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PsilocyBen17
Pin Pornographer


Registered: 10/20/13
Posts: 3,751
Last seen: 1 year, 1 month
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Why Pollyfill is a Waste of Time....
#23544186 - 08/15/16 01:57 PM (7 years, 5 months ago) |
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Hi All,
I thought I'd share my observations on Polyfill vs. SFD's as filters. I'll give you some background first.
Recently a friend and I started growing oyster to sell to local restaurants. This plan got kiboshed due to lack of space, but left me with 24 unninoculated jars. I decided to let them sit while I put my edible strains away for long term storage...
All 24 jars were prepped on the same date in the same way and sterilized for a 90 minute cycle. The only difference is the filters.
He had prepped 12 jars with Polyfill filters and I had prepped 12 with propper SFDs. A month later here are the results:
 
Despite never being opened the Pollyfilled jars are overrun with trich.
On the other hand the jars with SFDs still look great and I expect I can use them later:
 
Interestingly, even my P. Tampensis jars inoculated with a clean agar wedge on 5/21/16 are overrun with trich, despite clean colonization 10 days after inoculating:

 I suspect this is because there are so many contams coming through the filter that they were able to overtake the myc.
This would mean that even when spawn appears clean there is probably a shitload of contams sitting on the surface that will show up during the spawn run.
From now on I won't be using anything but SFDs. The more time I spend in this hobby the more I realize that "shortcuts" can turn into more work in the end...
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Rooster Cogburn
Ranger

Registered: 07/19/16
Posts: 265
Last seen: 7 years, 2 months
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Re: Why Pollyfill is a Waste of Time.... [Re: PsilocyBen17]
#23544209 - 08/15/16 02:05 PM (7 years, 5 months ago) |
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I don't know, I use SFD's because you flop em on top of the lid and screw the ring on, however when I was new grower I ran so many jars with poly lids with horrible technique and had plenty of success, I used to even inoculate them through the poly with a syringe. Im suspecting the poly isn't stuffed super tight, which is a bitch enough to not do it properly, I remember stuffing those little holes one night and said fuck this shit and ordered enough SFD's to last a lifetime, though I only use them now for masters and do my expanding in bags.
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Maximillion
Me



Registered: 07/21/15
Posts: 268
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Re: Why Pollyfill is a Waste of Time.... [Re: PsilocyBen17]
#23544222 - 08/15/16 02:09 PM (7 years, 5 months ago) |
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Quote:
PsilocyBen17 said: Hi All,
I thought I'd share my observations on Polyfill vs. SFD's as filters. I'll give you some background first.
Recently a friend and I started growing oyster to sell to local restaurants. This plan got kiboshed due to lack of space, but left me with 24 unninoculated jars. I decided to let them sit while I put my edible strains away for long term storage...
All 24 jars were prepped on the same date in the same way and sterilized for a 90 minute cycle. The only difference is the filters.
He had prepped 12 jars with Polyfill filters and I had prepped 12 with propper SFDs. A month later here are the results:
 
Despite never being opened the Pollyfilled jars are overrun with trich.
On the other hand the jars with SFDs still look great and I expect I can use them later:
 
Interestingly, even my P. Tampensis jars inoculated with a clean agar wedge on 5/21/16 are overrun with trich, despite clean colonization 10 days after inoculating:

 I suspect this is because there are so many contams coming through the filter that they were able to overtake the myc.
This would mean that even when spawn appears clean there is probably a shitload of contams sitting on the surface that will show up during the spawn run.
From now on I won't be using anything but SFDs. The more time I spend in this hobby the more I realize that "shortcuts" can turn into more work in the end...
That's gnarly. Lol. I must have extremely good luck. Trich hasn't struck me yet and I usually toss my subs before anything can take them over. Swear to god though I haven't even been using poly or sfd. I just have a single hole in all my lids. Now that being said I'm making the switch because obviously they need a filter barrier, but I just wanted to share my luck haha.
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cronicr



Registered: 08/07/11
Posts: 61,436
Loc: Van Isle
Last seen: 2 years, 9 days
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Re: Why Pollyfill is a Waste of Time.... [Re: Maximillion]
#23544293 - 08/15/16 02:36 PM (7 years, 5 months ago) |
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I've done thousands of jars with poly
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  It doesn't matter what i think of you...all that matters is clean spawn I'm tired do me a favor
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GreenRabbit
Plutonium Pollinator



Registered: 04/28/13
Posts: 2,667
Loc: In a forest
Last seen: 2 years, 3 months
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Re: Why Pollyfill is a Waste of Time.... [Re: cronicr]
#23544302 - 08/15/16 02:41 PM (7 years, 5 months ago) |
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Besides that^^^^ I'm just gonna throw this out
I had 18 jars colonizing. Half had SFDs, half had tyvek filters. The only 2 that contaminated had SFDs.
Just one experience. It proves nothing.
I think tyvek, poly, and SFDs can all work well. I do prefer SFDs still.
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theGODSmademedoit

Registered: 03/04/16
Posts: 516
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Re: Why Pollyfill is a Waste of Time.... [Re: GreenRabbit]
#23544316 - 08/15/16 02:49 PM (7 years, 5 months ago) |
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say it aint so , i love poly that shit is so cheap and easy to come by. Im sticking with it for those reasons.
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Greg
always learning




Registered: 10/28/15
Posts: 1,536
Loc: an autoclave
Last seen: 3 months, 3 days
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Just ordered 30 SFDs. I've had luck with them in the past whereas polyfill has caused lots of bacterial issues for me. It's kind of a crapshoot I've noticed.
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h0ldthedoor
HODOR



Registered: 06/25/16
Posts: 510
Loc: North of The Wall
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Re: Why Pollyfill is a Waste of Time.... [Re: Greg]
#23544334 - 08/15/16 02:56 PM (7 years, 5 months ago) |
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Quote:
Greg said: Just ordered 30 SFDs. I've had luck with them in the past whereas polyfill has caused lots of bacterial issues for me. It's kind of a crapshoot I've noticed.
Could have used the polyfil already on hand to make your own SFD's
https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/19938845#19938845
--------------------
Always keep your foes confused. If they are never certain who you are or what you want, they cannot know what you are like to do next. Sometimes the best way to baffle them is to make moves that have no purpose, or even seem to work against you. – Petyr Baelish
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Greg
always learning




Registered: 10/28/15
Posts: 1,536
Loc: an autoclave
Last seen: 3 months, 3 days
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Re: Why Pollyfill is a Waste of Time.... [Re: h0ldthedoor]
#23544342 - 08/15/16 02:59 PM (7 years, 5 months ago) |
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Quote:
h0ldthedoor said: Could have used the polyfil already on hand to make your own SFD's
https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/19938845#19938845
Damn, wish I would have noticed that before making the order.
I guess I can try both this way though! Thanks for the link.
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blackout


Registered: 07/16/00
Posts: 5,266
Last seen: 2 months, 25 days
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Quote:
Rooster Cogburn said: Im suspecting the poly isn't stuffed super tight,
There is not a lot of poly protruding out the top either. I liken it to the verm layer on PF jars, it has to be a certain depth to prevent contams making it all the way down as it does not have the micron rating as filters. I would compare it to having a sieve with holes 1mm wide, if you dropped polystyrene balls 0.9mm diameter into it many would pass through, if you had 50 sieves stacked up far less would make it all the way through. Balls only 0.5mm might not make it all the way down.
This is what I am more used to seeing.

I have not used polyfil but have used sponges with success and would have a lot of sponge on the outside and inside.
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bodhisatta 
Smurf real estate agent


Registered: 04/30/13
Posts: 61,889
Loc: Milky way
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Re: Why Pollyfill is a Waste of Time.... [Re: cronicr]
#23544360 - 08/15/16 03:04 PM (7 years, 5 months ago) |
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Quote:
cronicr said: I've done thousands of jars with poly
Maybe not 1000 here but it works it has to be tighter. Polyfil is my second choice only to SFDs I would go back to poly if I had to make more lids
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tripdawg420
low life with no life



Registered: 02/02/09
Posts: 7,071
Loc: illinois
Last seen: 16 hours, 55 minutes
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Re: Why Pollyfill is a Waste of Time.... [Re: bodhisatta]
#23544416 - 08/15/16 03:27 PM (7 years, 5 months ago) |
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ive used alot of poly lids but ya sfd ftw
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Inocuole
Scalpel of Evil's Bane



Registered: 11/21/11
Posts: 24,863
Loc: ★
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Re: Why Pollyfill is a Waste of Time.... [Re: tripdawg420] 1
#23544462 - 08/15/16 03:47 PM (7 years, 5 months ago) |
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Soooo Ben how you feeling about your post now?
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PsilocyBen17
Pin Pornographer


Registered: 10/20/13
Posts: 3,751
Last seen: 1 year, 1 month
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Re: Why Pollyfill is a Waste of Time.... [Re: Inocuole]
#23544577 - 08/15/16 04:38 PM (7 years, 5 months ago) |
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Not feeling any younger. Thats for sure.
I think you said it best....Its way too easy to get the right tools for the job. When it comes to mushroom cultivation, you can't beat something that is designed for mushroom cultivation.
Sucks I had to learn the hard way, but I'm glad I learned. I'll be using SFDs from now on.
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cronicr



Registered: 08/07/11
Posts: 61,436
Loc: Van Isle
Last seen: 2 years, 9 days
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Re: Why Pollyfill is a Waste of Time.... [Re: PsilocyBen17] 1
#23544928 - 08/15/16 06:24 PM (7 years, 5 months ago) |
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Fuck it all get bags ya won't regret it lol
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  It doesn't matter what i think of you...all that matters is clean spawn I'm tired do me a favor
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Mad Season
hookers and blackjack



Registered: 09/16/12
Posts: 12,666
Loc: Canada
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Re: Why Pollyfill is a Waste of Time.... [Re: cronicr]
#23545292 - 08/15/16 08:30 PM (7 years, 5 months ago) |
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bags
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PsilocyBen17
Pin Pornographer


Registered: 10/20/13
Posts: 3,751
Last seen: 1 year, 1 month
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Re: Why Pollyfill is a Waste of Time.... [Re: Mad Season]
#23546113 - 08/16/16 06:47 AM (7 years, 5 months ago) |
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How many bags can you guys do in a pc? Whats the bags vs. jars ratio? Lol. Do you NEED a heat sealer. Cant afford it right now but it does sound nice not to have crates and crates of jars around....drives the gf nuts.
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blindingleaf
blue collar underworld


Registered: 07/19/13
Posts: 22,008
Loc: sub-surface unseen
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Re: Why Pollyfill is a Waste of Time.... [Re: PsilocyBen17]
#23546131 - 08/16/16 07:02 AM (7 years, 5 months ago) |
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sealers are like $20, not pricey.
u don't need one, but if that flow hood in ur signature is still in commission, they are 110% worth it compared to zip ties IMO.
Bags are amazing man, especially with a hood. I maybe have 24 jars total.
in a 921, u can fit 4 bags at 5-6 qts each, and 6 bags at 3.5-4qts each.
the downside is waste stream. the upside is grain volume consolidation and space saving, and every filter is brand new every time (unless u reuse the bags, which some do i think).
they have their own set of problems (namely pinholes and occasional sealing problems if the top of bag is wet), but nothing u won't quickly figure out in time as u work with them.
-------------------- A few thoughts on cultivation MICROBIAL HUSBANDRY!!!! The whole is greater than the sum of its parts
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36fuckin5
Alchemycologist


Registered: 08/11/03
Posts: 12,079
Loc: Diving into Mystical Territori...
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Re: Why Pollyfill is a Waste of Time.... [Re: cronicr]
#23546638 - 08/16/16 11:40 AM (7 years, 5 months ago) |
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Quote:
cronicr said: I've done thousands of jars with poly
This. If it's not working, it needs to be tighter. IME, if you can inoculate through it, it's not tight enough.
-------------------- Redd Foxx said: If you're offended I don't give a shit and don't come see me no more. Pat The Bunny said: A punk rock song won't ever change the world, but I can tell you about a couple that changed me. bodhisatta said: i recommend common sense and figuring it out. These are the TEKs I use. They're all as cheap and easy as possible, just like your mom.
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PsilocyBen17
Pin Pornographer


Registered: 10/20/13
Posts: 3,751
Last seen: 1 year, 1 month
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Re: Why Pollyfill is a Waste of Time.... [Re: 36fuckin5]
#23546737 - 08/16/16 12:25 PM (7 years, 5 months ago) |
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good tip, thanks kindly.
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