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Offlinetreewitch
psychonaut/jr mycologist


Registered: 08/31/15
Posts: 85
Last seen: 3 years, 5 months
no signs of mycelium 2 weeks after inoculating spawn bags * 1
    #23608209 - 09/03/16 02:28 PM (7 years, 4 months ago)

So I knocked up 3 Midwest grow kit spawn bags 13 days ago, using a different variety of spores for each bag. There is absolutely no sign of mycelium in any of the 3 bags. The Grains in the bags do look pretty wet, far more wet than I've ever seen them.


My question is: is it possible that the bags are so wet that the spores won't germinate, or could it be that I got an entire shipment of spores that didn't make it through shipping?

I'm at a loss here. I've shot a bag or two that never germinated but have never shot up multiple bags with a 100% failure rate

Any help is appreciated in advance


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Offlinespore-ty
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Re: no signs of mycelium 2 weeks after inoculating spawn bags [Re: treewitch] * 1
    #23608254 - 09/03/16 02:39 PM (7 years, 4 months ago)

How many cc's per bag ? Also sometimes I've seen some take 14-21 days to show signs wait another week then I would decide what to do

But yes it being very wet can cause a multitude of problems.. most pre sterilized bags I bought have instructions to shake them prior to inoculation to redistribute the moisture


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OfflineMushierage
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Re: no signs of mycelium 2 weeks after inoculating spawn bags [Re: treewitch] * 1
    #23608262 - 09/03/16 02:40 PM (7 years, 4 months ago)

Well, your first problem is using grow kits.  I would never ever suggest using them.  The reason is you have no idea how long that grain has been sitting around before it ships. 

Problem 2:  You don't know how lazy their employees are.  They could very well have fudged up the sterile process and nobody would be the wiser. 

Problem 3;  From the sound of it, you are putting spores directly to grain through a self healing injection port.  Putting spores to grain is bad.  It's almost never clean and even if they do germinate, will almost always give your clean grain a bacterial infection that will either stall your bags, or reduce yields.  Put spores to agar first, and then drop them into bags you make yourself.

Problem 4:  It's all entirely possible that you just aren't waiting long enough, or do not have them in the right conditions.  True they could have fucked up the moisture content, but where do you have these bags?  What temp?  Do they have GE filters?  Pics?  Etc etc.


--------------------
Don't like researching posts? Read this! . Also, if you're new and your posts contain the words: Humidifer, incubator, air-stone, or heater, then you need to read and UTFSE before asking people to review your setup.  OR... You should be cultivating reptiles and fish, not mushrooms.



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OfflineMushierage
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Re: no signs of mycelium 2 weeks after inoculating spawn bags [Re: Mushierage] * 1
    #23608266 - 09/03/16 02:41 PM (7 years, 4 months ago)

And yes IF you ever buy pre sterile bags (which you should never do). Always shake them first.  Then inoculate them and leave them alone.  Don't shake after inoculation.


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Don't like researching posts? Read this! . Also, if you're new and your posts contain the words: Humidifer, incubator, air-stone, or heater, then you need to read and UTFSE before asking people to review your setup.  OR... You should be cultivating reptiles and fish, not mushrooms.



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Offlinetreewitch
psychonaut/jr mycologist


Registered: 08/31/15
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Re: no signs of mycelium 2 weeks after inoculating spawn bags [Re: Mushierage] * 1
    #23608290 - 09/03/16 02:49 PM (7 years, 4 months ago)

I've purchased dozens of these bags with very little problems, and i understand the pitfalls of premade spaen bags. They are simply the most economic option for me at the moment and until now have been a great success

Yes, shot thru a self healing port direct to grain. Bags also hav GE filters. Again, never had a single bag contam. Full colonization of every bag except a few random singles here and there that didn't take for whatever reason.

The bags are on a shelf in my closet, where they receive ambient/indirect sunlight and the temps range from 72-82 daily depending on time of day


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OfflineMushierage
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Re: no signs of mycelium 2 weeks after inoculating spawn bags [Re: treewitch] * 1
    #23608295 - 09/03/16 02:52 PM (7 years, 4 months ago)

Guess all you can do it wait then.  That's the thing about pre made bags.  They are a gamble.


--------------------
Don't like researching posts? Read this! . Also, if you're new and your posts contain the words: Humidifer, incubator, air-stone, or heater, then you need to read and UTFSE before asking people to review your setup.  OR... You should be cultivating reptiles and fish, not mushrooms.



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Offlinespore-ty
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Re: no signs of mycelium 2 weeks after inoculating spawn bags [Re: Mushierage] * 1
    #23608310 - 09/03/16 02:56 PM (7 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

Mushierage said:
Well, your first problem is using grow kits.  I would never ever suggest using them.  The reason is you have no idea how long that grain has been sitting around before it ships. 

Problem 2:  You don't know how lazy their employees are.  They could very well have fudged up the sterile process and nobody would be the wiser. 

Problem 3;  From the sound of it, you are putting spores directly to grain through a self healing injection port.  Putting spores to grain is bad.  It's almost never clean and even if they do germinate, will almost always give your clean grain a bacterial infection that will either stall your bags, or reduce yields.  Put spores to agar first, and then drop them into bags you make yourself.

Problem 4:  It's all entirely possible that you just aren't waiting long enough, or do not have them in the right conditions.  True they could have fucked up the moisture content, but where do you have these bags?  What temp?  Do they have GE filters?  Pics?  Etc etc.





Lol I think he covered it all... I'm on mobile 99.999% of the time haha but get started on agar !


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Offlinelovelaughlibs
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Registered: 10/14/15
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Re: no signs of mycelium 2 weeks after inoculating spawn bags [Re: spore-ty] * 1
    #23608478 - 09/03/16 03:59 PM (7 years, 4 months ago)

If you like grain methods I'd definitely recommend PastyWhyte's "No Pour Agar" Tek. It's very noob friendly and has great results. Less stressful than pouring agar too.


--------------------
Ask and ye shall receive; Seek and ye shall find.


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Offlinetreewitch
psychonaut/jr mycologist


Registered: 08/31/15
Posts: 85
Last seen: 3 years, 5 months
Re: no signs of mycelium 2 weeks after inoculating spawn bags [Re: lovelaughlibs] * 1
    #23609255 - 09/03/16 08:16 PM (7 years, 4 months ago)

Is it safe to say that it's the bags and not the spores?


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OfflineMushierage
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Re: no signs of mycelium 2 weeks after inoculating spawn bags [Re: treewitch] * 1
    #23609365 - 09/03/16 08:54 PM (7 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

treewitch said:
Is it safe to say that it's the bags and not the spores?





No it's not safe to say.  Sometimes spores can take a month to germinate.  It sucks but it happens.  As long as there is no visible contamination, there is no harm in just letting it go and seeing if it does.


--------------------
Don't like researching posts? Read this! . Also, if you're new and your posts contain the words: Humidifer, incubator, air-stone, or heater, then you need to read and UTFSE before asking people to review your setup.  OR... You should be cultivating reptiles and fish, not mushrooms.



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Offlinetreewitch
psychonaut/jr mycologist


Registered: 08/31/15
Posts: 85
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Re: no signs of mycelium 2 weeks after inoculating spawn bags [Re: Mushierage] * 1
    #23618971 - 09/06/16 05:07 PM (7 years, 4 months ago)

Well folks, I think I figured it out

After still no sign of any activity, and deeper looking into the moisture content of my bags, I concluded that indeed the grain was far wetter looking than any of the bags I've used before. There almost seemed to be a slimy coating on the grains.

Therefore, I cut one bag open and was hit with the sickly sweet smell of fermentation and/or bacteria. I cut the rest open and the same smells persisted throughout.

I've never had this issue with Midwest but I'm about to shoot for a refund.


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OfflineMushierage
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Re: no signs of mycelium 2 weeks after inoculating spawn bags [Re: treewitch] * 1
    #23619202 - 09/06/16 06:21 PM (7 years, 4 months ago)

That's why you don't order kits.  Learn from this, and make your own bags/jars now.


--------------------
Don't like researching posts? Read this! . Also, if you're new and your posts contain the words: Humidifer, incubator, air-stone, or heater, then you need to read and UTFSE before asking people to review your setup.  OR... You should be cultivating reptiles and fish, not mushrooms.



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Offlinejmullins1138
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Registered: 05/22/16
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Re: no signs of mycelium 2 weeks after inoculating spawn bags [Re: Mushierage] * 1
    #23619291 - 09/06/16 06:50 PM (7 years, 4 months ago)

Took about 2 weeks for my spawn bags to show any life. Spawn bags are definitely slower than growing in jars. But they require a lot less work in the beginning and can be left alone, which is great for someone like me. I also live on the road, I'm lucky to come home every weekend.


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Offlinemvpereira
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Registered: 06/08/14
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Re: no signs of mycelium 2 weeks after inoculating spawn bags [Re: jmullins1138] * 1
    #23622261 - 09/07/16 02:51 PM (7 years, 4 months ago)

I bought 2 bags from midwest and im about a month past inoculation and showing aroind 30% colonized.  Seems as though its going quite slow. I hope the grain doesnt dry out before full colonization.  Anyone have any ideas to jump start the colonizing?


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Invisibleuser265896
Stranger
Registered: 08/27/16
Posts: 46
Re: no signs of mycelium 2 weeks after inoculating spawn bags [Re: mvpereira] * 1
    #23622279 - 09/07/16 02:55 PM (7 years, 4 months ago)

If your at 30% and haven't mixed the bag up yet, then I'd definitely do that thoroughly. That's the % I like to mix at, because when it recovers in a few days, you should have myc growing everywhere (hopefully)

EDIT: Another tip for bags (I use the 1 pounders), is to make sure you don't inject too much spores. I put 3.3 cc in 3 of mine, and it was almost TOO much moisture content. Because I put 5 cc in 2 other ones, and all I got was slow slimy growth that stalled. And when you do inject, try and do 4 separate spots in the corners near the walls, and NOT mix up after inoculation (wait til the 20-30% mark IMO)


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OfflineMushierage
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Re: no signs of mycelium 2 weeks after inoculating spawn bags [Re: jmullins1138] * 1
    #23622286 - 09/07/16 02:58 PM (7 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

jmullins1138 said:
Took about 2 weeks for my spawn bags to show any life. Spawn bags are definitely slower than growing in jars. But they require a lot less work in the beginning and can be left alone, which is great for someone like me. I also live on the road, I'm lucky to come home every weekend.





Not necessarily.  I am assuming you guys are all injecting spores directly through the SHIPs which is baaaaad. Bad bad bad.  I used to do it this way too, until I learned how incredibly dumb and noobish I was.  No longer. 

Try making your own bags once, and then shooting it up with clean LC inoculated with agar, or drop a couple agar wedges in there once.  I guarantee you'll see activity in a matter of days, instead of weeks or not at all.


--------------------
Don't like researching posts? Read this! . Also, if you're new and your posts contain the words: Humidifer, incubator, air-stone, or heater, then you need to read and UTFSE before asking people to review your setup.  OR... You should be cultivating reptiles and fish, not mushrooms.



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Offlinemvpereira
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Re: no signs of mycelium 2 weeks after inoculating spawn bags [Re: user265896] * 1
    #23622295 - 09/07/16 03:01 PM (7 years, 4 months ago)

The bags are packed tight.  Almost like a brick of grain. So whay do u mean by mix it up? Just give it a shake?


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Invisibleuser265896
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Re: no signs of mycelium 2 weeks after inoculating spawn bags [Re: mvpereira] * 1
    #23622301 - 09/07/16 03:03 PM (7 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

mvpereira said:
The bags are packed tight.  Almost like a brick of grain. So whay do u mean by mix it up? Just give it a shake?



You literally want to man-handle it and mix every last bit of it up, till the myc seems to disappear. You can get rough with it, but just don't get anything in contact with the filter patch, which could cause problems.


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OfflineMushierage
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Re: no signs of mycelium 2 weeks after inoculating spawn bagshe [Re: mvpereira] * 1
    #23622309 - 09/07/16 03:04 PM (7 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

mvpereira said:
The bags are packed tight.  Almost like a brick of grain. So whay do u mean by mix it up? Just give it a shake?





Pull the gussets out on the bag.  If your bag has a filter patch, this will draw air through the filter and inflate it a little.  Then massage the grain a bit with your hands.

The bag needs to be a little inflated anyway to benefit from proper GE.  If you haven't done this yet, then it's no wonder your bags are colonizing slowly.


--------------------
Don't like researching posts? Read this! . Also, if you're new and your posts contain the words: Humidifer, incubator, air-stone, or heater, then you need to read and UTFSE before asking people to review your setup.  OR... You should be cultivating reptiles and fish, not mushrooms.



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Offlinemvpereira
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Re: no signs of mycelium 2 weeks after inoculating spawn bagshe [Re: Mushierage] * 1
    #23622323 - 09/07/16 03:08 PM (7 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

Mushierage said:
Quote:

mvpereira said:
The bags are packed tight.  Almost like a brick of grain. So whay do u mean by mix it up? Just give it a shake?





Pull the gussets out on the bag.  If your bag has a filter patch, this will draw air through the filter and inflate it a little.  Then massage the grain a bit with your hands.

The bag needs to be a little inflated anyway to benefit from proper GE.  If you haven't done this yet, then it's no wonder your bags are colonizing slowly.




Ok got it.  Ill give it a shot tonight and let u guys know how it turns out in a week or so.


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Offlinemvpereira
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Re: no signs of mycelium 2 weeks after inoculating spawn bagshe [Re: mvpereira]
    #23622411 - 09/07/16 03:36 PM (7 years, 4 months ago)

Thanks guys


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OfflinePeteyboy
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Re: no signs of mycelium 2 weeks after inoculating spawn bagshe [Re: mvpereira]
    #23622636 - 09/07/16 04:34 PM (7 years, 4 months ago)

I bought two bags from Midwest and proceeded as previously discussed in this thread, spores to grain. Neither germinated and both contaminated. wont ever do that again lol.


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Offlinemvpereira
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Re: no signs of mycelium 2 weeks after inoculating spawn bagshe [Re: Mushierage]
    #23638386 - 09/12/16 12:22 PM (7 years, 4 months ago)

Thanks again for the help. Its 4 days since you helped me out and the mycelium went from 30% to 80%.  Almost ready to blend it with the casing mix and start fruiting. 
Unfortunately only 1 spawn bagis colonozing and the other seems to have stopped completely.  But no worries still happy about the one bag.


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Offlinemvpereira
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Re: no signs of mycelium 2 weeks after inoculating spawn bagshe [Re: Peteyboy]
    #23638389 - 09/12/16 12:25 PM (7 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

Peteyboy said:
I bought two bags from Midwest and proceeded as previously discussed in this thread, spores to grain. Neither germinated and both contaminated. wont ever do that again lol.




Ya thats crazy. Worked good for me now that i got some air flow in the bags.
I had originally left the bag packed so tight but i guess you need to loosen up the bag so air can flow through the filter. 

I will try this again right from the start.

Id like to make my spawn bags from scratch but i dont have the time.


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OfflinePeteyboy
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Re: no signs of mycelium 2 weeks after inoculating spawn bagshe [Re: mvpereira]
    #23638403 - 09/12/16 12:33 PM (7 years, 4 months ago)

Agar all day, I'll never go back...


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OfflineMushierage
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Re: no signs of mycelium 2 weeks after inoculating spawn bagshe [Re: Peteyboy]
    #23638472 - 09/12/16 01:11 PM (7 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

Peteyboy said:
Agar all day, I'll never go back...






Same


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Don't like researching posts? Read this! . Also, if you're new and your posts contain the words: Humidifer, incubator, air-stone, or heater, then you need to read and UTFSE before asking people to review your setup.  OR... You should be cultivating reptiles and fish, not mushrooms.



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