Rowhl (09/10/16 04:43 PM)


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Offlinespirit_shadow
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Re: To the Vapers.. [Re: plasma]
    #23633044 - 09/10/16 04:28 PM (7 years, 4 months ago)

It could be your juice. Ive had a couple different brands that gave me bad/weird side Effects.


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OfflineLuSiD enthusiast
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Re: To the Vapers.. [Re: plasma]
    #23633050 - 09/10/16 04:30 PM (7 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

plasma said:
Yeah man, a vape is a godsend during a trip.

I've read that there is a chemical in juice that is used on microwave popcorn and can cause "popcorn lung"
But, of course, it is unhealthier to smoke cigarettes for the slew of chemicals it contains



I have heard of popcorn lung but i have never  about it being from "a chemical in popcorn". The last bit sounds fishy to me.(almost like "this acid has no strychnine in it)

Honestly I've never heard anyone make a convincing argument as to what even causes popcorn lung either. And at the end of the day what does popcorn lung actually do? Causes discomfort in breathing? Sounds a hell of a lot more pleasant than CANCER.

(I know you didn't state this as a fact or anything so I'm not attacking you or anything, just the phrase "popcorn lung" has a habit of irritating me more than it should):shrug:


--------------------
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Just take your damn pills and don't ask any questions, you'll be fine.


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Invisibleplasma
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Re: To the Vapers.. [Re: LuSiD enthusiast]
    #23633061 - 09/10/16 04:34 PM (7 years, 4 months ago)

https://mic.com/articles/130069/will-vaping-give-you-popcorn-lung-here-s-the-truth#.HjQ1m9lDE

Quote:

Popcorn lung: In May 2000, a Missouri doctor contacted the state's Department of Health and Senior Services to report that eight of his patients who had formerly worked at a microwavable popcorn factory had an obstructive respiratory disease that looked like bronchiolitis obliterans. Half of them were on the list for lung transplants. After years of investigation, the CDC traced this ailment to diacetyl.

Diacetyl is a yellow-green flavoring chemical that has an intensely buttery flavor. It's one of the most prevalent ingredients in popcorn-flavoring compounds. Diacetyl is classified as "generally regarded as safe" by the FDA, the same classification given to caffeine and many spices. That is, it's safe to ingest — but inhaling it is a whole other story.

Many vape juices are made without diacetyl. It's not a necessary flavor additive.
Workers who had been close to vats that were giving off diacetyl vapor were found to have severely increased risk for lung disease, and diacetyl-induced bronchiolitis obliterans was henceforth referred to as "popcorn lung."

The vaping industry has known about the use of diacetyl as an e-liquid flavoring chemical for years, and it has been waging an internal war to identify juices that contain this chemical. Vendors will bluster about how their liquids don't contain traces of harmful flavorings, but because it's such an early, unregulated and under-examined industry, there's too much opacity to know when in the process of making an e-liquid — from the wholesaling of chemical compounds to the mixing of the juice — diacetyl makes its way into the product. For customers, the labels on e-liquids simply say "Natural and Artificial Flavors."





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OfflineDuncan Rowhl
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Re: To the Vapers.. [Re: spirit_shadow]
    #23633062 - 09/10/16 04:34 PM (7 years, 4 months ago)

I've got another brand of Cherry Menthol ordered from EBay.

If I decide to try again, it's likely to be very gradually experimental.

It's fortunate I didn't have to work today, because it shut me down.


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InvisiblePatrickKn
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Re: To the Vapers.. [Re: Duncan Rowhl]
    #23633080 - 09/10/16 04:41 PM (7 years, 4 months ago)

You may be allergic or have a bad reaction to one of the ingredients in your juice. Propylene glycol is an ingredient that people are often allergic to. Try VG only juices. If there was no nicotine in your juice, this should be the only reason you would have a sped up heart that I can think of.

I developed an allergy to PG after a couple years of vaping. Prompted me to quit vaping and smoking altogether since all my favorite juices were made with it.


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OfflineDuncan Rowhl
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Re: To the Vapers.. [Re: PatrickKn]
    #23633113 - 09/10/16 04:52 PM (7 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

PatrickKn said:
You may be allergic or have a bad reaction to one of the ingredients in your juice. Propylene glycol is an ingredient that people are often allergic to. Try VG only juices. If there was no nicotine in your juice, this should be the only reason you would have a sped up heart that I can think of.

I developed an allergy to PG after a couple years of vaping. Prompted me to quit vaping and smoking altogether since all my favorite juices were made with it.




Youve touched upon a point.

The hookah which I previously used for 30 mins with pleasure, had no 'throat hit', whereas the vape pen (juice) did, which was surprising,  I was thinking that I'm coming to close to the real feeling of smoking cigarettes which wasn't the intention.

Having researched, PG gives the throat hit and VG doesn't.

Can you suggest a good brand of containing VG?

80 / 20. PG, VG respectively seems like a common norm.


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Offlinespirit_shadow
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Re: To the Vapers.. [Re: Duncan Rowhl]
    #23633127 - 09/10/16 04:57 PM (7 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

Duncan Rowhl said:
Quote:

PatrickKn said:
You may be allergic or have a bad reaction to one of the ingredients in your juice. Propylene glycol is an ingredient that people are often allergic to. Try VG only juices. If there was no nicotine in your juice, this should be the only reason you would have a sped up heart that I can think of.

I developed an allergy to PG after a couple years of vaping. Prompted me to quit vaping and smoking altogether since all my favorite juices were made with it.




Youve touched upon a point.

The hookah which I previously used for 30 mins with pleasure, had no 'throat hit', whereas the vape pen (juice) did, which was surprising,  I was thinking that I'm coming to close to the real feeling of smoking cigarettes which wasn't the intention.

Having researched, PG gives the through hit and VG doesn't.

Can you suggest a good brand of containing VG?

80 / 20. PG, VG respectively seems like a common norm.



Look up the user spacechimp. I just got some max vg juice from him and its awesome.


--------------------
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OfflineDuncan Rowhl
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Re: To the Vapers.. [Re: spirit_shadow]
    #23633129 - 09/10/16 04:59 PM (7 years, 4 months ago)

Thanks. Is he / she in the US?


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Invisiblemoonrockmushy
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Re: To the Vapers.. [Re: Duncan Rowhl]
    #23633155 - 09/10/16 05:09 PM (7 years, 4 months ago)

vape makes me sick too.  I don't know why, but I don't like the feeling.  I've quit smoking the past few days but vaping could never compare to me.  It feels wrong and doesn't have that smoky flavor.


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Invisible4runner
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Re: To the Vapers.. [Re: plasma] * 1
    #23633169 - 09/10/16 05:15 PM (7 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

plasma said:
I've read that there is a chemical in juice that is used on microwave popcorn and can cause "popcorn lung"
But, of course, it is unhealthier to smoke cigarettes for the slew of chemicals it contains




A more recent look at diacetyl,
Quote:

Vapors on average are exposed to nine micro-grams of diacetyl daily, while smokers are exposed to a daily dose of 6,718 micro-grams of diacetyl. Also Siegal wrote that the e-cigarette liquid with the highest level of diacetyl in the Harvard study exposed vapors to 239 micro-grams against 20,340 micro-grams of diacetyl for heavy smokers.

This shows that people who vape should not worry about contracting the diseases popcorn lung. Not only is the risk of diacetyl exposure far lower for vapers than for smokers but according to Critical reviews in Toxicology, “Smoking has not been shown to be a risk factor in bronchiolitis (Popcorn Lung).


So in conclusion if you Vape you have a far lower risk of contracting popcorn lung than someone who smokes traditional cigarettes.  Also if you smoke traditional cigarettes it is very unlikely that you will ever contract popcorn lung. The media totally exaggerated this Harvard study on the risk of popcorn lung from E-cigarettes.



http://vapingex.com/does-vaping-cause-popcorn-lung/


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Invisible404
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Re: To the Vapers.. [Re: plasma] * 1
    #23633174 - 09/10/16 05:15 PM (7 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

plasma said:
Yeah man, a vape is a godsend during a trip.

I've read that there is a chemical in juice that is used on microwave popcorn and can cause "popcorn lung"
But, of course, it is unhealthier to smoke cigarettes for the slew of chemicals it contains





Prob not gonna harm you in the amounts you will be exposed to... The studies that showed popcorn lung were from patients that were inhaling the stuff all day at factories or so... I do not have polcorn lung either. I dont even think fluid companies really use it either anymore

Also, nicotine is a cns stimulant... Prob why op had some negative side effects, and just probably used too much or had a bad reaction


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Offlinespirit_shadow
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Re: To the Vapers.. [Re: Duncan Rowhl]
    #23633178 - 09/10/16 05:16 PM (7 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

Duncan Rowhl said:
Thanks. Is he / she in the US?



Yes


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InvisibleOhMrJohnson
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Re: To the Vapers.. [Re: spirit_shadow]
    #23633196 - 09/10/16 05:22 PM (7 years, 4 months ago)

I love my vape when I'm tripping, I typically vape unflavored e-juice through a dripper at around 6-8mg nicotine, it has a really heavy throat hit similar to an American Spirit, which were/are my favorite cigarettes, the vape is the perfect replacement for me though, like I can switch back and forth between smoking and vaping and be equally satisfied


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Invisible404
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Re: To the Vapers.. [Re: OhMrJohnson]
    #23633212 - 09/10/16 05:27 PM (7 years, 4 months ago)

I hate smoking cigs most of the time. However, while nicotine is not really an maoi, tobacco users supposedly show marked monoamine oxidase* inhibition, and it definitely helps ease the trip

Edit- forgot word


Edited by 404 (09/10/16 05:58 PM)


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Invisibleplasma
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Re: To the Vapers.. [Re: OhMrJohnson]
    #23633245 - 09/10/16 05:35 PM (7 years, 4 months ago)

I might have to give the unflavored a go. No flavor whatsoever? The flavors get old to me


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Offlinespirit_shadow
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Re: To the Vapers.. [Re: 404]
    #23633333 - 09/10/16 05:57 PM (7 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

404 said:
I hate smoking cigs most of the time. However, while nicotine is not really an maoi, tobacco users supposedly show marked monoamine inhibition, and it definitely helps ease the trip



Im totally opposite, I am afraid of tabbaco products while tripping because it intensifies it so much for me its almost too intense.


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OfflineDuncan Rowhl
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Re: To the Vapers.. [Re: 404]
    #23633356 - 09/10/16 06:03 PM (7 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

404 said:
Quote:

plasma said:
Yeah man, a vape is a godsend during a trip.

I've read that there is a chemical in juice that is used on microwave popcorn and can cause "popcorn lung"
But, of course, it is unhealthier to smoke cigarettes for the slew of chemicals it contains





Prob not gonna harm you in the amounts you will be exposed to... The studies that showed popcorn lung were from patients that were inhaling the stuff all day at factories or so... I do not have polcorn lung either. I dont even think fluid companies really use it either anymore

Also, nicotine is a cns stimulant... Prob why op had some negative side effects, and just probably used too much or had a bad reaction




My emphasis was on the fact that I used non nicotine juice since I'm aware of nicotine based side effects. I'm an ex smoker 13 years gone who naturally doesn't want to evoke that habit so non nicotine was the choice of juice. 

It was just for the purpose of mellow smoke and taste for 10 mins or so after mishroom ingestion once every few weeks.


Edited by Duncan Rowhl (09/10/16 06:08 PM)


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