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bodhisatta 
Smurf real estate agent


Registered: 04/30/13
Posts: 61,889
Loc: Milky way
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Re: Cultivation General Discussion [Re: Enkidu]
#25372708 - 08/07/18 02:48 PM (5 years, 5 months ago) |
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Quote:
Enkidu said: Anyone know, could doing g2g over and over into new generations somehow impact potency when you spawn a g2g jar that was made from doing g2g 3-5 times?
I know bod seems to say it hasn't impacted the grow but I was wondering if somehow it could weaken potency for some reason?
Or is this not likely?
If something breaks from age because of g2g it probably won't be potency first. The first thing to break from age in a lot of fungi is their ability to respirate properly. Mitochondrial DNA has less built in protection mechanisms in fungi than their nuclear DNA
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Enkidu
"No-Such-Person"


Registered: 07/09/16
Posts: 10,698
Last seen: 6 months, 12 days
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Re: Cultivation General Discussion [Re: bodhisatta]
#25372738 - 08/07/18 03:04 PM (5 years, 5 months ago) |
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Thanks bod.
What would improper respiratory abilities look like?
Colonizing and fruiting difficulties?
-------------------- Within You , Without You
      
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Legend21
Legend



Registered: 04/27/18
Posts: 1,148
Last seen: 1 year, 5 months
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Re: Cultivation General Discussion [Re: bodhisatta]
#25372776 - 08/07/18 03:18 PM (5 years, 5 months ago) |
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Quote:
bodhisatta said:
Quote:
Enkidu said: Anyone know, could doing g2g over and over into new generations somehow impact potency when you spawn a g2g jar that was made from doing g2g 3-5 times?
I know bod seems to say it hasn't impacted the grow but I was wondering if somehow it could weaken potency for some reason?
Or is this not likely?
If something breaks from age because of g2g it probably won't be potency first. The first thing to break from age in a lot of fungi is their ability to respirate properly. Mitochondrial DNA has less built in protection mechanisms in fungi than their nuclear DNA
Can you dumb that down for me?
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FishLevelMidnight
Aquaman



Registered: 09/01/17
Posts: 2,328
Last seen: 5 months, 25 days
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Re: Cultivation General Discussion [Re: Legend21] 1
#25372850 - 08/07/18 04:07 PM (5 years, 5 months ago) |
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Nah bro look it up if interested.
Mitochondria are the organelles in cells that produce most of the energy (as ATP, oxidative phosphorylation).
Mitochondria have their own dna (they used to be free living organisms that were taken up by ancestral eukaryotic cells), you can think of it like a bacteria inside each cell that is forced to make energy.
Bod is suggesting that the repair mechanisms of DNA in fungal mitochondria aren’t as robust as those of the fungal cell DNA (which I’m sure he has literature to cite). So after many cell divisions the new cells do not get as many mitochondria (or the mitochondria don’t function as well), as such the fungal culture will have problems producing enough energy to do mushroom stuffs.
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stareatclouds
star eat clouds?



Registered: 09/29/14
Posts: 9,887
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Re: Cultivation General Discussion [Re: Enkidu]
#25372859 - 08/07/18 04:11 PM (5 years, 5 months ago) |
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Quote:
Enkidu said: Thanks bod.
What would improper respiratory abilities look like?
Colonizing and fruiting difficulties?
It looks and performs like a much weaker culture, e.g., slower colonization times, less strength/vigor overall, contaminates easier, etc. At least IME with G2G'ing the last of a clone I had like 5x times.
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Enkidu
"No-Such-Person"


Registered: 07/09/16
Posts: 10,698
Last seen: 6 months, 12 days
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Nice, thanks guys
-------------------- Within You , Without You
      
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tryptkaloids
Learner



Registered: 02/08/15
Posts: 12,641
Loc: Exact Center
Last seen: 3 days, 12 hours
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Re: Cultivation General Discussion [Re: Enkidu]
#25372928 - 08/07/18 04:52 PM (5 years, 5 months ago) |
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Would it show in fruit bodies or just performance?
-------------------- "Remember, kids, the difference between science and screwing around is writing it down" -adam savage Flowchart for Recommended plan of action. Learn the tried and true way to grow mushrooms Use the Damn search engine After you know what you're doing, take a break Pick a book, Make some chips! Josex said:Don't take the site seriously bro, ain't worth it.
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stareatclouds
star eat clouds?



Registered: 09/29/14
Posts: 9,887
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Re: Cultivation General Discussion [Re: tryptkaloids]
#25373001 - 08/07/18 05:28 PM (5 years, 5 months ago) |
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wtf is a decent recommended dose for Reishi tincture? I'm reading people taking an ounce per day, others saying 5g worth (wtf), and others saying 1-2ml 1-3x per day. I'm confused on how to calculate this shit when the strength of the concoction changes the recommended volume and pills/extract/tea/whatever are vastly different.
I have 2165ml of tincture from 100g of dried Reishi due to 95% Everclear. So I assume I need a higher dosage given my extract isn't concentrated. But what are the standard 1-2ml doses based on? What is the conversion in relation to dried grams of Reishi per ml of liquid?
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bodhisatta 
Smurf real estate agent


Registered: 04/30/13
Posts: 61,889
Loc: Milky way
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I don't think anyone really knows lol. Even the Japanese research is hokey
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Legend21
Legend



Registered: 04/27/18
Posts: 1,148
Last seen: 1 year, 5 months
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Quote:
fishermansjc said: Nah bro look it up if interested.
Mitochondria are the organelles in cells that produce most of the energy (as ATP, oxidative phosphorylation).
Mitochondria have their own dna (they used to be free living organisms that were taken up by ancestral eukaryotic cells), you can think of it like a bacteria inside each cell that is forced to make energy.
Bod is suggesting that the repair mechanisms of DNA in fungal mitochondria aren’t as robust as those of the fungal cell DNA (which I’m sure he has literature to cite). So after many cell divisions the new cells do not get as many mitochondria (or the mitochondria don’t function as well), as such the fungal culture will have problems producing enough energy to do mushroom stuffs.
Thanks for that explanation man you’re awesome!
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firsttimegrow5936
Stranger
Registered: 06/12/18
Posts: 9
Last seen: 5 years, 5 months
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Re: Cultivation General Discussion [Re: grainbrain]
#25373112 - 08/07/18 06:10 PM (5 years, 5 months ago) |
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Thank you for the reply! I tried to create spore prints from 10 different caps. I left them overnight on foil in a SAB. Today I found not a single spore print on any of the pieces of foil. Any ideas why my mushrooms didn't produce spores?
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stareatclouds
star eat clouds?



Registered: 09/29/14
Posts: 9,887
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Re: Cultivation General Discussion [Re: bodhisatta]
#25373388 - 08/07/18 08:07 PM (5 years, 5 months ago) |
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Quote:
bodhisatta said: I don't think anyone really knows lol. Even the Japanese research is hokey
I guess I'll bank on the placebo effect.
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tryptkaloids
Learner



Registered: 02/08/15
Posts: 12,641
Loc: Exact Center
Last seen: 3 days, 12 hours
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Re: Cultivation General Discussion [Re: stareatclouds] 1
#25373466 - 08/07/18 08:42 PM (5 years, 5 months ago) |
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Did you guys know the placebo effect isn't reversible? You can tell someone they took a placebo and it has the same success rate
-------------------- "Remember, kids, the difference between science and screwing around is writing it down" -adam savage Flowchart for Recommended plan of action. Learn the tried and true way to grow mushrooms Use the Damn search engine After you know what you're doing, take a break Pick a book, Make some chips! Josex said:Don't take the site seriously bro, ain't worth it.
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ManifoldPrime
Per Ardua Ad Astra



Registered: 03/16/17
Posts: 1,313
Loc: South Africa
Last seen: 1 year, 1 month
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Quote:
stareatclouds said: wtf is a decent recommended dose for Reishi tincture? I'm reading people taking an ounce per day, others saying 5g worth (wtf), and others saying 1-2ml 1-3x per day. I'm confused on how to calculate this shit when the strength of the concoction changes the recommended volume and pills/extract/tea/whatever are vastly different.
I have 2165ml of tincture from 100g of dried Reishi due to 95% Everclear. So I assume I need a higher dosage given my extract isn't concentrated. But what are the standard 1-2ml doses based on? What is the conversion in relation to dried grams of Reishi per ml of liquid?
Okay, my local myco vendor specialises in reishi extracts:
https://www.mushroomguru.co.za/mg-lz8.html
According to the product description of his extract:
Quote:
Reishi DOUBLE EXTRACT capsules contains 15mg of MG-LZ8, South Africa's first Reishi DOUBLE EXTRACT and is the corner stone of our new range. The name "LZ8" (Ling Zhi-8) was originally given to an immunomodulatory protein, isolated from Ganoderma lucidum.
Each bottle contains 30 capsules which are vegan, chitin free, organic, not GMO and 100% bio-available. Take one capsule daily for overall well being. For targeted concerns take 2 capsules twice a daily, depending on the severity of the condition.
so RDA is 15mg of extract that they state is equivalent to 5400mg (5.4gram) .
So if you have just dried powder, youd take 5g. Thats probably a lot of chitin. With your extract thats 5% of your tincture, which would be 100mls. if thats alcohol it would get you smashed. I'm assuming youre using home grown good shit instead of chinese mystery powder, which quite often is just inert powder
-------------------- My Magnum Opus:Thai Variety Comparison Please correct me if I say something wrong! | Current Trade Print Availability:Some PESA and RW available for South African posters. Snail Mail only. |
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scab eater
Stranger Danger


Registered: 04/28/11
Posts: 111
Last seen: 5 years, 3 months
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I've never made LC before. But I've been having good luck with this potato flake agar i have been making. Can i use the same recipe excluding the agar and drop a wedge from a agar culture into the lc?
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tryptkaloids
Learner



Registered: 02/08/15
Posts: 12,641
Loc: Exact Center
Last seen: 3 days, 12 hours
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Re: Cultivation General Discussion [Re: scab eater]
#25376578 - 08/09/18 06:56 AM (5 years, 5 months ago) |
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That's traditionally the way lc is made. Test it on agar before use, or use the Biopsy method
-------------------- "Remember, kids, the difference between science and screwing around is writing it down" -adam savage Flowchart for Recommended plan of action. Learn the tried and true way to grow mushrooms Use the Damn search engine After you know what you're doing, take a break Pick a book, Make some chips! Josex said:Don't take the site seriously bro, ain't worth it.
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ManifoldPrime
Per Ardua Ad Astra



Registered: 03/16/17
Posts: 1,313
Loc: South Africa
Last seen: 1 year, 1 month
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Re: Cultivation General Discussion [Re: scab eater]
#25376603 - 08/09/18 07:12 AM (5 years, 5 months ago) |
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@scabeater I've done 3 methods, dropping a wedge, the biopsy method ("Josex poke") and pastywhytes EZi LC method (most experience, but can go wrong easier IMO, most vectors ) . I like the biopsy method a lot right now.
-------------------- My Magnum Opus:Thai Variety Comparison Please correct me if I say something wrong! | Current Trade Print Availability:Some PESA and RW available for South African posters. Snail Mail only. |
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FishLevelMidnight
Aquaman



Registered: 09/01/17
Posts: 2,328
Last seen: 5 months, 25 days
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Just spawned my Puerto Rican jar today 
First tub in my new space, so I'm ready to fight the new conditions. I am growing right near a water heater (but I don't think it gets too hot), in a shoebox, in a monotub with holes and no poly/micropore. The culture was also a fast NEWB grow, spores directly to LC then to grains, so lets see if it works.
Will report a pic once I get some pins, 14 days or so I am guessing. 3-4 weeks and I'll have my next giveaway
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boom boom

Registered: 02/27/18
Posts: 429
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I'm kinda paranoid about senescence using the josex method with clone cultures but I'm sure it'll be fine.
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stareatclouds
star eat clouds?



Registered: 09/29/14
Posts: 9,887
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Quote:
ManifoldPrime said: Okay, my local myco vendor specialises in reishi extracts:
https://www.mushroomguru.co.za/mg-lz8.html
According to the product description of his extract:
Quote:
Reishi DOUBLE EXTRACT capsules contains 15mg of MG-LZ8, South Africa's first Reishi DOUBLE EXTRACT and is the corner stone of our new range. The name "LZ8" (Ling Zhi-8) was originally given to an immunomodulatory protein, isolated from Ganoderma lucidum.
Each bottle contains 30 capsules which are vegan, chitin free, organic, not GMO and 100% bio-available. Take one capsule daily for overall well being. For targeted concerns take 2 capsules twice a daily, depending on the severity of the condition.
so RDA is 15mg of extract that they state is equivalent to 5400mg (5.4gram) .
So if you have just dried powder, youd take 5g. Thats probably a lot of chitin. With your extract thats 5% of your tincture, which would be 100mls. if thats alcohol it would get you smashed. I'm assuming youre using home grown good shit instead of chinese mystery powder, which quite often is just inert powder 
I'm still every bit as confused as I was before on converting fruit body mass to extract dosage. It's not like I can know how many polysaccharides or triterpenes were extracted. A reishi extract in capsule form is not the same as a liquid tincture.
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