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InvisibleCelestial Traveler
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Why pay a lawyer to expunge criminal record?
    #23580601 - 08/26/16 03:52 PM (7 years, 5 months ago)

I received a pretrial diversion several years ago which I am now trying to get expunged.  It costs roughly $300 to file the petition I have been told, but the cheapest price I have found so far to pay an attorney to do it for me is $1200. 


All the resources I have read on the Internet strongly recommend the use of an attorney for this.  My question is - what are the concrete benefits that only an attorney can provide for this endeavor?


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Invisibleshadyy
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Re: Why pay a lawyer to expunge criminal record? [Re: Celestial Traveler]
    #23580619 - 08/26/16 03:55 PM (7 years, 5 months ago)

Lawyer stuff.


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OfflineEasyriding123
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Re: Why pay a lawyer to expunge criminal record? [Re: shadyy]
    #23580631 - 08/26/16 03:57 PM (7 years, 5 months ago)

I'm curious aswell


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InvisibleCelestial Traveler
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Re: Why pay a lawyer to expunge criminal record? [Re: shadyy]
    #23580681 - 08/26/16 04:06 PM (7 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

i hate liz said:
Lawyer stuff.




Like putting the petition forms in an envelope and writing the correct mailing address on the envelope?

Totally worth an extra $900 to do that..


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InvisibleButtFace
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Re: Why pay a lawyer to expunge criminal record? *DELETED* [Re: Easyriding123]
    #23580704 - 08/26/16 04:11 PM (7 years, 5 months ago)

Post deleted by TieACable2aTree

Reason for deletion: toodles



Edited by ButtFace (08/26/16 04:25 PM)


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InvisibleCelestial Traveler
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Re: Why pay a lawyer to expunge criminal record? [Re: ButtFace]
    #23581191 - 08/26/16 06:43 PM (7 years, 5 months ago)

The pretrial diversion program dropped the charges so there is no conviction, but still an arrest record.


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OfflinePatlal
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Re: Why pay a lawyer to expunge criminal record? [Re: Celestial Traveler]
    #23581219 - 08/26/16 06:51 PM (7 years, 5 months ago)

If 1500$ is all that it cost you to no longer be seen as a criminal by the system. You should definitely pay.


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InvisibleCelestial Traveler
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Re: Why pay a lawyer to expunge criminal record? [Re: Patlal]
    #23581279 - 08/26/16 07:02 PM (7 years, 5 months ago)

What if I only had $1,500 at the moment?  >_<

Not that I only have that amount (although I don't have much more than that), but you get the idea.


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Re: Why pay a lawyer to expunge criminal record? [Re: Celestial Traveler]
    #23581298 - 08/26/16 07:07 PM (7 years, 5 months ago)

I dunno if he was full of shit, if it was even my lawyer who said it or if it still applies but I seem to remember being told you only get one chance to get that stuff wiped off your record and if the court sides against you, you're screwed. So you want someone who knows the system and knows how to work it to handle it so you don't screw yourself out of the opportunity.

It was many many years ago I heard that so take it as you will. I'm just trying to answer why one might want a lawyer to handle it.


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InvisibleEnlilMDiscord
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Re: Why pay a lawyer to expunge criminal record? [Re: Celestial Traveler]
    #23581308 - 08/26/16 07:08 PM (7 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

Celestial Traveler said:
My question is - what are the concrete benefits that only an attorney can provide for this endeavor?




None, however a deferred adjudication doesn't result in a criminal record anyway, so it might be a moot issue.  As far as the arrest record, that usually can't be used against you, and most states won't allow you to expunge arrests anyway.


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InvisibleButtFace
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Re: Why pay a lawyer to expunge criminal record? *DELETED* [Re: Celestial Traveler]
    #23581352 - 08/26/16 07:14 PM (7 years, 5 months ago)

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InvisibleEnlilMDiscord
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Re: Why pay a lawyer to expunge criminal record? [Re: ButtFace]
    #23581366 - 08/26/16 07:16 PM (7 years, 5 months ago)

That's not how it works.  If he pled guilty, that plea is withdrawn after he completes his probation, and the charges are dismissed.  No conviction will appear on his record.


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InvisibleCelestial Traveler
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Re: Why pay a lawyer to expunge criminal record? [Re: Enlil]
    #23581447 - 08/26/16 07:34 PM (7 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

Enlil said:
Quote:

Celestial Traveler said:
My question is - what are the concrete benefits that only an attorney can provide for this endeavor?




None, however a deferred adjudication doesn't result in a criminal record anyway, so it might be a moot issue.  As far as the arrest record, that usually can't be used against you, and most states won't allow you to expunge arrests anyway.





First, this was a pretrial diversion, not a deferred adjudication. 

Second, when you say "that usually can't be used against you", are you referring to job applications and employment?  In my current job, the arrest record came up and they asked me about it.  I got the job anyways, but I had to explain what happened. 

I work as a graduate student right now but corporate employers that I apply for in the future might not be so forgiving.


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InvisibleEnlilMDiscord
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Re: Why pay a lawyer to expunge criminal record? [Re: Celestial Traveler] * 1
    #23581463 - 08/26/16 07:38 PM (7 years, 5 months ago)

A pretrial diversion and a deferred adjudication are the same thing...different names from state to state.

Some states have laws that arrests can't be used against you for employment purposes.

Have you checked to see if your state allows expungement of arrest record?


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InvisibleCelestial Traveler
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Re: Why pay a lawyer to expunge criminal record? [Re: Celestial Traveler]
    #23581467 - 08/26/16 07:40 PM (7 years, 5 months ago)

I was arrested in Texas, and they made it clear that pretrial and deferred are two separate things, at least in the state and/or county I was arrested in.

I was told by my lawyer at the time that I could apply for expungement 1 year after completing the pretrial requirements.  I have also called other lawyers today (in TX) who say that it can be done.


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InvisibleCelestial Traveler
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Re: Why pay a lawyer to expunge criminal record? [Re: Celestial Traveler]
    #23581478 - 08/26/16 07:44 PM (7 years, 5 months ago)

When I google it, I find:

"The motion asks the judge to seal or expunge the records pertaining to any arrest, court proceedings or conviction...", implying it can be expunged.


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InvisibleEnlilMDiscord
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Re: Why pay a lawyer to expunge criminal record? [Re: Celestial Traveler]
    #23581480 - 08/26/16 07:45 PM (7 years, 5 months ago)

Yeah, texas allows you to expunge everything about the case including the arrest.

You don't really need a lawyer, though.  It's really just some forms and maybe an appearance.


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InvisibleCelestial Traveler
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Re: Why pay a lawyer to expunge criminal record? [Re: Enlil]
    #23581516 - 08/26/16 07:56 PM (7 years, 5 months ago)

Thanks for your advice.  I guess I needed some reassurance because multiple Internet sources said that having a lawyer do it for you is strongly recommended.  I want to make sure I do it right.

Is there anything serious that you would caution me against overlooking during the process?


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InvisibleCelestial Traveler
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Re: Why pay a lawyer to expunge criminal record? [Re: Celestial Traveler]
    #23581550 - 08/26/16 08:04 PM (7 years, 5 months ago)

Also what do you think of having it done online through a website like the one below?  Do you think it could possibly be a scam or something?  They claim to have some expedited process where they go around to private background check companies and update the records too, so that sounds nice.  I'm just wondering if I should trust something like this.

http://www.recordgone.com/


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InvisibleEnlilMDiscord
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Re: Why pay a lawyer to expunge criminal record? [Re: Celestial Traveler]
    #23581553 - 08/26/16 08:06 PM (7 years, 5 months ago)

I don't practice in Texas, so I can't give you specifics, but there are a ton of document prep services that can help you with the forms.  They won't charge you much.

As far as the appearance, if you have to do one, just be polite.  It's not likely that there will be any opposition to the petition.


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OfflinePartoftheSource
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Re: Why pay a lawyer to expunge criminal record? [Re: Enlil]
    #23581575 - 08/26/16 08:11 PM (7 years, 5 months ago)

What about the "7 year rule" with background checks?
Does anyone know anything about this?

Also, do you really want to work for a company that is going to defer you based on something you weren't even convicted for?


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InvisibleCelestial Traveler
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Re: Why pay a lawyer to expunge criminal record? [Re: PartoftheSource]
    #23581588 - 08/26/16 08:16 PM (7 years, 5 months ago)

My guess would be that the more prestigious and selective the company (or position) is, the more likely they would be to decline me based on my arrest record.


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OfflinePartoftheSource
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Re: Why pay a lawyer to expunge criminal record? [Re: Celestial Traveler]
    #23581612 - 08/26/16 08:21 PM (7 years, 5 months ago)

It sounds like that sort of company is going to chew you up and spit you out eventually. And when I say eventually, I mean after they've given you enough raises over the years that you become too expensive an asset to where they can just hire someone new in, young and fresh, for a lot less money.


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InvisibleCelestial Traveler
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Re: Why pay a lawyer to expunge criminal record? [Re: PartoftheSource]
    #23581684 - 08/26/16 08:38 PM (7 years, 5 months ago)

Either way I would just like not to have to worry about it.


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OfflineCrystal G
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Re: Why pay a lawyer to expunge criminal record? [Re: Enlil]
    #23581734 - 08/26/16 08:52 PM (7 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

Enlil said:
That's not how it works.  If he pled guilty, that plea is withdrawn after he completes his probation, and the charges are dismissed.  No conviction will appear on his record.




What?? Is that how it works for all crime? Or just what OP was charged for?


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Re: Why pay a lawyer to expunge criminal record? [Re: Celestial Traveler]
    #23581889 - 08/26/16 09:46 PM (7 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

Crystal G said:
What?? Is that how it works for all crime? Or just what OP was charged for?



That's how a diversion works.  That's not how most plea deals work, no.

Quote:

Celestial Traveler said:
My guess would be that the more prestigious and selective the company (or position) is, the more likely they would be to decline me based on my arrest record.



In Cali, it's illegal for them to even ask about arrests that don't lead to conviction.


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InvisibleCelestial Traveler
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Re: Why pay a lawyer to expunge criminal record? [Re: Shroomslip]
    #23581924 - 08/26/16 10:04 PM (7 years, 5 months ago)

Enlil do you know if there's any truth to this?


Quote:

Shroomslip said:
I dunno if he was full of shit, if it was even my lawyer who said it or if it still applies but I seem to remember being told you only get one chance to get that stuff wiped off your record and if the court sides against you, you're screwed. So you want someone who knows the system and knows how to work it to handle it so you don't screw yourself out of the opportunity. .




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Re: Why pay a lawyer to expunge criminal record? [Re: Celestial Traveler]
    #23581972 - 08/26/16 10:22 PM (7 years, 5 months ago)

I've never heard of an expungement being denied, truthfully.


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OfflinePartoftheSource
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Re: Why pay a lawyer to expunge criminal record? [Re: Enlil]
    #23581981 - 08/26/16 10:26 PM (7 years, 5 months ago)

I petitioned the court once to have my felony dropped to a misdemeanor (as per the probationary plea agreement since I had a successful completion with no violations). They told me I had to fuckin' pay off my court costs before they would even consider it. FUCKERS! It's always about money.


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InvisibleCelestial Traveler
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Re: Why pay a lawyer to expunge criminal record? [Re: Enlil]
    #23581984 - 08/26/16 10:27 PM (7 years, 5 months ago)

So no other issues could arise from not using a lawyer?  I was wondering if the lawyer could also help make private firms delete their arrest records as well.


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OfflinePartoftheSource
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Re: Why pay a lawyer to expunge criminal record? [Re: PartoftheSource]
    #23581988 - 08/26/16 10:29 PM (7 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

PartoftheSource said:
What about the "7 year rule" with background checks?
Does anyone know anything about this?





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Re: Why pay a lawyer to expunge criminal record? [Re: Celestial Traveler]
    #23581990 - 08/26/16 10:30 PM (7 years, 5 months ago)

They will delete after the expungement anyway.  It takes some time, but it happens automatically.


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Re: Why pay a lawyer to expunge criminal record? [Re: PartoftheSource]
    #23582067 - 08/26/16 11:05 PM (7 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

PartoftheSource said:
What about the "7 year rule" with background checks?
Does anyone know anything about this?

Also, do you really want to work for a company that is going to defer you based on something you weren't even convicted for?




Im assuming its different company policies and not something that has to do with the court. Ive applied at places who say it needs to have been 7 years since your felony to apply to the job. Some say it needs to be 10. My felony was dismissed before it went to court, so i always tell them i was never convicted and that works fine. However, i had a misdemeanor charge for marijuana 3 years ago and most company policies (for the jobs i was applying for) said the misdemeanors need to be 5 years back. Some companies have a zero tolerance policy and deny you no matter how long its been. So even if it was dismissed after completion of probation, if it hasnt been expunged, you will still be denied. Its gay but its the truth.


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OfflineCrystal G
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Re: Why pay a lawyer to expunge criminal record? [Re: Ogla]
    #23584706 - 08/27/16 06:41 PM (7 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

losfreddy said:
Quote:

PartoftheSource said:
What about the "7 year rule" with background checks?
Does anyone know anything about this?

Also, do you really want to work for a company that is going to defer you based on something you weren't even convicted for?




Im assuming its different company policies and not something that has to do with the court. Ive applied at places who say it needs to have been 7 years since your felony to apply to the job. Some say it needs to be 10. My felony was dismissed before it went to court, so i always tell them i was never convicted and that works fine. However, i had a misdemeanor charge for marijuana 3 years ago and most company policies (for the jobs i was applying for) said the misdemeanors need to be 5 years back. Some companies have a zero tolerance policy and deny you no matter how long its been. So even if it was dismissed after completion of probation, if it hasnt been expunged, you will still be denied. Its gay but its the truth.




It depends on the amount of income.

For company records and employment background checks, they are able to go back 7 years. But that's only if the income you will be making is less than $75,000. If it's more than $75,000 they can check back much further. 

The last company I worked with never found my DUI that I got over 11 years ago. And they probably looked into my background more extensively than anybody else.


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Re: Why pay a lawyer to expunge criminal record? [Re: Crystal G]
    #23584717 - 08/27/16 06:46 PM (7 years, 5 months ago)

That only applies in a minority of states.


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Re: Why pay a lawyer to expunge criminal record? [Re: Enlil]
    #23584784 - 08/27/16 07:19 PM (7 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

Enlil said:
That only applies in a minority of states.




What is it normally in other states?


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Re: Why pay a lawyer to expunge criminal record? [Re: Enlil] * 1
    #23584796 - 08/27/16 07:23 PM (7 years, 5 months ago)

We are so lucky to have Enlil here. Seriously. No sarcasm.


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Re: Why pay a lawyer to expunge criminal record? [Re: Crystal G]
    #23584839 - 08/27/16 07:37 PM (7 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

Crystal G said:

What is it normally in other states?



Unlimited time for criminal background.  Credit is seven years federally.


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Re: Why pay a lawyer to expunge criminal record? [Re: Enlil]
    #23586723 - 08/28/16 12:14 PM (7 years, 5 months ago)

Enlil,

If you look at the following form, on page 4/5 there is a place to list organizations whom should be ordered to delete the arrest record.  Do you know where I should begin on this?  If there are some that I leave out, can I go back later and add them?

http://texaslawhelp.org/files/685E99A9-A3EB-6584-CA74-137E0474AE2C/attachments/905B79CB-3290-4133-B0F8-64141E594D91/expunction_petition_final.pdf


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Re: Why pay a lawyer to expunge criminal record? [Re: Celestial Traveler]
    #23586742 - 08/28/16 12:21 PM (7 years, 5 months ago)

1. The Police agency that arrested you
2. Any jail you attended
3. Department of Corrections
4. Probation Department
5. Texas Bureau of Criminal investigation.


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Re: Why pay a lawyer to expunge criminal record? [Re: Enlil]
    #23586867 - 08/28/16 12:55 PM (7 years, 5 months ago)

I would like to expunge my record, however I am pretty sure I would have to appear before a judge whose daughter was in my class in high school and she was one of the cool kids and I was one of the fringe kids, so he probably is biased against me. It is in sorta a rural county where everyone knows everyone and like to be all dramatic about shit. Thus I feel a lawyer would be in my best interest but I have a lawyer on retainer anyway so I think I would not have to pay 1200...


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invoke the shadows and dust, smoke infernal spliffs"
April 24th 2011


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InvisibleOgla
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Re: Why pay a lawyer to expunge criminal record? [Re: Enlil]
    #23587151 - 08/28/16 02:34 PM (7 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

Enlil said:
Quote:

Crystal G said:

What is it normally in other states?



Unlimited time for criminal background.  Credit is seven years federally.




So if you owe money to a bank and it's been over 7 years, can you reopen an account with that bank or is it just your credit score/report that's affected or what?


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Re: Why pay a lawyer to expunge criminal record? [Re: Ogla] * 1
    #23587362 - 08/28/16 03:48 PM (7 years, 5 months ago)

That's up to the bank.  Credit bureaus can only keep negative information for 7 years.  Banks can keep it forever for their own use.


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InvisibleCelestial Traveler
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Re: Why pay a lawyer to expunge criminal record? [Re: Enlil]
    #23588192 - 08/28/16 07:56 PM (7 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

Enlil said:
1. The Police agency that arrested you
2. Any jail you attended
3. Department of Corrections
4. Probation Department
5. Texas Bureau of Criminal investigation.





Can I go back later and add others?  Maybe for an additional fee and/or through a private agency ?


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InvisibleEnlilMDiscord
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Re: Why pay a lawyer to expunge criminal record? [Re: Celestial Traveler]
    #23588199 - 08/28/16 07:59 PM (7 years, 5 months ago)

What others would you add?  That's only for public agencies.


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InvisibleCelestial Traveler
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Re: Why pay a lawyer to expunge criminal record? [Re: Enlil]
    #23588228 - 08/28/16 08:08 PM (7 years, 5 months ago)

I want private agencies to delete theirs as well.  I know you said that they would adjust automatically but from what I read this can take some time.  I am already applying for jobs for when I graduate and would like to expedite the process if possible.


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InvisibleCelestial Traveler
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Re: Why pay a lawyer to expunge criminal record? [Re: Celestial Traveler]
    #23588248 - 08/28/16 08:13 PM (7 years, 5 months ago)

Additionally I feel that I might forget some public agencies.  I know that you listed some, but I saw an "example" sheet on www.texaslawhelp.org that had like 12 agencies listed.  This applied to an Austin, TX arrest.  I was arrested elsewhere, so there might be fewer or more agencies than that which I need to list.


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InvisibleEnlilMDiscord
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Re: Why pay a lawyer to expunge criminal record? [Re: Celestial Traveler]
    #23588249 - 08/28/16 08:13 PM (7 years, 5 months ago)

The court can't order that without jurisdiction.


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InvisibleCelestial Traveler
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Re: Why pay a lawyer to expunge criminal record? [Re: Enlil]
    #23588460 - 08/28/16 09:17 PM (7 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

Enlil said:
The court can't order that without jurisdiction.




If that's true, how do you interpret the legitimacy of this offer?

http://www.recordgone.com/expedited-record-clearance-update.htm


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InvisibleEnlilMDiscord
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Re: Why pay a lawyer to expunge criminal record? [Re: Celestial Traveler]
    #23588468 - 08/28/16 09:18 PM (7 years, 5 months ago)

That's not a court.  As I said, the background companies automatically update in time.  Sure, you can pay someone to contact them and speed up the process if you want


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Re: Why pay a lawyer to expunge criminal record? [Re: Celestial Traveler] * 1
    #23661616 - 09/20/16 12:33 PM (7 years, 4 months ago)

Doesn't sound like an advertisement at all.


--------------------
With my face against the floor I can’t see who knocked me out of the way.
I don’t want to get back up but I have to so it might as well be today.
Nothing appeals to me no one feels like me, I’m too busy being calm to disappear.
I’m in no shape to be alone contrary to the shit that you might hear.


You can't wake up, this is not a dream. You're part of a machine, you are not a human being
With your face all made up, living on a screen. Low on self esteem, so you run on gasoline


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Re: Why pay a lawyer to expunge criminal record? [Re: Shroomslip]
    #23662918 - 09/20/16 07:54 PM (7 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

Shroomslip said:
Doesn't sound like an advertisement at all.




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