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abductee
Time



Registered: 05/07/15
Posts: 2,224
Loc: Canada
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Re: Cultivation General Discussion [Re: YoshiTrainer]
#28226266 - 03/12/23 10:51 AM (10 months, 13 days ago) |
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I've read and seen videos of that method, but never really tried it. I actually may have tried it the first time prepping grains, but messed up or ended up with too much moisture so tried the soak and simmer and it worked for me so I stuck with that. It really doses sound a lot easier.
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AyePlus
Stony Danza


Registered: 12/18/14
Posts: 3,393
Loc: Fairfield, Connecticut
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Re: Cultivation General Discussion [Re: abductee] 5
#28226500 - 03/12/23 02:04 PM (10 months, 13 days ago) |
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I like my grain waaay more hydrated than no prep allows, especially in bags,
most no prep math ends up about 35%-40% hydration and still gets mushy af in the bottom schmears wheat/ millet paste all over jars when it gets shake if it can. i shoot for 55% no preps that wet would be garbage.
I also worry that dry grain centers arent being fully sterilized.
-------------------- Learn about breeding
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YoshiTrainer
Onion tied to belt



Registered: 04/30/22
Posts: 1,209
Loc: Castles made of sand
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Re: Cultivation General Discussion [Re: Smellyhobbit] 1
#28226651 - 03/12/23 04:38 PM (10 months, 13 days ago) |
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Quote:
Smellyhobbit said:
Quote:
YoshiTrainer said: Or, you could try low prep! Dump grains in jar, add water, into the PC!
I use your writeup as reference material. Question:
How do you account for the added moisture from washing grains? Or am I overthinking it?
I did change some of the ratios in there recently Smelly, so please double check when you have a minute. For rinsing, there is a section with pictures. Essentially, weigh your dry grains and to that # add your water weight (ml=g). The last time I weighed 1 1/3C wheat it was 268g and I add 220g water for a total of 488g (45% water) Now rinse and drain your quart all you want and fill it to 488g when you are done. If you are a multiple jar person, take the average and use that for the current and future batches. For laaaarge grain batches, figure out how much volume your scooper can grab, like an 8 cup and weigh those grains. Take the average from your first session and use that moving forward. Then just rinse your tub of grains and measure the wet grains by volume into bags, top with water until appropriate weight.
As for sterility of the grains, these are 1/2lb bags of WBS, rye and oats that were sterilized 12/2/22 and sealed w/out innoculating.

Low prep is not for everyone but works nicely for me! π
Edited by YoshiTrainer (03/12/23 04:39 PM)
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AyePlus
Stony Danza


Registered: 12/18/14
Posts: 3,393
Loc: Fairfield, Connecticut
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Re: Cultivation General Discussion [Re: YoshiTrainer] 2
#28226712 - 03/12/23 06:03 PM (10 months, 13 days ago) |
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The wheat looks very dry by my standards.. Iβd expect it to take forever for anything to grow.. Iβve seen your jars in the thread and they all look off to me, but it might just be the way the creamed/ burst/ smeared grains colonize. If my jars did that Iβd call it bacteria,
that 10% is huge IMO, especially in larger bags that have more airflow than jars. It equates to 2-3 days shaved off colonization and bags that dont need an extra shake to finish which can add more. Iβll spend a few hours prepping grain to save a few days to harvest. Iβve done the side by sideβ¦
Do it with 4 lb bags and show me the bottom isnt just cream of wheat.. because that was my result. 1/2lb is less than a jar. I dont think it proves anything tbh. Not trying to knock it if it works for you but I prefer to spend the time for speed of colonization and higher quality result over picking a method with more convenience and ease of use..
-------------------- Learn about breeding
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YoshiTrainer
Onion tied to belt



Registered: 04/30/22
Posts: 1,209
Loc: Castles made of sand
Last seen: 50 minutes, 12 seconds
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Re: Cultivation General Discussion [Re: AyePlus] 1
#28226768 - 03/12/23 07:02 PM (10 months, 13 days ago) |
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I've changed a few things, most of my jars take 10-14 days with single shake, double shake is faster. Thankfully I just do this for fun, I don't have a need for 4lb bags but I would be curious the difference. If a 1/2lb bag PCed for 2 hrs doesn't show contam, why would a 4 lb at 3-4 hrs be different if they have the same hydration levels?
Here are some more recent jars with better hydration. Wheat, oats, millet, WBS, grain mix, all low prepped. Some Mak118 and PEC4 plus a little jar of bisporus on millet. The bulk bags are colonized and just waiting for me.
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AyePlus
Stony Danza


Registered: 12/18/14
Posts: 3,393
Loc: Fairfield, Connecticut
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Re: Cultivation General Discussion [Re: YoshiTrainer]
#28226779 - 03/12/23 07:11 PM (10 months, 13 days ago) |
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I think the bigger container would have a more uneven distribution of moisture, It seems the larger you go the bigger puck of overcooked grain is and I imagine in a large bag it would be the whole bottom
The smaller containers hydrate quicker during the beginning of the PC cycle so they actually get pressure cooked for a reasonable amount of time because you go longer than itβs recommended.
A bigger bag might take an hour to hydrate the wheay so on a three hour cycle youβre only really getting two hours at full sterilization.
-------------------- Learn about breeding
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π΄ π° πΌ π
π΄ π° πΌ π² π» πΈ π½ πΆ π
π
π° πΏ
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tedoro
ToadStool Tender



Registered: 02/06/15
Posts: 2,206
Last seen: 1 day, 1 hour
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Re: Cultivation General Discussion [Re: YoshiTrainer] 1
#28226893 - 03/12/23 08:47 PM (10 months, 13 days ago) |
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Quote:
YoshiTrainer said: I've changed a few things, most of my jars take 10-14 days with single shake, double shake is faster. Thankfully I just do this for fun, I don't have a need for 4lb bags but I would be curious the difference. If a 1/2lb bag PCed for 2 hrs doesn't show contam, why would a 4 lb at 3-4 hrs be different if they have the same hydration levels?
Here are some more recent jars with better hydration. Wheat, oats, millet, WBS, grain mix, all low prepped. Some Mak118 and PEC4 plus a little jar of bisporus on millet. The bulk bags are colonized and just waiting for me.

If those are cubes, it looks bacterial. The last time I mentioned that to you you said you were weren't growing cubes. Anyhoo, nothing there to boast about.
-------------------- -------------------- Deep pour soft agar plates-->bags of WBS-->Low Profile Monos Clean spawn thread | Put a thermometer on your PC
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YoshiTrainer
Onion tied to belt



Registered: 04/30/22
Posts: 1,209
Loc: Castles made of sand
Last seen: 50 minutes, 12 seconds
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Re: Cultivation General Discussion [Re: tedoro] 1
#28227049 - 03/12/23 10:59 PM (10 months, 13 days ago) |
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I do appreciate your input AyePlus. Based upon the incredible filter wall you posted, you have a great love for the hobby or are in the industry, or both! If I had that space, my family would never see me, I'd sleep in front of that thing!
If I had a clean clone on agar and I put a piece to normal agar and a piece to high nutrient could you tell the difference just looking at the mycelium growth? How?
I am still confused on grain sterilization. If in both the large and small grain containers they are lacking hydration equally to the core of the grain, what would be the difference? I normally run Qts 1.5hrs and a 1/2lb is larger so I chose 2hrs.
Tedoro, I do owe you an apology for the caerulescens jar, it was bad and I had my head wedged deeply in its dark/warm protected spot. You are mistaken about me saying I didn't grow cubes, many of the grows were cubes in addition to exotics. Your being dismissive is unnecessary! If you'd like to post some of your cube grows, I'd be happy to see them. I think you are also wrong about the jars being bacterial. The jars of agar the samples came from remain clean, all steps of the process were quick to recover, hopefully in the next couple weeks, I'll have some lovely photos to share.
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nogoodnamesleft
Stranger than average



Registered: 09/19/20
Posts: 413
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Re: Cultivation General Discussion [Re: YoshiTrainer] 2
#28227060 - 03/12/23 11:10 PM (10 months, 13 days ago) |
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Hi.
I have no dog in the fight but I highly recommend that you look at the clean spawn thread
Jar 4 in your photos looks to have a bacterial contamination as the mycelium is very creamy and not fully colonizing some of thr grains/straw pieces in the jar.
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Way
The


Registered: 01/14/23
Posts: 4,336
Loc: A long way away
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Re: Cultivation General Discussion [Re: YoshiTrainer] 1
#28227105 - 03/12/23 11:49 PM (10 months, 13 days ago) |
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Quote:
YoshiTrainer said: I do appreciate your input AyePlus. Based upon the incredible filter wall you posted, you have a great love for the hobby or are in the industry, or both! If I had that space, my family would never see me, I'd sleep in front of that thing!
If I had a clean clone on agar and I put a piece to normal agar and a piece to high nutrient could you tell the difference just looking at the mycelium growth? How?
I am still confused on grain sterilization. If in both the large and small grain containers they are lacking hydration equally to the core of the grain, what would be the difference? I normally run Qts 1.5hrs and a 1/2lb is larger so I chose 2hrs.
Tedoro, I do owe you an apology for the caerulescens jar, it was bad and I had my head wedged deeply in its dark/warm protected spot. You are mistaken about me saying I didn't grow cubes, many of the grows were cubes in addition to exotics. Your being dismissive is unnecessary! If you'd like to post some of your cube grows, I'd be happy to see them. I think you are also wrong about the jars being bacterial. The jars of agar the samples came from remain clean, all steps of the process were quick to recover, hopefully in the next couple weeks, I'll have some lovely photos to share.
+1 for those jars being bacterial. You'll still get some fruits most likely.
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That's the way she goes, boys. Sometimes she goes, sometimes she doesn't, cause that's the fuckin way she goes.
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AyePlus
Stony Danza


Registered: 12/18/14
Posts: 3,393
Loc: Fairfield, Connecticut
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Re: Cultivation General Discussion [Re: YoshiTrainer]
#28227128 - 03/13/23 12:01 AM (10 months, 13 days ago) |
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The water would pool more in a Quote:
YoshiTrainer said: I do appreciate your input AyePlus. Based upon the incredible filter wall you posted, you have a great love for the hobby or are in the industry, or both! If I had that space, my family would never see me, I'd sleep in front of that thing!
thanks bud , yeah I grow for a living, mostly LM and oysters, cubes are an off season thing.
If I had a clean clone on agar and I put a piece to normal agar and a piece to high nutrient could you tell the difference just looking at the mycelium growth? How?
not sure what that has to docwith this discussion but yes, the low nute one would run faster and be more likely to exhibit rhizomorphic growth
I am still confused on grain sterilization. If in both the large and small grain containers they are lacking hydration equally to the core of the grain, what would be the difference? I normally run Qts 1.5hrs and a 1/2lb is larger so I chose 2hrs.
Most people call a mycoqt 1 lb, not sure why you think 1/2 lb bags would be bigger? Bags also sterilize quicker because the glass takes time to heat..
Basically the short of it is, once you start scaling up you realize certain techniques arent as viable anymore. Sure I could swith over to running millet at 45% hydration no prep bags and tweak a few things to make it work (trippleblack crushes this). But I cook multiple bags of grain in a session. With my Preferred and cheapest abailable grain, wheat; The βPuckβ as you call it, would be worse in a larger bag, and the paste that coated the bag would make it are to assess cleanliness, Im guessing rhats why everyone is calling your jars bacterial, even if they arent (i have my own suspicions) i like to see almost translucent myc hugging the grains, not coating the jar like a gnarly sslc..
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π
π° πΏ
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Floret
Unmodify everything


Registered: 01/02/23
Posts: 262
Loc: underneath the water
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Re: Cultivation General Discussion [Re: AyePlus] 1
#28227266 - 03/13/23 02:42 AM (10 months, 12 days ago) |
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Quote:
AyePlus said: Iβve done the side by sideβ¦
This is why your posts are great, you take the time to optimize your process.
-------------------- LAGM 2024
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A.k.a
Stranger



Registered: 10/27/19
Posts: 16,782
Loc: Gaming the system
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Re: Cultivation General Discussion [Re: Floret] 1
#28227310 - 03/13/23 05:12 AM (10 months, 12 days ago) |
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Those jars are all fine.
This is what makes learning spawn so difficult, thereβs many types of mycelium and then they also can look different on different grains.
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LAGM2020     
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bw86
Doesn't play well with others


Registered: 11/12/06
Posts: 5,937
Loc: 7b
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Re: Cultivation General Discussion [Re: A.k.a] 1
#28227372 - 03/13/23 07:16 AM (10 months, 12 days ago) |
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If you look closely at that last pint you cant see a beard hair pube
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Leftfield420
bong toker



Registered: 02/26/16
Posts: 10,023
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Re: Cultivation General Discussion [Re: bw86]
#28227379 - 03/13/23 07:22 AM (10 months, 12 days ago) |
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Quote:
bw86 said: If you look closely at that last pint you cant see a beard hair pube 
good eyeπ€£π€£
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bw86
Doesn't play well with others


Registered: 11/12/06
Posts: 5,937
Loc: 7b
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Re: Cultivation General Discussion [Re: Leftfield420]
#28227439 - 03/13/23 08:19 AM (10 months, 12 days ago) |
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*1/2 pint
You know what just dawned on me. I thinks i'm the only Trusted Cultivator with 4 star rating. (ever?)
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Screwup
Googles your dumb questions


Registered: 01/27/22
Posts: 6,301
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Re: Cultivation General Discussion [Re: bw86] 1
#28227444 - 03/13/23 08:21 AM (10 months, 12 days ago) |
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Just gave you 0 stars to help you out
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π° πΏ Help US help YOU TEK 2023 Dehydrator TEK
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mushboy
modboy



Registered: 04/24/05
Posts: 32,281
Loc: where?
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Re: Cultivation General Discussion [Re: bw86] 2
#28227446 - 03/13/23 08:22 AM (10 months, 12 days ago) |
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gimme a few more months in the political forum ill pile on the albinos.
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bw86
Doesn't play well with others


Registered: 11/12/06
Posts: 5,937
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Re: Cultivation General Discussion [Re: Screwup]
#28227447 - 03/13/23 08:23 AM (10 months, 12 days ago) |
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Quote:
Screwup said: Just gave you 0 stars to help you out
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rumfor69
Bodhicitta Cultivator



Registered: 08/05/11
Posts: 6,767
Loc: In the Gills
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Re: Cultivation General Discussion [Re: A.k.a]
#28227591 - 03/13/23 10:15 AM (10 months, 12 days ago) |
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Quote:
A.k.a said: Those jars are all fine.
This is what makes learning spawn so difficult, thereβs many types of mycelium and then they also can look different on different grains.
Definitely agree with this. I've noticed lots of variances just in the 3 grains I've tried. I've even noticed a few wet uncolonized grains on the glass doesn't always mean bacteria either. I've swabbed a few of them and the plate streaks grew nothing.
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