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newtothis3
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Lids and contamination
#23471984 - 07/24/16 11:08 AM (7 years, 6 months ago) |
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Lately I've been getting more forest green contamination despite following PF tell, adding extra time to the sterilization at 15 psi, using a reputable vender, disinfecting my glove box, the bathroom I inoculate in and blocking the bathroom vent and door to stop air flow. I wear gloves and flame between jars. I wash the jars in my dishwasher and I've notice the lid sets have started to rust. I use medical tape over the holes after inculcation (and before). I'm thinking my kids and the seals must be degrading from dishwasher use. Do you guys think this is an explanation? Do you sterilize or boil your jars after birthing? Do you toss the jars that you've found contamination in? How do you get them ready to use again? I thought the dishwasher and sterilization in the pressure cooker was enough. Also how often do you replace your lids? I can't figure out what is going on and why I am getting more contamination than ever. Any advice is appreciated. Thanks!
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spacechildo
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Re: Lids and contamination [Re: newtothis3]
#23471991 - 07/24/16 11:12 AM (7 years, 6 months ago) |
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use a SAB instead of glovebox, dont inoc in the bathroom, that's where you shit! jars get sterilized again with new cake mix in them, just wash them normally first.
do you use a dry verm barrier and leave it dry and undisturbed? could also be a dirty syringe simply.
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TheChief
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Re: Lids and contamination [Re: newtothis3]
#23471994 - 07/24/16 11:13 AM (7 years, 6 months ago) |
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Stop using spore syringes. Start from agar and make your own LC if you wish to do cakes, spore syringes are always some what dirty at the very least.
Really you should think about getting into grains/bulk applications, transfering agar wedges to grain and then g2g from then on, it is much safer route than PF tek. Using grains and agar you can limit your contamination to almost zero.
Also, as spaceman suggests, make sure you are actually using a SAB and proper sterile technique. Not a glovebox.
Edited by TheChief (07/24/16 11:19 AM)
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spacechildo
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Re: Lids and contamination [Re: TheChief]
#23471998 - 07/24/16 11:15 AM (7 years, 6 months ago) |
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pf-tek is very forgiving tho, no recolonization of substrate needed so bacteria doesnt really matter or at least break a grow and no nasty endospores in brf.
But if you already got a PC I agree go to grains and agar. But I have a theory OP isnt following a proper pf-tek.
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weetsie
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Re: Lids and contamination [Re: newtothis3]
#23472012 - 07/24/16 11:21 AM (7 years, 6 months ago) |
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>I'm thinking my kids and the seals must be degrading from dishwasher use. Do you guys think this is an explanation?
No, rusting lids are fine, the seals are not needed either, they are for people canning and need jars that will hold a vacuum, many people use them upside down, metal on glass without issue.
>Do you sterilize or boil your jars after birthing?
No, just clean them in the sink with soapy water and rinse them out.
> Do you toss the jars that you've found contamination in?
Some people do, I empty them outside then clean them. If they are full of mold spores you might wanna put your cloths straight in the wash afterwards, if they are just wet and full of bacteria then it's not so much of an issue.
> Also how often do you replace your lids?
I never do, even if they are rusted to hell, I won't replace them unless they get so bad they literally don't function as lids.
Your contamination could be lots of things, bathrooms are far from the cleanest room in the house for a start, spore syringes are never 100% even from vendors.
-------------------- Active grow logs: Oysters on Straw Pellets Trade list
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TheChief
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Quote:
spacechildo said: pf-tek is very forgiving tho, no recolonization of substrate needed so bacteria doesnt really matter or at least break a grow and no nasty endospores in brf.
But if you already got a PC I agree go to grains and agar. But I have a theory OP isnt following a proper pf-tek.
I also have a feeling the pf technique being used is the problem. OP needs a link to proper information.
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jcbowling1985 said: "Additionally I did one Armageddon jar with all of the types together."
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newtothis3
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Re: Lids and contamination [Re: TheChief]
#23472035 - 07/24/16 11:27 AM (7 years, 6 months ago) |
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I was following PF trek from the videos posted here. I do use a berm barrier. I was sterilizing in the bathroom after disinfecting with bleach spray and Lysol. I choose that room because it was the easiest to control air flow. I turn off every I got, blocked vent etc. I always wash clothes I've handed contaminated jars in the wash right away and open the bad jars outside. I never use to get such high contamination rates so I'm puzzled. What is a SAB? I haven't tried agar two at all, only PF tek thank you guys
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Bobabouy
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Re: Lids and contamination [Re: newtothis3]
#23472053 - 07/24/16 11:33 AM (7 years, 6 months ago) |
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Do not put tape over your holes. That's what the vermiculite is there for. (yes, I know I ended that sentence with a preposition).
Edited by Bobabouy (07/24/16 11:34 AM)
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TheChief
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Re: Lids and contamination [Re: newtothis3]
#23472067 - 07/24/16 11:37 AM (7 years, 6 months ago) |
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Quote:
newtothis3 said: What is a SAB?
This is your problem.
Use the search function and build a proper Still Air Box for doing clean work.
You are also trying to grow with very old information, it is no wonder you are getting a high contamination rate. You should search for methods posted by trusted cultivators in more recent years.
Edited by TheChief (07/24/16 11:40 AM)
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Bobabouy
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Re: Lids and contamination [Re: TheChief]
#23472075 - 07/24/16 11:40 AM (7 years, 6 months ago) |
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You shouldn't need a SAB for PF Tek. If your doing everything right, then it might be your syringe.
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spacechildo
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Re: Lids and contamination [Re: newtothis3]
#23472082 - 07/24/16 11:42 AM (7 years, 6 months ago) |
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Quote:
newtothis3 said: I was following PF trek from the videos posted here. I do use a berm barrier. I was sterilizing in the bathroom after disinfecting with bleach spray and Lysol. What is a SAB?
these videos www.mushroomvideos.com the "lets grow mushrooms" series? there's no lysol,bleach spray etc used there, and they explain the still air box.
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TheChief
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Re: Lids and contamination [Re: Bobabouy]
#23472087 - 07/24/16 11:42 AM (7 years, 6 months ago) |
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You don't need a toilet to take a shit either, but it makes things cleaner doesn't it?
I don't recommend doing any type of inoculation what so ever in open air.
Another thing, get your mushrooms out of the bathroom. Why are you innoculating where you shit and clean yourself? 
The only thing I feel confident in doing in the bathroom regarding growing mushrooms is dunking them, at that point they are 100% colonised and contams are not really a factor anymore.
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jcbowling1985 said: "Additionally I did one Armageddon jar with all of the types together."
Edited by TheChief (07/24/16 11:47 AM)
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Bobabouy
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Re: Lids and contamination [Re: TheChief]
#23472099 - 07/24/16 11:44 AM (7 years, 6 months ago) |
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What's a toilet? And a SAB will not fix a dirty syringe.
Edited by Bobabouy (07/24/16 11:46 AM)
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TheChief
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Re: Lids and contamination [Re: Bobabouy]
#23472113 - 07/24/16 11:48 AM (7 years, 6 months ago) |
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Quote:
Bobabouy said: What's a toilet? And a SAB will not fix a dirty syringe.
This is exactly why my first post in this thread is stop using spore syringes...
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jcbowling1985 said: "Additionally I did one Armageddon jar with all of the types together."
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Bobabouy
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Re: Lids and contamination [Re: TheChief]
#23472124 - 07/24/16 11:52 AM (7 years, 6 months ago) |
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Telling someone who uses their bathroom for inoculation to not use a syringe is kinda like pissing into the wind.
Edited by Bobabouy (07/24/16 11:54 AM)
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ToolTroll
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Re: Lids and contamination [Re: TheChief]
#23472129 - 07/24/16 11:54 AM (7 years, 6 months ago) |
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Is human feces really a contaminant in this case? I would think the constant moisture and the shower stall would be the main problem with a bathroom as clean room.
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Bobabouy
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Re: Lids and contamination [Re: ToolTroll]
#23472140 - 07/24/16 11:56 AM (7 years, 6 months ago) |
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You don't need a clean room for PF Tek. Wipe the lids with alcohol, flame the needle, inoculate.
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TheChief
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Re: Lids and contamination [Re: Bobabouy]
#23472141 - 07/24/16 11:56 AM (7 years, 6 months ago) |
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Quote:
Bobabouy said: Telling someone who uses their bathroom for inoculation to not use a syringe is kinda like pissing into the wind.
Well encouraging someone to do it seems kind of like you already pissed all over yourself many times in the past.
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jcbowling1985 said: "Additionally I did one Armageddon jar with all of the types together."
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Bobabouy
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Re: Lids and contamination [Re: TheChief]
#23472147 - 07/24/16 11:57 AM (7 years, 6 months ago) |
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Quote:
TheChief said:
Quote:
Bobabouy said: Telling someone who uses their bathroom for inoculation to not use a syringe is kinda like pissing into the wind.
Well encouraging someone to do it seems kind of like you already pissed all over yourself many times in the past.
You are super witty.
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TheChief
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Re: Lids and contamination [Re: Bobabouy]
#23472152 - 07/24/16 12:02 PM (7 years, 6 months ago) |
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I didn't grow pounds of dicks innoculating with spore syringes in a bathroom.
If you want to keep playing with contaminations for grams of shrooms, keep at your mentality.
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jcbowling1985 said: "Additionally I did one Armageddon jar with all of the types together."
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Bobabouy
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Re: Lids and contamination [Re: TheChief]
#23472156 - 07/24/16 12:03 PM (7 years, 6 months ago) |
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Um... because the OP does PF tek that means I must do PF tek? Like I said, super witty.
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TheChief
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Re: Lids and contamination [Re: Bobabouy]
#23472158 - 07/24/16 12:04 PM (7 years, 6 months ago) |
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Quote:
Bobabouy said: Um... because the OP does PF tek that means I must do PF tek? Like I said, super witty.
Sounds like you know your shit, bud.
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jcbowling1985 said: "Additionally I did one Armageddon jar with all of the types together."
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newtothis3
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Re: Lids and contamination [Re: TheChief]
#23472199 - 07/24/16 12:18 PM (7 years, 6 months ago) |
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Yes it was the Lets grow mushrooms series. I was calling the SAB a glove box, mistake in terms. I do use a verm barrier and use the jars I make within a few days. I was using trustee vendors so didn't suspect the syringes.
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TheChief
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Re: Lids and contamination [Re: newtothis3]
#23472225 - 07/24/16 12:25 PM (7 years, 6 months ago) |
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Never assume spore syringes are clean. Unless the fruits/spores were grown in a sterile environment and transfered to the syringes in the same regard, they can never be clean. Even if you did do that, which would be a PITA to accomplish don't forget, the process of making syringes still opens up a good chance for contamination to get in.
Dispite what they may advertise, I can tell you for certain right now; there are no vendors that are using sterile fruits to produce their syringes, not one. It just isn't economical for them, it would be way too much work. They may take some extra precaution to make sure they are "less dirty", but this still means they are all going to have contamination of some degree.
Agar is the only true, safe way to know a cluture is going to be clean. Even with agar you still have a risk, but it is minimal apposed to spore syringes.
I presume your sterile technique are most of your problem though.
Edited by TheChief (07/24/16 02:27 PM)
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newtothis3
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Re: Lids and contamination [Re: TheChief]
#23472274 - 07/24/16 12:48 PM (7 years, 6 months ago) |
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I have never tried agar. What tek for agar is best for a noob? Any links to a recommended tek are much appreciated. Thanks everyone for your answers.
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TheChief
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Re: Lids and contamination [Re: newtothis3]
#23472279 - 07/24/16 12:50 PM (7 years, 6 months ago) |
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Pastywhyte agar tek is probably a good place to start.
I don't do plates like this per se, I find it to be a tiny bit over complicated for my personal needs. However, I do hear great things about his tek, this is why I link it. All you really need is some containers that are translucent and easy to work with, that can handle the PC run. You don't really need filters or anything like that, as long as the container has a decent seal to stay sterile, your fine. They don't even really need GE vents in this application, but that is just my own opinion. The containers I use likely allow for a small amount through the lip of the lids naturally, even though they seem air tight.
Agar can be made from just about anything with a little mush nutes in it, or you can buy premade stuff in powder form that just mixes with water. You could also buy agar agar like in Pasty tek and use after soak grain water as the nutrient, just another simple way that is also cost effective. Natural syrups and starches will work great for a nutrient source as well, there are many options with agar.
I also prefer to pour my plates in the SAB, I find it to be less work in the end, but a lot of people don't like to do that. If you mixing up your own agar I can see how pre pours would be less work, as you already have the stuff mixed up, heated and in liquid form. I am still using some premade powder from a while back, I plan to make my own powdered form of agar in the dehydrator when it is all gone.
The rest is easy, inoculate your plates and get to work transferring clean cultures.
Edited by TheChief (07/24/16 03:03 PM)
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YeOlde
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Re: Lids and contamination [Re: TheChief]
#23472358 - 07/24/16 01:24 PM (7 years, 6 months ago) |
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Hi all I'm reading up on lots of threads and have a question. Everyone keeps saying drop the syringes and use agar but if you're just starting out how is that possible? You still need to inoculate the agar with a syringe unless you can buy inoculated agar which I can't. Is this what you are all suggesting?
-------------------- My Psychedelic experiences: LSD - 30+ times (2 hits min / max 3 hits) every time. Shrooms - 4 times (2.5 - 3.5g) DMT - 5 times (Powerful breakthrough only once) Life can be one hell of a bitter pill to swallow so I chose acid instead -YeOlde
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TheChief
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Re: Lids and contamination [Re: YeOlde]
#23472405 - 07/24/16 01:44 PM (7 years, 6 months ago) |
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Inoculation of agar with a spore syringe is the whole point, to sector out clean growth from contamination that may be hidden within it. If you end up with a contamination on a plate, you can still save the clean myc that grows beside it, in a sterile "still air" environment.
When you inoculate a grain or pf jar straight from a syringe, sectoring out from contamination just isn't an option. Going straight from syringe is like having sex without a condom or birth control hoping you don't get the girl pregnant, it is hit or miss. 
Syringes and any other type of inoculation method are perfectly suited for agar. Buy some syringes from a reputable souce and start from there. Agar is easy to get into without ordering a single thing online, everything is readily available at Walmart, grocery stores and many other places.
Edited by TheChief (07/26/16 05:11 PM)
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YeOlde
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Re: Lids and contamination [Re: TheChief]
#23472570 - 07/24/16 03:06 PM (7 years, 6 months ago) |
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Amazing. Thanks for the advice. I'm in the UK so no Walmart unfortunately but really appreciate it. I got the syringe just need to learn more about agar.
-------------------- My Psychedelic experiences: LSD - 30+ times (2 hits min / max 3 hits) every time. Shrooms - 4 times (2.5 - 3.5g) DMT - 5 times (Powerful breakthrough only once) Life can be one hell of a bitter pill to swallow so I chose acid instead -YeOlde
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newtothis3
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Re: Lids and contamination [Re: YeOlde]
#23475437 - 07/25/16 12:49 PM (7 years, 6 months ago) |
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Thank you guys. I'm interested to try this new method.
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newtothis3
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Re: Lids and contamination [Re: Bobabouy]
#23478329 - 07/26/16 10:44 AM (7 years, 6 months ago) |
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Won't wiping the kids with alcohol ruin the microspore tape?
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LocN9ne
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Re: Lids and contamination [Re: newtothis3]
#23478351 - 07/26/16 10:52 AM (7 years, 6 months ago) |
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Quote:
newtothis3 said: Won't wiping the kids with alcohol ruin the microspore tape?
No, but child protective services might have something to say about it...
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newtothis3
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Re: Lids and contamination [Re: LocN9ne]
#23478856 - 07/26/16 01:56 PM (7 years, 6 months ago) |
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This is what results when I type on my phone
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