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OfflineYaMoonSun
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Re: how do these jars look? pf tek, brf cakes [Re: h0ldthedoor]
    #23487206 - 07/28/16 08:03 PM (7 years, 6 months ago)

I've managed to do some agar work without a pressure cooker, but it's highly advised that you consider investing in one if you plan on doing frequent sterilization.

Essentially, to start off, you may want to buy some malt extract agar powder, some glade 5oz mini rounds, some micro-pore surgical tape, some cotton swabs (plain ones without plastic or lotion ect)

Here's how to make pasty plates


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Invisibleh0ldthedoor
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Re: how do these jars look? pf tek, brf cakes [Re: h0ldthedoor]
    #23487226 - 07/28/16 08:10 PM (7 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

h0ldthedoor said:
Before inoculation, wiped the needle with ISO alcohol and then flamed with a candle. Also wiped and flamed after 6 jars. And after a needle stick. One jar got a couple cc's excess due to operator error (the plunger got dry and released under pressure). (Should have mentioned this was done in a SAB)

Placed some water in a stock pot with mason jar lids, foil balls, and a layer of foil between them, and 6 jars at a time. After reaching boiling, some bowls were placed on the lid to weight it down, temp was reduced per pf tek, it was still boiling well, but not hard and fast enough to dry up all the water within a short period of time. 2 cups of water had to be added towards the end of the first 90 minutes. After that less than a cup was added on the second batch.

There is ~1/2" of dry verm on top of the BRF cake. The cakes were not pressed down hard, very gently with gloved hands just enough to get keep the verm off the dry glass. Once wiped dry, the dry verm was sprinkled on top until it was about flush with the mouth of the jar. Then the jars had their inoculation points covered with small pieces of micropore tape (plastic-like, apparently wrong type, not sure how to handle this), using ungloved hands. After waiting overnight the jars were inoc'd in a SAB, then taken out and the inoculation holes were taped over all at once.

The spores were taken manually from spore prints made of wild fruit. During the print, the caps were kept under a moistened glass on alcohol wiped foil for ~4 or 5 days. After that, they were moved to the SAB and collected with a 14Ga needle, distilled water, and a dishwasher cleaned glass measuring cup. Some other spore prints were available, but were made on paper and collected in open air with only an alcohol wiped blade.

This is all new, but an earnest effort is being made to not deviate from the tek.

:takingnotes:




Already have the SAB and used it where instructed, so far. Thank you for the links!!

Also, none of the jars should be kept and let continue? Should they all be scrapped and reused for whatever comes next?


--------------------
Always keep your foes confused. If they are never certain who you are or what you want, they cannot know what you are like to do next. Sometimes the best way to baffle them is to make moves that have no purpose, or even seem to work against you.

– Petyr Baelish


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Invisibleh0ldthedoor
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Re: how do these jars look? pf tek, brf cakes [Re: YaMoonSun]
    #23487232 - 07/28/16 08:12 PM (7 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

YaMoonSun said:
I've managed to do some agar work without a pressure cooker, but it's highly advised that you consider investing in one if you plan on doing frequent sterilization.

Essentially, to start off, you may want to buy some malt extract agar powder, some glade 5oz mini rounds, some micro-pore surgical tape, some cotton swabs (plain ones without plastic or lotion ect)

Here's how to make pasty plates




PC is an option, it is only 6 quarts and is electric. Pressure Cooker XL or some clone. A trip to the asian grocery store possibly sufficient? Or where can the malt extract agar powder be purchased locally?


--------------------
Always keep your foes confused. If they are never certain who you are or what you want, they cannot know what you are like to do next. Sometimes the best way to baffle them is to make moves that have no purpose, or even seem to work against you.

– Petyr Baelish


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InvisibleKenInVic
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Re: how do these jars look? pf tek, brf cakes [Re: h0ldthedoor]
    #23487253 - 07/28/16 08:16 PM (7 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

h0ldthedoor said:
Quote:

YaMoonSun said:
I've managed to do some agar work without a pressure cooker, but it's highly advised that you consider investing in one if you plan on doing frequent sterilization.

Essentially, to start off, you may want to buy some malt extract agar powder, some glade 5oz mini rounds, some micro-pore surgical tape, some cotton swabs (plain ones without plastic or lotion ect)

Here's how to make pasty plates




PC is an option, it is only 6 quarts and is electric. Pressure Cooker XL or some clone. A trip to the asian grocery store possibly sufficient? Or where can the malt extract agar powder be purchased locally?




I think you can get the malt extract wherever fine brewing supplies are sold.  Agar possibly an asian grocery or maybe even the pharmacy.  There are recipes here somewhere I believe, or find them in TMC if you have a copy.


--------------------
***My SGFC***  ***ID Mushrooms Here***
Pondering the question, "Are we all here, because we're not all there?"
       

"Because something is happening here, but you don't know what it is, do you, Mr. Jones."  Ballad of a Thin Man by Mrs. Zimmerman's little boy, Bobby.


Edited by KenInVic (07/28/16 08:18 PM)


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Invisibledankington
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Re: how do these jars look? pf tek, brf cakes [Re: KenInVic]
    #23487278 - 07/28/16 08:24 PM (7 years, 6 months ago)

agar is typically in asian markets and organic grocers, or online. Get a high percentage agar. Sometimes it'll be just too soft otherwise. I like landor trading co. myself. But there are many good brands

You can use instant mashed potatoes and karo (or any other simple sugar) as in the link I gave for easy agar.

Your malt can be purchased online or at a brewer's supply like keninvic said.


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Invisiblemupetmower
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Re: how do these jars look? pf tek, brf cakes [Re: dankington]
    #23488474 - 07/29/16 07:46 AM (7 years, 5 months ago)

i didnt realize you made the syringe from a print from those cow patties.. that's definitely your problem. if you want to grow with those prints, you basically need to use agar.

otherwise, you can get a syringe from a vendor, but those arent 100% clean either. but they are usually clean enough to where you can do a pf tek grow with minimal issues, and maybe just a tiny amount of bacteria.


but sorry dude. those cakes are toast. you got mold growing on them. =[

good luck next time :thumbup:


--------------------
-The wise man never stops seeking knowledge.


-I wanna feel the change consume me, feel the outside turning in. I wanna feel the metamorphosis and cleansing I've endured within.


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Invisibleh0ldthedoor
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Re: how do these jars look? pf tek, brf cakes [Re: mupetmower]
    #23488538 - 07/29/16 08:14 AM (7 years, 5 months ago)

Thank you everyone for all the advice and feedback, so far.

This https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/19208976#19208976 looks like the best bet for getting started with agar, ASAP. After producing a few plates to work with, (inside the SAB) a spore swab will be created from an existing spore print. After collecting the spore swab, the agar mini's would be opened (one by one) and the agar rubbed with the spore swab. The mini's would be left in the SAB until healthy mycelium appears. After healthy mycelium is growing on a significant portion of the plate (in a perfect world without contam's, going over this is all just to help get my bearings), move onto the Tiger Drop or Tiger Drop 2.0 (Tic tac toe).

On the right path so far?

After doing research mostly on pf tek, this is where things get fuzzy. Hoping to be able to use a tek that does not involve any sort of care and maintenance throughout the day. There will be no one available to perform any such tasks during the work week. Also, as mentioned above, a PC is available, though it is only a 6qt electric Pressure Cooker XL clone. Thoughts?

Also, to reiterate, all of these cakes are toast? Should the jars themselves be trashed or how could they be salvaged without spreading mold indoors?


--------------------
Always keep your foes confused. If they are never certain who you are or what you want, they cannot know what you are like to do next. Sometimes the best way to baffle them is to make moves that have no purpose, or even seem to work against you.

– Petyr Baelish


Edited by h0ldthedoor (07/29/16 08:16 AM)


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Invisiblemupetmower
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Re: how do these jars look? pf tek, brf cakes [Re: h0ldthedoor]
    #23488565 - 07/29/16 08:25 AM (7 years, 5 months ago)

after you inoc the plates, you dont need to leve them in the SAB, since thier lid will be closed.

also, you will want to make at least one transfer from the plates you inoc before using them to inoc grains or whatever. just to ensure it's clean. and since this wil be from a wild print, you will likely need to anyways, since there will probably be contams on the plate withe the myc.

some bacteria may be hidden and meshed in with the myc, too, which is why we take the leading edge of healthy growth as the transfer as soon as you start seeing the growth(when it's like the size of a dime). that way you can get some healthy myc which shouldve grew out a little quicker than the bacteria. thats the reason for one transfer at the very least.

you dont have to toss the jars themselves. just clean them out. just take the jars outside, and dumb them out out there.

but yes, they all look toast. the only one that might bee ok is F, just because i cant clearly see any of that yellow or black spots on it, but if you decide to keep it, just keep a close eye on it. the rest all have either the yellow or black, though. it seems whatever the yellow was, was just the beginnings of the black stuff.


EDIT - on another note, nice pictures, man! those look super professional haha.


--------------------
-The wise man never stops seeking knowledge.


-I wanna feel the change consume me, feel the outside turning in. I wanna feel the metamorphosis and cleansing I've endured within.


Edited by mupetmower (07/29/16 08:29 AM)


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Invisibleh0ldthedoor
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Re: how do these jars look? pf tek, brf cakes [Re: mupetmower]
    #23488585 - 07/29/16 08:35 AM (7 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

mupetmower said:
after you inoc the plates, you dont need to leve them in the SAB, since thier lid will be closed.

also, you will want to make at least one transfer from the plates you inoc before using them to inoc grains or whatever. just to ensure it's clean. and since this wil be from a wild print, you will likely need to anyways, since there will probably be contams on the plate withe the myc.

some bacteria may be hidden and meshed in with the myc, too, which is why we take the leading edge of healthy growth as the transfer as soon as you start seeing the growth(when it's like the size of a dime). that way you can get some healthy myc which shouldve grew out a little quicker than the bacteria. thats the reason for one transfer at the very least.

you dont have to toss the jars themselves. just clean them out. just take the jars outside, and dumb them out out there.




To recap

When working with homemade, wild prints
1. inoc plates
2. transfer to another plate
(repeat step 2 if time permits or contams are present)
3. inoc grains or whatever

When transferring, take sample from the edge of the myc growth (away from any contams, if present), which should be dime-sized.

Also, the jars will be taken outside, dumped out, placed in a plastic bag, brought inside and run through the dishwasher.

Sound good?

Thanks, a couple sheets of copy paper were used to make a sort of backdrop on the counter :super:


--------------------
Always keep your foes confused. If they are never certain who you are or what you want, they cannot know what you are like to do next. Sometimes the best way to baffle them is to make moves that have no purpose, or even seem to work against you.

– Petyr Baelish


Edited by h0ldthedoor (07/29/16 08:36 AM)


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Invisiblemupetmower
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Re: how do these jars look? pf tek, brf cakes [Re: h0ldthedoor]
    #23488589 - 07/29/16 08:37 AM (7 years, 5 months ago)

sounds good. good luck :thumbup:


--------------------
-The wise man never stops seeking knowledge.


-I wanna feel the change consume me, feel the outside turning in. I wanna feel the metamorphosis and cleansing I've endured within.


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Invisibleh0ldthedoor
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Re: how do these jars look? pf tek, brf cakes [Re: mupetmower]
    #23488755 - 07/29/16 09:46 AM (7 years, 5 months ago)

Available is powdered agar and a package with "two solid chunks" as the clerk explained over the phone, is one preferred over the other?

Also, still seeking advice on this

Quote:

After doing research mostly on pf tek, this is where things get fuzzy. Hoping to be able to use a tek that does not involve any sort of care and maintenance throughout the day. There will be no one available to perform any such tasks during the work week. Also, as mentioned above, a PC is available, though it is only a 6qt electric Pressure Cooker XL clone. Thoughts?




Mainly concerned with which tek is best for this schedule and whether or not the PC available is adequate for an agar tek? Somewhere it was mentioned that the electric PC's only get to 11psi, if that's the case can adjustments be made to account for this lack of pressure or are electric PC's wholly unsuitable for these purposes?

Again, advice and feedback is welcome,

Thank you!!

:smile:


--------------------
Always keep your foes confused. If they are never certain who you are or what you want, they cannot know what you are like to do next. Sometimes the best way to baffle them is to make moves that have no purpose, or even seem to work against you.

– Petyr Baelish


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InvisibleKenInVic
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Re: how do these jars look? pf tek, brf cakes [Re: h0ldthedoor]
    #23488780 - 07/29/16 09:55 AM (7 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

h0ldthedoor said:
Available is powdered agar and a package with "two solid chunks" as the clerk explained over the phone, is one preferred over the other?

Also, still seeking advice on this

Quote:

After doing research mostly on pf tek, this is where things get fuzzy. Hoping to be able to use a tek that does not involve any sort of care and maintenance throughout the day. There will be no one available to perform any such tasks during the work week. Also, as mentioned above, a PC is available, though it is only a 6qt electric Pressure Cooker XL clone. Thoughts?




Mainly concerned with which tek is best for this schedule and whether or not the PC available is adequate for an agar tek? Somewhere it was mentioned that the electric PC's only get to 11psi, if that's the case can adjustments be made to account for this lack of pressure or are electric PC's wholly unsuitable for these purposes?

Again, advice and feedback is welcome,

Thank you!!

:smile:




It sounds like your life schedule would be better suited for something like a monotub.  My understanding is they're more maintenance free than the PF tek/SGFC operation but also, a little more technical in getting started.  The results when dialed in properly are said to exceed your wildest dreams compared to PF tek (that could just be the mushrooms talking though).


--------------------
***My SGFC***  ***ID Mushrooms Here***
Pondering the question, "Are we all here, because we're not all there?"
       

"Because something is happening here, but you don't know what it is, do you, Mr. Jones."  Ballad of a Thin Man by Mrs. Zimmerman's little boy, Bobby.


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Invisibledankington
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Re: how do these jars look? pf tek, brf cakes [Re: h0ldthedoor]
    #23488802 - 07/29/16 10:02 AM (7 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

h0ldthedoor said:
Available is powdered agar and a package with "two solid chunks" as the clerk explained over the phone, is one preferred over the other?

Also, still seeking advice on this

Quote:

After doing research mostly on pf tek, this is where things get fuzzy. Hoping to be able to use a tek that does not involve any sort of care and maintenance throughout the day. There will be no one available to perform any such tasks during the work week. Also, as mentioned above, a PC is available, though it is only a 6qt electric Pressure Cooker XL clone. Thoughts?




Mainly concerned with which tek is best for this schedule and whether or not the PC available is adequate for an agar tek? Somewhere it was mentioned that the electric PC's only get to 11psi, if that's the case can adjustments be made to account for this lack of pressure or are electric PC's wholly unsuitable for these purposes?

Again, advice and feedback is welcome,

Thank you!!

:smile:




Agar is typically fine after 30min. @ 10psi. I do mine for a little more, but that should be adequate.
I haven't tried agar blocks, but I like the powdered better than the fluffy crystals, myself. The powder has really good gelling strength. You will want a real PC at some point so you can have properly prepared grains for spawn.


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Offlinelocallorax
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Re: how do these jars look? pf tek, brf cakes [Re: dankington]
    #23488886 - 07/29/16 10:29 AM (7 years, 5 months ago)

:takingnotes:


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Invisibleh0ldthedoor
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Re: how do these jars look? pf tek, brf cakes [Re: dankington]
    #23489036 - 07/29/16 11:29 AM (7 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

KenInVic said:
It sounds like your life schedule would be better suited for something like a monotub.  My understanding is they're more maintenance free than the PF tek/SGFC operation but also, a little more technical in getting started.  The results when dialed in properly are said to exceed your wildest dreams compared to PF tek (that could just be the mushrooms talking though).




Sounds enticing, checking into monotubs now.

Quote:

dankington said:
Agar is typically fine after 30min. @ 10psi. I do mine for a little more, but that should be adequate.
I haven't tried agar blocks, but I like the powdered better than the fluffy crystals, myself. The powder has really good gelling strength. You will want a real PC at some point so you can have properly prepared grains for spawn.




Two types were acquired, as the purchase was made before replies had been posted.

The powdered type is (1) Telephone Brand Agar-Agar Powder 25g (Product of Thailand) and the brick type is (1) Masagana Agar-Agar White 20g (Product of the Philippines).

Glad to hear the PC will work for the time being. Will be checking around for an old-school PC at the second-hand stores, though.

(Can't stop thanking everyone that is offering help and advice, thank you for your time)


--------------------
Always keep your foes confused. If they are never certain who you are or what you want, they cannot know what you are like to do next. Sometimes the best way to baffle them is to make moves that have no purpose, or even seem to work against you.

– Petyr Baelish


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Invisibleh0ldthedoor
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Re: how do these jars look? pf tek, brf cakes [Re: h0ldthedoor]
    #23495903 - 07/31/16 02:43 PM (7 years, 5 months ago)

Got the plates created yesterday using the pasty plate tek (except for using an electric PC, 45m on canning preserving) and today inoc'd the plates using this https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/20630969#20630969 method, basically swab spore print, swab agar, replace lid, let sit.

So the pasty plates are in the SAB now (where the swabbing was done) and they will remain there until signs of myc appear.

There is some condensation on the inside of the plastic tubs, is this OK?


--------------------
Always keep your foes confused. If they are never certain who you are or what you want, they cannot know what you are like to do next. Sometimes the best way to baffle them is to make moves that have no purpose, or even seem to work against you.

– Petyr Baelish


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Invisibledankington
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Re: how do these jars look? pf tek, brf cakes [Re: h0ldthedoor]
    #23495925 - 07/31/16 02:51 PM (7 years, 5 months ago)

:super:

You can also order sterile swabs. I got mine for about $5/ 100.


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Invisibleh0ldthedoor
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Re: how do these jars look? pf tek, brf cakes [Re: dankington] * 1
    #23495944 - 07/31/16 02:57 PM (7 years, 5 months ago)

Right, used the sterile wood cotton-tipped swabs instead of q-tips.
:gome:

Only swabbed 4 plates, figured the other 4 can be used for transfers once the first 4 colonize. Hopefully they come out half-decent..  :dawerp:


--------------------
Always keep your foes confused. If they are never certain who you are or what you want, they cannot know what you are like to do next. Sometimes the best way to baffle them is to make moves that have no purpose, or even seem to work against you.

– Petyr Baelish


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Invisibledankington
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Re: how do these jars look? pf tek, brf cakes [Re: h0ldthedoor]
    #23495973 - 07/31/16 03:08 PM (7 years, 5 months ago)

Oh, well, you should go ahead and make a few more :awesomenod:

But good going! This is how you get started right!


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Invisibleh0ldthedoor
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Re: how do these jars look? pf tek, brf cakes [Re: dankington]
    #23502788 - 08/02/16 06:04 PM (7 years, 5 months ago)

So all jars inevitably showed mold growth, the plates are still sitting in the SAB.

Sitting around is verm, brf, perlite, potting soil (most of a 20lb bag, a few years old), ~5lbs WBS, a dozen half pint widemouth mason jars, some pint mason jars and a model 1928 walmart tub.

The tub was going to be a SGFC for pf tek, but it remains untouched and ready to be made into a monotub, if that's the consensus.

Any advice and feedback is appreciated!!


--------------------
Always keep your foes confused. If they are never certain who you are or what you want, they cannot know what you are like to do next. Sometimes the best way to baffle them is to make moves that have no purpose, or even seem to work against you.

– Petyr Baelish


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