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fiddle_head
I'm not the dude, guy



Registered: 08/05/08
Posts: 1,877
Last seen: 19 hours, 4 minutes
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Re: Cultivation General Discussion [Re: Inocuole] 1
#28170075 - 02/02/23 11:03 PM (11 months, 20 days ago) |
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Billy Bob grows shoom
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A.k.a
Stranger



Registered: 10/27/19
Posts: 16,782
Loc: Gaming the system
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Re: Cultivation General Discussion [Re: Mycolorado] 2
#28170260 - 02/03/23 04:30 AM (11 months, 19 days ago) |
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Quote:
Mycolorado said: 100% clean spores are achievable. The issue though is that what the vendor is suggesting is bullshit.
Exactly.
Itβs also really not that difficult to make totally clean syringes. Iβve made hundreds myself that tested perfectly on plates. The amount of dirty ones in circulation is 100% a result of greedy and/or lazy people who canβt be bothered to put in the small amount of effort required to figure out how to do it when plenty of people will buy their dirty ones.
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Nonagon
Bacon frying, sparrows chirping


Registered: 09/01/22
Posts: 1,077
Loc: Hyperspace
Last seen: 2 days, 17 hours
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Re: Cultivation General Discussion [Re: A.k.a]
#28170319 - 02/03/23 05:57 AM (11 months, 19 days ago) |
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Curious what measures you would take for 100% clean spore syringes. Given that a couple spore syringes of a given variety could last me years - I was thinking about fruiting a pint or so of sterilized grain/coir in a quart jar and then removing the caps/printing in the SAB
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Floret
Unmodify everything


Registered: 01/02/23
Posts: 262
Loc: underneath the water
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Re: Cultivation General Discussion [Re: A.k.a] 1
#28170632 - 02/03/23 11:05 AM (11 months, 19 days ago) |
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Quote:
A.k.a said: Itβs also really not that difficult to make totally clean syringes. Iβve made hundreds myself that tested perfectly on plates.
How do you make and guarantee that the spores you save are 100% clean? Even if you test, it only means your sample is clean and the probability is higher that the syringe is 100% clean. As a business with higher volume, it becomes increasingly hard to maintain 100% all the time. There's an acceptable margin of error, albeit it should be extremely small.
I'm not trying to be antagonistic. I'm also interested in owning 100% clean syringes.
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Mycolorado
Hobbyist


Registered: 07/23/16
Posts: 8,529
Loc: Interdimensional Bootcamp
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Re: Cultivation General Discussion [Re: Floret] 4
#28170642 - 02/03/23 11:13 AM (11 months, 19 days ago) |
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Through aseptic technique and using spores from fruit grown in sterile conditions. You said it was impossible, weβre simply pointing out that that is not the case. Whether or not itβs tough for a business to do so is irrelevant. Having a business promote poor cultivation practices in order to sell more product is relevant and should be addressed, as is being done.
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Floret
Unmodify everything


Registered: 01/02/23
Posts: 262
Loc: underneath the water
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Re: Cultivation General Discussion [Re: Mycolorado]
#28170652 - 02/03/23 11:18 AM (11 months, 19 days ago) |
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djbluntmagic
Stranger


Registered: 02/10/15
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Re: Cultivation General Discussion [Re: Floret]
#28170672 - 02/03/23 11:39 AM (11 months, 19 days ago) |
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Seeking advice here before opening my own topic if necessary.
I started growing B+ soon after quarantine hit in 2020, first PF tek, then soon graduating to PC, oat jars and shoeboxes using mostly Bod teks. I've always intended to go to monotub but have always had to settle for shoeboxes once my jars started developing bacterial contams. Over this time I've been using the same inoculant from Petris, eventually keeping them in a lunchbox in the fridge insulated with cold packs. They have showed no apparent signs of contamination on agar. My last full production run, I think sometime early last Spring, was the first time I had taken the mycelium out of the fridge. After inoculation they were slow to colonize at first but picked up eventually, albeit with the bacteria issues I had already experienced. Nevertheless, eventual yield was satisfactory.
Over the holidays this year I started another grow by the usual process. Following advice from other Shroomerites sought after the problems with bacterial contam I had experienced, I modified Bod's approach to grain soak by waiting for the water to boil before adding the oats, then reducing to a simmer and soaking for 20 minutes only. Then I let the oats dry in colanders overnight in the fridge. I vent for 17 minutes then run PC for 2 full hours at 17-18 to further decrease likelihood of contamination. After the PC run, I let the jars cool overnight. Between sterilization in PC and inoculation about 16 hours passed. When I took off the aluminum foil covering from the jar lids there was significant moisture underneath, and for some of the jars the polyfill in the gas exchange holes was quite wet. This had not been a problem before and I'm at a bit of a loss to explain how it happened this time. I made the foil quite tight to the lids; is it possible it was loose enough to allow steam to accumulate under the foil but too tight to allow it to dissipate? In any case I persisted with the inoculation. Inoculant still looked good. It is worth noting that up to this point the mycelium on agar had been in the fridge for over a year. I stored the jars to colonize as normal. The problem is, we are a month on from inoculation now and the jars have made no progress whatsoever, not in any of the jars, which is something I have never seen before.
I see three possibilites that could have contributed to this aborted run:
1. I overcompensated for my previously excessively wet grains by letting them sit out too long during particularly dry weather before loading the jars. The grains dried out too much and there was not enough moisture for colonization. 2. The polyfill got too wet to allow for sufficient gas exchange. 3. I stored the inoculant for too long and it's no longer viable. I should start from scratch with a new spore syringe.
I appreciate the community's input on which of these possibilities or some other is most likely to have been the main factor in the lack of colonization of the oat jars. Yall have been so helpful over these last couple of years.
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SirPsycho
Purple Belt in Google-Fu



Registered: 01/01/20
Posts: 6,907
Loc: Rent free in your head
Last seen: 4 hours, 44 minutes
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Re: Cultivation General Discussion [Re: mushboy] 3
#28170750 - 02/03/23 12:56 PM (11 months, 19 days ago) |
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Quote:
mushboy said: pretty soon putting spore syringes to agar is going to void the warranty
Doesn't it already? Microscopy purpose only and all that.
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A.k.a
Stranger



Registered: 10/27/19
Posts: 16,782
Loc: Gaming the system
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Re: Cultivation General Discussion [Re: SirPsycho] 4
#28170752 - 02/03/23 01:00 PM (11 months, 19 days ago) |
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If you make tubs that only have air exchanged through filters, then dial them in so you donβt need to touch them til harvest youβre set for the most part. Opening to harvest the spores would be tough in SAB but with a hood itβs simple.
Second to last Jack Frost tub, taz clusters.
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LAGM2020     
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Greg
always learning




Registered: 10/28/15
Posts: 1,536
Loc: an autoclave
Last seen: 3 months, 3 days
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Re: Cultivation General Discussion [Re: A.k.a]
#28170903 - 02/03/23 03:08 PM (11 months, 19 days ago) |
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Posting this here to make sure this idea isn't stupid as shit and/or already written-up somewhere.
Every time I see a new user that's willing to learn agar, but has already wasted their syringe(s) on s2g, I wish I had an easy method I could recommend that would give them another try without sourcing more spores.
In my experience, empty syringes often have a small amount of spores stuck to the plunger and walls. There are obvious ways to make those spores usable, e.g. drawing up sterile water or wiping the inside with a swab or loop. In my opinion though, an ideal noob-friendly method would not require any extra supplies, tools, or prep work.
The idea I've got right now is to simply pull the plunger out of the syringe completely and streak plates with it like a swab. One downside I can see is the fact that air gets pulled into the syringe when removing the plunger. I'm not sure if this is a significant contamination vector in the context of germination plates. Just made some test plates this way for the hell of it.
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Smellyhobbit
Actual Retard



Registered: 04/01/22
Posts: 11,171
Loc: Hole
Last seen: 3 hours, 25 minutes
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Re: Cultivation General Discussion [Re: Inocuole] 5
#28171091 - 02/03/23 05:32 PM (11 months, 19 days ago) |
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People who have taken breaks due to circumstance: how did that make you feel?
Iβm sad I canβt cultivate.
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Greg
always learning




Registered: 10/28/15
Posts: 1,536
Loc: an autoclave
Last seen: 3 months, 3 days
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Re: Cultivation General Discussion [Re: Smellyhobbit] 4
#28171120 - 02/03/23 05:49 PM (11 months, 19 days ago) |
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Cultivation wise, both times I had to leave this hobby sucked. I lost clones and hard-to-find species I loved. A lot of my equipment and materials got ruined in storage.
If I could tell my past self one thing related to mush cult, it would be to take long-term culture storage seriously. All it takes is a mini fridge and some centrifuge tubes to make getting back into the swing of things so much easier.
Outside of cultivation though, I revisited my other hobbies. Gardening, programming, digital painting, and more. I gained so much perspective and experience that I might not have if I were pigeon-holed into one hobby this whole time.
This time around, after several years away, I found a relationship and living situation compatible with this hobby again. I couldn't be happier, and I wouldn't be the same person without the intermissions to growing that I've had.
Life is a balancing act, breaks can be positive. Seeing pins pop up never really loses its magic, time away can make it even better.
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A.k.a
Stranger



Registered: 10/27/19
Posts: 16,782
Loc: Gaming the system
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Re: Cultivation General Discussion [Re: Greg] 4
#28171130 - 02/03/23 06:04 PM (11 months, 19 days ago) |
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Iβve never really stopped yet, but my girl had to and drives her crazy.
Personally I usually feel a sense of relief from low a level anxiety I wasnβt even aware of anymore whenever I take a break from a legally dubious hobby. Itβs good to take a break once in a while from anything youβre heavily involved with in my opinion.
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Smellyhobbit
Actual Retard



Registered: 04/01/22
Posts: 11,171
Loc: Hole
Last seen: 3 hours, 25 minutes
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Re: Cultivation General Discussion [Re: Inocuole] 4
#28171222 - 02/03/23 07:15 PM (11 months, 19 days ago) |
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I do have a sorely neglected hobby. This year I wont be dumping so many hours into everything, since Iβm downsizing just a little and Iβve learned so much. A lot more setting and forgetting.
I need to get back into painting.
My break is only a month long, but I still donβt like it. Felt like I was just getting good.
Having said that, Aka, I definitely know what you mean about losing that little bit of stress.
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YoshiTrainer
Onion tied to belt



Registered: 04/30/22
Posts: 1,209
Loc: Castles made of sand
Last seen: 1 hour, 47 minutes
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Re: Cultivation General Discussion [Re: Smellyhobbit] 3
#28171297 - 02/03/23 08:11 PM (11 months, 19 days ago) |
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I find doing agar work stress releaving, most of the time.
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Crackatoa
Stranger in a strange land



Registered: 03/31/19
Posts: 5,399
Loc: Over by your Mama's house
Last seen: 6 hours, 5 minutes
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Re: Cultivation General Discussion [Re: djbluntmagic] 1
#28171300 - 02/03/23 08:13 PM (11 months, 19 days ago) |
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Quote:
djbluntmagic said: Seeking advice here before opening my own topic if necessary.
I started growing B+ soon after quarantine hit in 2020, first PF tek, then soon graduating to PC, oat jars and shoeboxes using mostly Bod teks. I've always intended to go to monotub but have always had to settle for shoeboxes once my jars started developing bacterial contams. Over this time I've been using the same inoculant from Petris, eventually keeping them in a lunchbox in the fridge insulated with cold packs. They have showed no apparent signs of contamination on agar. My last full production run, I think sometime early last Spring, was the first time I had taken the mycelium out of the fridge. After inoculation they were slow to colonize at first but picked up eventually, albeit with the bacteria issues I had already experienced. Nevertheless, eventual yield was satisfactory.
Over the holidays this year I started another grow by the usual process. Following advice from other Shroomerites sought after the problems with bacterial contam I had experienced, I modified Bod's approach to grain soak by waiting for the water to boil before adding the oats, then reducing to a simmer and soaking for 20 minutes only. Then I let the oats dry in colanders overnight in the fridge. I vent for 17 minutes then run PC for 2 full hours at 17-18 to further decrease likelihood of contamination. After the PC run, I let the jars cool overnight. Between sterilization in PC and inoculation about 16 hours passed. When I took off the aluminum foil covering from the jar lids there was significant moisture underneath, and for some of the jars the polyfill in the gas exchange holes was quite wet. This had not been a problem before and I'm at a bit of a loss to explain how it happened this time. I made the foil quite tight to the lids; is it possible it was loose enough to allow steam to accumulate under the foil but too tight to allow it to dissipate? In any case I persisted with the inoculation. Inoculant still looked good. It is worth noting that up to this point the mycelium on agar had been in the fridge for over a year. I stored the jars to colonize as normal. The problem is, we are a month on from inoculation now and the jars have made no progress whatsoever, not in any of the jars, which is something I have never seen before.
I see three possibilites that could have contributed to this aborted run:
1. I overcompensated for my previously excessively wet grains by letting them sit out too long during particularly dry weather before loading the jars. The grains dried out too much and there was not enough moisture for colonization. 2. The polyfill got too wet to allow for sufficient gas exchange. 3. I stored the inoculant for too long and it's no longer viable. I should start from scratch with a new spore syringe.
I appreciate the community's input on which of these possibilities or some other is most likely to have been the main factor in the lack of colonization of the oat jars. Yall have been so helpful over these last couple of years. 
I make my oats the same way pretty much when I use them. Oats I've found need to be a dryer than you think they need to be. I have that same moisture under my foil, I just wipe it off with an iso napkin. I would blame your inoculant. If you are going Spore syringe to grain, I see the huge flaw in your process.
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Floret
Unmodify everything


Registered: 01/02/23
Posts: 262
Loc: underneath the water
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Re: Cultivation General Discussion [Re: Crackatoa]
#28171481 - 02/04/23 12:28 AM (11 months, 19 days ago) |
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I agree, test the inoculant on agar to see if it's clean.
-------------------- LAGM 2024
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Adas
Lonely Dreamer



Registered: 12/22/16
Posts: 5,270
Loc: Central EU
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Re: Cultivation General Discussion [Re: Floret] 2
#28171670 - 02/04/23 06:20 AM (11 months, 18 days ago) |
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I will probably have to take a break soon as well. It's too much stress and paranoia. Good thing is that I'll be able to focus more resources into edibles!
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fiddle_head
I'm not the dude, guy



Registered: 08/05/08
Posts: 1,877
Last seen: 19 hours, 4 minutes
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Re: Cultivation General Discussion [Re: Inocuole]
#28171721 - 02/04/23 07:24 AM (11 months, 18 days ago) |
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Redboy revert looking sparse around the inner circumference but thick and healthy at edges. Agar recipe or genetics? I used 2% LME + 25% oat water (boil) by volume. All the other plates are performing well.
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AyePlus
Stony Danza


Registered: 12/18/14
Posts: 3,393
Loc: Fairfield, Connecticut
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Re: Cultivation General Discussion [Re: Adas] 5
#28171775 - 02/04/23 08:20 AM (11 months, 18 days ago) |
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Quote:
Adas said: I will probably have to take a break soon as well. It's too much stress and paranoia. Good thing is that I'll be able to focus more resources into edibles!
I just spent 2 years off of growing actives to run a gourmet farm and it was nice not to worry as much about certain things but let me tell you, plenty of stress still lol, maybe a lil less paranoia but damn it definitely feels good to be getting back in, diving in deeper than before and with renewed energy and time off for perspective.
Making the decision to take the winter off of gourmets to re-invision the farm was also a huge relief, been keeping the lab setup till the last minute and working on sourcing /fruiting alot of new varieties for my spore library and some brute spore crosses before I dive into serial dilution and monokayrons
having the time to breathe and not trying to grow 100 lbs of lions mane a week has given me time to come up with some really exciting new ideas for some new teks, products and equipment design. Always good to switch it up and keep it fresh
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