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DividedQuantum
Outer Head


Registered: 12/06/13
Posts: 9,819
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Re: We're so intelligent [Re: pineninja]
#23648314 - 09/15/16 06:14 PM (7 years, 4 months ago) |
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Quote:
War or atleast the notion of it may be necessary for relative peace.
To a large extent that is true, at least pertaining to deterrence. But with the "global village" phenomenon, it seems nationalism is growing obsolete, so where does that leave the capacity for war? But I'm sure our species is not done with war yet.
-------------------- Vi Veri Universum Vivus Vici
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pineninja
Dream Weaver



Registered: 08/17/14
Posts: 12,468
Loc: South
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I'm sort of not talking about the actuality of war but the fundamental necessity of evil to counter or make real, good. The percieved changes over time are really just different manifestations within the nature of human experience. Nationalism would be tribal warfare in a different time and globalism the knowledge of other. War is as intrinsic as love.
-------------------- Just a fool on the hill.
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nuentoter
conduit



Registered: 09/17/08
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Re: We're so intelligent [Re: pineninja]
#23648856 - 09/15/16 09:33 PM (7 years, 4 months ago) |
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Quote:
War or atleast the notion of it may be necessary for relative peace.
Necessary no I don't think so, but inevitable with our current situation.
Quote:
pineninja said: I'm sort of not talking about the actuality of war but the fundamental necessity of evil to counter or make real, good. The percieved changes over time are really just different manifestations within the nature of human experience. Nationalism would be tribal warfare in a different time and globalism the knowledge of other. War is as intrinsic as love.
I agree with this but don't believe war is the only outlet, like love, fear and hate can permeate deeply and slowly. It happens on a more under the radar, less confrontational, and more personal, private way, and on a large scale.
Resentment, prejudice, greed, ignorance, and the level of acceptance of these things is as alarming, if not more so, to me, than war. It is a war won without guns, but with schools, tv, the internet, advertising, pop culture, and any other mind numbing, distracting bullshit.
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The geometry of us is no chance. We are antennae, we are tuning forks, we are receiver and transmitters of all energy. We are more than we know. - @entheolove "I found I could say things with color and shapes that I couldn't say any other way - things I had no words for" - Georgia O'Keefe I think the word is vagina
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pineninja
Dream Weaver



Registered: 08/17/14
Posts: 12,468
Loc: South
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Re: We're so intelligent [Re: nuentoter]
#23648881 - 09/15/16 09:46 PM (7 years, 4 months ago) |
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War is just a manifestation of those emotions inevitable and necessary. I am not condoning it nor am I not, I'm just saying that's it's a necessary evil.
-------------------- Just a fool on the hill.
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funkymonk22
In Service to the Ineffable..



Registered: 01/25/16
Posts: 469
Loc: The Big O
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Re: We're so intelligent [Re: pineninja]
#23649033 - 09/15/16 10:58 PM (7 years, 4 months ago) |
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some interesting thoughts on all of this you guys:) i can only see a better future for humanity, ever since i heard t. mckenna say that the singularity was not before the big bang, but it is what is at the end of time, compelling us towards it..that's how i think of kali(the devourer, from hinduism) she is that force that draws all in and in turn, is everything. I can see humanity becoming more singular, when all the races mix to the point that we all look similar. a global humanity is to come, but as with anything born, there are the inevitable birthing pains..which i believe is what we experience as war, hate, racism and the likes...only through transcendence of the human condition can someone become kali for a moment, escape the pains, and understand..either through the psychedelic experience, meditation or the likes.
the trouble is, after one has stood before the naked truth, how does one relate that to their fellows? it seems impossible..because to try to analyze and communicate the experience it is perverted by ideals. hopefully, there is a tipping point and once 51% of people experience it, we will all understand. kinda like 100th monkey syndrome;)
sorry if i got off topic, haha...anyone have any thoughts on any of this?
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  "The clouds didn't look like cotton, they didn't even look like clouds.."-Townes Van Zandt
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redgreenvines
irregular verb


Registered: 04/08/04
Posts: 37,539
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there is always some kind of war but de-escalation is intelligent.
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nuentoter
conduit



Registered: 09/17/08
Posts: 2,721
Last seen: 7 years, 21 days
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Quote:
funkymonk22 said: some interesting thoughts on all of this you guys:) i can only see a better future for humanity, ever since i heard t. mckenna say that the singularity was not before the big bang, but it is what is at the end of time, compelling us towards it..that's how i think of kali(the devourer, from hinduism) she is that force that draws all in and in turn, is everything. I can see humanity becoming more singular, when all the races mix to the point that we all look similar. a global humanity is to come, but as with anything born, there are the inevitable birthing pains..which i believe is what we experience as war, hate, racism and the likes...only through transcendence of the human condition can someone become kali for a moment, escape the pains, and understand..either through the psychedelic experience, meditation or the likes.
the trouble is, after one has stood before the naked truth, how does one relate that to their fellows? it seems impossible..because to try to analyze and communicate the experience it is perverted by ideals. hopefully, there is a tipping point and once 51% of people experience it, we will all understand. kinda like 100th monkey syndrome;)
sorry if i got off topic, haha...anyone have any thoughts on any of this?
I see things more based on the geometry of s torus. The big baby was the point expanding away from the central point. The big freeze being on outer rim before condensing back towards center again. I could see how it is seen as returning or heading towards a singularity (or kali pulling in all existence).
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The geometry of us is no chance. We are antennae, we are tuning forks, we are receiver and transmitters of all energy. We are more than we know. - @entheolove "I found I could say things with color and shapes that I couldn't say any other way - things I had no words for" - Georgia O'Keefe I think the word is vagina
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funkymonk22
In Service to the Ineffable..



Registered: 01/25/16
Posts: 469
Loc: The Big O
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Re: We're so intelligent [Re: nuentoter]
#23651472 - 09/16/16 08:23 PM (7 years, 4 months ago) |
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thats an interesting idea too? what is the geometry of torus? never heard of it, is it something i can google?
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  "The clouds didn't look like cotton, they didn't even look like clouds.."-Townes Van Zandt
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nuentoter
conduit



Registered: 09/17/08
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Last seen: 7 years, 21 days
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It's a donut
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The geometry of us is no chance. We are antennae, we are tuning forks, we are receiver and transmitters of all energy. We are more than we know. - @entheolove "I found I could say things with color and shapes that I couldn't say any other way - things I had no words for" - Georgia O'Keefe I think the word is vagina
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nuentoter
conduit



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Re: We're so intelligent [Re: nuentoter] 1
#23654065 - 09/17/16 08:19 PM (7 years, 4 months ago) |
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Interesting read on geometry of space time when taken as a thought experiment.
 An example of what I was talking about. The universe would expand up and out from the centre (big bang) and at the outer most circumference would be the big freeze where outward acceleration would cease and the start collapsing back in on itself.
For myself at least i find this mental model fits well and makes a good visual mentally base curiosities and questions from. Cuz in reality no one really knows.
It also is a significant geometric shape, toroidal shapes of magnetic fields, and their interaction with other magnetic fields. Anyone with knowledge about electronics can tell you the significance of the torus in things like transformers, inductors, and antennas.
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The geometry of us is no chance. We are antennae, we are tuning forks, we are receiver and transmitters of all energy. We are more than we know. - @entheolove "I found I could say things with color and shapes that I couldn't say any other way - things I had no words for" - Georgia O'Keefe I think the word is vagina
Edited by nuentoter (09/17/16 08:25 PM)
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funkymonk22
In Service to the Ineffable..



Registered: 01/25/16
Posts: 469
Loc: The Big O
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Re: We're so intelligent [Re: nuentoter]
#23660373 - 09/19/16 11:55 PM (7 years, 4 months ago) |
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it is a donut..no frosting though?
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  "The clouds didn't look like cotton, they didn't even look like clouds.."-Townes Van Zandt
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akira_akuma
Φύσις κρύπτεσθαι ὕψιστος φιλεῖ


Registered: 08/28/09
Posts: 82,455
Loc: Onypeirophóros
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Quote:
Jokeshopbeard said: I think it's due to the fact that, as 'nations' or 'cultures' or 'religions' or whatever division is used to separate us into groups leads to said groups acting like fucking 5 year olds in the school playground.
I know a lot of very wise and mature humans personally, but as a species, we're fucking idiots.
Misanthropy FTW.
replace nation, culture,and religion, with coalition and ideology, and you'd be spot on, in my honest opinion.
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akira_akuma
Φύσις κρύπτεσθαι ὕψιστος φιλεῖ


Registered: 08/28/09
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Quote:
redgreenvines said: basically error, error, error...
all forms of error in the human intellect can be attributed to the failing of tradition.
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redgreenvines
irregular verb


Registered: 04/08/04
Posts: 37,539
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too much expectation from tradition is an error as well; tradition can only address or encompass that which is sustained or recurrent. when something new happens tradition has to step aside or it creates error.
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akira_akuma
Φύσις κρύπτεσθαι ὕψιστος φιλεῖ


Registered: 08/28/09
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that is, in my opinion, the source of 'error', termed that way.
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TameMe
Stranger



Registered: 10/24/05
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For the most part...we only sacrifice what will give us an individual payback.
we're not saints...and altruism is rare...
we're finite beings with animal instincts....we all want to live, and live well....
unfortunately we have not learned how to efficiently allocate minimum standards and tolerance for all lives/lifestyles....
one's freedom limits another's....
some are bound to be trampled on.
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redgreenvines
irregular verb


Registered: 04/08/04
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Re: We're so intelligent [Re: TameMe]
#23662908 - 09/20/16 07:51 PM (7 years, 4 months ago) |
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that is very dark
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TameMe
Stranger



Registered: 10/24/05
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Quote:
redgreenvines said: that is very dark
yeah...i'm a cynical bastard.....
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RJ Tubs 202


Registered: 09/20/08
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Quote:
redgreenvines said:
too much expectation from tradition is an error as well . . .
Isn't "tradition" also known as "conditioning"?
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MollyLucyMaryJane

Registered: 09/10/11
Posts: 1,302
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Re: We're so intelligent [Re: Alonzo]
#23663904 - 09/21/16 01:00 AM (7 years, 4 months ago) |
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Since much of our tech came from wars we probably wouldnt be where we are today without them.
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