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sandman420
Saint PP



Registered: 06/17/04
Posts: 5,384
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Re: Cultivation General Discussion [Re: Psicomb]
#27326648 - 05/28/21 12:16 PM (2 years, 7 months ago) |
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Bags are hard. How are you inoculating them? That's where a lot of people get contams. Big bulky item in the flowhood creates a lot of eddies of air, opening the vacuumed bag with your hands in the way, etc
There should be no difference in a Presto user and AA user in cook time. 3-4 hours @ 15psi is plenty for bags. Unless maybe you have an huge amount like 8-10lbs of grain in the bag. That would need longer probably. I find 5 or 6 lbs of hydrated grain works really well in 3Tsized bags @ 3.5hrs.
Edited by sandman420 (05/28/21 12:21 PM)
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Psicomb


Registered: 01/13/18
Posts: 4,636
Loc: the womb
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Re: Cultivation General Discussion [Re: sandman420]
#27326653 - 05/28/21 12:21 PM (2 years, 7 months ago) |
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Bags have been so bittersweet haha. They save my ass a lot of the time but also I've had times where I've thrown out 40 monos over a week because they all contammed before first flush.
I'm just doing a jar to bag g2g. I have a 2x4 hood and I never put more than 3 bags in front of it to inoculate at a time. I just inoculate, seal, repeat with the rest of the bags in front of the hood. I wipe em all down in front of the hood with ISO. they are presealed and I open them with ISO'd scissors

But I'll have some tubs that come through just fine, thank god, but I've been off-n-on batting like a 50% survival rate before first flush
At this point I'm just waiting for results of all my bags that were cooked over 4 hours. Anything under hasn't been consistently contam free.
I've spawned shoeboxes with jars and they dont contam so this also leads me to believe it's a bag sterilizing issue
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When we constantly pull things apart trying to see how it works, we may end up with only an understanding of how to destroy something - nick sand
Edited by Psicomb (05/28/21 12:24 PM)
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sandman420
Saint PP



Registered: 06/17/04
Posts: 5,384
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Re: Cultivation General Discussion [Re: Psicomb]
#27326661 - 05/28/21 12:24 PM (2 years, 7 months ago) |
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you are not alone in your strife's trust me.
Personally I only work on one bag at a time in front of the hood, 30x30, but I wouldn't really bother even if the hood was 4' because you can only work on one at once anyway) Just the rack holding the sealer and the rack the bag and inoculant sits on. And I grab one at a time from my shelf near the hood.
Also with a 2' high hood, you need to be mindful of not breaking the interface of clean air and room air at the top of the filter with your pouring jar/bottle. May consider putting bag on a rack if you are not, table surface is turbulent.
Edited by sandman420 (05/28/21 12:27 PM)
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A.k.a
Stranger



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Re: Cultivation General Discussion [Re: sandman420]
#27326669 - 05/28/21 12:27 PM (2 years, 7 months ago) |
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I cook bags for 2.5 hours usually. I think way less would be ok but I’d be so mad if I fucked up that much work because I wanted to save 40 minutes.
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LAGM2020     
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Psicomb


Registered: 01/13/18
Posts: 4,636
Loc: the womb
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Re: Cultivation General Discussion [Re: sandman420]
#27326670 - 05/28/21 12:28 PM (2 years, 7 months ago) |
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Quote:
sandman420 said: you are not alone in your strife's trust me.
Personally I only work on one bag at a time in front of the hood, 30x30, but I wouldn't really bother even if the hood was 4' because you can only work on one at once anyway) Just the rack holding the sealer and the rack the bag and inoculant sits on. And I grab one at a time from my shelf near the hood.
Right on I appreciate you sharing your experience. I feel I should slow down a bit on my workload and approaches; there has been a lot of people hungry for mushrooms and I've been trying to appease but my quality of work is for sure not as good as it was a year ago. There are a few things I could do better around cleaning tubs and cooking grain and more
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When we constantly pull things apart trying to see how it works, we may end up with only an understanding of how to destroy something - nick sand
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Psicomb


Registered: 01/13/18
Posts: 4,636
Loc: the womb
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Re: Cultivation General Discussion [Re: A.k.a]
#27326672 - 05/28/21 12:29 PM (2 years, 7 months ago) |
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Quote:
A.k.a said: I cook bags for 2.5 hours usually. I think way less would be ok but I’d be so mad if I fucked up that much work because I wanted to save 40 minutes.
Wow, word. A full PC of bags basically?
That's concerning because I've been doing 2.5 to 3hr this whole time I've used bags.
For a while I thought my issues were loose coir but now I dont think so. Smart attack has demonstrated you can get a healthy flush with a tub literally next to a sporulating trich tub with its lid off
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When we constantly pull things apart trying to see how it works, we may end up with only an understanding of how to destroy something - nick sand
Edited by Psicomb (05/28/21 12:32 PM)
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A.k.a
Stranger



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Re: Cultivation General Discussion [Re: Psicomb]
#27326679 - 05/28/21 12:32 PM (2 years, 7 months ago) |
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I was doing 4 or 5 bags of 4-5 quarts each. There’s a thread about fitting more somewhere that was made a couple months back.
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LAGM2020     
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SpaceBaby
alchemist



Registered: 11/01/20
Posts: 2,030
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Re: Cultivation General Discussion [Re: Crackatoa]
#27326697 - 05/28/21 12:47 PM (2 years, 7 months ago) |
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Quote:
Crackatoa said: Pyrex 500ml media bottles, mine came in a set of 3. Cell treat 100mm with the grip ring. Grip ring being the important part. I started with 60mm but tried 100s and never went back. That's what I use. I have been wanting bigger media bottles though.
They have 1000 ml on amazon.
Pretty sure that's a GL45 cap. I only use media bottles for agar and I pour to plastic petris 100x15. Wow! Just looked up Cell Treat; gotta save up a few more bucks, then I am getting them.
Ironically, I was going to post what I believe is contam on the rim of a media bottle. Yellow food coloring, 1/2 grain water agar with 20 ml H2O + LME added to bring it back to 400 ml...the GWA wevaporated 50% in the PC.

Any ideas on whadafuq happened, or what it is? This was a bit of a frankenstein receeipe and procedure; ntl, nuked to mix, into PC with 5 LMEA bottles, 2h5m and a very slow cool down. Tightened wiht aluminum foil still in place. I poured plaes anyway. I'll just sequester, then wrap them and see what happens.
Also, for LC I found the nalgene autoclavable squirt bottles. Don't know if it would suck stray contams in a SAB into the nozzle but maybe one could not release the blttle and just do multiple pours. If the tip is too small [no experience yet with LC, though I made up four 1/2-pints of broth], I think it could be modded.
https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B003OBYWVA/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_asin_title_o00_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1
What do you think of this idea?
mushlove
-------------------- SpaceBaby SPACEBABY'S LAGM22 THREAD MUSHBOY'S SHROOM TEA TEK Me as a cube
Another Day's Work:
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natedawgnow
Rocky mountain hood rat



Registered: 02/09/15
Posts: 8,939
Loc: ation
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Re: Cultivation General Discussion [Re: SpaceBaby]
#27326765 - 05/28/21 01:40 PM (2 years, 7 months ago) |
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6x 4qt bags in a presto ran for 3-3.5hrs hasnt failed me in years.
I did a write up about it a few months back. No need to lift bags fully into the flow. I work with 2-4 bags at a time in front of my hood depending on how many bags I decide to noc up with 1 jar with no issues.
If you think the contams are coming from insufficient sterilization then do a load of bags and leave one on the shelf undisturbed for a month to see if anything grows.
If not then it probably isnt your sterilization cycle
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PreparationH
apply daily

Registered: 03/28/05
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Re: Cultivation General Discussion [Re: natedawgnow]
#27326769 - 05/28/21 01:45 PM (2 years, 7 months ago) |
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is LME and DME the same shit? I am on amazon and keep coming across things like this
https://www.amazon.com/Organic-Light-Dried-Malt-Extract/dp/B007XYGBXQ/ref=sr_1_2?dchild=1&keywords=light+malt+extract&qid=1622231051&sr=8-2
"Light dried malt extract"
When would it ever not be dry lol wtf
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natedawgnow
Rocky mountain hood rat



Registered: 02/09/15
Posts: 8,939
Loc: ation
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Re: Cultivation General Discussion [Re: PreparationH]
#27326771 - 05/28/21 01:47 PM (2 years, 7 months ago) |
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They have liquid malt extract too.
If you have a brewery shop near you they'll have it too for pretty cheap
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PreparationH
apply daily

Registered: 03/28/05
Posts: 18,306
Loc: Amsterdam
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Re: Cultivation General Discussion [Re: natedawgnow]
#27326779 - 05/28/21 01:54 PM (2 years, 7 months ago) |
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Iwhen you guys are saying LME, is that liquid malt extract or light malt extract..?
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A.k.a
Stranger



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Re: Cultivation General Discussion [Re: PreparationH]
#27326793 - 05/28/21 02:07 PM (2 years, 7 months ago) |
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Light malt.
Spacebaby that looks like the agar boiled up over the rim.
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mushboy
modboy



Registered: 04/24/05
Posts: 32,281
Loc: where?
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Re: Cultivation General Discussion [Re: A.k.a]
#27326797 - 05/28/21 02:09 PM (2 years, 7 months ago) |
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I've used the liquid it's a bitch to measure out. Powder is way easier just keep it air tight or it will turn into a brick from outside moisture like brown sugar.
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Psicomb


Registered: 01/13/18
Posts: 4,636
Loc: the womb
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Re: Cultivation General Discussion [Re: natedawgnow]
#27326801 - 05/28/21 02:13 PM (2 years, 7 months ago) |
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Quote:
natedawgnow said: If you think the contams are coming from insufficient sterilization then do a load of bags and leave one on the shelf undisturbed for a month to see if anything grows.
If not then it probably isnt your sterilization cycle
Good thinking, thanks
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When we constantly pull things apart trying to see how it works, we may end up with only an understanding of how to destroy something - nick sand
Edited by Psicomb (05/28/21 02:13 PM)
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verum subsequentis
seeker of truth



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Re: Cultivation General Discussion [Re: Psicomb]
#27326864 - 05/28/21 03:25 PM (2 years, 7 months ago) |
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I cook bags for 3 hours. PC literally crammed as full as she can be with no spacers. Seems to work just fine. Used to do four but no longer see the need. Been tempted to try less time but it's just so easy to go outside and have a beer and no they'll be ok.
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A.k.a
Stranger



Registered: 10/27/19
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Do ESS pins start out looking normal?
I finally got some fruiting and noticed pins this morning. They look just like normal except maybe a little hourglass shaped.
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LAGM2020     
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Failboat
Fuck Up
Registered: 02/01/18
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I preseal my bags and run 4 in a presto and cram 8 into the AA75X. My bags are usually 2.5kg, sometimes up to 3kg, hydrated grain. Bags get 3hrs sterilization time and are inoculated one at a time with one full mycoquart each.
My main problems with bags going bad are dirty g2g innoculant or failure to seal adequately. Massaging bags can be rough on a weak seal. I use a cheap 5mm blue impulse unit and sometimes I have to finnagle a bit to get a proper seam. Occasionally I must reseal during a bag massage, but if done infront of the FFU the risk is minimal.
Just can't cut corners for efficiency, you'll end up losing time in the long run while you learn the lesson through failure.
Currently running wheat and no longer using the prestos daily, but might rock em for a few days to prep lots of masters mix really quick. Need a few dozen bags for oysters and kings. I put my wild oyster on grain yesterday and I'm excited to expand into gourmets fully.
Edited by Failboat (05/28/21 05:46 PM)
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BrownBear
Warrior-Traveler



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Re: Cultivation General Discussion [Re: A.k.a]
#27327007 - 05/28/21 05:42 PM (2 years, 7 months ago) |
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Yes.The ESS pins look normal.
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A.k.a
Stranger



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Re: Cultivation General Discussion [Re: BrownBear]
#27327024 - 05/28/21 05:58 PM (2 years, 7 months ago) |
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I love the caps I hope I get the speckles.
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LAGM2020     
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