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Prisoner#1
Even Dumber ThanAdvertized!


Registered: 01/22/03
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Re: So is anyone actually voting for hillary? [Re: hostileuniverse] 3
#23586596 - 08/28/16 11:33 AM (7 years, 5 months ago) |
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they're democrats, they help people
those people happen to be themselves
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Crumist
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Re: So is anyone actually voting for hillary? [Re: qman]
#23586733 - 08/28/16 12:19 PM (7 years, 5 months ago) |
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Quote:
qman said: Why would US citizens want millions of Muslims to migrate to the US? Is there a shortage of labor here? NO.
The TPP isn't "free trade", it's US corporations using slave labor to enhance profit margins at the expense of US workers.
From my understanding of the values of this nation, we are the world's refuge of the religiously oppressed. Believe it or not ISIS is doing a lot of religious oppression, and mainstream Muslims in the area are far more afraid and at much greater risk than we will ever be of violent harm. Let's be very generous and say 10,000 Americans have died of terrorism since 1985 (5000 for Iraq and Afghanistan and 5000 here in the states since 1985, guess how many died of accidental causes in the US just 2013 alone? 130,000! And accidents were only 5% of all deaths that year!
If you think the reduction of protective tariffs isn't free trade (which it is by definition), of which to my understanding mostly a reduction of other nations tariffs. But more than tariffs, it seems like it mostly enforceable labor, corruption, and environmental protections that apply to the other nations far more than to the US. Then there are the extension of US style copyright and US intellectual protections (my least favorite part) to the other nations. This agreement is so in the U.S.'s favor other nations are protesting in fear of cheap US goods flooding their markets (don't forget we an agricultural powerhouse) and gouging by US pharma. There are many criticisms to be made, but the ones I hear don't ever sound like they're related to the actual content.
No, it doesn't address currency manipulation, but China isn't even party.
-------------------- 'I am all for resources being allocated to the widowed single mother of 3, lost husband over seas fighting for our country. I am for vets getting mental health access and resources following war. I am not for free money cause a woman can't close her legs or some chump with low testosterone no going to work cause "i'm sad."' -finalexplosion Nice knowin ya'll! https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/23904704/vc/1#23904704
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Prisoner#1
Even Dumber ThanAdvertized!


Registered: 01/22/03
Posts: 193,665
Loc: Pvt. Pubfag NutSuck
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Re: So is anyone actually voting for hillary? [Re: Crumist]
#23586831 - 08/28/16 12:47 PM (7 years, 5 months ago) |
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Quote:
Crumist said: If you think the reduction of protective tariffs isn't free trade (which it is by definition)
free trade would be a two way street, NAFTA didnt give us that, what it did give us is a lit of shitty fir lumber out of canada being imported to the US while the pine lumber that was actually more rot resistant, harder and better to build with hasnt been getting shipped to canada and has pretty much disappeared in the lumberyards in the US other than southern yellow pine
NAFTA also allowed US automakers to move more facilities out of the US while importing the products without duties, this cheaper labor and duty free status didnt bring down the prices of cars and trucks
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California
A E S T H E T I C S A T A N


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Posts: 72,118
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Re: So is anyone actually voting for hillary? [Re: Prisoner#1] 1
#23586839 - 08/28/16 12:48 PM (7 years, 5 months ago) |
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You will have plenty of time to vote for Trump... ...when you're living in a van down by the river.
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specialpeopleclub



Registered: 04/10/14
Posts: 5,584
Loc: Mitten
Last seen: 3 years, 7 months
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Re: So is anyone actually voting for hillary? [Re: California]
#23586853 - 08/28/16 12:51 PM (7 years, 5 months ago) |
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voting for evil is voting for evil.
the two parties are dictators, the american people are complicit
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qman
Stranger

Registered: 12/06/06
Posts: 34,927
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Re: So is anyone actually voting for hillary? [Re: Crumist]
#23586878 - 08/28/16 12:57 PM (7 years, 5 months ago) |
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Quote:
Crumist said:
Quote:
qman said: Why would US citizens want millions of Muslims to migrate to the US? Is there a shortage of labor here? NO.
The TPP isn't "free trade", it's US corporations using slave labor to enhance profit margins at the expense of US workers.
From my understanding of the values of this nation, we are the world's refuge of the religiously oppressed. Believe it or not ISIS is doing a lot of religious oppression, and mainstream Muslims in the area are far more afraid and at much greater risk than we will ever be of violent harm. Let's be very generous and say 10,000 Americans have died of terrorism since 1985 (5000 for Iraq and Afghanistan and 5000 here in the states since 1985, guess how many died of accidental causes in the US just 2013 alone? 130,000! And accidents were only 5% of all deaths that year!
If you think the reduction of protective tariffs isn't free trade (which it is by definition), of which to my understanding mostly a reduction of other nations tariffs. But more than tariffs, it seems like it mostly enforceable labor, corruption, and environmental protections that apply to the other nations far more than to the US. Then there are the extension of US style copyright and US intellectual protections (my least favorite part) to the other nations. This agreement is so in the U.S.'s favor other nations are protesting in fear of cheap US goods flooding their markets (don't forget we an agricultural powerhouse) and gouging by US pharma. There are many criticisms to be made, but the ones I hear don't ever sound like they're related to the actual content.
No, it doesn't address currency manipulation, but China isn't even party.
"we are the world's refuge of the religiously oppressed"
That's not true, the US can't even take care of tens of millions of their own citizens, we can't afford to take care of migrants.
TPP is in favor of US corporations, not US citizens, BIG DIFFERENCE!!!
"It doesn't address currency manipulation"
That's true and that's why it can't be called "free trade".
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Great Scott
Trigger Lover


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Re: So is anyone actually voting for hillary? [Re: qman] 2
#23590339 - 08/29/16 02:55 PM (7 years, 4 months ago) |
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Crumist
Stranger


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Re: So is anyone actually voting for hillary? [Re: qman]
#23590799 - 08/29/16 05:01 PM (7 years, 4 months ago) |
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Quote:
qman said: "we are the world's refuge of the religiously oppressed"
That's not true, the US can't even take care of tens of millions of their own citizens, we can't afford to take care of migrants.
TPP is in favor of US corporations, not US citizens, BIG DIFFERENCE!!!
"It doesn't address currency manipulation"
That's true and that's why it can't be called "free trade".
The USA's status in the world was much lower back in the 1860s and 1920s when immigration reached peaks. These immigrants and the first few generations became leaders and inventors resulting in the back-payment of any public investment in them by several-fold.
"Free trade" has a definition. "Free trade is a policy followed by some international markets in which countries' governments do not restrict imports from, or exports to, other countries. (wikipedia, ctrl+F 'currency' yields 0 results)" At least that similar to the definition most of the world works off of. If you and Mr. Trump would like to suggest a new one, by all means do so.
-------------------- 'I am all for resources being allocated to the widowed single mother of 3, lost husband over seas fighting for our country. I am for vets getting mental health access and resources following war. I am not for free money cause a woman can't close her legs or some chump with low testosterone no going to work cause "i'm sad."' -finalexplosion Nice knowin ya'll! https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/23904704/vc/1#23904704
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qman
Stranger

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Re: So is anyone actually voting for hillary? [Re: Crumist]
#23590824 - 08/29/16 05:10 PM (7 years, 4 months ago) |
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Quote:
Crumist said:
Quote:
qman said: "we are the world's refuge of the religiously oppressed"
That's not true, the US can't even take care of tens of millions of their own citizens, we can't afford to take care of migrants.
TPP is in favor of US corporations, not US citizens, BIG DIFFERENCE!!!
"It doesn't address currency manipulation"
That's true and that's why it can't be called "free trade".
The USA's status in the world was much lower back in the 1860s and 1920s when immigration reached peaks. These immigrants and the first few generations became leaders and inventors resulting in the back-payment of any public investment in them by several-fold.
"Free trade" has a definition. "Free trade is a policy followed by some international markets in which countries' governments do not restrict imports from, or exports to, other countries. (wikipedia, ctrl+F 'currency' yields 0 results)" At least that similar to the definition most of the world works off of. If you and Mr. Trump would like to suggest a new one, by all means do so.
So a US success story after the 1920's means immigration is a proven fact regardless of economic conditions? Correlation is NOT causation.
The term "free trade" has been hijacked by the elite, most people don't understand that you can NOT have free trade when you don't let currencies trade in a free and open market, why is that so difficult to understand?
The people that promote this "free trade" never mention how the currencies involved are NOT allowed to trade? Why is that?
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California
A E S T H E T I C S A T A N


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Re: So is anyone actually voting for hillary? [Re: qman]
#23590832 - 08/29/16 05:12 PM (7 years, 4 months ago) |
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But are you actually going to vote for Hillary?
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Crumist
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Re: So is anyone actually voting for hillary? [Re: qman]
#23590888 - 08/29/16 05:29 PM (7 years, 4 months ago) |
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Quote:
qman said: So a US success story after the 1920's means immigration is a proven fact regardless of economic conditions? Correlation is NOT causation.
I didn't say immigration caused our success (though that argument can be made). My point was that we can afford taking on refugees (not that they tend to "cost" much of anything) as we are better off now than we were then.
Quote:
The term "free trade" has been hijacked by the elite, most people don't understand that you can NOT have free trade when you don't let currencies trade in a free and open market, why is that so difficult to understand?
The people that promote this "free trade" never mention how the currencies involved are NOT allowed to trade? Why is that?
International trade theory tends to be pretty arcane stuff. You claim that the definition of free trade has been hijacked, but also that your definition is the true one and the masses don't understand? What do you mean by restrictions on currency exchange? China devalues the Yuan by buying USD with said Yuan. Were we to restrict this we would stop the manipulation.
-------------------- 'I am all for resources being allocated to the widowed single mother of 3, lost husband over seas fighting for our country. I am for vets getting mental health access and resources following war. I am not for free money cause a woman can't close her legs or some chump with low testosterone no going to work cause "i'm sad."' -finalexplosion Nice knowin ya'll! https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/23904704/vc/1#23904704
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qman
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Re: So is anyone actually voting for hillary? [Re: Crumist]
#23591069 - 08/29/16 06:15 PM (7 years, 4 months ago) |
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Quote:
Crumist said:
Quote:
qman said: So a US success story after the 1920's means immigration is a proven fact regardless of economic conditions? Correlation is NOT causation.
I didn't say immigration caused our success (though that argument can be made). My point was that we can afford taking on refugees (not that they tend to "cost" much of anything) as we are better off now than we were then.
Quote:
The term "free trade" has been hijacked by the elite, most people don't understand that you can NOT have free trade when you don't let currencies trade in a free and open market, why is that so difficult to understand?
The people that promote this "free trade" never mention how the currencies involved are NOT allowed to trade? Why is that?
International trade theory tends to be pretty arcane stuff. You claim that the definition of free trade has been hijacked, but also that your definition is the true one and the masses don't understand? What do you mean by restrictions on currency exchange? China devalues the Yuan by buying USD with said Yuan. Were we to restrict this we would stop the manipulation.
"we can afford taking on refugees"
No we can't, we are $20 trillion in debt and we don't have the jobs available for them like we did for European immigrants 100 years ago, big difference.
The Yuan needs to trade freely, it's a fixed exchange rate and that's unacceptable. We should never have trade deficits with China, never mind a $365 billion deficit in 2015. That means we don't have free trade.
http://www.investopedia.com/articles/forex/09/chinas-peg- to-the-dollar.asp
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Shroomopotamus
Happy Mushrooming



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Posts: 18,757
Loc: Funkotron
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Re: So is anyone actually voting for hillary? [Re: qman]
#23633540 - 09/10/16 06:56 PM (7 years, 4 months ago) |
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-------------------- * Live by the mushroom, die by the mushroom
    This is a trap! A trap! You are all busted! Busted! You fools!
If a time comes where I fail to appear I've been abducted and I will miss you all Please smile and pet puppies as often as possible Be happy Be nice (<3);}
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Crumist
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Re: So is anyone actually voting for hillary? [Re: Shroomopotamus]
#23633601 - 09/10/16 07:26 PM (7 years, 4 months ago) |
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Result #3 under news: Snopes says bullshit.
Im sure Sanders received plenty of death threats, just as Clinton and Trump and Obama and anyone half controversial does. Their aides sift through for threats, bombs, and extreme hate mail, call the popo if necessary then move on with their day
-------------------- 'I am all for resources being allocated to the widowed single mother of 3, lost husband over seas fighting for our country. I am for vets getting mental health access and resources following war. I am not for free money cause a woman can't close her legs or some chump with low testosterone no going to work cause "i'm sad."' -finalexplosion Nice knowin ya'll! https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/23904704/vc/1#23904704
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koods
Ribbit



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Re: So is anyone actually voting for hillary? [Re: Shroomopotamus]
#23633603 - 09/10/16 07:27 PM (7 years, 4 months ago) |
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Don't vote for Hillary she has a cold.
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NotSheekle said “if I believed she was 16 I would become unattracted to her”
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Webster10
Up like Trump



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Re: So is anyone actually voting for hillary? [Re: koods]
#23633608 - 09/10/16 07:28 PM (7 years, 4 months ago) |
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pirate-blues


Registered: 10/15/12
Posts: 13,656
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Re: So is anyone actually voting for hillary? [Re: Shroomopotamus]
#23633636 - 09/10/16 07:41 PM (7 years, 4 months ago) |
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He obviously was put under immense pressure to resign from the race, it was made very public. Ultimately I suspect he gave into that when he endorsed her, but I do also think that he got sucked into the us vs. them thing, knew he couldn't win, and didn't want to see his followers flock to Trump more than him not wanting hildog in power. At this point nothing would shock me though.
Honestly the fact that someone(a DNC staffer)was murdered directly in the wake of the DNC email leaks is very unsettling. A supposed robbery gone wrong where nothing was taken - I can believe that it could be a horrible coincidence, and I don't think it's odd that the robbers panicked after shooting him and ran, there was definitely a struggle, and it's possible he had attempted to keep his stuff(the same exact thing happened to a girl I knew, but she survived the gunshot wound) - however I think if someone had a hit on him then they would also want it to look like a robbery gone wrong and not just drive by and shoot the guy randomly.
The Clintons have a lot of blood on their hands, a lot of it we know about in other countries - but I think they have a lot more on home turf that we don't know about too. Very dangerous people.
I cannot justify voting for either Trump or Clinton. I just can't. I do hope that the race goes to Clinton over Trump because she at least doesn't think that global warming is a Chinese hoax and while I think she has done evil things and is a very dangerous person, I do absolutely think climate change is the biggest immediate threat towards mankind and I think in the long run if we do not act now - or worse go backwards on our attitudes towards the environment and expanding green technology and research then there will be far more lives lost. There's already some scientists who have theorized that the 2013 Arab spring was triggered by the effects of climate change(amongst many other things, but the straw that broke the camel's back, here's a very interesting read on more of that https://www.americanprogress.org/issues/security/report/2013/02/28/54579/the-arab-spring-and-climate-change/).
Even my parents who tend to vote for republicans(they're socially VERY liberal people, listen to NPR watch John Oliver all that shit, just fiscally conservative and in the income bracket that is disproportionately taxed by far the most and do not trust our current government with things like healthcare and while ideologically they believe in it, they have very sound reasoning in their logic with the current people in power. I agree with them but lean left on the hopes that we stop electing idiots and change the system from the bottom up to accommodate a more progressive agenda so it's implemented right ) and they know he'll be a disaster. They would both vote Hillary over Trump, but I reckon they'll go third party too because they hate her as well.
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tyrannicalrex
Strange R



Registered: 04/24/03
Posts: 38,323
Loc: subtropics
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Re: So is anyone actually voting for hillary? [Re: pirate-blues]
#23634589 - 09/11/16 01:49 AM (7 years, 4 months ago) |
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suppose the dems and repubs are both distractions and this all just a ruse to get the third party in for the first time!
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Great Scott
Trigger Lover


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Re: So is anyone actually voting for hillary? [Re: tyrannicalrex]
#23634678 - 09/11/16 03:30 AM (7 years, 4 months ago) |
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The 3rd parties are polling around 10%. Are you expecting a miraculous last minute surge? 
That's an interesting conspiracy theory you got there tho.
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tyrannicalrex
Strange R



Registered: 04/24/03
Posts: 38,323
Loc: subtropics
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Re: So is anyone actually voting for hillary? [Re: Great Scott]
#23634708 - 09/11/16 04:11 AM (7 years, 4 months ago) |
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something to ponder in your spare time. came to me today around lunch time.
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