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Invisiblethirdeyewild
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Registered: 11/01/13
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Re: Cultivation General Discussion [Re: TheAtlantean]
    #28574144 - 12/08/23 09:52 AM (1 month, 19 days ago)

Quote:

TheAtlantean said:
Trying a new method of pasteurizing my Pan Substrate



Doing it in Jars


already hydrated coir: 7lbs
Field aged manure: 3lbs
Chopped organic straw: 200 grams


Going to pasteurize at 140-160 for 2 hours.




This is how I do it


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OnlineScrewup
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Re: Cultivation General Discussion [Re: San Pedro Girl]
    #28574148 - 12/08/23 09:55 AM (1 month, 19 days ago)

Is this stable in air?
Does it rapidly degrade?
How do you handle this?


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InvisibleTheAtlanteanS
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Re: Cultivation General Discussion [Re: thirdeyewild]
    #28574149 - 12/08/23 09:56 AM (1 month, 19 days ago)

Awesome. I don’t have any gypsum. Is that going to be an issue?


--------------------

Meditation is passive learning. Tabernacling with the one infinite Creator is passive learning. It is the learning from listening to the voice one cannot hear which answers questions which one cannot ask. The process cannot be known and cannot come into consciousness in local sense, yet the learning is there. And the strength of spirit and will which comes from this learning is helpful.
.

:egyptian:www.templeofhermes.org:egyptian:


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Invisiblethirdeyewild
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Re: Cultivation General Discussion [Re: TheAtlantean] * 1
    #28574150 - 12/08/23 09:59 AM (1 month, 19 days ago)

I don't use it.


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OfflineEniQma
Registered: 11/28/23
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Re: Cultivation General Discussion [Re: TheAtlantean] * 1
    #28574161 - 12/08/23 10:11 AM (1 month, 19 days ago)

Quote:

TheAtlantean said:
Awesome. I don’t have any gypsum. Is that going to be an issue?



Just tear into the walls of your house. Make sure it isn’t the purple drywall, that has antifungals
Come on man, how committed are you anyway


Edited by EniQma (12/08/23 10:12 AM)


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InvisibleTheAtlanteanS
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Re: Cultivation General Discussion [Re: EniQma] * 1
    #28574164 - 12/08/23 10:16 AM (1 month, 19 days ago)

I mean, I would probably steal it from the courthouse before I damage my own home. They probably have top notch drywall in that bitch.


--------------------

Meditation is passive learning. Tabernacling with the one infinite Creator is passive learning. It is the learning from listening to the voice one cannot hear which answers questions which one cannot ask. The process cannot be known and cannot come into consciousness in local sense, yet the learning is there. And the strength of spirit and will which comes from this learning is helpful.
.

:egyptian:www.templeofhermes.org:egyptian:


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OfflineSan Pedro GirlS
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Re: Cultivation General Discussion [Re: Screwup] * 2
    #28574182 - 12/08/23 10:33 AM (1 month, 19 days ago)

Quote:

Screwup said:
Is this stable in air?
Does it rapidly degrade?
How do you handle this?



In a room temp sealed container with desiccant and protected from light, I would expect just about every alkaloid in salt form to last hundreds if not thousands of years.


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InvisibleTheAtlanteanS
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Re: Cultivation General Discussion [Re: thirdeyewild]
    #28574186 - 12/08/23 10:38 AM (1 month, 19 days ago)

Do you wait the 5 days after pasteurization to use the sub? Or just when it’s cooled?


--------------------

Meditation is passive learning. Tabernacling with the one infinite Creator is passive learning. It is the learning from listening to the voice one cannot hear which answers questions which one cannot ask. The process cannot be known and cannot come into consciousness in local sense, yet the learning is there. And the strength of spirit and will which comes from this learning is helpful.
.

:egyptian:www.templeofhermes.org:egyptian:


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OnlineRockinRobot
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Re: Cultivation General Discussion [Re: TheAtlantean] * 1
    #28574194 - 12/08/23 10:40 AM (1 month, 19 days ago)

Quote:

TheAtlantean said:
Do you wait the 5 days after pasteurization to use the sub? Or just when it’s cooled?




You can use it once cooled. Only thing we give time to show contamination like that is agar.


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InvisibleTheAtlanteanS
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Re: Cultivation General Discussion [Re: RockinRobot]
    #28574195 - 12/08/23 10:42 AM (1 month, 19 days ago)

Only reason I thought to wait with HPOO subs was to allow for beneficial flora to come back more completely.


--------------------

Meditation is passive learning. Tabernacling with the one infinite Creator is passive learning. It is the learning from listening to the voice one cannot hear which answers questions which one cannot ask. The process cannot be known and cannot come into consciousness in local sense, yet the learning is there. And the strength of spirit and will which comes from this learning is helpful.
.

:egyptian:www.templeofhermes.org:egyptian:


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Invisiblethirdeyewild
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Re: Cultivation General Discussion [Re: TheAtlantean] * 1
    #28574198 - 12/08/23 10:45 AM (1 month, 19 days ago)

Quote:

TheAtlantean said:
Do you wait the 5 days after pasteurization to use the sub? Or just when it’s cooled?




I give it overnight, theoretically to let the beneficial bacteria multiply. Not sure that it really matters though.

Edit: I have read posts that say it does better if you wait a day or two.


--------------------


Edited by thirdeyewild (12/08/23 10:47 AM)


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OfflineSan Pedro GirlS
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Re: Cultivation General Discussion [Re: TheAtlantean] * 1
    #28574200 - 12/08/23 10:47 AM (1 month, 19 days ago)

Quote:

TheAtlantean said:
Only reason I thought to wait with HPOO subs was to allow for beneficial flora to come back more completely.



I was under the impression that you want the sub very well cultured BEFORE you pasteurize, in the anticipation that many of the good bacteria will die off as well. After pasteurization, I believe good and bad are both back to competing for the resources, but with good having the advantage. But I also don’t work with pasteurized sub, so I’m just being academic/talking out of my ass here.🤷


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Invisiblethirdeyewild
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Re: Cultivation General Discussion [Re: San Pedro Girl] * 2
    #28574210 - 12/08/23 10:53 AM (1 month, 19 days ago)

The good bacteria are thermophilic so they start to thrive and the bad stuff dies. I don't think you would want to culture your sub before pasteurizing, you would have all kinds of molds growing which could poison the sub with their metabolites.

The good stuff gets a foothold and protects the sub from competitors.


--------------------


Edited by thirdeyewild (12/08/23 10:54 AM)


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Offlinetryptkaloids
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Re: Cultivation General Discussion [Re: thirdeyewild]
    #28574214 - 12/08/23 10:54 AM (1 month, 19 days ago)

I've never bothered to wait longer than cool time.


--------------------
"Remember, kids, the difference between science and screwing around is writing it down" -adam savage
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Learn the tried and true way to grow mushrooms
Use the Damn search engine
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Pick a book, Make some chips!
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Invisiblewavyedge

Registered: 09/24/11
Posts: 362
Loc: Canada
Re: Cultivation General Discussion [Re: tryptkaloids]
    #28574225 - 12/08/23 11:04 AM (1 month, 19 days ago)

As for separating, my understanding is that you would use column chromatography for this, as alkaloids separate at different heights. You load a column with silica gel and titrate the results from different heights. This is how you extract LSD from the final reaction mixture, in my understanding (never done that). There is a lot to dig into for extractions. Alternatively the DMT community uses a "selective" solvent (naptha) to avoid pulling gramine and other unwanted alkaloids from the basic mix. I don't know how you'd find a solvent selective for just one alkaloid in the profile that mushrooms produce.

In my understanding, mescaline salts are much more stable than psilocin, and you run the risk of dephosphorylating psilocybin (or just destroying it) at these higher pH levels used in A/B extractions. If there's a TEK out there for extracting psilocybin to crystals I'd love to see it.

Edit: elaborate and clarify


Edited by wavyedge (12/08/23 11:12 AM)


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OfflineEniQma
Registered: 11/28/23
Posts: 470
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Re: Cultivation General Discussion [Re: wavyedge] * 1
    #28574234 - 12/08/23 11:07 AM (1 month, 19 days ago)

Some seriously good convos in here right now!:freewilly:


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InvisibleTheAtlanteanS
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Re: Cultivation General Discussion [Re: thirdeyewild]
    #28574235 - 12/08/23 11:08 AM (1 month, 19 days ago)

Quote:

thirdeyewild said:
Quote:

TheAtlantean said:
Do you wait the 5 days after pasteurization to use the sub? Or just when it’s cooled?




I give it overnight, theoretically to let the beneficial bacteria multiply. Not sure that it really matters though.

Edit: I have read posts that say it does better if you wait a day or two.





Understanding how quickly bacteria multiply is the real factor at play here. I would think overnight to 2 days would be a minimum to ensure they have taken over completely


Quote:

San Pedro Girl said:
Quote:

TheAtlantean said:
Only reason I thought to wait with HPOO subs was to allow for beneficial flora to come back more completely.



I was under the impression that you want the sub very well cultured BEFORE you pasteurize, in the anticipation that many of the good bacteria will die off as well. After pasteurization, I believe good and bad are both back to competing for the resources, but with good having the advantage. But I also don’t work with pasteurized sub, so I’m just being academic/talking out of my ass here.🤷




That's what the HPOO is for.


--------------------

Meditation is passive learning. Tabernacling with the one infinite Creator is passive learning. It is the learning from listening to the voice one cannot hear which answers questions which one cannot ask. The process cannot be known and cannot come into consciousness in local sense, yet the learning is there. And the strength of spirit and will which comes from this learning is helpful.
.

:egyptian:www.templeofhermes.org:egyptian:


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OfflineSan Pedro GirlS
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Re: Cultivation General Discussion [Re: wavyedge]
    #28574264 - 12/08/23 11:28 AM (1 month, 19 days ago)

Quote:

wavyedge said:
As for separating, my understanding is that you would use column chromatography for this, as alkaloids separate at different heights. You load a column with silica gel and titrate the results from different heights. This is how you extract LSD from the final reaction mixture, in my understanding (never done that). There is a lot to dig into for extractions. Alternatively the DMT community uses a "selective" solvent (naptha) to avoid pulling gramine and other unwanted alkaloids from the basic mix. I don't know how you'd find a solvent selective for just one alkaloid in the profile that mushrooms produce.

In my understanding, mescaline salts are much more stable than psilocin, and you run the risk of dephosphorylating psilocybin (or just destroying it) at these higher pH levels used in A/B extractions. If there's a TEK out there for extracting psilocybin to crystals I'd love to see it.

Edit: elaborate and clarify



Yeah, A/B extraction of shrooms would be a poor choice. Even with mescaline people screw it up. Once you basify past 10.6, you’re just lowering your yield, but people pull at 14 or more!

Edit: molecular sieves are also great for alkaloid extraction, but tedious.


--------------------


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Invisiblewavyedge

Registered: 09/24/11
Posts: 362
Loc: Canada
Re: Cultivation General Discussion [Re: San Pedro Girl] * 1
    #28574298 - 12/08/23 11:53 AM (1 month, 19 days ago)

Quote:


Yeah, A/B extraction of shrooms would be a poor choice. Even with mescaline people screw it up. Once you basify past 10.6, you’re just lowering your yield, but people pull at 14 or more!

Edit: molecular sieves are also great for alkaloid extraction, but tedious.




Cool good to note about mesc I'll watch my pH closer. Thanks


Edited by wavyedge (12/08/23 11:54 AM)


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OfflineTheOffice
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Re: Cultivation General Discussion [Re: TheAtlantean] * 1
    #28574376 - 12/08/23 12:49 PM (1 month, 19 days ago)





I threw this here on mushboy’s suggestion. Sorry for the off topic!

People have been isolating psilocybin from shrooms since the 1950s, but you think it can’t be done now? Hot water extraction is a fine way to make a tea, but it’s nowhere near pure. Reduce and try to crystallize and see what kind of trash you get.

Even a simple MeOH soxhlet extraction will yield better results than hot water. Take that and re crystallize in freezing anhydrous acetone, and you’ll further reduce it without a lot of work. At that point you’re at a full spectrum alkaloid extraction and beautiful crystals.

Beyond that, you’ll have to discuss with someone more knowledgeable in psilocybin than me, but feel free to message me anytime about Mescaline extractions. Here’s some of my pretty crystals.🙂







This is so interesting.. In my country Mushroomdrops are the new hype (just a couple of drops for a trip), i get asked about them constantly. I've been trying extracting as above. But still figuring out how to stabilise and store the psilocybin/psilocin. I can't see how you would make such an extraction/drops and make it shelfstable.


Any thoughts on it would be very welcome.


--------------------
Cum grege non gradior







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