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OfflineSoundscaper
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[First grow BRF cakes] am I doing it right?
    #23612081 - 09/04/16 05:27 PM (7 years, 4 months ago)

Hey all!

I have been wanting to grow my own magics for awhile now, and I finally did the research and started my own :smile: Glad to be a part of the family! I hope that I don't make this post too long and boring but I'd like to know if I'm doing everything right.

So I'm working with two strains, the Creeper and Golden Teacher from spore syringes. I have two different grades of vermiculite, medium and fine. I used the medium grade for the substrate with Red Mills Organic brown rice flour. PC'd them for about 90min even tho I've heard 45 is the average for BRF (just wanted to make sure I killed them nasties). I let them sit in the PC for about 3 hours to cool off then let them sit outside to cool and clear the excess water vapor in the bottom of the jars. The tin foil was still on when this happened.

When I inoculated them I lysoled the shit out of my bathroom and let it sit for a few minutes then got everything ready. Now I noticed that the dry verm layer that I had originally filled to the top was now sitting about an inch or two lower from the lid than it was when I PC'd. Does that mean the steam caused the substrate to shrink or compress more? I dunno but the verm layer was so low that I had to open some of the jars just to get the needle past the dry verm. I know that's frowned upon but there was little air flow in the bathroom so I wasn't too worried, and the syringes were all flame sterilized in between jars and wiped with alcohol swabs right before noccing. I put a little more than I shouldve in each jar, about 1.5ccs per jar

So after that they've all been sitting in my room in a plastic tub at around 80F and they get a decent amount of ambient light. Now I've heard that Golden Teachers are fairly fast colonizers and it's been about a week and I still see no growth. They still smell good and I don't see any contams, but at 80F I should see something by now right?!? I'm really anxious and want to see something so I hope I didn't mess anything up along the way. Any thoughts?

Thanks for looking!






--------------------
Just looking to enjoy the world in a new way! :grin:


Edited by Soundscaper (09/04/16 11:49 PM)


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OfflineTrippyJuice
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Re: [First grow BRF cakes] am I doing it right? [Re: Soundscaper]
    #23612198 - 09/04/16 06:07 PM (7 years, 4 months ago)

Build a sgfc to spec.  Jars look good.  Even though they are not wide mouth jars.


--------------------
We trippy mane!


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OfflineTrippyJuice
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Re: [First grow BRF cakes] am I doing it right? [Re: TrippyJuice] * 1
    #23613118 - 09/04/16 11:03 PM (7 years, 4 months ago)

Although 80 degree incubation seems a tad high..  I always keep my jars around 70-75f..  The higher temps are a breeding ground for bacteria.


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OfflineMushierage
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Re: [First grow BRF cakes] am I doing it right? [Re: TrippyJuice]
    #23613125 - 09/04/16 11:06 PM (7 years, 4 months ago)

:whathesaid:


--------------------
Don't like researching posts? Read this! . Also, if you're new and your posts contain the words: Humidifer, incubator, air-stone, or heater, then you need to read and UTFSE before asking people to review your setup.  OR... You should be cultivating reptiles and fish, not mushrooms.



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OfflineMushierage
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Re: [First grow BRF cakes] am I doing it right? [Re: Mushierage]
    #23613130 - 09/04/16 11:08 PM (7 years, 4 months ago)

Also mentioning the place you bought your spores from and then showing pictures and stating that you're  illegally cultivating those spores they sold you is not... Uh... Smart.  At all.


--------------------
Don't like researching posts? Read this! . Also, if you're new and your posts contain the words: Humidifer, incubator, air-stone, or heater, then you need to read and UTFSE before asking people to review your setup.  OR... You should be cultivating reptiles and fish, not mushrooms.



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Offlinejesustripped
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Re: [First grow BRF cakes] am I doing it right? [Re: Mushierage]
    #23613138 - 09/04/16 11:10 PM (7 years, 4 months ago)

:whathesaid: Edit your original post to remove the vendor name.


--------------------
row row row your boat gently down the stream, merrily merrily merrily merrily life is but a dream


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OfflineTrippyJuice
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Re: [First grow BRF cakes] am I doing it right? [Re: TrippyJuice]
    #23613140 - 09/04/16 11:12 PM (7 years, 4 months ago)

Build you a still air box to inoculate in.  Bathrooms are horrible..



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We trippy mane!


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Offlinejesustripped
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Re: [First grow BRF cakes] am I doing it right? [Re: TrippyJuice]
    #23613152 - 09/04/16 11:18 PM (7 years, 4 months ago)

Also, were you wiping the needle after flaming?  That's a no no nowadays.  Correct procedure is to flame, then squirt a drop of two out of the needle to cool it, and noc immediately.  And the part about the verm layer dropping is new to me. I dunno what to say about that.


--------------------
row row row your boat gently down the stream, merrily merrily merrily merrily life is but a dream


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OfflineSoundscaper
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Re: [First grow BRF cakes] am I doing it right? [Re: jesustripped]
    #23613259 - 09/04/16 11:55 PM (7 years, 4 months ago)

Oh ok thanks! Yeah I edited the vendors name out. I only mentioned it in the first place to see if anyone else could validate them as a reliable source.

@jesusstripped, can you explain to me why wiping the needle with an alcohol wipe is bad after flaming?


--------------------
Just looking to enjoy the world in a new way! :grin:


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Offlinelovelaughlibs
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Re: [First grow BRF cakes] am I doing it right? [Re: Soundscaper]
    #23613606 - 09/05/16 02:44 AM (7 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

Soundscaper said: can you explain to me why wiping the needle with an alcohol wipe is bad after flaming?



Nothing is more sterile than fire :p


--------------------
Ask and ye shall receive; Seek and ye shall find.


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OfflineGizmoleon
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Re: [First grow BRF cakes] am I doing it right? [Re: lovelaughlibs]
    #23613659 - 09/05/16 03:32 AM (7 years, 4 months ago)

With GT I see solid growth in brf on day five. What do you mean with "excess water vapor in the bottom of the jars"? Are you sure your water content is right?


--------------------
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I do. I invented it in Camberwell, and it looks like a carrot."


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OfflineSoundscaper
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Re: [First grow BRF cakes] am I doing it right? [Re: Gizmoleon]
    #23613675 - 09/05/16 03:45 AM (7 years, 4 months ago)

Well I'm not seeing any contamination. In fact they all smell good and look moist as well. I'm just not seeing any indication of mycelia growth with both strains after 5 solid days. I used the 2:1:1 ratio. 2 cups of verm to 1 cup BRF and water. Especially since I'm keeping them at a fairly high temp I should be seeing growth of some sort by now right?

I did have the tin foil still covering the jars for a day after inoculating. Is there a chance I suffocated the spores? or are they still dormant?


--------------------
Just looking to enjoy the world in a new way! :grin:


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Offlinelovelaughlibs
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Re: [First grow BRF cakes] am I doing it right? [Re: Soundscaper]
    #23613814 - 09/05/16 05:57 AM (7 years, 4 months ago)

Did you definitely let the water run down the SIDES of the jar when you inoculated? If the spore water ended up going inside the cake it might be quietly growing out of sight :smile:


--------------------
Ask and ye shall receive; Seek and ye shall find.


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InvisibleBunji Fungi
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Re: [First grow BRF cakes] am I doing it right? [Re: lovelaughlibs]
    #23613892 - 09/05/16 06:56 AM (7 years, 4 months ago)

Spores can sometimes take 2-3 weeks to germinate. The strain has no bearing on how fast they germinate.

Foil needs to be taken off after inoculation so the moisture doesn't seep into the dry verm layer; don't worry they didn't suffocate. :smile:

Sounds like you did pretty well for your first time. Be patient, soon you will see growth.


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OfflineSoundscaper
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Re: [First grow BRF cakes] am I doing it right? [Re: Bunji Fungi]
    #23615655 - 09/05/16 06:13 PM (7 years, 4 months ago)

Ok thanks for the help men!


--------------------
Just looking to enjoy the world in a new way! :grin:


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OfflineNoobtrip
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Re: [First grow BRF cakes] am I doing it right? [Re: Soundscaper]
    #23615967 - 09/05/16 07:29 PM (7 years, 4 months ago)

Remove jars from tub. I did the same thing and was corrected on my post.

https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/23544370


--------------------
WOOOO! - Ric Flair


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OfflineTedTheHighlighter
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Re: [First grow BRF cakes] am I doing it right? [Re: Noobtrip]
    #23616341 - 09/05/16 09:14 PM (7 years, 4 months ago)

Also try the fine vermiculite next time


--------------------
Alice asked the Cheshire Cat, who was sitting in a tree, “What road do I take?”

The cat asked, “Where do you want to go?”

“I don’t know,” Alice answered.

“Then,” said the cat, “it really doesn’t matter, does it?”


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OfflineSoundscaper
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Re: [First grow BRF cakes] am I doing it right? [Re: TedTheHighlighter]
    #23616393 - 09/05/16 09:35 PM (7 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

Noobtrip said:
Remove jars from tub. I did the same thing and was corrected on my post.

https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/23544370




hmmm Interesting. It seems we even have the same tub lol! From Fred Meyers? Haha

Does the tub hamper gas exchange? I never thought they were just supposed to be out in the open. Does that increase the chance of contamination?

Quote:

TedTheHighlighter said:
Also try the fine vermiculite next time




Fine verm for the Substrate?


--------------------
Just looking to enjoy the world in a new way! :grin:


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OfflineTedTheHighlighter
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Re: [First grow BRF cakes] am I doing it right? [Re: Soundscaper]
    #23616422 - 09/05/16 09:45 PM (7 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

Soundscaper said:

Quote:

TedTheHighlighter said:
Also try the fine vermiculite next time




Fine verm for the Substrate?



Yes. Also for the top 1/2 of the jars. Maybe that verm won't shrink or whatever happened


--------------------
Alice asked the Cheshire Cat, who was sitting in a tree, “What road do I take?”

The cat asked, “Where do you want to go?”

“I don’t know,” Alice answered.

“Then,” said the cat, “it really doesn’t matter, does it?”


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OfflineSoundscaper
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Re: [First grow BRF cakes] am I doing it right? [Re: TedTheHighlighter]
    #23616641 - 09/05/16 11:37 PM (7 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

TedTheHighlighter said:
Quote:

Soundscaper said:

Quote:

TedTheHighlighter said:
Also try the fine vermiculite next time




Fine verm for the Substrate?



Yes. Also for the top 1/2 of the jars. Maybe that verm won't shrink or whatever happened




Is it possible I packed it too loosely that when it was shaken the substrate condensed? If so that might be why it's taking so long to show a germination. I've heard that shaking the jars a few days after noccing makes it take longer to startup but colonize faster in the long run. Idk


--------------------
Just looking to enjoy the world in a new way! :grin:


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Offlinelovelaughlibs
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Re: [First grow BRF cakes] am I doing it right? [Re: Soundscaper]
    #23616812 - 09/06/16 01:48 AM (7 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

Soundscaper said:
Quote:

TedTheHighlighter said:
Quote:

Soundscaper said:

Quote:

TedTheHighlighter said:
Also try the fine vermiculite next time




Fine verm for the Substrate?



Yes. Also for the top 1/2 of the jars. Maybe that verm won't shrink or whatever happened




Is it possible I packed it too loosely that when it was shaken the substrate condensed? If so that might be why it's taking so long to show a germination. I've heard that shaking the jars a few days after noccing makes it take longer to startup but colonize faster in the long run. Idk




You should never shake BRF jars, their protection against contamination entirely depends on the dry vermiculite layer remaining in place. If it gets displaced your cake will likely just become contam food.


--------------------
Ask and ye shall receive; Seek and ye shall find.


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OfflineTira
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Re: [First grow BRF cakes] am I doing it right? [Re: Soundscaper]
    #23616847 - 09/06/16 02:15 AM (7 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

Soundscaper said:

Is it possible I packed it too loosely that when it was shaken the substrate condensed? If so that might be why it's taking so long to show a germination. I've heard that shaking the jars a few days after noccing makes it take longer to startup but colonize faster in the long run. Idk




That's for grain jars and only at %20-%30 colonization. You should not shake BRF jars as they wont mix anyway and only thing you'll accomplish will be breaking the verm barrier at the top of the jar (and you don't want that, that layer serves as an extra layer of protection holding contams away from the substrate under it, and by shaking & breaking it you'll help the contaminants reach your substrate)


--------------------
Useful Links for Beginners

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OfflineSoundscaper
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Re: [First grow BRF cakes] am I doing it right? [Re: Tira]
    #23632838 - 09/10/16 03:33 PM (7 years, 4 months ago)

Hey guys quick update. I think my jars are compromised but I'm still new and dont know how to spot the difference between trichodermia and mycelium. How does this look? I know the last pic is green mold but are the others mycelium? It's not too wispy looking but could still be some sort of mold.



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Just looking to enjoy the world in a new way! :grin:


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Offlinemrmazdarx9
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Re: [First grow BRF cakes] am I doing it right? [Re: Soundscaper]
    #23632885 - 09/10/16 03:47 PM (7 years, 4 months ago)

Why's it two different colours half way up? The dry verm needs be like an inch at most
And the green is game over for that jar I'm afraid


--------------------
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Re: [First grow BRF cakes] am I doing it right? [Re: mrmazdarx9]
    #23632914 - 09/10/16 03:54 PM (7 years, 4 months ago)

:whathesaid:


--------------------
Alice asked the Cheshire Cat, who was sitting in a tree, “What road do I take?”

The cat asked, “Where do you want to go?”

“I don’t know,” Alice answered.

“Then,” said the cat, “it really doesn’t matter, does it?”


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OfflineMushierage
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Re: [First grow BRF cakes] am I doing it right? [Re: TedTheHighlighter]
    #23632937 - 09/10/16 03:59 PM (7 years, 4 months ago)

Unfortunately, green is not good in this line of cultivation.    You got teh trich!


--------------------
Don't like researching posts? Read this! . Also, if you're new and your posts contain the words: Humidifer, incubator, air-stone, or heater, then you need to read and UTFSE before asking people to review your setup.  OR... You should be cultivating reptiles and fish, not mushrooms.



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OfflineTira
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Re: [First grow BRF cakes] am I doing it right? [Re: Soundscaper]
    #23632963 - 09/10/16 04:04 PM (7 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

Soundscaper said:
Hey guys quick update. I think my jars are compromised but I'm still new and dont know how to spot the difference between trichodermia and mycelium.




Just wait on them, it turns green when trich drops its spores and then you'll know.


--------------------
Useful Links for Beginners

The Basics              AMU Teks

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Noob Forum Reccomended Teks

Agar for guaranteed spawn,
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Offlinemrmazdarx9
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Re: [First grow BRF cakes] am I doing it right? [Re: Tira]
    #23632972 - 09/10/16 04:07 PM (7 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

Tira said:
Quote:

Soundscaper said:
Hey guys quick update. I think my jars are compromised but I'm still new and dont know how to spot the difference between trichodermia and mycelium.




Just wait on them, it turns green when trich drops its spores and then you'll know.



Lol did you not even look at the pics


--------------------
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OfflineSoundscaper
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Re: [First grow BRF cakes] am I doing it right? [Re: mrmazdarx9]
    #23632994 - 09/10/16 04:12 PM (7 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

mrmazdarx9 said:
Why's it two different colours half way up?




I have medium verm for substrate and fine verm for dry layer. I thought it would work better since it would create a denser mesh to block contams.

Do the other jars look fine? They seem a little wispy but then again, I've never seen any growth develop due to inexperience.


--------------------
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Offlinemrmazdarx9
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Re: [First grow BRF cakes] am I doing it right? [Re: Soundscaper]
    #23633046 - 09/10/16 04:29 PM (7 years, 4 months ago)

Tbh I can't tell much but could just be tomentose myc, FYI in future use the same verm fine verm is better for faster colonisation I've use both and there is a massive difference imo. Don't throw away the thick stuff if you have a blender blend it down to a finer grade


--------------------
COCA GROWERS come here and share your knowledge
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OfflineTira
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Re: [First grow BRF cakes] am I doing it right? [Re: mrmazdarx9]
    #23633073 - 09/10/16 04:39 PM (7 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

mrmazdarx9 said:
Lol did you not even look at the pics




I did, but he said he didn't know how to spot the difference between trich and mycelium so I told him how he could.

And only one jar has green in it (even if all their verm barriers are all over the place) and he can wait on other jars to see if they're contammed or not.


--------------------
Useful Links for Beginners

The Basics              AMU Teks

Frank''s Teks          Agar

Noob Forum Reccomended Teks

Agar for guaranteed spawn,
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Offlinemrmazdarx9
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Re: [First grow BRF cakes] am I doing it right? [Re: Tira]
    #23633091 - 09/10/16 04:44 PM (7 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

Tira said:
Quote:

mrmazdarx9 said:
Lol did you not even look at the pics




I did, but he said he didn't know how to spot the difference between trich and mycelium so I told him how he could.

And only one jar has green in it (even if all their verm barriers are all over the place) and he can wait on other jars to see if they're contammed or not.



Well your post doesn't say that it says wait till it turns green which it was so :shrug:


--------------------
COCA GROWERS come here and share your knowledge
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:penis:Click here for UK trades:penis:
:penis: need some supplies in the UK check Here or PM me:penis:
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OfflineTedTheHighlighter
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Re: [First grow BRF cakes] am I doing it right? [Re: mrmazdarx9]
    #23633106 - 09/10/16 04:50 PM (7 years, 4 months ago)

Im gonna repeat my advice from earlier.
Use fine vermiculite for both the substrate and the dry layer.

Also, it looks to me like the dry verm layers on those jars is way too thick. All you need is a 1/2 inch layer. The rest of the jar should be substrate.
Make sure you aren't actually shaking the jars.
I'm no expert on mycelia growth. I suppose the other 2 jars are good.

What conditions are they in?


--------------------
Alice asked the Cheshire Cat, who was sitting in a tree, “What road do I take?”

The cat asked, “Where do you want to go?”

“I don’t know,” Alice answered.

“Then,” said the cat, “it really doesn’t matter, does it?”


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OfflineTira
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Re: [First grow BRF cakes] am I doing it right? [Re: mrmazdarx9]
    #23633124 - 09/10/16 04:56 PM (7 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

mrmazdarx9 said:
Well your post doesn't say that it says wait till it turns green which it was so :shrug:




I was talking about the other jars (and his future jars) ofc, he already stated that he knew the jar in the last pic was contammed.


--------------------
Useful Links for Beginners

The Basics              AMU Teks

Frank''s Teks          Agar

Noob Forum Reccomended Teks

Agar for guaranteed spawn,
Proper pasteurization for guaranteed substrate.


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OfflineMushierage
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Re: [First grow BRF cakes] am I doing it right? [Re: Tira]
    #23633141 - 09/10/16 05:04 PM (7 years, 4 months ago)

So now that you know how to spot trich, and know that you can't do anything about it but throw it out, focus on what really matters. 

Making more clean spawn/cakes!! :super:


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Re: [First grow BRF cakes] am I doing it right? [Re: mrmazdarx9]
    #23633153 - 09/10/16 05:08 PM (7 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

mrmazdarx9 said:
Tbh I can't tell much but could just be tomentose myc, FYI in future use the same verm fine verm is better for faster colonisation I've use both and there is a massive difference imo. Don't throw away the thick stuff if you have a blender blend it down to a finer grade




Ok will note. Is there a good sticky or gallery comparing trich and cobweb molds (basically ones that are harder to distinguish from regular myc growth) that you can link me?

I have been trying to look for one that compares side by side but no luck  :shrug:

anyway thanks a lot guys!


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Re: [First grow BRF cakes] am I doing it right? [Re: Soundscaper]
    #23633161 - 09/10/16 05:12 PM (7 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

Soundscaper said:
Quote:

mrmazdarx9 said:
Tbh I can't tell much but could just be tomentose myc, FYI in future use the same verm fine verm is better for faster colonisation I've use both and there is a massive difference imo. Don't throw away the thick stuff if you have a blender blend it down to a finer grade




Ok will note. Is there a good sticky or gallery comparing trich and cobweb molds (basically ones that are harder to distinguish from regular myc growth) that you can link me?

I have been trying to look for one that compares side by side but no luck  :shrug:

anyway thanks a lot guys!



Yep
https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/23130868
Its not cobweb if it was cobweb within 24 hours it'd be 1000x bigger.


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Re: [First grow BRF cakes] am I doing it right? [Re: TedTheHighlighter]
    #23633163 - 09/10/16 05:12 PM (7 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

TedTheHighlighter said:
What conditions are they in?




Sitting on top shelf in lysoled room at approx 75F


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Re: [First grow BRF cakes] am I doing it right? [Re: Soundscaper]
    #23633181 - 09/10/16 05:17 PM (7 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

Soundscaper said:
Ok will note. Is there a good sticky or gallery comparing trich and cobweb molds (basically ones that are harder to distinguish from regular myc growth) that you can link me?





Just browse contamination forum and read the stickies in there and you'll have an idea.  chances are you probably won't see any cobweb inside of your jars but maybe during fruiting (especially if your FAE is low and humidity is high) and it's really not that hard to tell because it's darker than mycelium (sort of greyish and semi-transparent) and it grows rapidly (like grows 10x its size overnight).

Like I said, browsing some posts will likely help you identifying it when it happens.


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Re: [First grow BRF cakes] am I doing it right? [Re: Tira] * 1
    #23633216 - 09/10/16 05:27 PM (7 years, 4 months ago)

Cobweb is really not a big deal.  It's very rare, and if you ever do get it, chances are you can get rid of it with some hydrogen peroxide.  Then you don't have cobweb and now all those worries were for nothing.  Damn.


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Re: [First grow BRF cakes] am I doing it right? [Re: Soundscaper]
    #23633344 - 09/10/16 06:00 PM (7 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

Soundscaper said:
Quote:

TedTheHighlighter said:
What conditions are they in?




Sitting on top shelf in lysoled room at approx 75F




Are they getting any light?


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Re: [First grow BRF cakes] am I doing it right? [Re: TedTheHighlighter]
    #23633409 - 09/10/16 06:16 PM (7 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

TedTheHighlighter said:
Quote:

Soundscaper said:
Quote:

TedTheHighlighter said:
What conditions are they in?




Sitting on top shelf in lysoled room at approx 75F




Are they getting any light?




Yeah they have some ambient light in about 12 hour cycles


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