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TheBlackCat
Possibly Human



Registered: 10/05/16
Posts: 2,819
Last seen: 1 year, 5 months
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Re: Cultivation General Discussion [Re: Huskies]
#24909506 - 01/13/18 12:35 AM (6 years, 17 days ago) |
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Quote:
Huskies said: I've been using the bucket tek but I've been having shit contam issues (Eco Earth bricks).
I want to try proper pasteurization, but the oven method seems a bit messy (i'm a lazy fuck)
I saw some posts about doing it in quart jars in the pressure cooker, just boiling them, can't seem to find a great tek for that.
Any hints?
Umm... I would think filling turkey pans would be easier than stuffing a bunch of jars. I am lazy as fuck and oven pasteurization is my lazy as fuck method of choice. I haven't had any contams since I've been doing it this way. Be careful to check the moisture afterwards. I was using two sheets of foil because I ran out of wide foil and the moisture was getting out.
Edited by TheBlackCat (01/13/18 12:36 AM)
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bodhisatta 
Smurf real estate agent


Registered: 04/30/13
Posts: 61,889
Loc: Milky way
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Re: Cultivation General Discussion [Re: van hatton]
#24909520 - 01/13/18 12:39 AM (6 years, 17 days ago) |
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Requires lower temps than caramelization they cite 280 for the low end but i also went 11 hours. And at 18psi give or take which is only 256f or so.
It takes 35 psi to get to 280.
Dry heat and wet heat are different tho. Wet heat is far more energetic and these cite dry heat energy transfer which in comparison is incredibly inefficient
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mushboy
modboy



Registered: 04/24/05
Posts: 32,281
Loc: where?
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Re: Cultivation General Discussion [Re: TheBlackCat]
#24909909 - 01/13/18 06:31 AM (6 years, 17 days ago) |
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Quote:
TheBlackCat said: Be careful to check the moisture afterwards. I was using two sheets of foil because I ran out of wide foil and the moisture was getting out.
Oh i remember those days of oven tek. That might be why your shoebox is causing you stress? Your water content might be off??

What you pointed out as a 'problem' is actually the benefit. Putting in jars and using water is far more controlled.
Ever see someone boil water for pasta/cook it in a stove?
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TheBlackCat
Possibly Human



Registered: 10/05/16
Posts: 2,819
Last seen: 1 year, 5 months
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Re: Cultivation General Discussion [Re: mushboy]
#24909978 - 01/13/18 07:43 AM (6 years, 17 days ago) |
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It's ok. I just spray it down after. No time for stuffing jars. Also the moisture stays inside if you use one solid sheet of foil and wrap it tight. My new boxes are looking much better and are actually getting condensation on the sides. I'm actually glad I figured this out after the first run and wasn't asking myself WTF was wrong 5 cycles in. The moisture content is right so whatever goes wrong is going to be something else this time.
Edited by TheBlackCat (01/13/18 07:43 AM)
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Josex
#cheat_code


Registered: 11/13/15
Posts: 8,995
Loc:
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Re: Cultivation General Discussion [Re: bodhisatta]
#24910006 - 01/13/18 08:09 AM (6 years, 17 days ago) |
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Quote:
bodhisatta said: Dry heat and wet heat are different tho. Wet heat is far more energetic and these cite dry heat energy transfer which in comparison is incredibly inefficient
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Steevo
Just a cog in the death wheel



Registered: 03/02/17
Posts: 2,702
Loc: Here and There
Last seen: 1 year, 9 months
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Re: Cultivation General Discussion [Re: TheBlackCat]
#24910009 - 01/13/18 08:11 AM (6 years, 17 days ago) |
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Why the witch hunt against coir? I thought it was established already that its your spawn and not the coir so wtf gives? Hell I’ve rehyrated coir with warm tap water and its worked out before. No boil, no bucket, no shit
--------------------
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TheMadHatter420
Trusted Farmer


Registered: 10/12/16
Posts: 12,941
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Re: Cultivation General Discussion [Re: TheBlackCat]
#24910043 - 01/13/18 08:27 AM (6 years, 17 days ago) |
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Mist those mother fuckers instead of letting them dry out.
There are more vectors than just spawn. When we spawn to bulk we are scraping the mycelium off grains in some places, leaving an open vector for any mold spores in that coir to get a foot hold on the bare grain. Coir works, but is far from innocent. I can case bacterial grains and bet fruits, but the same jars, spawned to coir, will most likely trich out. It is all about how it is use. OVER HYDRATED coir is a HUGE promoter of contaminations, both bacterial and mold. I have noticed that green molds, trich+, thrive and flourish in wetter conditions that the shroom mycelium. None of this is scientifically tested, and most is simple observations. Some coir may be better than other. What if one brand is produces in a wet moldy factory? It would naturally carry with it a high spore load. Where as a factory in a drier climate may not have mold in it and in turn their coir bricks could carry with them less mold spores.
Everyone always wants to blame spawn 1st. YES the spawn usually can be better, but there are plenty of other things that will cause our grows tam out.
-------------------- JOIN THE POW WOW
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mushboy
modboy



Registered: 04/24/05
Posts: 32,281
Loc: where?
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Re: Cultivation General Discussion [Re: Steevo]
#24910058 - 01/13/18 08:34 AM (6 years, 17 days ago) |
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Quote:
Steevo said: Why the witch hunt against coir? I thought it was established already that its your spawn and not the coir so wtf gives? Hell I’ve rehyrated coir with warm tap water and its worked out before. No boil, no bucket, no shit
I used cold nasty sink water. Performed like shit but didnt tam out.
The more i grow the more i realize its either the water content or the spawn.
Control what you can control, watch your inventory(spawn) and know everything falls on you at the end of the day.
Retail management 101 applied to mushcult
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Ferather
Mycological



Registered: 03/19/15
Posts: 6,325
Loc: United Kingdom
Last seen: 1 year, 2 months
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Re: Cultivation General Discussion [Re: mushboy]
#24910063 - 01/13/18 08:35 AM (6 years, 17 days ago) |
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You do have a brain then!
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mushboy
modboy



Registered: 04/24/05
Posts: 32,281
Loc: where?
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Re: Cultivation General Discussion [Re: Ferather] 2
#24910069 - 01/13/18 08:39 AM (6 years, 17 days ago) |
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If only i had a brain?? 
The scarecrow still made it to oz and thats all that counts
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van hatton
Still a noob



Registered: 11/23/14
Posts: 5,617
Loc: Michigan
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Re: Cultivation General Discussion [Re: mushboy]
#24910091 - 01/13/18 08:51 AM (6 years, 17 days ago) |
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Over hydrating coir leads to a more suitable environment for mold but if our spawns clean it shouldn't matter should it.
-------------------- If I ever give out misinformation please inform me so I can have the correct information. Tmethyl said: Chuck Norris once roundhouse kicked a monotub that wasn't pinning fast enough. The force of the kick rearranged the genetics of the mushrooms, we now call them Penis Envy. Caps McGee said:
Fun part is figuring out what works best for you
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mushboy
modboy



Registered: 04/24/05
Posts: 32,281
Loc: where?
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Re: Cultivation General Discussion [Re: van hatton]
#24910097 - 01/13/18 08:55 AM (6 years, 17 days ago) |
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probably
I spawned some rather damp ass shoeboxes for open air shit but the spawn was really clean so it didnt matter then.
But i bet if the spawn was slightly iffy it would of been a mold fest
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Josex
#cheat_code


Registered: 11/13/15
Posts: 8,995
Loc:
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Re: Cultivation General Discussion [Re: van hatton]
#24910101 - 01/13/18 08:58 AM (6 years, 17 days ago) |
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I know some damn fine growers here, the best of the best, whose definition of field capacity goes to be something like this...

Of course, you need a beast culture that can take that and use that.
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TheMadHatter420
Trusted Farmer


Registered: 10/12/16
Posts: 12,941
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Re: Cultivation General Discussion [Re: mushboy]
#24910103 - 01/13/18 08:58 AM (6 years, 17 days ago) |
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I think there is a point where the extra water content slows the mushroom mycelium while allowing the mold to thrive. If I am correct then there is a point that to much moisture will fuck you.
-------------------- JOIN THE POW WOW
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mushboy
modboy



Registered: 04/24/05
Posts: 32,281
Loc: where?
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Its in the spawn tho. Mold wont germinate on coco alone. Unless its introduced.
If straight coir molded then id dig the theory of quickly colonizing coir to avoid it contaming...the 'window' but it doesnt so i wont.
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Mateja


Registered: 07/14/16
Posts: 7,948
Loc: Here
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Quote:
TheMadHatter420 said: Mist those mother fuckers instead of letting them dry out.
There are more vectors than just spawn. When we spawn to bulk we are scraping the mycelium off grains in some places, leaving an open vector for any mold spores in that coir to get a foot hold on the bare grain. Coir works, but is far from innocent. I can case bacterial grains and bet fruits, but the same jars, spawned to coir, will most likely trich out. It is all about how it is use. OVER HYDRATED coir is a HUGE promoter of contaminations, both bacterial and mold. I have noticed that green molds, trich+, thrive and flourish in wetter conditions that the shroom mycelium. None of this is scientifically tested, and most is simple observations. Some coir may be better than other. What if one brand is produces in a wet moldy factory? It would naturally carry with it a high spore load. Where as a factory in a drier climate may not have mold in it and in turn their coir bricks could carry with them less mold spores.
Everyone always wants to blame spawn 1st. YES the spawn usually can be better, but there are plenty of other things that will cause our grows tam out.
I keep finding these small husks to some flower seed or something in my coir after I hydrate it. I just dump my shredded coir inside a large pot with boiling water, turn off the stove and close it up for a couple of hours.
 
Has anyone ever found this in their coir, and what kind of risks does it pose?
-------------------- Cakes inside Water Tub
Edited by Mateja (01/13/18 09:02 AM)
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van hatton
Still a noob



Registered: 11/23/14
Posts: 5,617
Loc: Michigan
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Mayb that's where I'm fucking up 
Had jars that recovered in 30~ hours trich out on me. The sub is fucking soaked too much misting
The end goal is clean spawn but some fruits in the meantime is cool
-------------------- If I ever give out misinformation please inform me so I can have the correct information. Tmethyl said: Chuck Norris once roundhouse kicked a monotub that wasn't pinning fast enough. The force of the kick rearranged the genetics of the mushrooms, we now call them Penis Envy. Caps McGee said:
Fun part is figuring out what works best for you
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TheMadHatter420
Trusted Farmer


Registered: 10/12/16
Posts: 12,941
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Re: Cultivation General Discussion [Re: mushboy] 1
#24910129 - 01/13/18 09:09 AM (6 years, 17 days ago) |
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Quote:
mushboy said: Its in the spawn tho. Mold wont germinate on coco alone. Unless its introduced.
Then i dig the theory of quickly colonizing coir to avoid it contaming...the 'window'
I disagree since I find PLENTY of stuff in eco earth that would support mold growth. If my eco earth, all by itself, will sprout seedlings of some sort, then it can support mold growth all on its own. Those seeds and the seedlings, when they die back, are a food source for mold. I find coir left setting around gets a mildew smell to it. Since that's hit is black it would be hard to see on the coir, but still an issue.
Keep in mind if those spores lay dormant in the coir, that the act of spawning, scraps mycelium on the grains. This presents bare grain that the mold can grow on. Mold germinates and does grow much faster than mushroom mycelium. It does NOT have to be in the spawn to start. Now as we all know, bacterial spawn does recover slower which helps the mold out pace the mushroom mycelium.
I now do this. Pour 4 qt boiling water over my coir brick and let set in the sealed bucket over night. The next day I add, by hand, dry vermiculite. I like to feel my sub. When I get ONLY a few drops to a quick 1 sec stream of water, I am good. I am fairly sure I was over hydrating before. This appears to have helped a lot.
-------------------- JOIN THE POW WOW
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mushboy
modboy



Registered: 04/24/05
Posts: 32,281
Loc: where?
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Why is the grain bare?
And imo those same seedlings will get colonized quickly if what you are saying is true. Making it mute.
And i disagree people would not use coco coir for pets if it molded and got nasty.
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tryptkaloids
Learner



Registered: 02/08/15
Posts: 12,641
Loc: Exact Center
Last seen: 3 days, 11 hours
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Re: Cultivation General Discussion [Re: TheBlackCat]
#24910141 - 01/13/18 09:15 AM (6 years, 17 days ago) |
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Quote:
TheBlackCat said: It's ok. I just spray it down after. No time for stuffing jars.
Someone please correct me if I'm wrong. But isn't it a vector (and bad practice) to add non pasteurized water to a non colonized bulk sub? As said before, with clean spawn it shouldn't be a huge deal but I would never trust non treated water in my pasteurized sub
Quote:
the act of spawning, scraps mycelium on the grains. This presents bare grain that the mold can grow on.
the grain is colonized through. Not just the outside
-------------------- "Remember, kids, the difference between science and screwing around is writing it down" -adam savage Flowchart for Recommended plan of action. Learn the tried and true way to grow mushrooms Use the Damn search engine After you know what you're doing, take a break Pick a book, Make some chips! Josex said:Don't take the site seriously bro, ain't worth it.
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