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Crispykoot
Jello Wrangler



Registered: 10/16/16
Posts: 5,921
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Re: Cultivation General Discussion [Re: Mad Season]
#24176899 - 03/20/17 07:01 AM (6 years, 10 months ago) |
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Quote:
Mad Season said:
Quote:
bodhisatta said:
clostridum butyricum from brewers grain(rye malt) it's very heat resistant because of the spores. it is responsible for the most part in the rancid smell if you let grains soak too long. it will survive the boil and is why your grains go bad and smell like puke and Greek feet feta if you don't sterilize them after your grain prep.
it forms endospores even culture on anaerobic plates with an abidance of nutrients. as you can see some subset of the population finds it appropriate to form endospores despite not having "bad conditions" as conditions get worse spore formation goes up. I would be nearly positive you end up with more endospores if you do a soak than if you skip a soak, either way these DO get killed by a PC in a sufficient cycle.
FWIW. Under harsh conditions they produce more endospores, but as populations continue to rise, endospore populations rise too. They always make endospores regardless of conditions, this is a key to their survival.
Letting the grain sit after simmering/drying could be beneficial...Maybe the bacteria acting on the grain breaks it down and makes it easier to digest after PCing?
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Shadowboxing the apocalypse and wandering the land
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Mad Season
hookers and blackjack



Registered: 09/16/12
Posts: 12,666
Loc: Canada
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Re: Cultivation General Discussion [Re: Crispykoot]
#24177140 - 03/20/17 09:11 AM (6 years, 10 months ago) |
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Who knows it is possible, especially with certain types of beneficial bacteria, but endospore forming ones IMO make things harder to colonize
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bodhisatta 
Smurf real estate agent


Registered: 04/30/13
Posts: 61,889
Loc: Milky way
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Quote:
TheMadHatter420 said:
Quote:
PinPornProducer said: Makes sense, its just how fast are the endospores produced?
This made me curious so I looked into it. Turns out that not all bacteria can form endospores, in fact only a few can. Those that can take about 8 hours.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Endospore
Quote:
PinPornProducer said: Under conditions of starvation, especially the lack of carbon and nitrogen sources, a single endospore forms within some of the bacteria. The process is called sporulation (def). (Kaiser, 2011)
When a bacterium detects environmental conditions are becoming unfavourable it may start the process of endosporulation, which takes about eight hours.
Quote:
TheMadHatter420 said: "While significantly resistant to heat and radiation, endospores can be destroyed by burning or by autoclaving at a temperature exceeding the boiling point of water, 100 °C. Endospores are able to survive at 100 °C for hours, although the longer the number of hours the fewer that will survive. An indirect way to destroy them is to place them in an environment that reactivates them to their vegetative state. They will germinate within a day or two with the right environmental conditions, and then the vegetative cells, not as hardy as endospores, can be straightforwardly destroyed"
So It would take a couple day soak to bring them to life to kill them, BUT they would only form endospores when conditions get harsh, and that takes about 8 hours. This is very interesting.
That's all the watered down version
Some endospores form in a few hours. Most take around 8
Theyre formed in all circumstances, formed in more abundance when conditions start to deteriorate
https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/21604725
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PinPornProducer
Buy the ticket, take the ride



Registered: 08/23/14
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Re: Cultivation General Discussion [Re: bodhisatta]
#24177188 - 03/20/17 09:31 AM (6 years, 10 months ago) |
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4 days post pc and looking good
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Tiamo
Trust in LITFA




Registered: 04/07/16
Posts: 1,935
Loc: Amsterdam
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Sweet wheat, wouldn't mind having that for breakfast (without the fungi)
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mushboy
modboy



Registered: 04/24/05
Posts: 32,281
Loc: where?
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Re: Cultivation General Discussion [Re: Tiamo]
#24177222 - 03/20/17 09:49 AM (6 years, 10 months ago) |
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extra fungi on mine please.
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PinPornProducer
Buy the ticket, take the ride



Registered: 08/23/14
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Re: Cultivation General Discussion [Re: mushboy]
#24177234 - 03/20/17 09:54 AM (6 years, 10 months ago) |
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These were no soak, just boiled, rinsed, strained and loaded.
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lovelaughlibs
Dopamine Slave



Registered: 10/14/15
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Can you get away with not soaking rye, or will grains burst during boil?
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PinPornProducer
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Registered: 08/23/14
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Never used rye but I don't see why not, just have to experiment with boil times. I do have a couple 4lb bags a rye I picked up as samples a while ago. Maybe I'll give em a shot and see how they do.
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bodhisatta 
Smurf real estate agent


Registered: 04/30/13
Posts: 61,889
Loc: Milky way
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I think sbj has a quick rye TEK
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PinPornProducer
Buy the ticket, take the ride



Registered: 08/23/14
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Re: Cultivation General Discussion [Re: bodhisatta]
#24177349 - 03/20/17 10:34 AM (6 years, 10 months ago) |
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Crispykoot
Jello Wrangler



Registered: 10/16/16
Posts: 5,921
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Last seen: 20 hours, 37 minutes
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Quote:
PinPornProducer said: 4 days post pc and looking good

As I was shaking the fuck outta freshly dropped wedges this morning this very picture popped into my mind and I thought...3P is on to something with that waiting to shake thing. Hmmm. How long generally before your masters are ready?
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Shadowboxing the apocalypse and wandering the land
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PinPornProducer
Buy the ticket, take the ride



Registered: 08/23/14
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Re: Cultivation General Discussion [Re: Crispykoot]
#24177413 - 03/20/17 10:55 AM (6 years, 10 months ago) |
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Agar inoculated masters usually take me 2 weeks before they are ready. I like to wait 5-7 days before shaking just to make sure no contams pop up and also to let the myc crawl off the agar and get some grain coverage. But a normal g2g jar takes 7-10 days.
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lovelaughlibs
Dopamine Slave



Registered: 10/14/15
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The quick rye tek looks interesting, I'll have to try it next time.
-------------------- Ask and ye shall receive; Seek and ye shall find.
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van hatton
Still a noob



Registered: 11/23/14
Posts: 5,617
Loc: Michigan
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Re: Cultivation General Discussion [Re: lovelaughlibs] 1
#24177691 - 03/20/17 12:51 PM (6 years, 10 months ago) |
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It tends to be under hydrated imo
@ kinetic 45-50 transfers 6 contamed with much less contamination then previously again thanks lol
-------------------- If I ever give out misinformation please inform me so I can have the correct information. Tmethyl said: Chuck Norris once roundhouse kicked a monotub that wasn't pinning fast enough. The force of the kick rearranged the genetics of the mushrooms, we now call them Penis Envy. Caps McGee said:
Fun part is figuring out what works best for you
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Kenetic
Nam Sayin



Registered: 08/24/14
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Re: Cultivation General Discussion [Re: van hatton]
#24177745 - 03/20/17 01:06 PM (6 years, 10 months ago) |
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Np. Just takes practice
-------------------- Todo Cambia    DMT said: Everyone know's me, they just don't know it yet
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bodhisatta 
Smurf real estate agent


Registered: 04/30/13
Posts: 61,889
Loc: Milky way
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Re: Cultivation General Discussion [Re: Kenetic]
#24177952 - 03/20/17 02:11 PM (6 years, 10 months ago) |
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same ESS culture I've been using but I did 7quarts of spawn to a brick and used a top layer of coir
it either hates the high spawn ratio, the coir pseudocasing, or both.
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natedawgnow
Rocky mountain hood rat



Registered: 02/09/15
Posts: 8,939
Loc: ation
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Re: Cultivation General Discussion [Re: bodhisatta]
#24177973 - 03/20/17 02:17 PM (6 years, 10 months ago) |
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My bet is on high spawn ratio
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TheMadHatter420
Trusted Farmer


Registered: 10/12/16
Posts: 12,941
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Re: Cultivation General Discussion [Re: Inocuole]
#24178037 - 03/20/17 02:33 PM (6 years, 10 months ago) |
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Hey so will one 13mm syringe filter provide enough GE for a Quart jar, or should I double up? I figure ill use them in all these metal lids I got laying around and just use for grains.
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ComebackKid
Multispore Enthusiast



Registered: 05/27/16
Posts: 3,951
Loc: ked in the trunk of a car
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Re: Cultivation General Discussion [Re: natedawgnow]
#24178329 - 03/20/17 04:06 PM (6 years, 10 months ago) |
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Just posted this in bods growlog but I have to agree with you Natedawgnow based off personal experience... but doesn't liloldme use a high spawn ratio? Is there a possibility this issue could be variety specific?
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Substrate surface conditions / Monotub prep and care
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