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Mateja


Registered: 07/14/16
Posts: 7,948
Loc: Here
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Re: Cultivation General Discussion [Re: van hatton]
#25539813 - 10/15/18 04:07 PM (5 years, 3 months ago) |
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Quote:
stareatclouds said: Of course it does. It's a living organism that requires oxygen, brah.
I did a LC experiment once where I didn't swirl or do anything to them, they ran until they fully colonized the LC, then shortly after they all colonized the surface and they all pinned. This makes me wonder if it's really necessary to swirl to provide oxygen?
They do breathe oxygen but I don't think they breathe in the amount the we imagine most of the time.
-------------------- Cakes inside Water Tub
Edited by Mateja (10/15/18 04:10 PM)
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JHOVA
Post whore


Registered: 02/17/17
Posts: 4,727
Loc:
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Re: Cultivation General Discussion [Re: Mateja]
#25539824 - 10/15/18 04:09 PM (5 years, 3 months ago) |
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You can make LC with a non filtered lid. Theres enough air in the jar.
-------------------- 🅃 🄴 🄰 🄼 🄲 🄻 🄸 🄽 🄶 🅆 🅁 🄰 🄿
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Mateja


Registered: 07/14/16
Posts: 7,948
Loc: Here
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Re: Cultivation General Discussion [Re: JHOVA]
#25539828 - 10/15/18 04:11 PM (5 years, 3 months ago) |
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You mean there's enough oxygen in the water? Remember my LC jars never got swirled so 5he water was completely still 100% of the time. I honestly handled them so carefully as to not disturb anything in the LC and not to create any type of turbulence in the LC or the air inside.
This is how every LC in that experiential ended up
Edited by Mateja (10/15/18 04:14 PM)
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00Burnout
That one guy



Registered: 05/02/16
Posts: 2,186
Loc: Ozarks
Last seen: 6 months, 21 days
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Re: Cultivation General Discussion [Re: Mateja]
#25539836 - 10/15/18 04:14 PM (5 years, 3 months ago) |
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Probably not necessary, but I'm sure it helps. I know using a stir bar gives outstanding results, but maybe that has more to do with constantly breaking the mycelium apart than oxygenation.
-------------------- Peace, pot and microdot! No amount of progress has ever been made in the way of man without challenging the things we think we understand.-00Burnout Ghetto Greenhouse Trade List https://psychedelia.space
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bodhisatta 
Smurf real estate agent


Registered: 04/30/13
Posts: 61,889
Loc: Milky way
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Re: Cultivation General Discussion [Re: Mateja]
#25539838 - 10/15/18 04:14 PM (5 years, 3 months ago) |
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If you put an oxygen indicator like potassium metal in degassed mineral oil after a couple of hours you'll start to see potassium oxide and potassium superoxide form on the metal from oxygen from the atmosphere diffusing through the oil. With water this happens much more rapidly. Without swirling on contact with air you get something like 1ppm o2 in solution.
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stareatclouds
star eat clouds?



Registered: 09/29/14
Posts: 9,887
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Re: Cultivation General Discussion [Re: JHOVA]
#25539912 - 10/15/18 04:48 PM (5 years, 3 months ago) |
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Quote:
JHOVA said: You can make LC with a non filtered lid. Theres enough air in the jar.
It won't stall from CO2 buildup?
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JHOVA
Post whore


Registered: 02/17/17
Posts: 4,727
Loc:
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It worked for me i just shook it every once in a while.
-------------------- 🅃 🄴 🄰 🄼 🄲 🄻 🄸 🄽 🄶 🅆 🅁 🄰 🄿
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Mateja


Registered: 07/14/16
Posts: 7,948
Loc: Here
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Re: Cultivation General Discussion [Re: JHOVA]
#25539984 - 10/15/18 05:22 PM (5 years, 3 months ago) |
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I guarantee that my BRF jars get Zero GE cause I really pack it down with verm barrier then the first piece lid clamps down (rubber side DOWN) then the other (full lid, not just ring) clamps down. I don't believe BRF jars will stall ever cause of lack of GE
-------------------- Cakes inside Water Tub
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Munchauzen


Registered: 06/22/11
Posts: 14,342
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Re: Cultivation General Discussion [Re: van hatton] 1
#25540110 - 10/15/18 06:20 PM (5 years, 3 months ago) |
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Quote:
van hatton said: Just switched to telephone brand.
How the hell do you guys manage to mess with agar that thick. I'm to the point where I'm doing 1g per 100ml and it's still harder than it was when I was doing 1.5gs to 100ml with my old agar.
Tf
recently experienced this myself. my pucks were solid bricks. had to reduce the amount drastically.
Quote:
Mateah said: I guarantee that my BRF jars get Zero GE cause I really pack it down with verm barrier then the first piece lid clamps down (rubber side DOWN) then the other (full lid, not just ring) clamps down. I don't believe BRF jars will stall ever cause of lack of GE 
wheres the tek
Edited by Munchauzen (10/15/18 07:33 PM)
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space_shrooms

Registered: 05/04/17
Posts: 438
Last seen: 5 months, 2 days
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Re: Cultivation General Discussion [Re: JHOVA]
#25540114 - 10/15/18 06:21 PM (5 years, 3 months ago) |
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Sweet I figured LC would be fine without GE filter as there is enough oxygen in there and LC is used relatively quickly after innoculating. Kind of like a monotub will colonize and start pinning when it’s totally sealed as there is enough air in there for it to get that far (I note that is outdated tek but it demonstrates that GE is not required for colonization as there’s enough oxygen in the empty space).
Pros of no GE filter on LC bottle - no messing around with lids, can shake the hell out of it, clean and simple
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stareatclouds
star eat clouds?



Registered: 09/29/14
Posts: 9,887
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Re: Cultivation General Discussion [Re: Mateja]
#25540220 - 10/15/18 07:03 PM (5 years, 3 months ago) |
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Quote:
space_shrooms said: Sweet I figured LC would be fine without GE filter as there is enough oxygen in there and LC is used relatively quickly after innoculating. Kind of like a monotub will colonize and start pinning when it’s totally sealed as there is enough air in there for it to get that far (I note that is outdated tek but it demonstrates that GE is not required for colonization as there’s enough oxygen in the empty space).
An LC sits around for a decent amount of time. And that's not at all how monotubs work as they aren't sealed at all. The lids absolutely allow for GE even on an unmodified tub.
Quote:
Mateah said: I guarantee that my BRF jars get Zero GE cause I really pack it down with verm barrier then the first piece lid clamps down (rubber side DOWN) then the other (full lid, not just ring) clamps down. I don't believe BRF jars will stall ever cause of lack of GE 
You're using a verm barrier and 2 lids?
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space_shrooms

Registered: 05/04/17
Posts: 438
Last seen: 5 months, 2 days
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Yea you’re right a tub is much less airtight than a Pyrex bottle. I’m going to try it anyway. I usually use LC about two weeks after making it.
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stareatclouds
star eat clouds?



Registered: 09/29/14
Posts: 9,887
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A tub isn't airtight at all. Go ahead and try it and post the results. I'm interested. I'm sure it's possible certain configurations won't produce enough CO2 to stall out a culture.
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Mateja


Registered: 07/14/16
Posts: 7,948
Loc: Here
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Quote:
Munchauzen said:
Quote:
Mateah said: I guarantee that my BRF jars get Zero GE cause I really pack it down with verm barrier then the first piece lid clamps down (rubber side DOWN) then the other (full lid, not just ring) clamps down. I don't believe BRF jars will stall ever cause of lack of GE 
wheres the tek
PF Tek? isn't this how BRF cakes are made?
Quote:
stareatclouds said: I guarantee that my BRF jars get Zero GE cause I really pack it down with verm barrier then the first piece lid clamps down (rubber side DOWN) then the other (full lid, not just ring) clamps down. I don't believe BRF jars will stall ever cause of lack of GE 
You're using a verm barrier and 2 lids?
If I didn't use both lids and a verm barrier then after I lift the lid the BRF substrate is exposed and then I'd have to simply stab it from above with the syringe and that seems very wrong
The first piece lid is just that, has 4 small inoculation holes and then the second lid is screwed on top of that to keep it secured.
I do it how pretty much how PF Tek instructs. The only difference is that I keep the rubbed band down to make the first piece sit secured on the jar. Since there are 4 small inoculation holes on top of the lid then it won't create vacuum in the PC. Flipping the first piece lid rubber side down is pretty much the only difference from PF.
-------------------- Cakes inside Water Tub
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stareatclouds
star eat clouds?



Registered: 09/29/14
Posts: 9,887
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Re: Cultivation General Discussion [Re: Mateja]
#25540476 - 10/15/18 08:56 PM (5 years, 3 months ago) |
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I've only done PF Tek once ever when I first started, but I don't remember any decent Tek instructing someone to use 2 different lids. It's always been dry verm barrier and a lid with 4 small inoculation holes with optional MP tape. And all PF Tek guides have holes for GE.
I have no idea what you're actually describing. You don't ever lift or remove the lid in PF Tek from what I remember. You inject through the holes in the single lid you use. And you don't have to flip the lid upside down, either. I didn't and I got 23/24 jars without contamination from vendor syringes without a PC. 
Do you think maybe the extra shit you're always doing is the reason you have so much contamination?
Edit: last comment was not a diss or anything. But I feel like you're often describing unnecessary methods of MC and seem to have lots of stuff go bad.
Edited by stareatclouds (10/15/18 09:03 PM)
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Mateja


Registered: 07/14/16
Posts: 7,948
Loc: Here
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Like what "extra shit I'm always doing"?
I'll snap some photos of my BRF jars design and I bet it will become clear as day to you!
Wait.. is that you always trying to give me shit for something? Implying I don't take this hobby 'serious'
-------------------- Cakes inside Water Tub
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mushboy
modboy



Registered: 04/24/05
Posts: 32,281
Loc: where?
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Re: Cultivation General Discussion [Re: Mateja]
#25540504 - 10/15/18 09:06 PM (5 years, 3 months ago) |
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2 lids on a pf jar?
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stareatclouds
star eat clouds?



Registered: 09/29/14
Posts: 9,887
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Re: Cultivation General Discussion [Re: Mateja]
#25540511 - 10/15/18 09:09 PM (5 years, 3 months ago) |
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Well adding an extra lid on top of the verm barrier for PF Tek seems unnecessary since it totally is. And again, I've never heard of that being standard practice, but maybe things have changed on the archaic and established Tek that I did once 4 years ago? You also peel off contaminated subs instead of tossing them, which is poor practice as well.
No, and I've never implied or said you don't take the hobby serious. To be honest, I don't care if people take their own hobby serious or not. We're all in this for different reasons. But this board is to help others grow mushrooms optimally, IMO. And it just seems like I've seen you describe non-standard ways to grow mushrooms on multiple occasions, sometimes claiming it's because you're a scientist or some shit. And the other day you said you might've finally hit your first 100% clean grow (congrats, by the way). Just saying maybe if it takes you 2 years to finally hit a 100% clean grow, maybe the methods need a bit of tinkering with?
I'm not trying to give you shit. I don't care to make you feel bad about anything or point out your contaminations or anything. It does nothing for me and I enjoy helping people on here get better at this hobby if I'm able to. It seems like you're cool with your own methods, though, and that's fine. To each their own.
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Mateja


Registered: 07/14/16
Posts: 7,948
Loc: Here
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Like I said everything will become clear as day to you when I post pics. On my way home from work now!
BTW it was only ONE (1) time I 'peeled' off overgrown myc that covered all the pins on this substrate once and this resulted in a full flush for me and one after that as well. Wauw you are really trying youre best to Stare as always 
And When did a claim I was a scientist?
-------------------- Cakes inside Water Tub
Edited by Mateja (10/15/18 09:17 PM)
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stareatclouds
star eat clouds?



Registered: 09/29/14
Posts: 9,887
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Re: Cultivation General Discussion [Re: Mateja]
#25540566 - 10/15/18 09:26 PM (5 years, 3 months ago) |
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Quote:
Mateah said: Like I said everything will become clear as day to you when I post pics. On my way home from work now!
Right. I'm just saying it's not the standard way to do PF Tek as you believe.
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Wauw you are really trying youre best to Stare as always 
I'm not, but I'm realizing chatting with you is fruitless, so I'll just not comment on your posts anymore to avoid derails and shit like this. No hard feelings.
Quote:
And When did a claim I was a scientist?
Uh, here where you were incorrectly understanding low nutrients resulting in rhizo growth. And also here when I was telling you not to dig through infected tubs so you'd not jeopardize future grows.
Take care, bud. Happy growing!
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